Legislature(1997 - 1998)

04/25/1997 03:40 PM House HES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
               HOUSE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL                              
                  SERVICES STANDING COMMITTEE                                  
                         April 25, 1997                                        
                           3:40 p.m.                                           
                                                                               
                                                                               
 MEMBERS PRESENT                                                               
                                                                               
 Representative Con Bunde, Chairman                                            
 Representative Joe Green, Vice Chairman                                       
 Representative Brian Porter                                                   
 Representative Fred Dyson                                                     
 Representative J. Allen Kemplen                                               
 Representative Tom Brice                                                      
                                                                               
 MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                
                                                                               
 Representative Al Vezey                                                       
                                                                               
 COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                            
                                                                               
 HOUSE BILL NO. 16                                                             
 "An Act relating to delinquent minors, to the taking of action                
 based on the alleged criminal misconduct of certain minors, to the            
 services to be provided to the victims of criminal misconduct of              
 minors, and to agency records involving minors alleged to be                  
 delinquent based on their criminal misconduct; and amending Rule 19           
 and repealing Rules 6, 7, 11(a), 12(a), and 21(f), Alaska                     
 Delinquency Rules."                                                           
                                                                               
      - HEARD AND HELD                                                         
                                                                               
 HOUSE BILL NO. 213                                                            
 "An Act relating to teacher certification."                                   
                                                                               
      - HEARD AND HELD                                                         
                                                                               
 HOUSE BILL NO. 190                                                            
 "An Act relating to the participating share for school construction           
 grants; and providing for an effective date."                                 
                                                                               
      - HEARD AND HELD                                                         
                                                                               
 (* First public hearing)                                                      
                                                                               
 PREVIOUS ACTION                                                               
                                                                               
 BILL:  HB  16                                                               
 SHORT TITLE: JUVENILE DELINQUENCY PROCEDURES                                  
 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) KELLY                                           
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE     JRN-DATE             ACTION                                      
 01/13/97        31    (H)   PREFILE RELEASED 1/3/97                           
 01/13/97        31    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 01/13/97        31    (H)   HES, JUDICIARY                                    
 04/25/97              (H)   HES AT  3:30 PM CAPITOL 106                       
                                                                               
 BILL:  HB 213                                                               
 SHORT TITLE: REQUIREMENTS FOR TEACHER CERTIFICATION                           
 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) KUBINA                                          
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE     JRN-DATE             ACTION                                      
 03/25/97       828    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 03/25/97       828    (H)   HES                                               
 04/25/97              (H)   HES AT  3:30 PM CAPITOL 106                       
                                                                               
 BILL:  HB 190                                                               
 SHORT TITLE: SCHOOL CONSTRUCTION GRANT PROGRAM                                
 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) JOULE                                           
                                                                               
 JRN-DATE     JRN-DATE             ACTION                                      
 03/12/97       640    (H)   READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S)                 
 03/12/97       640    (H)   HES, STATE AFFAIRS, FINANCE                       
 04/25/97              (H)   HES AT 3:30 PM CAPITOL 106                        
                                                                               
 WITNESS REGISTER                                                              
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PETE KELLY                                                     
 Alaska State Legislature                                                      
 Capitol Building, Room 411                                                    
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 465-2327                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Sponsor of HB 16                                         
                                                                               
 MARGOT KNUTH, Assistant Attorney General                                      
 Central Office                                                                
 Criminal Division                                                             
 Department of Law                                                             
 P.O. Box 110300                                                               
 Juneau, Alaska  99811-0300                                                    
 Telephone:  (907) 465-3191                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 16                                       
                                                                               
 THOMAS VanBROCKLIN, Legislative Assistant                                     
    to Representative Kubina                                                   
 Alaska State Legislature                                                      
 Capitol Building, Room 404                                                    
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 465-4859                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 213                                      
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GENE KUBINA                                                    
 Alaska State Legislature                                                      
 Capitol Building, Room 404                                                    
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 465-4859                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Sponsor of HB 213                                        
                                                                               
 DIANE CRONK                                                                   
 P.O. Box 554                                                                  
 Northway, Alaska  99764                                                       
 Telephone:  (907) 99764                                                       
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 213                                      
                                                                               
 NANCY BUELL, Ed. D., Director                                                 
 Teaching and Learning Support                                                 
 Department of Education                                                       
 801 West Tenth Street, Suite 200                                              
 Juneau, Alaska  99801-1894                                                    
 Telephone:  (907) 465-8689                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 213                                      
                                                                               
 DAVID REAUME, Member                                                          
 Juneau School Board                                                           
 10746 Horizon Drive                                                           
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 586-9677                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 213                                      
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE REGGIE JOULE                                                   
 Alaska State Legislature                                                      
 Capitol Building, Room 405                                                    
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 465-4833                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Sponsor of HB 190                                        
                                                                               
 DAVID BELL, Director of Property Services                                     
 Northwest Arctic School District                                              
 P.O. Box 51                                                                   
 Kotzebue, Alaska  99752                                                       
 Telephone:  (907) 442-3476                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 190                                      
                                                                               
 JOHN ATCHAK                                                                   
 P.O. Box 157                                                                  
 Chevak, Alaska  99563                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 858-7712                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 190                                      
                                                                               
 GREG FLAST                                                                    
 P.O. Box 157                                                                  
 Chevak, Alaska  99563                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 858-7712                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 190                                      
                                                                               
 MICHAEL A. MORGAN, PMP, Manager                                               
 Facilities Section                                                            
 Education Support Services                                                    
 Department of Education                                                       
 801 West Tenth Street, Suite 200                                              
 Juneau, Alaska  99801-1894                                                    
 Telephone:  (907) 465-2891                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 190                                      
                                                                               
 B. A. WEINBERG, Lobbyist                                                      
 Kashunamiut School District                                                   
 Aurora Corporate Enterprises, Inc.                                            
 300 Hermit Street, Number 12                                                  
 Juneau, Alaska  99801                                                         
 Telephone:  (907) 586-3897                                                    
 POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified on HB 190                                      
                                                                               
 ACTION NARRATIVE                                                              
                                                                               
 TAPE 97-34, SIDE A                                                            
 Number 0000                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN CON BUNDE called the House Health, Education and Social              
 Services Standing Committee meeting to order at 3:40 p.m.  Members            
 present at the call to order were Representatives Bunde, Porter and           
 Dyson.  Representatives Kemplen, Green and Brice arrived at 3:43              
 p.m., 3:48 p.m. and 4:18 p.m., respectively.  Representative Vezey            
 was absent.  This meeting was teleconferenced to Anchorage,                   
 Kotzebue, Mat-Su, Northway and offnet sites.                                  
 HB 16 - JUVENILE DELINQUENCY PROCEDURES                                     
                                                                               
 Number 0035                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE said a quorum was not present, but they would begin            
 to hear testimony on HB 16, "An Act relating to delinquent minors,            
 to the taking of action based on the alleged criminal misconduct of           
 certain minors, to the services to be provided to the victims of              
 criminal misconduct of minors, and to agency records involving                
 minors alleged to be delinquent based on their criminal misconduct;           
 and amending Rule 19 and repealing Rules 6, 7, 11(a), 12(a), and              
 21(f), Alaska Delinquency Rules."                                             
                                                                               
 Number 0053                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PETE KELLY, Sponsor of HB 16, stated that juvenile             
 crime has become a great problem in this state and people have                
 expressed concern about it.  In November of 1995, the Governor                
 convened a conference on youth and justice in order to find some              
 solutions to this growing problem.  This conference produced a                
 number of recommendations for pieces of legislation including HB 6,           
 the disclosure bill.  He said HB 16 compliments HB 6 and includes             
 a number of recommendations from that youth conference.                       
 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY explained that HB 16 authorizes;                         
 municipalities to take minors to civil court, provides for a                  
 victim/witness assistance program, a dual sentencing procedure,               
 involves communities in the informal adjustment of the juvenile               
 offenders, addresses some of flaws in the community service laws              
 and increases communication between the Department of Health and              
 Social Services (DHSS) and law enforcement.                                   
                                                                               
 Number 0217                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE asked the Administration's position on HB 16.                  
                                                                               
 Number 025                                                                    
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY responded that, in his opinion, the                      
 Administration favored this legislation.                                      
                                                                               
 Number 0243                                                                   
                                                                               
 MARGOT KNUTH, Assistant Attorney General, Central Office, Criminal            
 Division, Department of Law, said she worked on youth and justice             
 issues addressed by the Governor's Conference on Youth and Justice            
 of which Representatives Porter and Kelly were active participants.           
 The conference focused on low level offenders; the need to provide            
 more consistent and predictable consequences for these juveniles              
 and how to monitor those who were at risk of being chronic, serious           
 offenders.  She said HB 16 addresses both of those issues and the             
 Administration endorses this bill.                                            
                                                                               
 Number 0365                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH explained that in terms of low level offenders, as the              
 state is more restricted in its funding and personnel, there needs            
 to be a stronger focus on the serious offender.  A large gap is               
 being created in terms of responding to low level offenders.  While           
 this is happening, communities are stepping forward in order to               
 address low level offenders, particularly those who are committing            
 misdemeanor offenses.  This provides a good opportunity for a                 
 partnership between the state and communities to make sure there              
 are consequences.  These consequences need not be particularly                
 severe, but they must be predictable and consistent.                          
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH said that HB 16 provides a couple of different                      
 approaches; it creates a civil penalty procedure that                         
 municipalities can use and it authorizes the DHSS to enter into               
 agreements with communities about how they want to respond to low             
 level offenses.  Possible examples include youth court, village               
 court and pre-trial type diversion panels such as are being used in           
 the Mat-Su area.  These examples provide an authority presence                
 before which the offender makes an appearance.  These systems serve           
 as an alternative to going through the DHSS formal delinquency                
 procedures.  These programs give the juvenile a choice.  He or she            
 can either go through the traditional juvenile delinquency                    
 procedures, possibly resulting in formal juvenile adjudication, or            
 the juvenile can choose to go through this informal process where             
 they will not receive a criminal record and cannot be given any               
 time in detention, but short of that they can be ordered to perform           
 community work service, make restitution, write a letter of                   
 apology, seek counseling, work with their family and other things             
 which bridge the distance between that juvenile and society.  This            
 process attempts to give the juvenile the opportunity to get back             
 into mainstream society.                                                      
                                                                               
 Number 0555                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH stated that the other end of the spectrum are those                 
 juveniles who are at risk of becoming serious, chronic offenders.             
 On a national level, as the number of offenses increases, states              
 have lowered the age at which juveniles are treated as adult                  
 offenders and are given adult sentences.  Studies are uncovering              
 some problems with this approach such as a higher rate of                     
 recidivism by these juveniles.  These juveniles are more likely to            
 commit another crime, the new crime is likely to be more serious              
 and their commission of a new offense is likely to occur faster               
 than that of those in the juvenile system.  These things can be the           
 result of a couple factors, one of which is that we have targeted             
 a group which is particularly egregious in their behavior and so              
 they are self-selecting to be more serious offenders.  Another                
 factor can be that once you put the juveniles through the adult               
 system you are putting them with some real experts at criminal                
 offenses, creating a situation which is less rehabilitative and               
 possibly destructive.  These experiences have led to a nationwide             
 search for an alternative.  The dual sentencing provision shows the           
 most promise of any alternative.                                              
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH explained that if a juvenile commits an offense that                
 would be an automatic waiver offense if they were older or a                  
 situation occurred where the child was 16 or 17-years-old and                 
 committed a number of offenses, then they would go through the                
 juvenile proceedings but they would also be indicted by a grand               
 jury.  When this juvenile is adjudicated, they receive both a                 
 juvenile and an adult sentence.  This adult sentence hangs over               
 their head if they do not comply with all the requirements of the             
 juvenile sentence.  These requirements include making restitution,            
 committing no new offenses, performing whatever treatment orders              
 were entered by the court and whatever is seen to be the                      
 restorative, rehabilitative mechanism for that child.  The dual               
 sentencing provision gives the child a sense of responsibility for            
 staying out of the adult system.  What happens would be under her             
 or his control.  This is seen as something that could motivate                
 compliance with a juvenile sentence, something which is not                   
 currently being experienced under the current system.                         
                                                                               
 Number 0658                                                                   
 MS. KNUTH said there are questions about whether or not all the               
 constitutional safe guards, associated with an adult criminal                 
 conviction, are included in the juvenile delinquency proceedings.             
 She assured the committee that Alaska already provides all of those           
 safe guards, with the exception of the right to indictment.  This             
 right was added in the state's procedure so that anybody who could            
 be subject to dual sentencing will be indicted as is required for             
 any adult conviction.  She said that juveniles have the right to a            
 trial by 12 jurors on all offenses, including misdemeanor offenses.           
 Adults are only afforded the right to a 12 person jury trial in               
 felony cases and have a six person jury in misdemeanor offenses.              
                                                                               
 Number 0817                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH referred to the disclosure of juvenile information and              
 explained that currently parents have the ability to go to a                  
 legislator and discuss a Child in Need of Aid (CINA) case or a                
 delinquency case.  Currently, the DHSS is not able to provide any             
 information to the legislator about that case.  There are two                 
 provisions in HB 16; one addressing delinquents and one for CINA              
 cases.  These provisions would allow information to be provided by            
 DHSS, instead of that person only receiving one segment of                    
 information.                                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 0866                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE asked if this impacted federal law.                            
                                                                               
 Number 0872                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH said no, because it is a select disclosure instead of a             
 broad based public disclosure.  A clause is included in HB 16                 
 regarding that this disclosure is done on a need to know basis.               
                                                                               
 Number 0970                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH referred to a posted chart which showed that for the dual           
 sentencing process, one would start with the district attorney and            
 seek the grand jury indictment.  If there is a new offense or a               
 failure to comply after juvenile treatment, then a petition would             
 be filed which could result in the imposition of the adult sentence           
 including jail time.  The second chart related to juvenile                    
 delinquency proceedings where two processes are available.  One is            
 called an informal adjustment and the other is the formal                     
 delinquency adjudication.  The last chart explains that if you have           
 a violation and an arrest, the city of Anchorage would use a                  
 hearing officer system resulting in an imposition of a civil                  
 penalty.  Anchorage has been successful in their use of this                  
 system.  She referred to a bill which would criminalize curfew                
 violations.  This violation is currently being treated through the            
 civil penalty process.  Both those who are involved in using the              
 civil penalties and the prosecutors who don't want additional work            
 are pleased with the civil process.  Other communities do not have            
 a civil process in place and this bill would make it available.               
                                                                               
 Number 1041                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOE GREEN referred to dual sentencing.  He asked if            
 a person was under age 13 on the first offense and over 13-years-             
 old on the second offense would that make any difference as opposed           
 to having both offenses occurring after age 13.                               
                                                                               
 Number 1080                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH recollected that for the instances when dual sentencing             
 could be used for a 13, 14 or 15-year-old, it would only take them            
 one offense to get them there because of the severity of the crime.           
 The 15 and 16-year-olds would have committed multiple offenses,               
 some of which could have occurred when they were age 14 or younger.           
                                                                               
 Number 1097                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE FRED DYSON asked for a definition of civil                     
 penalties.                                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 1111                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH answered that it was fines.   A person could perform                
 community work service in lieu of the fine.  The court cannot                 
 initially order community work service because of an appellate                
 ruling which states that it is a criminal sanction, it is                     
 involuntary servitude.                                                        
                                                                               
 Number 1133                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON asked, under our existing state law or under             
 the change made by HB 16, how restitution is enforced and what                
 happens if the juvenile cannot do it.  He asked what would happen             
 if the parents are unable to satisfy the requirements of                      
 restitution.                                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 1161                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH answered that the state requires offenders to sign over             
 their permanent fund dividend (PFD) checks.  This action has proven           
 to be a source of restitution which has made a difference to a lot            
 of victims.  After that action, the offender is brought back to               
 court and queried about not paying the restitution.  There are                
 those who cannot work or are not earning enough money.  The court             
 tries very hard to work with the offender to come up with a                   
 reasonable, realistic pay schedule.  In terms of a parent's                   
 liability for a juvenile's fines or court ordered restitution,                
 there is a statute which describes the age and amount.                        
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE stated that the parents can be responsible for                 
 restitution up to $10,000.                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 1223                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON clarified that if the parents were not                   
 immediately able to satisfy the amount, then there was a procedure            
 to seize their present and future PFD checks and garnish wages.  He           
 asked if there was a procedure in this state allowing a parent to             
 go through a process to divorce their child.                                  
                                                                               
 Number 1251                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE answered that you could emancipate a child, but that           
 it is a difficult process.                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 1264                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY referred to a bill from last session, HB 387,            
 the juvenile crime rewrite.  Provisions were included were                    
 restitution could be enforced as a civil matter and after age 19              
 they could still be held liable.                                              
                                                                               
 Number 1287                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON referred to an example in Anchorage where they           
 were getting juveniles to clean up graffiti.  He assumed that we              
 could not force them to clean it up.  However the perpetrator could           
 agree to it at the time of adjudication and then it would be okay.            
                                                                               
 Number 1310                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH explained that if you are in a criminal proceeding, then            
 this type of service can be ordered.  The appellate court decision            
 regards instances when you are in a civil proceeding, agreed to by            
 the juvenile, in lieu of a criminal proceeding.  "The only time the           
 court cannot order and at this point it's only been community work            
 service that is generic work as opposed to clean up what you did,             
 is in the civil that that it's a civil, I'm going to say                      
 prosecution and, and that's what it started out being and that's              
 all you're, you're trying for."                                               
                                                                               
 Number 1352                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE BRIAN PORTER mentioned that the emancipation of the            
 child is a difficult process.  The child has to be capable of                 
 independent emancipation as determined by the court.                          
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE stated that it is a separate court proceeding.                 
                                                                               
 Number 1372                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH said she grew up in California where there was a process,           
 called incorrigibility, where a parent could sign responsibility              
 for the child over to the state because the parent no longer felt             
 they could control or be responsible for the child.  The child                
 might still be placed with the parent, but the parent would be                
 relieved of this type of responsibility.  She cited a personal                
 example where she is the guardian for her 17-year-old nephew and              
 said that Alaska does not have a similar proceeding.                          
                                                                               
 Number 1403                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER made a motion to adopt the committee                    
 substitute, Chenoweth, dated April 24, 1997, as the working                   
 document.  Hearing no objections CSHB 16(HES) was before the                  
 committee.                                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 1420                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE asked about a fiscal note.                                     
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said language was purposefully pulled out of             
 HB 16 to prevent a fiscal note.                                               
                                                                               
 Number 1438                                                                   
                                                                               
 MS. KNUTH stated that there is not currently a fiscal note and she            
 did not anticipate a fiscal note on this draft.                               
                                                                               
 Number 1464                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked if the victim/offender mediation                  
 program would still be available.                                             
                                                                               
 Number 1500                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE stated that this was the first time this bill was              
 heard and is the tradition of the committee it would be held to               
 give members a chance to review the bill.                                     
 HB 213 - REQUIREMENTS FOR TEACHER CERTIFICATION                             
                                                                               
 Number 1530                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE announced the next item on the agenda was HB 213,              
 "An Act relating to teacher certification."                                   
                                                                               
 Number 1555                                                                   
                                                                               
 THOMAS VanBROCKLIN, Legislative Assistant to Representative Kubina,           
 stated that Representative Kubina would arrive shortly.                       
                                                                               
 Number 1584                                                                   
 REPRESENTATIVE GENE KUBINA, Sponsor of HB 213, referred to the                
 early retirement bill which passed last year allowing many teachers           
 to retire early.  He mentioned a Fairbanks news article about their           
 school district authorizing their administration to put together a            
 recruitment team to look for teachers in the Lower 48.  He was                
 bothered by this because there are roughly a thousand people on the           
 teacher placement list at the University of Alaska-Fairbanks (UAF).           
 He sought information on this subject.  One person, a supporter of            
 the university system, told him that UAF doesn't put out good                 
 teachers.  No one wants to hire those teachers.                               
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA explained that HB 213 is similar to a system            
 that he went through in California.  A person has to get a degree             
 in something other than teaching, then they apply to the                      
 university's department of education.  Once accepted, the student             
 would do a year consisting of two semesters of methods classes and            
 student teaching.  The student teaching would consist of one                  
 semester in one school under one master teacher and the second                
 semester in another school under another master teacher.  He stated           
 that he learned more while student teaching than he did from                  
 methods classes.  You really learn to be a teacher by teaching.               
                                                                               
 Number 1738                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA felt that the state needed to demand more of            
 students getting a teaching degree through the state university               
 system and it should be done early.  He stated that this process              
 would take an extra year for those just wanting to become teachers.           
 For people with a degree, who then decide they want to teach, they            
 would only need nine months.  He felt it might help people who have           
 worked through a career, have degrees and want to come into the               
 system for a short, but intense period of time.  He didn't think              
 that it was right to have people graduating from university,                  
 certified to teach school, that aren't wanted.                                
                                                                               
 Number 1811                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE commented that he got a teaching degree in a state             
 where they required a fifth year, within the first few years of               
 teaching.  He asked what area of specialization or degree would a             
 potential teacher get in order to teach elementary education.                 
                                                                               
 Number 1837                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA said that elementary teachers instruct every            
 subject, but usually at a lower level.  A person should have a                
 degree in a basic subject area; whether it is math, science or                
 something else.  He stated that his degree was in social sciences             
 with an emphasis in economics.  When potential teachers took their            
 methods classes, they would be focusing on elementary school                  
 education including reading or math.  He felt the type of degree              
 should not be restricted.                                                     
 Number 1880                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE asked if HB 213 would require the same amount of               
 methods classes as is found in the current system.                            
                                                                               
 Number 1896                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA was not sure how many methods hours are                 
 currently required.                                                           
                                                                               
 Number 1899                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE mentioned the difficulty of placing student                    
 teachers.  He commented that it was interesting that no one from              
 the university was here.                                                      
                                                                               
 Number 1905                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA said he has had discussions with various                
 university staff from the different universities.  He said the                
 universities have different requirements for teaching degrees.  The           
 Southeast program is well on the way to becoming something closer             
 to what HB 213 would propose.  The university staff wanted him to             
 postpone hearing this bill for a week in order to prepare comments.           
 He wanted to present it to the committee in order to get comments             
 on the bill.                                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 1961                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if the required degree would have                  
 something at least associated with what you would ultimately be               
 teaching.                                                                     
                                                                               
 Number 2019                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA answered that Alaska does not statutorily               
 require that a teacher teach in their field, possibly because of              
 the size of schools.  He cited a personal example where he taught             
 outside his area of specialty which is sixth grade.  He felt that             
 beginning in junior high, the state should tighten this leniency so           
 that people are teaching in their fields of instruction.  He stated           
 that special education programs require a masters degree with                 
 specialties.                                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 2058                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE reminded the committee that the House passed a                 
 teacher competency test, requiring basic teacher competencies.  He            
 stated that if the local school board chooses to have them teach a            
 subject outside their area of expertise, then this was an issue of            
 local control.                                                                
                                                                               
 Number 2074                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE KUBINA felt there should be testing before these               
 potential teachers entered the programs.                                      
                                                                               
 Number 2092                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE pointed out that, at least at the University of                
 Alaska-Anchorage, there are some entrance requirements.                       
                                                                               
 Number 2104                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked what classes now constitute an                    
 education degree which would not be given under a one year methods            
 course.                                                                       
                                                                               
 Number 2160                                                                   
                                                                               
 DIANE CRONK, student, testified next via teleconference from                  
 Northway.  To become an elementary school teacher she has to take             
 an introduction to education, child psychology, a class for special           
 learners, two classes in math for elementary school teachers,                 
 diagnosis and evaluation of learning, communication and cross                 
 cultural classrooms, literature for children, art education,                  
 teaching physical education and electives such as philosophy of               
 education.  She felt HB 213 was okay for high school teachers, but            
 it was not appropriate for elementary school teachers.  As a parent           
 she would want the best teachers for her children, not necessarily            
 teachers from Alaska.                                                         
                                                                               
 MS. CRONK referred to the rural Alaskan program to encourage rural            
 Alaskans to get a teaching degree to return to their rural areas              
 and teach.  She said they would not be able to get a degree in                
 anything except for rural development and education.                          
                                                                               
 Number 2227                                                                   
                                                                               
 NANCY BUELL, Ed. D., Director, Teaching and Learning Support,                 
 Department of Education, said her division includes teacher                   
 certification.  On behalf of the department, they support any                 
 attempt to raise teaching standards.  The commissioner has stated             
 in the past months that they have been working to raise teaching              
 standards in Alaska.  This piece of legislation represents one kind           
 of bill for doing that.                                                       
                                                                               
 Number 2262                                                                   
                                                                               
 DAVID REAUME, Member, Juneau School Board, explained that he was              
 not necessarily speaking on behalf of the school board.  He                   
 supported the theme behind HB 213.  He felt the first thing that a            
 degree in a subject grants to a system is teachers with higher                
 academic qualities.  He referred to a table listing various                   
 undergraduates and their degrees, ethnicity and their scores on the           
 graduate record examination (GRE).  People with teaching degrees              
 scored last, probably because they aren't well trained in the types           
 of things tested by the GRE.                                                  
                                                                               
 TAPE 97-34, SIDE B                                                            
 Number 0000                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME felt that the type of student who goes into the field              
 and the training were involved in the GRE results.  The scores                
 could be lower because the subject material isn't really being                
 studied and possibly because the individuals entering the field may           
 not have as high an aptitude as others.  Lower Scholastic Aptitude            
 Test (SAT) results are also found in those who go on to receive               
 teaching degrees.                                                             
                                                                               
 Number 0246                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME stated the second advantage of HB 213 would be to raise            
 overall standards.  People who know a lot about a subject demand              
 more of their students than people who don't know very much about             
 it.  A third thing which would happen is that teachers, who are               
 more knowledgeable in their subject, are better able to assist                
 their students to learn.  If teachers cannot clarify the                      
 ambiguities of textbooks, if their knowledge is such that they are            
 dependent on the textbook then there are serious problems in the              
 classroom.  Students become reluctant to ask questions because they           
 are perceived as challenging the teacher.                                     
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME explained that HB 213 would dramatically change the                
 culture in the schools.  He has observed that at the University of            
 Alaska and the school system in Juneau, there are two hallmarks of            
 people who come out of education schools with a principle degree in           
 education.  One of these hallmarks is a tendency to argue from                
 authority and the second is to use theory without bothering to see            
 what the empirical results are.                                               
                                                                               
 Number 0410                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME stated that United States students do poorly on                    
 international exams.  Students in Juneau, Anchorage and Fairbanks             
 score slightly above the national average on the California                   
 Achievement Test (CAT) and the Iowa Tests of Basic Skills.                    
 Students are roughly at the national average, but the national                
 average isn't so hot internationally.  At a minimum level, a well             
 educated person should be able to do well on a standardized test.             
                                                                               
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME said studies have endorsed the concept that a teacher              
 must be well trained in a subject if they are going to teach the              
 subject well.  He mentioned the varying meanings of the word                  
 subject.  Some feel that a science degree is a subject without an             
 emphasis in a particular area of science such as physics.                     
                                                                               
 Number 0658                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME said 63 percent of high school math classes are taught             
 by individuals who did not have a minor in the field.  The vast               
 majority of the classes are being taught in Anchorage, Fairbanks,             
 Juneau, Kenai and Ketchikan.  As of 1991, Alaska did not value                
 having people in our high school classes who were trained in the              
 subject they were teaching.                                                   
                                                                               
 Number 0771                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked if this accounted for those who might             
 have received an endorsement based on the credits they took                   
 subsequent to their graduation.                                               
                                                                               
 Number 0786                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME answered that if they received credits, then he assumed            
 that it would have been covered.                                              
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER stated that it would not have been reflected            
 by their minor in college.                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 0793                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME clarified that whatever definition considered was used             
 in every single state.  Unless Alaska is peculiar in having many              
 more people picking up credits after they enter teaching, then it             
 should not change the fact that we are last in the nation.                    
                                                                               
 Number 0841                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON stated that he has heard frequent comments               
 that the methods course, while valuable, are amongst the most                 
 boring and poorly taught.  There is consistent grade inflation,               
 particularly among the soft sciences and arts, that begins to                 
 destroy the goal of excellence.                                               
                                                                               
 Number 0920                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME stated that grade inflation is part of what goes on when           
 individuals in the classrooms are not terribly well trained in the            
 subject they are teaching.  This situation is also the product of             
 other aspects of educational objectives.  Emphasis is placed in our           
 school system to help out the worst students.  Teachers pass                  
 students who are not ready to pass.  The Juneau School District               
 policy is to flunk no one, no matter how badly they do unless there           
 is some special request from the parents and the school people                
 agree to it.  This is called social promotion.                                
                                                                               
 Number 0970                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME explained that current research suggests that the United           
 States does not hire the best teachers, if best teachers are                  
 defined by their accomplishment in college and the quality of the             
 school they attended.  He felt that we must change the culture in             
 the schools and change the things that are looked for when teachers           
 are hired.  He strongly endorsed the sentiment behind HB 213.                 
                                                                               
 Number 1046                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked if he would apply this philosophy to              
 kindergarten through twelfth grade or just to high school.                    
                                                                               
 Number 1050                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME felt the HB 213 concept was correct for high school.               
 Changing the requirement to a minor in a subject would make a lot             
 of sense for teachers in the sixth through eighth grade level.  The           
 elementary level is an area where he would do the least amount of             
 tinkering.                                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 1087                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE commented that the elementary level has the greatest           
 impact on future learners.                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 1099                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN cited a personal experience where a teacher's            
 enthusiasm made him learn a subject that was personally difficult.            
                                                                               
 MR. REAUME responded that you can't get excited about a subject               
 unless you really know your subject well.                                     
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE stated that this is the first time this bill was               
 heard and it will be held for further testimony.                              
 HB 190 - SCHOOL CONSTRUCTION GRANT PROGRAM                                  
                                                                               
 Number 1152                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE announced the next item on the agenda as HB 190, "An           
 Act relating to the participating share for school construction               
 grants; and providing for an effective date."                                 
                                                                               
 Number 1167                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE REGGIE JOULE, Sponsor of HB 190, explained that when           
 a school district meets the listed criteria the commissioner will             
 waive the required match for school construction projects.  The               
 three criteria include: the assessed valuation per average daily              
 membership of $200,000 or less, currently in statute; have an                 
 unemployment rate of at least 10 percent; the average per capita              
 income of the district is 85 percent or less of the statewide                 
 average per capita income.  This criteria attempts to identify what           
 factors would best indicate districts with economic situations                
 leaving them with little ability to generate cash for their local             
 match.                                                                        
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE stated that HB 190 sets the stage so that a              
 district can see new construction and/or have the issue of deferred           
 maintenance addressed.  The school district will not feel that                
 because they cannot meet this required match amount they would                
 never see a project in their district.                                        
                                                                               
 Number 1270                                                                   
                                                                               
 DAVID BELL, Director of Property Services, Northwest Arctic School            
 District, testified next via teleconference from Kotzebue.  He                
 explained there were 12 village sites with 25 educational                     
 facilities.  The newest building is seven-years-old and the oldest            
 is 41-years-old.  Two buildings have had structural failures this             
 year.  A six year plan has been updated and sent to the borough.              
 This plan includes major maintenance items, renovation items and              
 construction items for new schools.  Currently the list represents            
 $66 million worth of items with a local contribution of $6.6                  
 million.  The school district does not have funds within its normal           
 operational budget to take care of these problems and so they are             
 deferred to the borough.  The borough has a difficult time meeting            
 the local match contribution for some of the larger projects.                 
                                                                               
 Number 1402                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN referred to the unemployment rate of 10                  
 percent or higher.  He asked if this would be measured on an                  
 average annual rate.                                                          
                                                                               
 Number 1415                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE answered that it would be based on the                   
 Department of Labor employment statistics, the average annual.                
                                                                               
 Number 1422                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN referred to an area that has a per capita                
 income of its residents at 85 percent or lower than the state                 
 average.  He thought some rural areas might have both a cash and a            
 barter economy.  He wondered if this fact might skew the criteria             
 in favor of rural areas.                                                      
                                                                               
 Number 1460                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE said the criteria would only be based on a               
 cash economy.                                                                 
                                                                               
 Number 1487                                                                   
                                                                               
 JOHN ATCHAK testified next via teleconference from Chevak.  He                
 stated that they have been talking about this for more than six               
 years.  The first school was built in 1951 and is still in use.               
 Some student housing is needed, there is a separation between the             
 buildings and this is why a new school is needed.                             
                                                                               
 Number 1614                                                                   
                                                                               
 GREG FLAST (Ph.) testified next via teleconference from Chevak.  He           
 said there are more enrollees in the kindergarten then the number             
 of the graduating class.  The current school was built for 180                
 enrollees and now there are 247 students enrolled in the school.              
 The proposed construction consists of a cost of over $20 million,             
 requiring a $500,000 local match.  There are no revenues in Chevak            
 which would fund this $500,000 match.                                         
                                                                               
 Number 1717                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. ATCHAK discussed the condition of the school and the separation           
 of the buildings.  He said there is no sprinkler system in the                
 schools.  At least 5 to 10 percent of students would get hurt or              
 die because of trampling for lack of fire escape routes, inadequate           
 classrooms and hallways.  The plumbing in the building is so                  
 deteriorated that the water is unfit for human consumption.  There            
 is too much iron and manganese in the plumbing.                               
                                                                               
 Number 1904                                                                   
                                                                               
 CHAIRMAN BUNDE turned the gavel over to Representative Green.                 
                                                                               
 Number 1916                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER stated that the section of statutes, that HB
 190 replaces, currently allows the commissioner to waive the                  
 requirement for a participating share in situations where a                   
 community can't meet it.                                                      
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE clarified that the current language is "may"             
 and HB 190 would change it to "shall".                                        
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER asked if he could obtain information                    
 regarding denials.                                                            
                                                                               
 Number 1950                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON felt that most communities outside of the                
 railbelt have a 10 percent unemployment rate.                                 
                                                                               
 Number 1972                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE pointed to information listing the 20                    
 districts which would meet all three criteria.  He said if an                 
 expanded version of unemployment statistics were used, then                   
 probably more districts would qualify.  The unemployment figures              
 change, year to year, so one year a district may qualify and the              
 next year they might not qualify depending on their level of                  
 activity.  Currently, 20 of the existing districts meet the                   
 criteria.  It recognizes that there are villages within other                 
 districts who don't make it.                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 2019                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN presented a scenario where District A                    
 qualified one or two years allowing construction to begin without             
 requiring a match, but then the next three years District A did not           
 meet the criteria.                                                            
                                                                               
 Number 2038                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE explained that there are two issues involving            
 capital dollars and accessing them; potential school construction             
 and major deferred maintenance.  He said the criteria for some of             
 these districts will probably not change, but he did not know how             
 to answer this particular situation.                                          
                                                                               
 Number 2063                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if the intent was to increase the amount           
 of funding or to reallocate the finite amount of money available.             
                                                                               
 Number 2081                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE stated that Chevak cannot meet the 2 percent             
 matching requirement, consisting of $500,000.  Chevak could not               
 meet the match for deferred maintenance.  This bill states that               
 these areas that meet the three criteria have very little cash.               
 These areas probably have a local sales tax and some of the slack             
 is attempted to be taken up by government assistance, but there               
 really isn't a tax base.  He stated that 85 percent of the                    
 population is under that income per capita, the community has                 
 double digit unemployment and there is devaluation.  The intent of            
 this legislation is to offer those communities, who need                      
 construction or deferred maintenance, some encouragement that they            
 would be able to complete some needed projects.  He said a 41-year-           
 old building is going to become a 60 and 70-year-old building if              
 communities cannot come up with the local match.                              
                                                                               
 Number 2168                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER referred to a bill which would change the               
 formula to allow other kinds of participation including land.                 
                                                                               
 TAPE 97-35, SIDE A                                                            
 Number 0000                                                                   
                                                                               
 MICHAEL A. MORGAN, PMP, Manager, Facilities Section, Education                
 Support Services, Department of Education, stated that there is a             
 current department regulation which allows an in-kind contribution            
 by districts where labor, equipment materials or land can be used             
 to meet the local match requirement.                                          
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN clarified that this is an existing regulation.           
                                                                               
 Number 0043                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE explained that the contractors have issues of            
 liability, in terms of people getting out there to volunteer their            
 work.  People will expect to get paid for specialty work,                     
 especially in places where there is high unemployment.  He thought            
 that this was a potential avenue, but there are also issues of                
 liability, recognizing that the contractors and construction people           
 are coming in from the urban areas of the state and would have                
 insurance considerations.                                                     
                                                                               
 Number 0161                                                                   
                                                                               
 B. A. WEINBERG, Lobbyist, Kashunamiut School District, said                   
 legislation providing a local share contained a provision allowing            
 the commissioner to grant a waiver.  The department's policy on               
 granting waivers is so restrictive that it is virtually impossible            
 to get a waiver.  To the best of his knowledge, a waiver has never            
 been granted.  The school district he represents has simply stopped           
 asking for waivers.                                                           
                                                                               
 MR. WEINBERG explained that local governments with little property            
 wealth, low income and high unemployment are already strained to              
 provide the most basic kinds of public services.  The burden of the           
 local share would cause those meager services to be reduced even              
 further.                                                                      
                                                                               
 MR. WEINBERG stated that the Kashunamiut is number one on the 1998            
 priority list.  The current school is documented to be a life                 
 safety hazard, it is educationally inadequate and is at 189 percent           
 of capacity in terms of enrollment.  He said 98 percent of those              
 students are Alaska Natives, 84 percent have limited English                  
 proficiency and 79 percent live below the poverty level.  If this             
 project were to be funded, the school district would have to come             
 up with approximately $484,000.  The only practical place this                
 money could come from is the operating budget.  There are in-kind             
 methods of funding, but as a practical matter a contractor is not             
 going to be able to put in a bid based on the fact that he is going           
 to get $500,000 in volunteer labor.  The school district has been             
 negotiating with the DOE for about three years to use land in lieu            
 of their participating share.  Those negotiations are still                   
 inconclusive.  Based on what has been said, the school district has           
 no expectation that the land will be allowed.  The only practical             
 place for that money to come from is out of the operating budget.             
                                                                               
 Number 0394                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN suggested that it was difficult to incorporate           
 manpower into a construction or a renovation project, but added               
 that it could be a possibility.                                               
                                                                               
 Number 0481                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE JOULE answered that this is a real dilemma.  There             
 is a school in his district which used to be at the top of the list           
 of needs.  He said when it was at the top, the Northwest Arctic               
 Borough School District couldn't come up with the required match.             
 Since then, this school has dropped down to number five.  This                
 school has the library in the hall and the high school is in a                
 building without restroom facilities.  He said there are schools              
 like this throughout the rural areas.                                         
                                                                               
 Number 0531                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER clarified that the plan in Chevak would be to           
 create a replacement facility.  He suggested that demolition could            
 be possible and labor from the village could be utilized.                     
                                                                               
 Number 0566                                                                   
                                                                               
 MR. WEINBERG explained that the existing facility belongs to the              
 state.  The school district's position would be to turn over the              
 existing building to the state.  The state could demolish it, give            
 it away or whatever.  The new school is intended for a separate               
 space.                                                                        
                                                                               
 Number 0584                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER suggested that if it were slated for                    
 demolition, labor used to demolish it could be used as a cost for             
 the project.                                                                  
 ADJOURNMENT                                                                   
                                                                               
 There being no further business to conduct, REPRESENTATIVE GREEN              
 adjourned the meeting of the House Health, Education and Social               
 Services Standing Committee at 5:22 p.m.                                      
                                                                               

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