SENATE STATE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE April 16, 1998 3:37 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Senator Lyda Green, Chairman Senator Jerry Ward, Vice-Chairman Senator Jerry Mackie Senator Mike Miller MEMBERS ABSENT Senator Jim Duncan COMMITTEE CALENDAR CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 462(STA) "An Act relating to the contents of certain state documents." - MOVED SCS CSHB 462(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE SENATE BILL NO. 348 "An Act relating to rights of conscience protection for persons who directly or indirectly provide or perform health care services." - MOVED CSSB 348(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 264(FIN) "An Act relating to negotiated regulation making; and providing for an effective date." - HEARD AND HELD IN COMMITTEE PREVIOUS SENATE COMMITTEE ACTION HB 462 - No previous action to record. SB 348 - See State Affairs minutes dated 4/7/98. HB 264 - No previous action to record. WITNESS REGISTER Representative Gene Therriault State Capitol Juneau, AK 99801-1182 POSITION STATEMENT: Prime Sponsor of HB 462 Jack Kreinheder, Senior Policy Analyst Office of Management & Budget Office of the Governor P.O. Box 110020 Juneau, AK 99801-0020 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in opposition to CSHB 462(STA) Walt Wilcox, Staff to Representative Jeannette James State Capitol Juneau, AK 99801-1182 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on behalf of sponsor of HB 264 Ms. Deborah Behr, Assistant Attorney General Legislation & Regulations Section Department of Law P.O. Box 110300 Juneau, AK 99811-0300 POSITION STATEMENT: Offered information on CSHB 264(FIN) Ms. Pam La Bolle Alaska State Chamber of Commerce 217 2nd St., #201 Juneau, AK 99801 POSITION STATEMENT: Outlined concerns with CSHB 264(FIN) ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 98-17, SIDE A Number 001 CHAIRMAN GREEN called the Senate State Affairs Committee to order at 3:37 p.m., and noted the presence of Senators Ward, Mackie, Miller and Green. CSHB 462(STA) - USE OF STATE MONEY FOR IMAGES/MESSAGES CHAIRMAN GREEN brought CSHB 462(STA) before the committee as the first order of business. REPRESENTATIVE GENE THERRIAULT, prime sponsor of HB 462, directed attention to the current version of the legislation and said there is some concern with the language on page 1, lines 12 and 13 where the limitation on the longevity bonus check stub is "limited to stating the requirements or deadlines of a program." He said that language is pretty tightly worded and he suggested changing that wording to "relating to the program." The restriction would not be so tightly worded and it would still be a prohibition on any message coming from an elected official; however, the people that are involved in the program would have a little bit more latitude. He said the legislation is designed to curtail the increasingly prevalent practice of using state publications for further personal political agendas, and it would not preclude information related to the overall operation of the program. Number 075 SENATOR WARD moved the following amendment to CSHB 462(STA): Amendment No. 1 Page 1, lines 12 - 13: Delete "limited to stating the requirements or deadlines of" and insert "related to" Hearing no objection, the amendment was adopted to be incorporated into a SCS CSHB 462(STA). In his closing comments, REPRESENTATIVE THERRIAULT emphasized that the purpose of the legislation it to prevent the underlying programs behind these application and check stubs from becoming politicized because there have been examples in the past where the Administration has taken some steps that have moved towards that. Number 110 JACK KREINHEDER, Senior Analyst, Office of Management & Budget, stated the Administration is opposed to HB 462. It is there view that the Governor is the chief executive officer of the state and, as such, any Governor should have the prerogative to communicate freely with the people of the state. Mr. Kreinheder made reference to the Governor's letter in last year's permanent fund dividend application booklet, and he said it was not a political message; it simply discusses the importance of the permanent fund, the fund's success, and it encourages people to apply in a timely manner. He also noted there has been discussion about the size of the Governor's picture on the booklet, but he pointed out that it was something initiated entirely at the division. Mr. Kreinheder commented that the bill appears to be an election year bill and they should be flattered that the Legislature is considering adopting it. He said it seems to imply that there is some confidence that this Administration will be around in the next election cycle as well. Number 140 CHAIRMAN GREEN stated she took exception to Mr. Kreinheder's remarks because she doesn't think it would be appropriate for any Governor to be involved in this practice. She added that it isn't only the message in the permanent fund dividend booklet that has outraged her constituents, but messages on longevity bonus stubs as well. She said there has been an inappropriate use of going into homes with various mailings, and they need to be curtailed regardless of who occupies the third floor. Number 150 SENATOR WARD asked Mr. Kreinheder if he thinks the legislation will stop the Governor from running quarter-page ads with his picture on it in the newspapers. MR. KREINHEDER responded that the legislation only applies to application forms, warrants or direct deposit notices. Number 160 SENATOR MILLER moved SCS CSHB 462(STA) and the accompanying zero fiscal note be passed out of committee with individual recommendations. Hearing no objection, it was so ordered. Number 175 SB 348 - RIGHTS OF CONSCIENCE PROTECTION CHAIRMAN GREEN brought SB 348 before the committee as the next order of business. There was a new proposed committee substitute before the committee for its consideration. SENATOR WARD moved adoption of CSSB 348(STA), version "F." There being no objection, CHAIRMAN GREEN stated the committee substitute was adopted as a working document. SENATOR WARD moved CSSB 348(STA) and the accompanying zero fiscal note be passed out of committee with individual recommendations. Hearing no objection, it was so ordered. CSHB 264(FIN) - NEGOTIATED REGULATION MAKING CHAIRMAN GREEN brought CSHB 264(FIN) before the committee as the final order of business. WALT WILCOX, staff to Representative Jeannette James who is prime sponsor of HB 264, said the legislation enables and encourages negotiated regulation/rule making. Currently, negotiated regulation making is in use by the Federal Government, the states of Montana and Nebraska, as well as several other states. Mr. Wilcox stated that the citizens of Alaska have been hounding Representative James and the Administrative Regulation Review Committee for changes in the regulation review process for several years, and this is one solution wherein regulations that are very complex can bring the impacted parties to the table prior to the promulgation of the regulations, bringing in industry and other interested parties to help formulate their ideas and policies for the regulations before they are actually written. Mr. Wilcox related that with the current process, the commissioner promulgates the regulations and puts them out for public hearing and they are somewhat cast in concrete. HB 264 will provide the opportunity, especially in complex regulations such as air regs, water regs and airport regs, to bring the impacted members in first. The Administrative Procedures Act will be followed after the process. It is purely a voluntary process to be used or not used by the commissioner. Although it will cost more up front to do, it appears that it will cost less in the long run. Mr. Wilcox pointed out that the Administration is in support of HB 264, and he noted Deborah Behr of the Department of Law has been working closely with the sponsor on the drafting of the legislation. Number 255 CHAIRMAN GREEN asked how the process works under negotiated rule making. DEBORAH BEHR, Assistant Attorney General, Department of Law, said negotiated rule making is not what would be done in the average rule making process because it involves calling a committee together, having the committee meet, so it is intended to be for the larger more complex projects. Outlining the process, Ms. Behr explained that the commissioner would decide, based on their factors, whether negotiated rule making would be appropriate under the circumstance. After the commissioner decides whether or not it is appropriate to have negotiated rule making, the commissioner would give notice to the public of the intent to set up a committee. Once the committee is selected, the agency puts someone on the committee who could speak for the department and would have a sense of what is going on there. The committee meets in a public meeting and issues a report if they reach consensus. If a committee consensus is not reached, then there would be a majority and a minority report and the commissioner could pick and choose what is appropriate. The entire APA process is then initiated. The commissioner makes the ultimate decision on the negotiated regulation and, at that point, it goes to through the Department of Law for review before going to the Lieutenant Governor's office. Ms. Behr said the intent of negotiated regulation/rule making is to bring more people into the process. She added that she is a firm believer that the more people involved, the more information people bring into the process, information that the committee might not otherwise have access to in developing a regulation. Number 333 PAM LA BOLLE, representing the Alaska State Chamber of Commerce, stated they think the idea of the process of is commendable, but they do have three concerns with the legislation. Those concerns include: (1) The legislation is open ended as far as a time frame. If the negotiation process continued over a long period of time, a lot of company time and resources could be eaten up; (2) The individual serving on the committee at the start of a negotiation process should be the same one who finishes that process; and (3) There is concern that if industry does not want to participate in the process, a substitute for industry that doesn't really adequately represent industry will be brought in and thereby forcing the industry to come to the table. Ms. La Bolle said the Alaska State Chamber would like to see some parameters put on how large this process would become and how long it could go on, and that it truly be voluntary so no one can be forced to participate. Number 396 SENATOR MACKIE asked Ms. La Bolle if she had discussed these concerns with the sponsor and staff. MS. LA BOLLE answered that she had not had the opportunity to do so as yet. MR. WILCOX said he thought her concerns could be worked out with one small amendment. There being no further testimony on HB 264, CHAIRMAN GREEN stated the legislation would be held in committee until the following week for a possible amendment. She then adjourned the meeting at 4:12 p.m.