ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
              SENATE JUDICIARY STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                         March 7, 2018                                                                                          
                           1:33 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Senator John Coghill, Chair                                                                                                     
Senator Mia Costello                                                                                                            
Senator Pete Kelly                                                                                                              
Senator Bill Wielechowski                                                                                                       
Senator Click Bishop                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 124                                                                                                             
"An  Act relating  to the  duties of  physicians and  health care                                                               
practitioners  when performing  or inducing  abortions; providing                                                               
that a child removed from a  pregnant woman's womb alive after an                                                               
abortion may  be surrendered and found  to be a child  in need of                                                               
aid; and providing for an effective date."                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 109                                                                                                             
"An  Act relating  to background  investigation requirements  for                                                               
state  employees  whose  job duties  require  access  to  certain                                                               
federal tax information; relating  to persons under contract with                                                               
the  state  with  access  to  certain  federal  tax  information;                                                               
establishing  state personnel  procedures  required for  employee                                                               
access to certain  federal tax information; and  providing for an                                                               
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 124                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: ABORTION PROCEDURES; CHILD SURRENDER                                                                               
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) GIESSEL                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
01/16/18       (S)       PREFILE RELEASED 1/8/18                                                                                
01/16/18       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
01/16/18       (S)       HSS, JUD                                                                                               
02/19/18       (S)       HSS AT 1:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
02/19/18       (S)       Moved SB 124 Out of Committee                                                                          
02/19/18       (S)       MINUTE(HSS)                                                                                            
02/21/18       (S)       HSS RPT  1DP 1DNP 3NR                                                                                  
02/21/18       (S)       NR: WILSON, VON IMHOF, MICCICHE                                                                        
02/21/18       (S)       DP: GIESSEL                                                                                            
02/21/18       (S)       DNP: BEGICH                                                                                            
02/21/18       (S)       FIN REFERRAL ADDED AFTER JUD                                                                           
03/07/18       (S)       JUD AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 105 (TSBldg)                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 109                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: CRIM HIST CHECK: ST EMPLOYEES/CONTRACTORS                                                                          
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
04/07/17       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/07/17       (S)       JUD, FIN                                                                                               
03/07/18       (S)       JUD AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 105 (TSBldg)                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR CATHY GIESSEL                                                                                                           
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of SB 124.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
KARI NORE, Staff                                                                                                                
Senator Cathy Giessel                                                                                                           
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT: Delivered the sectional analysis for SB 124,                                                              
version U:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
GENEVIEVE WOJTUSIK, Legislative Liaison                                                                                         
Department of Revenue                                                                                                           
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT: Introduced SB 109 on behalf of the                                                                        
administration.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CAROL BEECHER, Director                                                                                                         
Division of Child Support Services                                                                                              
Department of Revenue (DOR)                                                                                                     
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions related to SB 109.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
ERIC GAFFNEY, Records and Licensing Supervisor                                                                                  
Criminal Records Identification Bureau                                                                                          
Department of Public Safety                                                                                                     
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions related to SB 109.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BRANDON SPANOS, Deputy Director                                                                                                 
Tax Division                                                                                                                    
Department of Revenue (DOR)                                                                                                     
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions related to SB 109.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                              
1:33:16 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  JOHN   COGHILL  called   the  Senate   Judiciary  Standing                                                             
Committee meeting  to order at 1:33  p.m. Present at the  call to                                                               
order were  Senators Costello,  Bishop, Kelly,  Wielechowski, and                                                               
Chair Coghill.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
          SB 124-ABORTION PROCEDURES; CHILD SURRENDER                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:34:21 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL announced the consideration of SB 124.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
1:36:04 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR CATHY GIESSEL, Alaska  State Legislature, Juneau, Alaska,                                                               
sponsor of  SB 124, said  the purpose  of this legislation  is to                                                               
give babies the  opportunity to be born alive. The  bill lays out                                                               
the following guidelines:                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     When performing  or inducing an abortion  the physician                                                                    
     shall   use  the   method   that   provides  the   best                                                                    
     opportunity for the unborn child to survive.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     A child  born alive  as a result  of an  abortion shall                                                                    
     receive  the same  degree of  professional skill,  care                                                                    
     and diligence  to preserve the  life and health  of the                                                                    
     child as  a child born  in the course of  natural birth                                                                    
     at the same fetal age.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     A child  born alive as a  result of an abortion  may be                                                                    
     surrendered  to  a  physician or  an  employee  of  the                                                                    
     hospital or facility where the abortion is performed.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
        A child born alive as a result of an abortion is                                                                        
     considered to be a child in need of aid if the parent                                                                      
     is unwilling or unable to care for the child.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
        This bill applies to all abortions performed or                                                                         
       induced after the effective date. u This bill take                                                                       
     effect immediately.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     This bill take effect immediately.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  said in  Roe v.  Wade, 410  U.S. 113  (1973) the                                                               
Supreme  Court  maintained that  the  state  has an  interest  in                                                               
protecting  the life  of a  fetus  after viability.  That is  the                                                               
point at which the fetus is capable of living outside the womb.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
She  said  the  protection  of fetal  life  after  viability  has                                                               
biological justifications  and may proscribe abortion  during the                                                               
period of viability,  except when necessary to  preserve the life                                                               
and health of the mother.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR   GIESSEL  referenced   Planned  Parenthood   of  Central                                                               
Missouri v. Danforth,  428 U.S. 52, 63(1976), 410 U.  S., at 160,                                                               
163. That  court upheld  the definition of  viability in  Roe. It                                                               
signifies the  point at which  the fetus is "potentially  able to                                                               
live outside the mother's womb,  albeit with artificial aid," and                                                               
presumably  capable  of  "meaningful life  outside  the  mother's                                                               
womb,".                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
She also referenced Whitner v.  State of South Carolina, 328 S.C.                                                               
1, 7-8  (S.C.1997) that addressed  the issue  of when a  fetus is                                                               
entitled to protection.  That court held that a  viable fetus was                                                               
a  "person" for  the purposes  of  the Children's  Code in  South                                                               
Carolina.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:39:38 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GIESSEL  summarized some  of the  sentinel events  in the                                                               
development  of a  fetus.  Week  5: vital  organs  form; week  8:                                                               
eyelids  form; week  6:  brain waves  detected;  week 9;  sucking                                                               
thumb and yawning.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
She continued to describe fetal development:                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Fetal development 14 weeks after conception.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Finger Pads -2nd and 3rd months of pregnancy. 3rd and                                                                      
       4th months - the buckling and folding of this skin                                                                       
     layer is partially responsible  for the unique stresses                                                                    
     in  fingertip   pads.  Ridges,   the  faint   lines  on                                                                    
     fingertips  that are  the foundation  of finger  prints                                                                    
     start developing around this time.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL  advised  that  at this  stage  of  development,                                                               
removing  the  fetus  from  the   uterus  requires  dilation  and                                                               
evacuation.  She  said  the  new   term  for  this  procedure  is                                                               
dismemberment.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Fetal development 23 weeks after conception.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     By six  months of  age fingerprints and  footprints are                                                                    
     fully  developed. Three  main  patterns have  developed                                                                    
     from   the  ridges   (arches,  loops,   whorls).  These                                                                    
     patterns on  the fingertips, palms  and soles  are used                                                                    
     to grasp things.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL said  it's been  documented that  by 20  weeks a                                                               
fetus feels  pain. At 24  weeks there  is response to  sound. She                                                               
noted that in Alaska abortion is allowed at this stage.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Fetal development 27 weeks after conception:                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Baby's eyelids  can partially  open and  eyelashes have                                                                    
     formed. The central nervous  system can direct rhythmic                                                                    
     breathing movements and control body temperature.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Fetal development 31 weeks after conception:                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Baby's eyes can open wide.  Red blood cells are forming                                                                    
     in  your  baby's  bone   marrow.  Baby's  toenails  are                                                                    
     visible.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said a baby  would be considered term approaching                                                               
37  weeks.  She  noted  that  in  Alaska  an  abortion  could  be                                                               
performed at this stage.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said  the concept of SB 124 is  that babies would                                                               
have the  best opportunity  to survive at  the age  of viability.                                                               
She made the following points:                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
   · In the second trimester, 96 percent of abortion procedures                                                                 
      are dilatation and evacuation. This is also called                                                                        
      dismemberment.                                                                                                            
   · The Centers for Disease Control reports, in 2014 that 9                                                                    
      percent of all abortions are performed on these very                                                                      
      developed babies.                                                                                                         
   · In the U.S. about 100,000 babies each year are aborted                                                                     
      using the D&E procedure.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL discussed  the  following  points regarding  the                                                               
dismemberment procedure.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
   · It is never medically necessary to preserve the life of the                                                                
     mother in acute medical emergencies.                                                                                       
   · Dilation of the cervix takes at least 36 hours                                                                             
   · It is often guided by ultrasound, forceps grip each                                                                        
     extremity and tears it off.                                                                                                
   · The head must be crushed to remove it.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:45:45 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GIESSEL  discussed survival  rate estimates  at different                                                               
gestational ages.  At 23  weeks or  less, the  potential survival                                                               
rate is about  35 percent. The estimates rise  as gestational age                                                               
increases.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
She displayed data to show  that other states and countries limit                                                               
the  age  after which  an  abortion  may be  performed.  Multiple                                                               
states  identify 20  weeks  as the  limit and  20  states ban  an                                                               
abortion once  there is viability.  She said the bill  takes that                                                               
into account  and requires  the doctor to  deliver a  viable baby                                                               
with the best chance of survival.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  said some  people oppose  the bill  because they                                                               
don't believe it would make  a meaningful difference. She's heard                                                               
the argument  that it would  only save  2-3 lives in  Alaska. She                                                               
maintained that vastly underestimates  the impact and pointed out                                                               
that every life matters.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
She  displayed  pictures  of  Alaskan  children  who  have  Downs                                                               
Syndrome and noted that in  Iceland pregnant women are tested for                                                               
this  genetic disorder.  Parents  of children  with this  genetic                                                               
disorder are  told they will  be responsible for the  medical and                                                               
special education  costs for  their child. She  said the  test is                                                               
only 85 percent  accurate and she suspects  many children without                                                               
Downs Syndrome are aborted.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:50:01 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GIESSEL noted  that Oskar Schindler received a  ring at a                                                               
reunion  with  Jewish  people  whose   lives  he  saved.  It  was                                                               
inscribed  with a  quote  from the  Talmud  that said,  "…whoever                                                               
saves a life,  it is considered as if he  saved an entire world."                                                               
She said that's what this bill is about.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
She cited  a recent poll in  which 76 percent said  that abortion                                                               
should be  limited after the end  of the first trimester.  To the                                                               
question  of whether  abortion should  be prohibited  for genetic                                                               
issues, 64  percent agreed.  She maintained that  the bill  is in                                                               
keeping  with  the sentiments  of  Americans.  Eight states  have                                                               
identified 20  weeks as  the cutoff  for abortion  and challenges                                                               
have  been raised  in six  of those  states. She  said SB  124 is                                                               
modeled after  the federal  bill that failed  to pass  the Senate                                                               
last  month. The  only  difference  is that  this  bill does  not                                                               
identify the age of viability and  it does not provide a penalty.                                                               
She advised that she would not  oppose adding those things to the                                                               
bill.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:52:32 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  KELLY asked  her to  clarify  that nothing  in the  bill                                                               
encourages  abortions   for  genetic  disorders  such   as  Downs                                                               
Syndrome.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  said she called  out Iceland to  demonstrate how                                                               
far an abortion mandate can  go. She added, "These are productive                                                               
individuals and absolutely should be  given the opportunity to be                                                               
born alive."                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
1:53:42 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI said his research  shows that the earliest a                                                               
premature baby can survive is 21 weeks  and 4 or 5 days. He asked                                                               
if she agrees.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL replied that is  approximately correct at present                                                               
but  technology  is  always  improving, which  is  why  the  bill                                                               
doesn't identify an age of viability.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI directed attention  to the DHSS 2016 Induced                                                               
Termination of  Pregnancy Statistics publication that  her office                                                               
provided.  On  page  6  it  says that  99.5  percent  of  induced                                                               
terminations  in  Alaska  were  performed at  13  weeks  or  less                                                               
gestational age. He asked if she had any reason to dispute that.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said no.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL said this is an issue  that is near and dear to his                                                               
heart  and  he  appreciates  the  sponsor  bringing  it  forward.                                                               
Abortion is  a question  that is  discussed as  a moral  issue, a                                                               
legal  issue, and  a  political  issue but  it's  really a  child                                                               
issue. Roe v. Wade made it  a legal issue and people like himself                                                               
are trying to value a life under  the rule of law in the best way                                                               
possible. People  who are very,  very prolife don't  believe this                                                               
bill goes  far enough. It  preserves the woman's right  and still                                                               
gives the child a chance to be treated well.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
He asked Ms. Nore to go through the sectional analysis.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:57:25 PM                                                                                                                    
KARI   NORE,  Staff,   Senator   Cathy   Giessel,  Alaska   State                                                               
Legislature  Juneau,  Alaska  provided  the  following  sectional                                                               
analysis for SB 124, version U:                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Section   1:  Amends   AS  18.16.010   by  adding   new                                                                    
     subsections  to  provide for  a  physician  to use  the                                                                    
     method of terminating the  pregnancy that best provides                                                                    
     for the  unborn child  to survive outside  the mother's                                                                    
     womb. It  requires health practitioners present  at the                                                                    
     procedure to  exercise the same degree  of professional                                                                    
     practice  and diligence  to preserve  the  life of  the                                                                    
     viable child born as would  be provided to a child born                                                                    
     through   the  course   of   natural  birth.   Provides                                                                    
     definitions    for   "alive,"    "clinical   judgment,"                                                                    
     "fertilization," and "fetal age."                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Section  2: Amends  AS 18.16  by adding  a new  section                                                                    
     that would allow a parent  of a child born alive during                                                                    
     the process of an abortion  to surrender the child to a                                                                    
     physician or  employee of the  hospital. The  person to                                                                    
     whom  the child  had been  surrendered will  notify the                                                                    
     Department of  Health and  Social Services  as required                                                                    
     under AS 47.10.013(d).                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Section 3: Amends AS 47.10.011  and adds a provision in                                                                    
     the Child  in Need  of Aid (CINA)  statue to  include a                                                                    
     child born alive during the  termination of a pregnancy                                                                    
     whose parent  is unwilling  or unable  to care  for the                                                                    
     infant.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Section 4: Adds an  applicability provision that states                                                                    
     that  AS   18.16.010(k)-(m),  added   by  Sec.   1,  AS                                                                    
     18.16.012,  added  by  Sec. 2,  and  AS  47.10.011,  as                                                                    
     amended  by  Sec. 3  apply  to  abortions performed  or                                                                    
     induced  on  or  after  the effective  dates  of  those                                                                    
     sections.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
      Section 5: Provides for an immediate effective date                                                                       
     for this Act                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
1:59:25 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI referenced  the language  in Section  1 and                                                               
asked which methods of abortion allow for a child to survive.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said that would be an induced delivery.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI asked  if a  hysterotomy (c  section) is  a                                                               
safer method of abortion.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  said yes, and if  it's a question of  saving the                                                               
mother's life, a c section would be done.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if a c section is major surgery.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  replied some regard  it as that but  it's become                                                               
rather minimal surgery.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  said the information he's  seen indicates a                                                               
woman who has had a c section  stays in the hospital 2-3 days and                                                               
is recommended  to stay off work  for six weeks. He  asked if she                                                               
agreed.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said it depends  on the woman and her fundamental                                                               
health.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL  said his daughter had  twins with a c  section and                                                               
she had two  days of rest with  the twins and then  she went back                                                               
to work.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  referenced a document from  the Mayo Clinic                                                               
that  said,  "After  a  c  section you  face  a  higher  risk  of                                                               
potentially  serious  complications  in a  subsequent  pregnancy,                                                               
including  problems with  the placenta."  He asked  if she  would                                                               
agree with that statement.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  replied a  phenomenal number  of c  sections are                                                               
done in  this country. It's become  a very common way  to deliver                                                               
babies and  it's an  overstatement to  say it  jeopardizes future                                                               
pregnancies or the life of the mother.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI responded that it's  a direct quote from the                                                               
Mayo Clinic. Noting  that 21 weeks and 4 days  was the earliest a                                                               
premature  baby has  survived,  he asked  how  many abortions  in                                                               
Alaska in the last five years were done after 21 weeks.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL replied those numbers are  on page 11 of the DHSS                                                               
2016  Induced Termination  of  Pregnancy Statistics  publication.                                                               
She  directed attention  to the  category of  "Not Stated"  which                                                               
could mean  those not wanting  to admit the  age of the  child at                                                               
the time of the abortion.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if she  agrees that in 2016 there were                                                               
zero abortions at 21-24 weeks.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL agreed  and pointed  out that  four were  in the                                                               
"Not Stated" category  and two are in the 17  to 20-week bracket.                                                               
She said  technology is  always improving  and she  believes that                                                               
every life is worth saving.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  noted that  the lowest  recorded age  for a                                                               
surviving  fetus  in  the  world  is 21  weeks.  He  asked  if  a                                                               
physician  would  be required  to  perform  a different  type  of                                                               
abortion procedure on fetuses under 21 weeks.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL  requested  he  share   the  document  with  world                                                               
statistics  with  the committee.  He  asked  him to  restate  the                                                               
question.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  said a baby born  May 20, 1987 at  21 weeks                                                               
and five  days was the  earliest premature  baby in the  world. A                                                               
more recent  document said a baby  was born at 21  weeks and four                                                               
days. If  the bill passes, he  asked if physicians would  have to                                                               
perform induced labor or a  hysterotomy if the gestational age is                                                               
younger than 21 weeks and four days.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL replied it is  left to the professional judgement                                                               
of  the physician.  She  added that  because  gestational age  is                                                               
often incorrect,  it's not  advisable to set  a specific  date in                                                               
these situations.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL  asked if ultrasound  or other technology  helps to                                                               
determine gestational age.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  confirmed that ultrasounds  are very  helpful in                                                               
determining gestational age and viability.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  noted  that  since 1999,  0.5  percent  of                                                               
abortions  are done  at 13  weeks or  earlier. He  asked if  it's                                                               
possible  to induce  labor or  perform a  hysterotomy that  would                                                               
save the life of a child at 13 weeks gestational age.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL said  the  bill doesn't  limit  the age  because                                                               
technology advances may make that possible at some point.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR COGHILL commented on technologic  advances in other areas                                                               
and said,  "We're continually  trying to figure  out ways  how we                                                               
guard that life."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI   asked  if  it's  accurate   that  if  the                                                               
technology  were to  improve, any  woman who  wanted an  abortion                                                               
would need to have a c section.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL  replied the  bill  doesn't  make that  dramatic                                                               
statement.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked  if she would agree  that's the effect                                                               
of the bill.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR   GIESSEL  clarified   that  the   bill  says,   "In  the                                                               
professional judgment  of the physician,  if viability  is likely                                                               
then  the best  opportunity for  survival  must be  given to  the                                                               
baby."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked  if there are criminal  penalties if a                                                               
physician violates the provision.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL said  she  purposely did  not  include that  but                                                               
would  welcome an  amendment. The  physician is  required to  use                                                               
their ethical and professional judgment.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:11:42 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI directed  attention  to page  2 lines  5-7,                                                               
that  defines "alive."  He asked  if "spontaneous  respiratory or                                                               
cardiac function or  pulsation of the umbilical  cord means after                                                               
removal from the womb.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said yes.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  said he assumes pulsation  of the umbilical                                                               
cord happens very early on.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  said pulsation of  the umbilical  cord indicates                                                               
the circulatory system is functioning.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL said  if he  were to  look at  accountability he'd                                                               
start  with the  reporting.  He  opined that  based  on the  2016                                                               
report, the DHSS fiscal note will be easy to challenge.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI directed  attention to  the definitions  of                                                               
induced termination  procedures in Appendix  A on page 18  and 19                                                               
of the DHSS 2016 report. Noting  that she said that induced labor                                                               
and a  hysterotomy provided the  best opportunity for  the unborn                                                               
child  to survive,  he asked  which  of the  procedures would  be                                                               
induced labor.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said  none of the listed  procedures would result                                                               
in a live  birth. "There's no way that  induced delivery, induced                                                               
labor would be listed here. It's not a way to kill the baby."                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:16:58 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI read  the language on page 1,  lines 7-9. He                                                               
said  if  induced  labor  isn't   a  method  of  terminating  the                                                               
pregnancy, that  leaves a  hysterotomy or  c section.  Should the                                                               
bill pass, every  woman in Alaska who wants an  abortion would be                                                               
required to get  a c section if the physician  determines that is                                                               
the best way to  save the child. He asked if  she agreed with his                                                               
reading.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL said  she was somewhat tempted to  suggest he was                                                               
practicing medicine without a license.  She said the normal way a                                                               
pregnancy is  terminated is  with the delivery  of the  baby. The                                                               
methods listed on  page 18 of the report  are induced termination                                                               
procedures that do not result in a live birth.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI  said he didn't  have any  medical expertise                                                               
but the  language in Section 1  seems to leave a  woman who wants                                                               
to  terminate a  pregnancy with  the only  option of  having a  c                                                               
section.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  KELLY read  the definition  of  "Induced Termination  of                                                               
Pregnancy" on page  18 of the report and said  he didn't think it                                                               
followed that the woman would have to have a c section.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL  added that termination  of pregnancy  that results                                                               
in a live birth  would be added to the statutes  if the bill were                                                               
to pass.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:20:03 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR GIESSEL said the subject of  c section came up because it                                                               
is a method of terminating a  pregnancy that would be employed if                                                               
it were an  emergency procedure to save the mother's  life. A D&E                                                               
is not an emergency procedure because  it takes at least 36 hours                                                               
to dilate the cervix.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked  for   confirmation  that  the  bill                                                               
doesn't seek to ban D&Es.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL replied it is a procedure called dismemberment.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked  if  she  was  seeking  to  ban  the                                                               
procedure.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR GIESSEL  responded that  the procedure  involves dilating                                                               
the  cervix  and  entering  it   with  a  tool  that  grasps  and                                                               
dismembers pieces of babies.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL said  that  for some  people,  the controversy  is                                                               
there should never be any dismemberment.  Not at at any stage. He                                                               
agrees  with  that viewpoint.  The  bill  maintains the  mother's                                                               
right to  terminate the  pregnancy and  directs the  physician to                                                               
use their clinical  judgment and use the  procedure that provides                                                               
the  best  opportunity  for  the unborn  child  to  survive.  The                                                               
question of viability rests with the physician.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  GIESSEL confirmed  that viability  is the  basis of  the                                                               
bill.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL  thanked the  sponsor  for  the introduction.  His                                                               
intention   is  to   take  public   testimony  Monday,   consider                                                               
amendments on  Wednesday, and move  the bill either  Wednesday or                                                               
Friday.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:23:10 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL held SB 124 in committee.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:23:14 PM                                                                                                                    
At ease                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
        SB 109-CRIM HIST CHECK: ST EMPLOYEES/CONTRACTORS                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:30:24 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR   COGHILL  reconvened   the  meeting   and  announced   the                                                               
consideration of SB 109.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:31:26 PM                                                                                                                    
GENEVIEVE WOJTUSIK,  Legislative Liaison, Department  of Revenue,                                                               
Juneau,  Alaska, said  SB  109 relates  to  background checks  of                                                               
state employees. The September 30,  2016 Internal Revenue Service                                                               
(IRS)  publication   1075  has   new  guidelines   that  requires                                                               
individuals who have access to federal data to undergo a                                                                        
background check. The state is not in compliance with the                                                                       
fingerprinting requirement in that publication.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
She provided the following sectional analysis for SB 109:                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Section  1   Amends  AS  12.62.400  by   adding  a  new                                                                    
     subsection. This  will require an agency  to submit the                                                                    
     fingerprints  of current  or  prospective employees  or                                                                    
     contractors whose job duties  require access to federal                                                                    
     tax  information  (defined  in AS  39.55.015(e)(3)  and                                                                    
     36.30.960(d)(3))  to the  Department  of Public  Safety                                                                    
     for submission  to the Federal Bureau  of Investigation                                                                    
     to obtain a criminal  history record. Defines "agency",                                                                    
     "employee" and "contractor".                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Section  2 Amends  AS 36.30  by adding  a new  section.                                                                    
     This  section  establishes state  personnel  procedures                                                                    
     for obtaining  and submitting fingerprints  for current                                                                    
     or  prospective  contractors  if a  contract  with  the                                                                    
     state  requires  access  to  federal  tax  information.                                                                    
     Defines   "agency",  "contractor"   and  "federal   tax                                                                    
     information".                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Section 3  Amends AS 39  by adding a new  chapter. This                                                                    
     new  chapter   addresses  state   personnel  procedures                                                                    
     related to federal tax information.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Adds AS 39.55.010                                                                                                          
     This section  explains the purpose of  the chapter-- to                                                                    
     establish   procedures   to   safeguard   federal   tax                                                                    
     information   which  will   apply  to   a  current   or                                                                    
     prospective  state employee  whose  job duties  require                                                                    
     access to federal tax information.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Adds AS 39.55.015                                                                                                          
     This  section requires  current  and prospective  state                                                                    
     employees whose  job duties  require access  to federal                                                                    
     tax  information to  provide information  to an  agency                                                                    
     for  a  state  and  national  criminal  history  record                                                                    
     check.  Defines  "agency",   "employee",  "federal  tax                                                                    
     information", "return", and "return information".                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Section 4 Provides the effective date of July 1, 2017.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK noted that the effective date will need to be                                                                      
amended to 2018.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:34:24 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  COGHILL asked  what  happened at  the  federal level  that                                                               
elicited this requirement.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK said it came about in a routine review.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  BISHOP asked  if  an employee  who did  not  want to  be                                                               
fingerprinted  would have  the option  of being  reassigned to  a                                                               
different division or department.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK said  that hasn't come up. All the  employees in the                                                               
Tax  Division and  the  Child Support  Services  Division of  the                                                               
Department of  Revenue (DOR) have already  had background checks.                                                               
They receive federal data so they also need to be fingerprinted.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  BISHOP said  he  understands that  but  wonders if  they                                                               
could transfer to a division that doesn't have that requirement.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked if  there  is  any other  heightened                                                               
scrutiny  that employees  could go  through if  they objected  to                                                               
giving their fingerprint information.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK  said the FBI  said that fingerprints are  needed as                                                               
part  of  a  full  background  check.  They  did  not  offer  any                                                               
alternative.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL said he'd asked the individuals who were online.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:37:31 PM                                                                                                                    
CAROL  BEECHER,   Director,  Child  Support   Services  Division,                                                               
Department of Revenue (DOR), said  her understanding from reading                                                               
Publication 1075 is that there is no other option.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  COGHILL   asked  if  any   employees  objected   that  the                                                               
requirement is too onerous.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MS. BEECHER said there has been no pushback.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI observed  that the  definition of  "agency"                                                               
covers the  entire executive and then  some. He asked if  she has                                                               
an estimate of  the number of employees who would  be required to                                                               
give fingerprints.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK said she didn't know.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked  Ms. Wojtusik to do some  research and follow                                                               
up with the information.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK said  DHSS is affected and 300  employees within the                                                               
Department of Revenue.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI said  he'd like  more complete  numbers. He                                                               
asked what  assurance Alaskans can  have that their data  will be                                                               
safely maintained.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:41:00 PM                                                                                                                    
MS. BEECHER  clarified that DOR  doesn't receive  the fingerprint                                                               
information. When DOR has a  background check done, the report is                                                               
returned  to  the  agency's   Criminal  Investigation  Unit.  She                                                               
believes  that information  is  destroyed if  it  doesn't have  a                                                               
nexus to the  job. She offered to  follow up and find  out if her                                                               
understanding is correct.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked Senator Wielechowski  to clarify his question                                                               
for Mr. Gaffney.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked what  kind of safety protections there                                                               
are and  what the plans are  for the fingerprints after  they are                                                               
collected.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:42:56 PM                                                                                                                    
ERIC GAFFNEY, Records and  Licensing Supervisor, Criminal Records                                                               
Identification  Bureau, Department  of Public  Safety, Anchorage,                                                               
Alaska, explained  that the fingerprints  would be placed  in the                                                               
archive  that is  maintained by  the  state for  other civil  and                                                               
criminal  fingerprint  submissions. Alaska  is  a  member of  the                                                               
Western  Identification Network  with  other  Western states  and                                                               
criminal  justice  agencies  in  those  states  can  access  that                                                               
archive. The prints would also be  conveyed to the FBI to be used                                                               
for comparison and then destroyed.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked how  much  it  costs to  obtain  the                                                               
fingerprints and who would be responsible for paying.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS. WOJTUSIK  said DPS  charges $47 to  take the  fingerprint and                                                               
the state will pay.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if there is a fiscal note.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  WOJTUSIK  said it's  forthcoming;  it's  being updated  from                                                               
2017.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL updated  Mr. Spanos on the discussion  and asked if                                                               
the House had questions about the security of the information.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:46:44 PM                                                                                                                    
BRANDON  SPANOS, Deputy  Director,  Tax  Division, Department  of                                                               
Revenue (DOR), Juneau, Alaska, confirmed  that the other body did                                                               
have  concerns   about  the  security  of   the  information.  He                                                               
explained that  DOR has policies  in place for security  and they                                                               
take this seriously, but that isn't part of the bill.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI asked  if other  states have  complied with                                                               
this  requirement  and what  the  consequences  are if  the  bill                                                               
doesn't pass.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. SPANOS said  the IRS has been talking about  this a long time                                                               
and it has  been discussed with the states.  When the publication                                                               
was finalized,  the new requirements  were background  checks and                                                               
fingerprinting.  To date,  26 states  have passed  legislation to                                                               
allow  fingerprinting   and  background   checks,  14   states  -                                                               
including Alaska  - have legislation  under consideration,  and 8                                                               
states have  no legislation  pending. Some  of the  latter states                                                               
may be able to comply without a bill.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if there is a deadline for complying.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. SPANOS  said if the  bill doesn't  pass, the IRS  will likely                                                               
have  a  finding on  the  May  2018  audit  that notes  that  the                                                               
legislation  hasn't  passed.  He  suspects  that  the  IRS  would                                                               
eventually  stop   sharing  federal  tax  information   with  the                                                               
division. For  the Tax Division that  means the loss of  about $2                                                               
million a year  from federal fee back audits.  The division would                                                               
also lose the  ability to get federal tax  information on certain                                                               
taxpayers  like tobacco,  mining,  and alcohol  to  use in  their                                                               
audits. Child support services would  lose the ability to collect                                                               
the  federal refunds  of taxpayers  who owe  child support.  They                                                               
would also  potentially lose  the funding  they receive  from the                                                               
federal government, which is 66 percent of their budget.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
He said he wasn't aware of a deadline to pass the legislation.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
2:51:08 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  COSTELLO said  she would  like to  look at  the form  an                                                               
individual  would fill  out. She  asked if  the form  asks for  a                                                               
Social  Security  Number  and  what the  state  does  with  those                                                               
numbers.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. SPANOS said the Tax Division  has slimmed the form to one and                                                               
a  half pages.  It  requires name,  age,  aliases, former  names,                                                               
Social  Security Number,  places  of residence  for  the last  10                                                               
years, conviction dates and the  classification of the crime, the                                                               
punishment,  and a  signature authorizing  the department  to run                                                               
the  background  check. The  questionnaires  go  to the  Criminal                                                               
Investigation Unit  to run the  background check and  the results                                                               
come back  they give  the division  a clean  sheet that  says the                                                               
person passed  the background check  or that there  were concerns                                                               
due to crimes  of dishonesty. The division would  review those to                                                               
determine whether  they would retain  or potentially hire  or not                                                               
hire the prospective  employee. The division keeps  a record that                                                               
the background check was run but  the results are retained by the                                                               
Criminal Investigation Unit.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  COSTELLO  asked  what happens  to  the  Social  Security                                                               
Number that's on the form.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. SPANOS  said DOR's Criminal  Investigation Unit  would retain                                                               
it in a locked file behind a locked and secure door.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR COSTELLO  related her personal  experience of  having her                                                               
identity stolen. She  emphasized that public servants  need to be                                                               
on the lookout to protect  Alaskans when they're asked to provide                                                               
this type of information.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:55:43 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. SPANOS  said the department  is very concerned  about privacy                                                               
and  confidentiality.  Forms  with Social  Security  Numbers  are                                                               
handled by  very few people in  the department. There is  a chain                                                               
of custody and the forms are always secured under lock and key.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:57:00 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if he  is aware of any state employees                                                               
misusing federal tax information.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. SPANOS  said the Child  Support Services  Division terminated                                                               
several  employees who  were accessing  information  they had  no                                                               
business  reason  to  access. That  information  potentially  had                                                               
federal  tax  information.   He  was  aware  of   one  breach  of                                                               
information within  the Tax Division that  resulted in discipline                                                               
and termination.  Other breaches  were mistakes;  information was                                                               
sent to the wrong email  that involved state tax information, not                                                               
federal. The division has a procedure to address that.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:58:12 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR COGHILL asked if the companion bill in the House is                                                                       
moving.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. SPANOS said the intention is to take amendments and                                                                         
potentially move the bill on Friday.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL held SB 109 in committee.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:59:04 PM                                                                                                                    
There being no further business to come before the committee,                                                                   
Chair Coghill adjourned the Senate Judiciary Standing Committee                                                                 
meeting at 2:59 p.m.