SENATE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL SERVICES COMMITTEE April 21, 1995 9:10 a.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Senator Lyda Green, Chairman Senator Loren Leman, Vice-Chairman Senator Mike Miller Senator Judy Salo MEMBERS ABSENT Senator Johnny Ellis COMMITTEE CALENDAR Confirmation Hearings for Appointments to the University of Alaska Board of Regents: Chancy Croft and Joe J. Thomas. WITNESS REGISTER Chancy Croft, Appointee University of Alaska Board of Regents 441 W. 5th Avenue, Suite 400 Anchorage, Alaska 99501 Joe J. Thomas, Appointee University of Alaska Board of Regents 879 Vide Way Fairbanks, Alaska Ralph McGrath, President Alaska Community College Federation of Teachers POSITION STATEMENT: Indicated support of the two nominees. ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 95-32, SIDE A Number 003 CHAIRMAN GREEN called the Senate Health, Education and Social Services (HESS) Committee to order at 9:10 a.m. and informed everyone that testimony would be taken from the Appointments to the University of Alaska Board of Regents. The appointees were not yet present, so the Chair called a brief at ease from 9:11 a.m. to 9:16 a.m. CHANCY CROFT thanked the committee for accommodating his and Mr. Thomas's schedules. The University of Alaska is an exciting challenge for the state. He informed the committee that the university is very important because most of the higher education in Alaska comes from public education; only Wyoming has a similar situation. Mr. Croft pointed out three crucial goals that the university should work towards: (1) the continuance and expansion of academic excellence, (2) public accountability across the board by the university, (3) adult education - the previous mission of the community college. Mr. Croft indicated that adult education would become increasingly important especially in lieu of current economic changes. The average person would face changing jobs three or five or more times during their life; learning would become a life-long experience. He predicted that in the future, distance learning would become more important; location is not going to be as important as opportunity. In conclusion, Mr. Croft noted his commitment to educational quality as well as equal educational opportunity to all Alaskans. Number 093 JOE J. THOMAS informed the committee that he had attended the University of Alaska for a couple of years. The university is one of Alaska's greatest assets. He believed that the diversity of the State of Alaska creates the need for a university system to be prepared to educate the children of Alaska as well as the adults of Alaska. SENATOR LEMAN noted that Alaska is in financial trouble; the state is facing reductions at the same time the university has increasing needs. From where could the revenues the university needs come? Number 140 CHANCY CROFT commented that the students he had spoken to recognized the need for a tuition increase, but the students objected to the increase coming all at once. He expressed concern with the revenue change under which the largest portion is increased tuition. He said that the university has gone through an evaluation program which he believed was important. He expressed the need to ensure the implementation of the savings projected in the reevaluation. The university has implemented the Foundation in order to increase revenue which holds much for the future. Mr. Croft stated that a land bill allowing the university to select additional land for development to obtain revenue would be in the best interest of higher education. He discussed the three new two- year degree programs of Prince Williams Sound. These new degree programs are funded by contributions or tuition paid by industry who would then supply the jobs for these degrees. He emphasized that the university system is going to have to find additional revenue sources. Furthermore, the university should explore new manners in which to deliver services instead of the traditional build a building and staff the building delivery. He informed the committee that educational institutions, especially in this era, must utilize all the new techniques of education in delivering education, which often results in a lower cost than the traditional classroom method. Number 204 SENATOR LEMAN was excited about the export of classroom television from the school of engineering to outside Alaska. JOE J. THOMAS explained that the budget cuts serve as an impetus to more thought with regard to how things are accomplished. The coordination with industry being done in the Prince Williams Sound Community College would seem to initiate financial support to education. He commented that as students move into industry after college, the students could create endowments for the university as they rise up in the industry. This area should be reviewed more closely. He reiterated the importance of spreading education through different mediums. He also felt that the land grant was important. SENATOR MILLER inquired as to how long the three major campuses in Alaska could be sustained in the face of decreasing budgets. At what point would the campuses specialize, or concentrate all the revenues at one main campus in order to become more efficient. JOE J. THOMAS believed that the Board of Regents and the University Administrators are already moving in that direction with the program assessment. He acknowledged the possible conflict between the Board of Regents and the Campus Administrators. Someone should review what is necessary and what can be afforded; what are the needs of the community. He also indicated that various communication techniques could afford some economy of scale for some programs. Number 285 CHANCY CROFT specified that Mr. Thomas had summed it up well. Mr. Croft cited the perennial problem of education in Alaska: how can an education be made accessible throughout a state of this size without duplicating. Duplication of programs also duplicates costs. He proposed specialization as one possible solution. He noted that specialization often carries a substantial cost to the student. Mr. Croft expressed pride in the Loussac Library in Anchorage and the Consortium Library at the university. However, if one library could have been built to serve both the community and the university everyone would have benefitted. He specified that duplicating services does not necessarily mean that new facilities must be constructed. For instance, there are secondary educational facilities in the smallest villages in Alaska. The community college system has utilized facilities such as those in the villages in order to deliver quality education. Those facilities must be used as well as other modern delivery techniques. Mr. Croft explained that the current trend in education seems to be moving from site-based teaching to broad-based learning which he believed to be the best opportunity for the university. SENATOR LEMAN mentioned Judge Greene's decision regarding the discrimination of cohabiting couples and their medical benefits and such. He asked if Mr. Croft and Mr. Thomas supported the university's existing policy regarding the cohabitation of couples. CHANCY CROFT specified that he had not read the decision. He felt that if the possible violation violates the state's constitution or state statutes, then the matter would seem to be a problem for the state to solve. He did not feel that this matter was one in which he had been called upon to decide. Mr. Croft did not want to comment further on this case. JOE J. THOMAS had not read the decision either. He indicated that there may be some similar cases on appeal and headed for the Supreme Court. Number 343 CHAIRMAN GREEN expressed concern for the lack of future for agriculture in the university system which seems a shame since agriculture, mining, and such were the foundations of the university system. These programs do not necessarily require nor need a large enrollment. She asked how the university could continue to support agriculture. CHANCY CROFT was nervous about the consolidation of the agriculture and mineral programs. He felt that it was important to continue both programs. He informed the committee that British Petroleum only recruits at four of the 19 petroleum engineering schools; one of those four is the University of Alaska at Fairbanks. The ability of the university to respond to the university and the state's historical basis through agriculture and mining is important. JOE J. THOMAS supported both programs. He did not believe that there had been enough work done with the agriculture program in order to illustrate the realistic possibilities. The Alaskan grown product is small, but there is more room for development of that. Perhaps, the emphasis has been placed in the wrong areas. He indicated the need to review what can be produced and the market for that item. The market should be defined first and then the product should be developed. Mr. Thomas commented that mining is exciting, although it brings some concerns. The Board of Regents basically supports that program. He informed the committee that there is a world-class mine being developed in Fairbanks. Part of the reasons for this mine are due to the mapping and the work of the university. The community, industry, and the university working together would accomplish the desired goals within the present budget constraints. Number 408 CHAIRMAN GREEN inquired as to what concerns regarding mining development Mr. Thomas was referring. JOE J. THOMAS clarified that he was speaking to the environmental concerns such as clear-cutting and mine tailings. Usiveli Coal Mine is a good example of what can be done; the environmental community should not have any complaints about that mine. Mr. Thomas supported mining and oil development. Development can be done in such a way that most interests could be satisfied. CHAIRMAN GREEN asked Mr. Thomas if all his labor experience created any baggage when he is on the other side. JOE J. THOMAS did not consider the university to be the other side. Mr. Thomas indicated that perhaps his labor relations experience could help the university with working out problems. Mr. Thomas did not see a conflict with his background and this appointment. Number 442 SENATOR SALO pointed to the medical involvement program at the university, WAMI, as an example of how small states can offer a professional program. She inquired as to the position of Mr. Croft and Mr. Thomas on the issue of professional programs, which Alaska cannot afford; how can they be offered in cooperation with other states. CHANCY CROFT felt that the medical involvement program is a good example of how Alaska can work with other states. Such programs reduce the costs while allowing Alaskan students the opportunity to pursue professional careers. He said that such programs are acceptable alternatives. Mr. Croft informed the committee that during his time in the Alaska Legislature, he supported a change in the Bar Admissions Act which passed in 1976. That change allowed students to complete one year of attendance at a certified law school and then complete the remainder of their education through an internship program in Alaska. The WAMI program can be applied in other areas in which the cost of the program is prohibitive. JOE J. THOMAS agreed that the university cannot afford to develop curriculum that would be pervasive at every school. Programs such as WAMI will have to be considered or students will have to travel to obtain some aspect of an education. He expressed the need to encourage people in the pursuit of education, although each situation cannot be taken care of by the university; the university can facilitate the process. Mr. Thomas emphasized his background in development. SENATOR SALO commented that for some Mr. Thomas' labor background is a plus. JOE J. THOMAS noted that perhaps his background could be an asset in understanding labor relations and the process. CHAIRMAN GREEN asked both appointees what had attracted them to the position and what was the process for consideration as an appointee. JOE J. THOMAS explained that he had been asked in the past. Perhaps the fact that he was born in Alaska and attended the University of Alaska helped people consider him for an appointee. Mr. Thomas noted that he has dealt with many large corporations and their deliberations as well as budgets and trust funds. He has also dealt with the political process to some degree which would be helpful. The labor relations background probably had some influence on the decision for his appointment. Mr. Thomas was concerned about the university. CHANCY CROFT informed the committee that he came from a family of educators. He has been nominated in prior years, but never selected. CHAIRMAN GREEN asked how the cost per credit hour could be viewed during efficiency work regardless of the diversity and location of the campuses. Number 526 CHANCY CROFT said that he was not willing to accept all the university figures as entirely accurate. He noted that the Board of Regents had discussed the need to ensure that campus to campus figures were based on the same standards. There has been some progress in this area, however more is necessary in order to achieve comparable figures. He explained that these comparisons are necessary in order for policy to be established. He hoped that comparable statistics would be produced within the next year. He agreed that the cost of what is produced is an important element in making decisions. JOE J. THOMAS also believed that there are some unacceptable discrepancies that need to be reviewed. Statistics are being analyzed in order to determine if the numbers are comparable. RALPH MCGRATH, President of the Alaska Community College Federation of Teachers, informed the committee that this organization has represented the faculty who teach in the community college programs for over 20 years. The community college programs emphasize vocational, technical, and developmental education. He noted that there had been approximately 16 faculty present throughout this hearing. He expressed enthusiasm about the nominees to the Board of Regents whom the organization has had the opportunity to work with over the past 20 years. He applauded the committee for their discussion and conversation with the nominees. Mr. McGrath believed that Mr. Croft and Mr. Thomas would add another dimension to the Board of Regents, particularly a dimension regarding job training which was lost when the university destroyed the community colleges in 1987. This organization is the only remnant of the community college that could keep the name. He indicated that the board seems to have realized that the destruction of the community college was an error. The board now has the opportunity to review the restoration of the community colleges. Mr. McGrath also expressed concern regarding the program assessment and the elimination of the agriculture program. He related that to the second class status placed on the community college faculty and students at the university. He informed the committee that in 1987, there were 13 accredited community colleges. In conclusion, Mr. McGrath expressed the need to return to the education of the community college. Number 587 CHAIRMAN GREEN said that often the efficiency of the money and time utilized in a community college is better than a traditional university setting. RALPH MCGRATH commented that Speaker of the House Gail Phillips and Chancy Croft served on a committee that investigated the costs using the university's figures. This investigation pointed out that 70 percent of all students in Alaska were attending community colleges. The community colleges operated on 30 percent of the university's budget. Number 596 SENATOR MILLER moved that Mr. Croft and Mr. Thomas's names be forwarded on to the Senate President. Hearing no objection, it was so ordered. There being no further business before the committee, the meeting adjourned at 10:02 a.m.