MILITARY SCHOOLS TASK FORCE PUBLIC HEARING October 12, 1993 2:00 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Representative Mulder Representative Martin Bonnie Carroll Captain Dennis Porter Colonel George Vakalis Lt. Colonel David Melcher Janet Stokesbury Nancy Miller Patty Norheim Sue Wilken MEMBERS ABSENT Senator Leman Representative Willis Barbara Martin CALENDAR Third Public Hearing of the Military Schools Task Force WITNESS REGISTER REPRESENTATIVE JEANNETTE JAMES P.O. Box 56622 North Pole, Alaska 99705 SCOTT JOHNSON, Architect Fairbanks North Star Borough School District P.O. Box 71267 Fairbanks, Alaska 99707 JOE RYAN, Staff Representative Al Vezey's Office 119 N. Cushman Street Suite 211 Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 Observer DAVID SKIDMORE, Staff Senator Steve Frank's Office 119 N. Cushman Street Suite 211 Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 Observer LT. COL. STEVE BOYCE 2258 Central Avenue Eielson Air Force Base Fairbanks, Alaska 99702 Observer LEN MACKLER Fairbanks North Star Borough School District 1300 Minnie Street Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 Observer DEBORAH LUPER, Staff Senator Loren Leman's Office 716 W. Fourth Avenue Anchorage, Alaska 99501 Observer ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 93-4, SIDE A Number 024 REPRESENTATIVE ELDON MULDER called the meeting to order at 2:20 p.m. He requested those present at the meeting introduce themselves. In addition to Representative Mulder, those present in Fairbanks were Representative Jeannette James, Lt. Colonel David Melcher, Captain Dennis Porter, Sue Wilken, Lisa Fitzpatrick, Janet Stokesbury, Nancy Miller, and Bonnie Carroll. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER welcomed Representative Terry Martin and Senator Loren Leman's aide, Deborah Luper, both of whom were present by telephonic hook-up in Anchorage, Colonel George Vakalis who was present by teleconference hook-up in Juneau, and Patty Norheim, Chair of the State Board of Education who was present by teleconference from Petersburg. Number 058 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER requested the task force address its strategy and that it finalize a list of recommendations for inclusion in a draft piece of legislation in order to have a plan to be considered and approved at the final meeting on October 25, 1993. Number 086 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked if any one had any comments or corrections regarding the minutes from the September 30, 1993, meeting. Number 097 BONNIE CARROLL, GOVERNOR'S APPOINTEE, moved that the minutes be accepted as prepared. CAPTAIN PORTER, ALCOM, seconded the motion. Hearing no objections, REPRESENTATIVE MULDER ruled that the minutes be adopted. Number 104 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER requested the Fairbanks North Star Borough School District provide a final assessment of the costs associated with the base school upgrades. Number 111 SUE WILKEN, GOVERNOR'S APPOINTEE, on behalf of the Fairbanks North Star Borough, responded that the report presented to the task force on the base school tour earlier that morning represented the school district's final assessment. She noted the projected total cost which appears on this list is lower than the projected total cost figure which had previously been presented to the task force. She indicated this figure represents the school district's recommendation only - it was not the board's recommendation. She commented that the Fairbanks North Star Borough was not willing to take title until deficiencies are corrected. Number 148 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER opened the floor to questions. Number 153 CAPTAIN PORTER questioned whether it was feasible for the Fairbanks North Star Borough School Board to take possession once funding was obligated rather than waiting until completion of the work itself. He voiced his concern that this timing is crucial to the success of the transfer process. Number 169 COLONEL VAKALIS, GARRISON COMMANDER, FORT RICHARDSON, emphasized the key term here is the word obligation - the money must actually be obligated, not just committed. Number 175 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER agreed and asked Colonel Vakalis for any suggestions regarding how such a requirement should be worded. Number 188 COLONEL VAKALIS explained that the federal government commits money for a particular project, but that a commitment can be retracted at any time. However, he noted that once a contract is signed, the money is obligated and it is very difficult to retract the commitment at that point. Number 202 CAPTAIN PORTER proposed that with respect to the $4.9 million committed for Ursa Major, once the Anchorage School District spends the first ten percent, that would be an appropriate time for ownership transfer. Number 220 REPRESENTATIVE TERRY MARTIN compared the instant situation to the federal monies which the state receives for highways. He suggested the task force put together a packet and try to get as much money as possible obligated by the United States Department of Defense as a strategy to get the state legislature to come up with matching funds. Number 280 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER summarized for those on teleconference that the total amount of money requested by the Fairbanks North Star Borough School District is $20,405,563. Number 294 JANET STOKESBURY, CHIEF FINANCIAL OFFICER, ANCHORAGE SCHOOL DISTRICT, stated since the last meeting, the Anchorage School District staff had reviewed the original list and scaled back its estimates. Excluding Ursa Major which is already funded, the total comes to $27.9 million for the six facilities. The school district has not contacted the school board as yet, but it has contacted its legal counsel to ascertain whether the school district has any obligations to the Anchorage taxpayers which might present an impediment to the transfer. However, the answer to that query has not been determined yet. Number 324 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked Janet Stokesbury and Sue Wilken, in their experience dealing with the federal government, whether the federal government would accept the project list as put together by the school districts. Number 332 MS. STOKESBURY responded, using the Ursa Major experience as an example, that the federal government did accept their numbers in that case. Number 347 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER summarized, for the benefit of those on teleconference, the cost increases on the handout distributed by Janet Stokesbury. Combined with the Fairbanks North Star Borough cost estimates, the grand total is $48,298,702. Number 373 MS. STOKESBURY explained that the Anchorage School District numbers are projected out to 1994. They include a seven percent inflation factor. Number 378 CAPTAIN PORTER explained that the Fairbanks North Star Borough used the same inflation factor in computing their numbers. Therefore, all of the estimates are good until 1994. Number 390 COLONEL VAKALIS noted the total is about nine millions less than at the last meeting. Number 392 MS. STOKESBURY explained that the school district took a number of the program needs out of the original estimate. Number 395 COLONEL VAKALIS questioned whether the same criteria had been used in arriving at these factors as those used in arriving at the figures for Ursa Major. Number 403 MS. STOKESBURY said yes, and qualified her answer by stating these figures may even be less, relatively speaking, for the reason that the Ursa Major numbers were based on a twenty- six student classroom model and these numbers are based on a higher classroom size. Number 408 CAPTAIN PORTER commented it was his understanding that while the scope of work approved by the United States Department of Education (USDOE) with respect to Ursa Major changed, the actual dollar amount that the USDOE agreed to pay did not change. Number 424 REPRESENTATIVE JEANNETTE JAMES questioned why the federal government needs to approve the scope of work set forth on the school districts' project lists. Number 431 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER explained that there may be a discrepancy between what the task force considers to be necessary upgrades and what the federal government considers necessary. Number 441 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN indicated that, according to Senator Leman, Senator Stevens' office related to him that an additional $10 million was added to the United States Department of Defense (USDOD) budget for schools and maintenance. The USDOD committee goes to conference next week at which time it should be determined how the money will be spent. Number 465 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER concurred that it was his understanding that this money had been added to the USDOD budget and hopefully Alaska would net a significant percentage of that money. He also added it was his understanding that $53 million had been added to the impact aid budget. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked Ms. Stokesbury whether there is anything the task force can do to help speed the process along. Number 489 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN responded that the task force needs to establish project priorities. Number 525 REPRESENTATIVE JAMES noted that the legislature did appropriate $600,000 for the plans for the new school. Since the federal government has already committed $3.9 million for this school, to avoid losing this money, she suggested that perhaps attention should be focused on this project by diverting money from this year's appropriations to Fairbanks schools and through next year's legislative process. Number 540 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN commented he thought it likely that there would be a shared effort amongst legislators. Number 550 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER said he thought the best approach was to shoot for the entire package. REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN said he thought that was a good idea. Number 583 REPRESENTATIVE JAMES again reiterated that it is important to focus on the new Eielson elementary school. Number 592 CAPTAIN PORTER agreed that the new Eielson elementary school ought to be a task force priority. He further agreed that the task force ought to seek a fifty-fifty split of the total funding necessary between the federal government and the state. Number 610 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER raised the question of conditioning the state funding upon a matching federal commitment within a certain period of time such as five years. Number 629 COLONEL VAKALIS stated he feels the task force needs to pursue the entire package of funding as opposed to piecemealing it over the years. He noted the existing problems are only going to be exacerbated over time which will result in additional costs. Number 640 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN agreed that the task force should seek funding for the entire package, but that it should be prepared to accept less. He also wanted to know why Senator Frank was not at this meeting along with any other legislators who have affected districts. He also noted that it is necessary to get the Hickel Administration involved in the base school project. Number 658 COLONEL VAKALIS agreed, but reiterated that it is necessary to force the issue of what it is going to cost overall so that money can be allocated, even if over a period of time. Number 670 COLONEL MELCHER, U.S. ARMY, commented that Arctic Light and Ladd elementary schools provide an example of the federal government and the state working together. He added that he feels the task force should pursue a fifty-fifty funding split. Number 678 CAPTAIN PORTER agreed that it is necessary to pursue the entire package, but the state needs to be willing to accept that that money will come in over a period of years. COLONEL VAKALIS signed off the meeting to catch a plane. Number 686 NANCY MILLER, PARENT ADVOCACY COMMITTEE, suggested the task force include the money the state has already received for Ursa Major in the total funding request and then count that money towards the federal government's contribution. Number 692 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN thought this might be a good idea to motivate the state to commit resources. He indicated that Commissioner Covey had previously indicated to him the state Department of Education would be willing to get involved. TAPE 93-4, SIDE B Number 001 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER stated that one of the task force's strategies should be to secure inclusion in the Governor's capital request for funding. He asked Patty Norheim whether she would be willing to carry this banner on behalf of the task force. PATTY NORHEIM, CHAIR, STATE BOARD OF EDUCATION, said the school board would be meeting in Fairbanks at the end of October and that might be a good time for the board to get a look at the Fairbanks base schools. Number 025 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER noted that Ms. Wilken was nodding her head in agreement and added that this was a good idea. MS. NORHEIM noted that the Governor has been very committed to education projects. Number 037 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER noted that Senator Frank's staff person just entered the room. Number 046 CAPTAIN PORTER asked Ms. Carroll her opinion of the Governor's views. She indicated she felt the Governor was very supportive of the task force's mission and she would be happy to take the task force's proposal to him. Number 061 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked whether the task force wanted to adopt the school districts' estimates regarding the total cost of the upgrades. Number 072 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN questioned whether there were other schools in the state that ought to be included in this package. Number 080 CAPTAIN PORTER stated it was his understanding that all of the schools facing this problem were included on the existing lists. Number 124 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER concluded that the task force wished to accept the cost estimates proposed by the school districts and therefore, these numbers constituted the task force's starting point. He then asked the task force what it wished to recommend as a funding source. Number 135 MS. MILLER questioned whether any one had been in contact with the USDOE. Number 144 CAPTAIN PORTER indicated there has been little discussion at his request. It was his intent that the task force come up with its own recommendation to present to the USDOE rather than have the USDOE present a plan to the task force. Number 162 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN agreed that this was a sensible approach. Number 229 MS. NORHEIM signed off. Number 247 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked the task force for its position regarding the percentage split between the federal government and the state. Number 254 CAPTAIN PORTER moved that the task force adopt proposed legislation which would enable the state and the federal government to each pay fifty percent of the total sum of $48,298,702 for the immediate upgrade and transfer of the following base schools: Aurora Elementary, John F. Kennedy, Mount Iliamna Elementary, Mt. Spurr Elementary, Orion Elementary, Ursa Minor Elementary, Ben Eielson Jr./Sr. High School, Anderson Elementary, and the creation of a new elementary school to replace Taylor and Pennell Elementary schools. Captain Porter further moved that part of that funding include the $3.9 million and the $4.9 already committed by the federal government and the respective school districts assume immediate ownership of these schools upon the obligation of monies to bring them up to standards. Number 282 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER requested the motion be broken down into two separate motions. Number 286 MS. STOKESBURY noted the inclusion of the $4.9 and $3.9 million brings the total up to $57 million. Number 294 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER questioned whether these monies should be included in the total since they have already been obligated. Number 304 MS. MILLER stated the reason she felt these monies should be included is that it demonstrates that the federal government is coming forward to meet its obligations. Number 311 CAPTAIN PORTER questioned whether these monies should be included to avoid any quarrel over whether the state has already met its entire obligation by appropriating monies for Arctic Light and Ladd Elementary Schools. He suggested that rather than looking at the past, the task force focus its attention on the future. He did note that the $3.9 million for Ben Eielson should be included. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER said the motion could be drafted so as to include the $3.9. Number 334 CAPTAIN PORTER made a new motion that the task force recommend legislation that would allow for a joint venture between the state and the USDOE or USDOD to each put up fifty percent of $53 million dollars. Number 344 REPRESENTATIVE JAMES commented that it might be appropriate to list out the priorities by year, even if this is not included in the legislation per se. Number 356 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER noted that from the state legislature's perspective, it would be necessary to appropriate the entire amount of funding in one year because, by Constitution, one legislature cannot obligate future legislatures. Number 369 REPRESENTATIVE JAMES questioned, since the state has no control over the federal government, what might be the task force's back up position if the federal government does not come up with its share of the money. Number 374 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN answered there is going to be a fair amount of give and take later, but all the task force can do is to request funding and wait and see. MS. CARROLL stated that once the task force gets its proposal together, it needs to approach the United States Congressional delegation in a lobbying effort. Number 404 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER questioned whether the task force wanted to put percentage figures on the requested contributions of the state and federal government, or whether it should allow the state and the federal government come up with percentages. Number 408 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN said he thought the task force should put a fifty-fifty percentage split in its proposal. Number 415 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER requested that Captain Porter restate his motion. Number 417 CAPTAIN PORTER moved that the state match the federal government in funding the base schools, regardless of the funding source. Number 444 MS. CARROLL noted this is also a project of great interest to Senator Dole and there are a number of funding avenues which need to be explored. Number 451 COLONEL MELCHER commented that it helps in negotiating with the federal government if the state is willing to appropriate the necessary money. MS. MILLER stated the money needs to be appropriated because its the right thing to do. Number 468 REPRESENTATIVE JAMES noted that we need to remember how important the military presence is to the state and we need to send a message that the military children will be educated in the same manner as all other children. Number 475 MS. CARROLL observed there are a number of states that feel the same way, but what makes Alaska unique is its importance as a military site. She felt the task force needs to capitalize on that. Number 484 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked if there were any objections to the motion made by Captain Porter. Hearing no objections, he moved that the motion passes unanimously. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER then summarized the purpose of the task force as one of identifying the needs of the schools and the funding sources available to meet those needs, and to then lobby the appropriate authorities to secure that funding. He indicated it was hoped that by the next committee meeting, the task force would have a piece of draft legislation with a list of findings and an appropriation bill along with the backup supporting materials. He then requested the task force members identify any things that should be included in the bill. Number 509 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN commented that he hadn't been thinking of hazardous waste as an issue up until now, but he raised the question of whether there was any known contamination which might make hazardous waste cleanup monies a viable avenue for seeking funding. Number 536 MS. CARROLL questioned the arrangement between the federal government and the Office of Military and Veteran's Affairs regarding funding. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER noted the federal government pays approximately 85 percent of the state's military and veteran's affairs budget. However, most of that goes to personnel payroll. It would probably be a far stretch to get construction dollars. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER then asked again for any suggestions about information which should be included in the draft legislation. Number 569 COLONEL MELCHER recommended the school districts assume ownership of the schools at the point the money is obligated both from the federal government and the state. Number 578 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked Ms. Stokesbury if there is any way the task force can have any input into the transfer process. Number 581 MS. STOKESBURY stated there is ongoing discussion about when ownership of Ursa Major will be transferred. Number 589 COLONEL MELCHER stated that it was his understanding the obligation of the money occurs when the school district receives it. That is the optimum time to effect a transfer. Number 593 MS. STOKESBURY indicated that she had gotten clarification from Laurel Cornish of the USDOE office regarding the exchange of funds. Number 602 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked what the task force could do to effect a transfer at this point. He asked to have the strongest wording possible included in the proposed legislation. Number 614 CAPTAIN PORTER suggested the most resistance was likely to come from the constituents and therefore, any support the task force might be able to give the school districts in this regard would be an aid in dealing with this potential roadblock. Number 622 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER said the task force should show a united front with the school districts on this point. Number 628 COLONEL MELCHER moved that the task force adopt language to the effect that the local school districts accept control and title at the earliest possible time that federal monies appear to be forthcoming or obligated in whatever terms are used at the federal level, and then proceed with their repair or refurbishment as expeditiously as possible. Number 638 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER asked if there was any discussion on the motion. Number 640 CAPTAIN PORTER added that to the strongest legal extent possible, the wording should help the school districts fight off any backlash. Number 651 COLONEL MELCHER added, the task force's responsibilities do not end with the proposed legislation, but everyone needs to take this proposed legislation and lobby it before their respective bodies. REPRESENTATIVE MULDER agreed and asked for any additional suggestions, comments or objections to the motion. Hearing no objections, he ruled that the motion carries. Number 668 SCOTT JOHNSON, FAIRBANKS NORTH STAR BOROUGH PUBLIC WORKS DEPARTMENT, noted that the since the Fairbanks North Star Borough owns the school facilities, perhaps they should be consulted before being asked to take over these facilities. Number 675 MS. WILKEN agreed with Scott that all the major players need to be talking, but she added that the role of this task force is to get the ball rolling. Number 695 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER agreed too, and added the immediate task is to get the information compiled and then to market it. TAPE 93-5, SIDE A Number 004 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER noted that the next meeting is October 25, 1993, in Anchorage. At that time, he indicated the task force would hopefully be presented with draft legislation. Number 008 LISA FITZPATRICK asked whether the task force wanted a preliminary report for the task force's review or just the draft legislation. Number 011 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER answered the preliminary report was essentially the same thing as the draft legislation which will be backed up by the information already gathered. Number 026 REPRESENTATIVE MULDER adjourned the meeting at 3:56 p.m.