HOUSE JUDICIARY STANDING COMMITTEE February 4, 1994 1:15 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Rep. Brian Porter, Chairman Rep. Jeannette James, Vice-Chair (arrived 1:35 p.m.) Rep. Pete Kott (arrived 1:29 p.m.) Rep. Gail Phillips Rep. Joe Green Rep. Jim Nordlund (arrived 1:28 p.m.) Rep. Cliff Davidson (via teleconference) MEMBERS ABSENT None OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT Rep. Mark Hanley COMMITTEE CALENDAR *HB 319: "An Act relating to the training of law enforcement and corrections officers; to the establishment of surcharges to be assessed for violations of certain traffic offenses; creating the Alaska Police Standards Training Fund; and providing for an effective date." HEARD AND ASSIGNED TO A SUBCOMMITTEE HJR 48: Proposing amendments to the Constitution of the State of Alaska relating to revenues from natural resources, the Alaska permanent fund, the appropriation limit and the budget reserve fund; and providing for an effective date for the amendments. HEARD AND ASSIGNED TO A SUBCOMMITTEE WITNESS REGISTER REP. GAIL PHILLIPS Alaska State Legislature Capitol Building, Room 216 Juneau, Alaska 99811 Phone: 465-2689 POSITION STATEMENT: Prime Sponsor of HB 319 LADDIE SHAW Executive Director Alaska Police Standards Council P.O. Box 111200 Juneau, Alaska 99811 Phone: 465-4378 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HB 319 RON OTTE Palmer Police Chief 423 S. Valley Way Palmer, Alaska 99645 Phone: 745-4811 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HB 319 (via teleconference) JACK McDONALD Kodiak Chief of Police 217 Lower Mill Bay Rd. Kodiak, Alaska 99615 Phone: 486-8000 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HB 319 (via teleconference) MARY A. NORDALE P.O. Box 21211 Juneau, Alaska 99802 Phone: 586-3340 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HJR 48 JOHN WILLIAMS, Mayor City of Kenai 210 Fidlago Kenai, Alaska 99611 Phone: 283-3104 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HJR 48 (via teleconference) VINCE O'REILLY 1611 Toyon Way Kenai, Alaska 99611 Phone: 283-4846 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HJR 48 (via teleconference) JAMES ELSON P.O. Box 2788 Kenai, Alaska 99611 Phone: 283-7970 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HJR 48 (via teleconference) ROGER CREMO, Attorney 425 G Street Anchorage, Alaska 99501 Phone: 277-4531 POSITION STATEMENT: Author of the plan that led to the introduction of HJR 48 (via offnet from Hawaii) REP. MARK HANLEY Alaska State Legislature Capitol Building, Room 51 Juneau, Alaska 99811 Phone: 465-4939 POSITION STATEMENT: Discussed HJR 48 with the committee PREVIOUS ACTION BILL: HB 319 SHORT TITLE: ALASKA PEACE STNDS TRAINING FUND SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) PHILLIPS,MacLean,Sanders,Kott JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 01/03/94 2010 (H) PREFILE RELEASED 01/10/94 2010 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 01/10/94 2010 (H) JUDICIARY, FINANCE 01/13/94 2054 (H) COSPONSOR(S): SANDERS, KOTT 01/19/94 2113 (H) COSPONSOR(S): MACLEAN 01/24/94 2140 (H) FIRST COSPONSOR: MACLEAN 02/04/94 (H) JUD AT 01:15 PM CAPITOL 120 BILL: HJR 48 SHORT TITLE: RESTRUCTURE PERMANENT FUND SPONSOR(S): FINANCE JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 01/11/94 2032 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 01/11/94 2032 (H) JUDICIARY, FINANCE 02/02/94 (H) JUD AT 01:15 PM CAPITOL 120 02/04/94 (H) JUD AT 01:15 PM CAPITOL 120 ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 94-17, SIDE A Number 000 The House Judiciary Standing Committee was called to order at 1:23 p.m. on February 4, 1994. A quorum was present. Chairman Porter announced that the committee would address HB 319 first. HB 319 - ALASKA PEACE STANDARDS TRAINING FUND Number 017 REP. GAIL PHILLIPS, Prime Sponsor of HB 319, gave the following statement to the committee: "Mr. Chairman, members of the committee. For the record, my name is Gail Phillips, representing House District 7, and the prime sponsor of this legislation. During the past year I have served as chairman of the Governor's Task Force on the Contract Jails program. During our meetings, it was brought to the task force's attention that no standards for operational staffing existed within the contract jails program. It was learned that some contracts operate with full-time employees, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. Other operators may have no correctional staff available and operate by utilizing dispatch staff for jail operations in addition to their regular dispatch duties. "It is commonly recognized that custodial care must be provided by `professionally' trained correctional staff. Presently, correctional personnel in these facilities are not receiving adequate training, and in some instances the majority of them are using what is called a `correspondence' course, which is less than adequate for the job that they are required to perform. "The Alaska Police Standards Council is mandated by statute to establish and maintain police training programs, probation and parole officer training programs, and correctional training program. With very few exceptions, funding has been insufficient to allow the Alaska Police Standards Council to provide statewide training for over 2,500 law enforcement and corrections officers annually. "I appointed a subcommittee, chaired by Representative Eileen MacLean, to look into this matter and report back with their recommendations to the full task force. The task force members adopted the subcommittee recommendations on officer training and staffing of contract jails. Included in their report is a recommendation, endorsed by the Alaska Police Standards Council, to establish a statewide training fund for law enforcement officials. Revenues would be generated by assessing a uniform surcharge against traffic violations and for the offense of driving while intoxicated. "The product of our efforts is the legislation we're considering in committee today. Mr. Chairman, this legislation will enable the Alaska Police Standards Council to function in a manner that will enhance performance and accountability within the law enforcement and corrections community. It is my belief that the law enforcement and corrections community will be greatly strengthened by having professionally trained staff. With the establishment of a training fund as a predictable funding base, statewide public safety will benefit overall. "Your bill packets contain a position paper prepared by the Alaska Police Standards Council, a recap of 1993 total vehicle and traffic offenses with projected revenues and a detailed list of vehicle and traffic offenses to be assessed by this legislation. "Mr. Chairman, I do have an amendment to offer to this legislation that is strictly a housekeeping matter; however, I know you have people who have signed up to testify via teleconference and possibly in the audience. I also note that the director of the Alaska Police Standards Council, Laddie Shaw, is also present. So, I will hold off on the amendment until their testimony is heard." Number 171 LADDIE SHAW, Executive Director, Alaska Police Standards Council, said he was available to answer questions as needed regarding HB 319, as Rep. Phillips has covered most of their needs. Number 180 REP. PORTER asked Mr. Shaw to stand by while the committee took testimony from the teleconference network. Number 187 RON OTTE, Palmer Police Chief, indicated he was representing all of the Alaska Chiefs of Police as president of the Alaska Chiefs Association and testified in favor of HB 319. He said the issue is the deficiency of law enforcement and corrections training around the state, and the loss of funds for these areas resulted in the loss of ability to provide training funds. Chief Otte indicated that over a period of time lack of training will be disastrous for both the correctional portion of law enforcement, as well as the actual on-line officers. He added that enactment of this legislation will relieve communities from constantly having to tap into their resources to provide this training support, of which much is mandated by federal, state and local laws. Number 263 REP. PORTER asked Chief Otte to explain the difference between the funds used for in-service training and the existing basic training that goes on in the state. Number 269 CHIEF OTTE explained that when a department hires an officer, there is a state requirement that the officer complete a minimum amount of entry level training; and for large departments like the Alaska State Troopers, they conduct their own academy, but virtually all the rest of the state rely on one or the other of some of those organizations and the Alaska Police Standards Council to conduct entry level training on their behalf. Number 301 REP. PORTER added that is what the funding from HB 319 is aimed at, the in-service training portion. Number 321 REP. PHILLIPS gave the following statement: "Mr. Chairman, I would like to move my amendment at this time. As I stated earlier, this is just a housekeeping matter. The amendment simply references the rest of the provisions in AS 28.15.181 that involve court suspensions, revocations and limitations, and makes them correspond to the original bill. The original bill referenced subsections 5 and 8 of 28.15.181, but omitted subsections 3, 6 and 9, and this amendment would correct that error. "Mr. Chairman, it has also been brought to my attention that there may be some aspects regarding the collection of fines that need to be ironed out before this bill moves on. Therefore, I am requesting that you consider placing this bill in a subcommittee so that we resolve the situation." Number 338 REP. PORTER asked if there was objection to the amendment. Seeing none, the amendment E1 dated January 27, 1994, by Luckhaupt was adopted. Rep. Porter asked Rep. Phillips to chair the subcommittee made up of herself and Reps. Nordlund and Kott, and asked Rep. Phillips to call the subcommittee together to iron out the difficulties in the acquisition of these funds through the various systems that exist. REP. PORTER then asked if JACK McDONALD, Kodiak Chief of Police, was on-line. Due to technical difficulties, his testimony was delayed. Number 469 JACK McDONALD, Kodiak Chief of Police, announced that Rep. Davidson was also present. Mr. McDonald testified in favor of HB 319 and shared some observations with the committee: that due to the nature of their jobs, citizens of Alaska expect their officers to be skilled, well-trained in the performance of their duties, and must be worthy of the trust they instill. He stated that the high level of professionalism we enjoy in the state of Alaska does not happen automatically, and long-term financial investments are required to ensure acceptable police officer service. CHAIRMAN PORTER said the next bill on the agenda was HJR 48. HJR 48 - RESTRUCTURE PERMANENT FUND Number 548 MARY A. NORDALE, a Juneau attorney representing herself, testified against HJR 48. She presented a written statement to the committee for the record. Ms. Nordale objected to HJR 48 because it replaces the precision of the language of Article IX, Section 15 (mineral, with very imprecise language); it requires taxes, severance and income, to be deposited into the fund; and it specifies an investment strategy that, if interpreted correctly, will yield less, rather than more revenues for the support of government. She also opposed the resolution because, if adopted, it will insure that entitlement programs will dominate state government, it would leave as revenue sources for the support of general government only incomes taxes, it will impair the state's credit and will chill natural resource development. Number 643 REP. PORTER referred Ms. Nordale to point number four in her written statement, which states if adopted entitlement programs would dominate state spending, and asked for her reasoning on that point. Number 650 MS. NORDALE replied that when you get a very static sum of money, you get vested interests in the status quo, which is dominated at this particular time by entitlement programs. She explained that population growth and inflation increase those, but they don't change them, so the longer the static income exists, the more likely the vested interest of the entitlement programs becomes and you get into a hamstrung situation. Number 657 The committee discussed Ms. Nordale's comments. Number 719 JOHN WILLIAMS, Mayor of Kenai, testified he was representing the opinions of the City of Kenai, the City of Soldotna, the City of Homer, and the Kenai Peninsula Caucus, all of whom have taken a very positive attitude towards HJR 48 and support of the Cremo plan, or a variation of the plan that would do basically what the Cremo plan would be expected to do. MAYOR WILLIAMS concluded there has to be a change, and the time for that change is now, and this legislature has the opportunity to become the developers of a legacy for our children for years to come; or on the other hand, they can always go down in history as the wrecking ball that refused to take the time and opportunity to create a good solid place for Alaska. He added that the Cremo plan lays the groundwork for the creation of that plan. TAPE 94-17, SIDE B Number 000 MAYOR WILLIAMS and the committee discussed various aspects of the Cremo plan. Number 101 VINCENT O'REILLY testified via teleconference from Kenai in opposition to HJR 48 and supported Ms. Nordale's earlier testimony. Mr. O'Reilly acknowledge that the legislature was faced with a fiscal gap, and said the legislature has a budget mechanism process that encourages unpredictable fluctuations of revenue available for appropriation, which places unbearable pressure on legislators to appropriate wisely and appropriately, with the result of creating a boom bust cycle. Mr. O'Reilly reiterated his objection to HJR 48 and referred to Ms. Nordale's comments. Number 241 REP. PHILLIPS said she had a question that would be a big premise if the legislature is to be successful in doing a plan such as this, and that is, overall the message legislators are getting is no new taxes until you cut the budget, but in order for a plan like this to be successful, we are going to have to put taxes on it in order to have enough revenues. She told Mr. O'Reilly, with the two conflicting opinions on taxes now, that is going to be one of the main questions they deal with. Discussion regarding taxes and Rep. Phillips comments ensued. Number 420 JAMES ELSON, testifying via teleconference from Kenai, said he has been employed in the private sector for about 25 years and wanted to approach his comments from a different point of view. He agreed that another approach to the budget must be found, but the thing that concerned him is the nonrenewable resource concept, and that we can put money from nonrenewable resources in the permanent fund and nurture it, so it becomes a renewable resource. Mr. Elson said his other concern was that whatever the state does within its own budget has a significant impact on the private economy. He said the Cremo plan seems to be the best option, it may not be the answer, but he urged the legislature to find some way to stabilize state government spending. Number 518 ROGER CREMO, author of the plan that led to introduction of HJR 48, testified via teleconference and discussed comments made by Ms. Nordale. He said he was opposed to using taxes in the savings fund, but said he found it hard to consider the type of taxes considered here, but surely a broad tax on the people, income, sales or property tax have no place in the fund. Mr. Cremo indicated he didn't understand the entitlement points and ruining the state's credit that Ms. Nordale made and couldn't comment there. MR. CREMO discussed HJR 48 at length with the committee. Number 679 REP. MARK HANLEY, House Finance Committee Vice Chair, testified that all the questions were good, and they brought forth a good debate in which to work out a plan. Rep. Hanley indicated that he thought the legislature first needed to look at the current system to see if the legislature can sustain what it's doing, see if it is a viable system, and what kind of problems are we going to arrive at if we continue down this road. Rep. Hanley said Ms. Nordale brought up some good points for discussion, but he doesn't think cash drives resource development; stability and reasonable regulations drive development; and let the private sector do the development and bring in the resources. Rep. Hanley continued, saying he thought the Cremo plan was a constitutional plan; we could change the constitutional spending limit, the constitutional budget reserve and a lot of other things. He pointed out that a lot of the problems people have pointed out about the Cremo plan can be attributed to the current system, and he didn't think that was a good reason to be extremely critical of it. Number 780 The committee continued to discuss the testimony regarding HJR 48. Number 838 REP. PORTER asked the committee for their consideration of assigning HJR 48 to a subcommittee to help address the concerns that have come up and then come back and discuss the specifics with the full committee. TAPE 94-18, SIDE A Number 000 The committee discussed Rep. Porter's suggestion. Number 104 REP. PORTER appointed Rep. Phillips to chair a subcommittee on HJR 48 made up of Reps. James, Nordlund and Green. ADJOURNMENT CHAIRMAN PORTER adjourned the meeting at 3:15 p.m.