HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON FISHERIES January 24, 1996 5:02 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Representative Alan Austerman, Chairman Representative Carl Moses, Vice Chairman Representative Scott Ogan Representative Gary Davis Representative Kim Elton MEMBERS ABSENT All members were present. OTHER HOUSE MEMBERS PRESENT Representative Joe Green COMMITTEE CALENDAR Guide/Charter Task Force Proposal Presentation PREVIOUS ACTION No previous action on this presentation. WITNESS REGISTER BUD HODSON, Chair Sport Fishing Guide/Charter/ Task Force 4852 Hunter Drive Anchorage, Alaska 99502 Telephone: (907) 243-8450 POSITION STATEMENT: Presented recommendations from Task Force. PAT CARTER, Member Sport Fishing Guide/Charter/ Task Force; and Legislative Assistant to Representative Eldon Mulder Alaska State Legislature State Capitol Building, Room 411 Juneau, Alaska 99801 Telephone: (907) 465-2647 POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on Task Force recommendations. ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 96-2, SIDE A Number 0001 CHAIRMAN ALAN AUSTERMAN called the House Special Committee on Fisheries meeting to order at 5:02 p.m. Members present at the call to order were Representatives Austerman, Moses, Ogan, Davis and Elton. Chairman Austerman informed the committee that the presentation would end at 5:25 p.m. Further testimony would be taken when the committee reconvened the following Wednesday for that purpose. CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN noted that there already had been a public hearing on the original recommendations from the Sport Fishing Guide/Charter Task Force ("Task Force"). He commented that the purpose of the current meeting was to hear the final recommendations from the Task Force. He added that at this point, testimony would only be taken from Task Force members; however, a representative from the Department of Fish and Game was available to answer any technical questions. Number 0196 BUD HODSON, Chair, Sport Fishing Guide/Charter Task Force, presented recommendations via teleconference from Anchorage. He prefaced his remarks by saying he owned the Tikchik Narrows Lodge and participated in the sport fishing industry in Bristol Bay. He referred to a letter he had written to Chairman Austerman the previous spring and thanked him for working with their group during the interim. MR. HODSON explained that the Task Force had been created by the Board of Fisheries because of a proposal for guide registration that was before the board. Prior to the board's meeting on this subject, a group of industry representatives from around Alaska had met to discuss the proposal. At that time, he said, it had become clear that the definitions and requirements in the proposal were inadequate. The industry representatives had recommended that the Board of Fisheries form a task force to address these issues. Number 0331 MR. HODSON observed that the difference between registration and licensing was that the Board of Fisheries could not require a fee when a person registered, nor require certain other elements that occurred in association with licensing. The Task Force's first question, then, was whether licensing was appropriate and if so, should it be accomplished through statute rather than regulations by the Board of Fisheries. Mr. Hodson noted that the Task Force had mulled over the problem of identifying precisely who was participating in the sport fish guiding industry. The Task Force had quickly concluded there were two categories of participants, employees and operators. The operators employed the guides; both groups carried different responsibilities. In response to these considerations, the Task Force had come up with their two-tier licensing proposal. Number 0498 MR. HODSON said the Task Force had sent out more than 3,000 copies of their original proposal, met with different user groups, and held both teleconferences and workshops before creating the proposal currently before the committee. In reaction to public testimony and letters received, he added, the Task Force had made several amendments when they met on January 11, 1996, including one that lowered the insurance rates. Deletions were made at that time to drop both the age limit and the requirement of a separate guide's license for operators. The rationale behind dropping the age limit, he said, was that there was a lot of public comment about family operations where teenagers participated in the industry. MR. HODSON explained that the proposal before the committee was the final action of the Task Force, approved unanimously by that body. He disclosed that following the January 11, 1996, meeting, several Task Force members had found the original proposal unacceptable. However, after amendments were made, they had been in unanimous agreement. Mr. Hodson expressed that in the sport fishing industry, there was still concern over licensing at the statewide level, with many operators worried about the possibility for numerous rules, excessive fees and lots of paperwork. Therefore, there were still many people opposed to any form of licensing. On the other hand, Mr. Hodson said, as chairman of the Task Force, he had heard numerous positive remarks, with many saying they could not believe it had not been done earlier. He expressed that although he did not believe the proposal was perfect, he personally felt good about the product the Task Force had created. Number 0740 CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN thanked Mr. Hodson and said he was officially accepting the recommendations in the report from the Task Force. He recognized Representative Green, who was attending the meeting. He then reiterated that no public testimony was being taken at the meeting. He stated his intention of bringing the issue up at the following Wednesday's meeting, at which time they would accept committee substitutes to HB 175 and discuss whether to roll these recommendations into that bill or any other. CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN asked if any other Task Force members were on teleconference to testify. Hearing none, he asked if any Task Force members were in the audience and called on Pat Carter. Number 0856 PAT CARTER, Member, Sport Fishing Guide/Charter Task Force, and Legislative Assistant to Representative Eldon Mulder, stated that one part of the final proposal still concerned him. He explained that at the last meeting of the Task Force, they had combined the licenses so that if a single-boat operator purchased an operator's license, he was exempted from having to buy a guide's license, provided that he qualified under the requirements for a guide. Mr. Carter added that he had originally voted for that amendment; however, after further discussion and thought, he and other members had asked for a reconsideration, which was voted down. MR. CARTER explained that his only problem with the final conclusions of the proposal was the unknown number of single-boat operators in Alaska. He thought the number would be quite high, possibly 50 to 70 percent of operators. He felt that the Task Force had effectively taken money that would have been generated by guide fees and left the burden on the rest. He thought the monetary burden should be shared throughout the guiding industry, rather than exempting the single-boat operators. Number 990 CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN asked if Mr. Carter would give the committee a recommendation in writing prior to the following Wednesday's meeting. MR. CARTER agreed he would. He added that he would first contact the Department of Fish and Game to find out how many guides were currently registered as single-boat operators and to determine the department's likely cost of monitoring the sport fishing guide industry. Number 1017 REPRESENTATIVE KIM ELTON asked, if a guide were licensed under the Department of Fish and Game, whether the license fees would go into the Fish and Game fund and whether they could be used for that kind of administrative work. He wanted to know what restrictions were placed on the Fish and Game fund as it pertained to administering such a program. MR. CARTER asserted that the original operator's fee was paid to the Department of Commerce and Economic Development, not to the Department of Fish and Game. Number 1073 REPRESENTATIVE ELTON said his understanding was that if a license was sold by the Department of Fish and Game, then the license receipts went into the Fish and Game fund. He wanted to know if that fund could be used to administer the program in question. Number 1120 CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN referred to the Task Force recommendation and asked Mr. Hodson about combining the operator's and guide's licenses for single-boat operators. He noted that the definition in the proposal did not specify the same qualifications for being a guide as for being an operator. For example, the sport fish guide license required CPR training, whereas the operator license did not. He wondered if that simply needed correction. Number 1166 MR. HODSON responded that the intention was that the operator would have to qualify under the guide requirements in order to be entitled to guide under the exemption. He said he believed the language specified this. Number 1212 CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN referred to page 2 of the recommendations and said that another issue which needed addressing was the reporting requirement discussed in the second to last paragraph. He stated that the committee wanted to put some teeth into that concept, ensuring that reporting occurred. However, he said, they did not want to create a bureaucracy. He added that if guides and operators were already reporting in some manner, perhaps that would suffice under the reporting requirement. He suggested that the committee address that issue. Number 1264 REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT OGAN said that for the next meeting, the committee should consider what regulations would be affecting this issue, whether through statute, a board or other means. He expressed concern that they were creating additional bureaucracy. Number 1304 MR. HODSON said the Task Force's intention was to keep the process simple. No board had been envisioned. An operator would only have to show proof of insurance and a business license. In talking with the Department of Commerce and Economic Development (DCED), he said, he understood that DCED could figure out the cost of administering the program and set appropriate fees that could be adjusted every two years. Number 1343 CHAIRMAN AUSTERMAN noted that both the Task Force proposal and HB 175 would be discussed at the next meeting on Wednesday, January31, 1996, at 5:00 p.m. Number 1397 ADJOURNMENT Chairman Austerman adjourned the meeting of the House Special Committee on Fisheries at 5:25 p.m.