Number 270 SB 305-RIGHTS OF PROPERTY OWNER IN DISASTER AREA MS. PORTIA PARKER, aid to Senator Lyda Green, stated for the record that SB 305 was introduced to address the concerns of private property owners and residents during emergency management of wildfires and disaster areas. SB 305 establishes statutory guidelines for balancing the rights of private property owners and emergency personnel during wildfires and natural disasters. MS. PARKER said the main provisions of SB 305 provide that an adult resident or property owner can choose to evacuate or not to evacuate an area, unless a minor or young children are involved. Property owners and residents shall be permitted to enter a threatened area if entry does not interfere with emergency personnel and proof of residency or property ownership is provided. MS. PARKER stated that SB 305 also provides statutory protection for all emergency personnel from liability if a property owner or resident is injured or killed because they choose not to evacuate or they entered or re-entered a threatened area. Number 432 MAJOR TED BACHMAN, Alaska State Troopers, said he has been working with the Department of Natural Resources (DNR), the Bureau of Land Management (BLM) and Public Safety and Fire Services in the Matsu Valley to develop a statewide evacuation policy. The committee feels that SB 305 does not address all of the essential issues. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR asked about the granting of complete immunity for people or organizations that might have some type of liability in a disaster. MAJOR BACHMAN said he thinks immunity is given to the emergency agency or organization that is handling the disaster if they advise a resident to leave and the resident refuses or the resident obtains re-entry knowing there may be some danger to life and property. Number 754 CAPTAIN TOM SAVAGE, Alaska State Troopers, said the committee's policy is almost in the final stages of development and it provides more flexibility for all concerned. The policy provides input for modifying areas that need strengthening or areas that need to be corrected and it clarifies the issues. One area of difficulty has been the definitions of terminology, and the policy defines these things and provides a clear direction for emergency responders. CAPTAIN SAVAGE said that one of the biggest issues has been access into an area. SB 305 has not changed current statutory issues-- firefighters can still restrict or close access to areas. The policy approach allows more flexibility, greater input, and greater mobility once issues are found. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR asked Captain Savage if he had specific instances he wanted to address. CAPTAIN SAVAGE said there is no provision in the statute for removing a intoxicated person or a mentally incapable person without their consent. CAPTAIN SAVAGE commented that re-entry or entry is also an issue addressed by the policy. The draft policy defines what will be expected if there is a road closure, road block or checkpoint. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR said he was not sure what policy Captain Savage was referring to. CAPTAIN SAVAGE responded it is the policy Major Bachman was referring to--what the committee has been developing for the past nine or ten months. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR asked if this is a internal policy to guide personnel in making decisions or is it a policy that will be enforceable through regulation. CAPTAIN SAVAGE said the policy has not been addressed at this level and certainly not in terms of regulation. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR asked how the policy addresses the issue of a intoxicated person wanting to go into a fire area? CAPTAIN SAVAGE responded that a incapacitated person will be prevented from going into a fire area, but a person with alcohol on his breath who appears to be rational will be allowed to enter to protect his property. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR asked to what extent does the policy assist in these circumstances. CAPTAIN SAVAGE said it develops greater layers and levels for evacuation, providing for exigent circumstance when people are unable to protect themselves and have to be removed without their consent. Number 1211 MR. LARRY WOOD, resident of Lazy Mountain, said he witnessed the entire exercise at Lazy Mountain. His house fronted Clark Wolverine Road where the majority of the activity occurred, and his letter to the Governor was the catalyst for what has happened. He also stated that he disagrees with Captain Savage. MR. WOOD said he is a member of the Lazy Mountain Community Counsel Post-fire Committee which drafted the statutes. The committee decided to reject the policy because policy changes, depending on who is in charge. Contrary to Captain Savage's assertions, the policy is not benign for the residents of the area. If an evacuation order is given, people who refuse to leave should be removed even if force is needed. There is no qualification for this point in the policy. MR. WOOD said the Lazy Mountain Community Council feels that SB 305 will insure that property owners are not treated as chattel. Federal mandate says that there should be no participation of property owners in defense of their property, but it was recognized at Miller's Reach that homes were saved when residents stayed to help. Fire crews can bulldoze the property, the house or whatever, in order to stop the fire but the State takes no responsibility for that property. MR. WOOD said his only criticism of SB 305 is that the proof of identification (ID) is raised beyond the level of a driver's license. If a person is called at work or finds out over the radio that there is an emergency, they may leave their ID behind in their haste to leave. MR. WOOD noted that the only thing he is trying to do with SB 305 is to insure that people have access to their property. SENATOR TAYLOR asked Mr. Wood if he had a copy of SB 305. MR. WOOD responded yes. He said it varies little from what was drafted with the exception of the section that states: "contains the photograph," and the original draft from the Lazy Mountain Council said that a person who provides false witness should be held criminally liable. The financially responsible aspect of SB 305 is also objectionable because it makes "the person who vouches is responsible for that individual who goes into the area and has a fender bender, for example." MR. WOOD said the citizens of Lazy Mountain are not going to sue a police officer for trying to do his job under the circumstances that were experienced at Lazy Mountain, but they most assuredly will object--SB 305 is that objection. MR. WOOD said the Lazy Mountain fire was handled very badly by the Division of Forestry and the Alaska State Troopers in terms of security and perimeter control. The draft plan addresses some of this, but the residents of Lazy Mountain feel that it would serve all of Alaska well to have the protection afforded by SB 305. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR thanked Mr. Wood and said he shares some of the same concerns. One of his concerns is over the wording "legally and financially responsible for another person," and another concern is over the liability aspects of the immunity provision. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR said it is the intent of the Committee to hold SB 305 and work on it in the interim. Number 1900 MS. BARBARA LEISS made the following comments: First of all, this is farm country. Most of the people who live here are farmers with large tracts of land, livestock and other animals. A lot of the people have lived here all of their life and everyone knows everyone. Hence, the reason for all of the problems that occurred during the roadblock. People seeking access to a fire or disaster area must show good reasons to the officers or firefighters in charge for wanting to enter that area, whether they are a resident, relative of a resident, or friend of a resident who wants to help. There are a lot of people in Alaska that do not have fire insurance and they will take desperate measures to save their goods--firefighters and police officers need to realize that. Another problem was that the fire occurred in the afternoon and it reached its peak around 1:30 or 2:00 on a weekday. Elementary school children were being bussed home at that time. They were dropped off on the main road to walk to their homes. Shortly after 2:30, State Troopers were informed by the firefighters to put up a roadblock to the mountain at its main entrance. Remember, we have only one way in and one way out and that's the problem. Parents returning home from work were denied access to get to their children who were home alone and the authorities did not know which homes had children nor did they take any steps to evacuate the children. There was no means of transportation for evacuating the children. There were also disabled people in wheelchairs who were home alone. The police should work with the residents when there are children and disabled and elderly people involved. This area is not addressed in SB 305 and the citizens of Lazy Mountain would like it included. There was also an incident with an old man who was in a wheelchair. The man's son finally convinced the police to check on him. The police went to the door, didn't wait very long, and were already out the driveway by the time the elderly man in the wheelchair got to the door. Common sense needs to be used. "And, of course, you've already heard about the drawing of the gun on a farmer boy here who has never had a criminal record in his life and the reason that boy was so desperate to get to his farm and his family was because at the roadblock, he was told that his house was on fire and his family was trapped." MS. LEISS said that changing the statutes to be more reasonable for the majority of citizens is in order. Number 2115 MR. KEN ROWLAND, resident of Lazy Mountain, said he does not believe the policy is the way to address this problem, and he wholeheartedly agrees with Larry Wood that policy changes with the people in charge. He is also concerned about the gun issue. MR. ROWLAND said that policy should not be at the whim of bureaucrats and firefighters who can change it indiscriminately. He is also concerned that firefighters can burn a person's home to enhance the firefighting effort. Destroying property should never be left to the decision of one person--at least three officials should make that decision. CHAIRMAN TAYLOR suggested the re-draft should have a provision saying that if there is a decision to burn a home or building the State will rebuild or give the owner money to rebuild. Number 2287 MS. HELEN MUNOZ said the other people who testified expressed her concerns. She said that for the first time in her life she felt threatened by authority during the Lazy Mountain fire.