HJR 27 - ALASKA/RUSSIA MARITIME BOUNDARY [Contains discussion of HJR 26] Number 1092 CHAIR BARNES announced that the next order of business would be House Joint Resolution No. 27, relating to the maritime boundary between Alaska and the former Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. She asked that Mr. Olson and Mr. Seidenberg share their expertise on information pertinent to HJR 27, rather than having Representative Coghill, sponsor, give opening comments. Number 1168 CARL OLSON, Chairman, State Department Watch, testified via teleconference from California. He emphasized that negotiations of a maritime boundary between the United States and Russia impinge upon Alaska in many different areas. He said these negotiations are important to Alaska with respect to sovereignty, boundaries, and its own property. He related that the United States Department of State is responsible for negotiating these kinds of executive agreements. It is, at this point, only an executive agreement, not a treaty, as it has never been ratified by the Russian side. It can easily be modified, rescinded, or amended, for example. MR. OLSON explained that approximately a year and a half ago, the Russians were discontent with "how much they already got out of the State Department, and they'd been demanding to get additional seabed rights - I think it's about 40,000 (indisc.--simult. speech). He indicated that the Russians now would like the maritime boundary to be moved closer to Alaska in order to obtain an additional 300 million pounds of fish per year from the Bering Sea. He said unfortunately the State Department is very accommodating about having discussions over this kind of relinquishment, which is being conducted by Thomas Pickering, Under Secretary for Political Affairs. MR. OLSON told members, "You can't take away territory from a state without the consent of the state." He said he doubts that in Alaska there would have to be input, participation or hearings on this issue, let alone hearing from the rest of the American public, which is very much impacted by it. The resolution is another impetus to get this out in the open and get the rights of Alaskans and the American public initiated in here. He believes this issue is therefore even more critical than it was a year before. REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS, acting as chair, thanked Mr. Olson for his comments and asked if members had any additional questions. Number 1319 REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ noted Mr. Olson's article in Orbis, contained in committee packets, then said he has questions about the strength of American assertions of sovereignty in the [Russian] Arctic. He said as he understands it, discovery must be followed by effective occupation. He stated, "I don't know what sort of effective occupation we've exerted over some of these islands in recent years, or continuing assertions of sovereignty." Number 1401 MARK SEIDENBERG, Vice-Chairman, State Department Watch, testified again via teleconference from Seattle, Washington. He explained: Basically, you have to look at the Organic Act of 1884. The Organic Act of 1884 includes two forms of territory, one which was included in the 1867 Convention of Washington, which was Russia's (indisc.) to the United States, which is this little area in what's main Alaska, and some of the islands - not all of them. And then the other territory that was included in the 1994 Organic Act was that territory known as Alaska. The practice was that during the Treasury Department phase for administrating Alaska, from 1877 to 1884, they would put in ... their files everything that was added to Alaska. And those were transferred to the Interior Department in 1884, pursuant to the ... 1884 Organic Act. Wrangell Islands, which was the largest of the group, for an example, ... was "American discoveried" - the Russians never knew about it. Then, in 1881, Calvin Hooper (ph), who was the de facto governor of Alaska, went there and annexed it. Then, in complying with the requirements at that time, occupation was considered effective, because they included it in Alaska, and then the ... U.S. government started issuing publications, starting from before the turn of the century, and then as late as 1977, on ... U.S. Department of Interior documents, including within the state. MR. SEIDENBERG offered to go into a longer history, about the U.S. Navy's survey of it in the 1930s. He also offered to send Representative Berkowitz a copy of a journal article he wrote for "Muskox" (ph) at the University of Saskatchewan on the subject. Number 1538 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if there were any year-round residents on the islands being discussed. MR. SEIDENBERG responded that Wrangell Island has year-round residents, but all the other islands are deserted. REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS asked how many people reside on Wrangell Island. MR. SEIDENBERG estimated from his last visit to Wrangell Island, in 1995, that 150 people resided there, although that might have changed. At that time, Russia maintained approximately 18 troops there, including 17 enlisted troops and one lieutenant, although they had been talking about moving the military off the island altogether. RYNNIEVA MOSS, Legislative Assistant to Representative John Coghill, Jr., Alaska State Legislature, informed members that Representative Coghill would like to make a technical amendment to HJR 27, changing the spelling of "Wrangel Island" to "Wrangell Island", as he had received information that the latter spelling is preferred. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN made a motion to adopt the technical amendment. REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS asked if there was any objection to the amendment, which would change the spelling throughout HJR 27. There being no objection, she stated that a committee substitute would be ordered for HJR 27. She asked whether there were further questions or testimony. Number 1647 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN made a motion to move HJR 27 [as amended] from committee with individual recommendations. Number 1662 REPRESENTATIVE BERKOWITZ objected for a brief discussion. He pointed out that the tone of HJR 26 is more statesmanlike than that of HJR 27, which seems to have an angry tone. He recommended that HJR 27 be given a more diplomatic tone in keeping with the respectful relationship with the federal government. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN concurred. MS. MOSS asked Representative Berkowitz to bring any suggestions to the sponsor's office. REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS asked whether there was any objection to moving the resolution from the committee. REPRESENTATIVE JOULE informed Mr. Seidenberg that he looked forward to receiving the information from him. MR. SEIDENBERG specified that he would be glad to send the information on the oral histories of the Eskimo residents of Wrangell Island. REPRESENTATIVE PHILLIPS thanked participants for their time. She then noted that CSHJR 27(WTR) was moved from the House Special Committee on World Trade and State/Federal Relations without any objection.