HB 175-US PRESIDENT ELECT. COMPACT: POPULAR VOTE  4:12:42 PM CHAIR KREISS-TOMKINS announced that the next order of business would be HOUSE BILL NO. 175, "An Act ratifying an interstate compact to elect the President and Vice-President of the United States by national popular vote; and making related changes to statutes applicable to the selection by voters of electors for candidates for President and Vice- President of the United States and to the duties of those electors." 4:13:21 PM REPRESENTATIVE ZACH FANSLER, Alaska State Legislature, as prime sponsor of HB 175, stated that the proposed legislation has generated good discussion. He maintained that it is important that there be an [electoral] system in which everyone has an equal "say" in the voting process and in which all states contribute to the process through as much voter participation as possible. 4:14:33 PM REPRESENTATIVE BIRCH stated that he is opposed to HB 175; each vote already counts; and it would diminish the ability of Alaskans to influence the national election. He maintained that Alaska has three electoral votes; two of them are U.S. Senators; and [the current system] gives Alaska an "out-of-balance" impact on presidential elections. He asserted that Alaska should recognize and utilize that opportunity as a benefit and not diminish it through National Popular Vote. He expressed his belief that National Popular Vote would detract from the Electoral College approach; it would be bad for his constituents and for Alaska. He added that in the last presidential election, if Alaska were a member of the compact, it could have had a 100-percent vote for the Republican candidate, but the three electoral votes would have had to be cast for the winner of the national popular vote. He maintained that result would have "buried" every Alaskan vote. He reiterated that the Electoral College is a good process and is good for the state. 4:16:26 PM REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX expressed that she is conflicted about the proposed legislation. She stated that from the time she was a child learning about the Electoral College, she has always thought the system "weird." She asserted that she would have no problem supporting a constitutional amendment to eliminate the Electoral College; however, she expressed that she is uncomfortable with the prospect of Alaska, through the mechanism of the compact, having to cast its electoral votes to a candidate for whom the majority of Alaskans did not vote. She offered that she supports HB 175 moving to another committee for further discussion, but she does not want her vote for HB 175 to be considered as support of the proposed legislation. 4:18:09 PM REPRESENTATIVE WOOL stated that he is also conflicted about HB 175. He said that National Popular Vote is a mechanism that would essentially produce the same result as a constitutional amendment but without the burdensome process. He relayed that if enough states join the compact, the country would essentially choose the President by popular vote. He said the fundamental question is: "As a nation, do we want to elect our national leader based on the population of the country, as opposed to 50 individual states and how they break it down?" He suggested that if one applied this system to the election of the governor of Alaska, instead of using the popular vote to determine the winner, the vote would be determined by the results of each district with each district "weighted" according to its population. He added that Alaska's districts have equal populations, but the states do not. He maintained that with electoral votes being based on population, Alaska has the lowest possible number of electoral votes - three electoral votes - and that number is insignificant. He asserted that it is only through the popular vote that a person's individual vote can "tip the scale." REPRESENTATIVE WOOL said that he understands the appeal of using the results of the popular vote and offered that most democracies use a national vote count. He mentioned that voters used to have to be landowners and could not be slaves. He cited the historical reasons for the Electoral College, which include counting slaves as three-fifths of a person to boost the number of electoral votes of the southern states. He suggested that these practices and historical justifications are antiquated. REPRESENTATIVE WOOL expressed his belief that presidential candidates would campaign differently if the election was decided by popular vote. He opined that they would not just campaign in Los Angeles and New York, because much of the population live in rural areas. 4:22:21 PM REPRESENTATIVE TUCK expressed that he agreed with Representative Wool. He offered that under President George W. Bush, when the President and both houses of the U.S. Congress were Republican, the "stars were aligned" to open the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR). He maintained that Alaska does not get the attention it is due, because it represents only three electoral votes and is therefore insignificant. He offered that a popular vote system would encourage Alaska legislators to present a united front on issues; there is strength in numbers; and Alaska would get the attention it deserves. He referred to testimony regarding candidates visiting rural Colorado and attested that was due to Colorado being a "swing" state. He asked, "When will Alaska ever be a swing state? When will we ever have the population density to where we're all of a sudden ... significant [in] the eyes of these candidates?" He reiterated that under National Popular Vote, Alaska would attract more federal campaign money, more focus on Alaskan issues, and more individual attention to Alaskans. He stated that he supports HB 175 because he believes Alaska would get more attention; it has big concerns and offers big benefits to the federal government. He mentioned that Alaska can decide to opt out later if it so desires. He added that the conditions that led to the Electoral College are outdated. 4:25:23 PM REPRESENTATIVE KNOPP stated that he is opposed to HB 175. He opined that it would not encourage voter participation and joining a compact disenfranchises voters. He maintained that he would support a constitutional amendment but believes the compact is the wrong mechanism. 4:26:23 PM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON stated that she does not support HB 175. She relayed that she believes in states' rights and the Electoral College gives Alaska a true advantage in the national election. She conceded that it is inevitable that the results of the election are decided before the polls close in Alaska, but she maintained that does not mean Alaska's votes do not count. She expressed her belief that using the popular vote [to decide an election] would be a disadvantage to Alaska and would disenfranchise Alaska voters. She opined that the United States has the best elections and the longest history of elections, and elections in many other countries, even democracies, are fraught with civil unrest. She asked, "Why are we trying to fix something that isn't broken?" 4:28:27 PM REPRESENTATIVE TUCK moved to report HB 175 out of committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes. [AN UNINDENTIFIED SPEAKER objected.] A roll call vote was taken. Representatives LeDoux, Tuck, Wool, and Kreiss-Tomkins voted in favor of HB 175. Representatives Birch, Johnson, and Knopp voted against it. Therefore, HB 175 moved out of committee by a vote of 4-3.