HB 409-CAMPAIGN EXPENDITURES  8:30:28 AM CHAIR LYNN announced that the next order of business was HOUSE BILL NO. 409, "An Act relating to state election campaigns, the duties of the Alaska Public Offices Commission, the reporting and disclosure of expenditures and independent expenditures, the filing of reports, and the identification of certain communications in state election campaigns; and providing for an effective date." 8:31:11 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON moved to adopt the proposed committee substitute (CS) for HB 409, Version 26-LS1495\E, Bullard, 3/2/10, as a work draft. 8:31:45 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG objected for discussion purposes. 8:32:03 AM MICHAEL SICA, Staff, Representative Bob Lynn, Alaska State Legislature, on behalf of the House State Affairs Standing Committee, prime sponsor, which is chaired by Representative Lynn, discussed the changes to HB 409 proposed in the committee substitute (CS), Version E. He said the intent of the proposed CS is to enact laws that address disclosures and disclaimers for independent expenditures by corporations, labor unions, and limited liability companies (LLCs). He highlighted the following proposed new language: on page 3, Section 4, regarding disclosures; on page 5, Section 10, regarding disclaimers; and on page 6, Section 11, regarding personal liability for a chief officer in a corporation in the event of statements that are defamatory. He directed attention to Section 12, and said the committee had passed an amendment that "basically creates a 24-hour rule for reporting the expenditure." Mr. Sica noted that in the committee packet is a checklist regarding Version E, as well memorandums from Legislative Legal and Research Services. 8:35:03 AM MR. SICA, in response to Chair Lynn, reminded the committee that Amendment 3a, which changed the requirement for filing an independent expenditure report with the Alaska Public Offices Commission (APOC) from "not later than three days after an expenditure has been made" to "not later than 24 hours after an expenditure has been made", was adopted. He mentioned the language in Amendment 3b, which had been tabled. 8:36:26 AM CHAIR LYNN moved to take from the table Amendment 3b. [There being no objection, Amendment 3b was before the committee.] 8:36:36 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON moved to adopt Conceptual Amendment 1, [Amendment 3b, with line numbers changed to reflect Version E], which read as follows: Page 6, lines 13 - 17: Delete "An expenditure report filed under this subsection must include any expenditure not yet reported that was made before the filing of the report. However, an expenditure that exceeds $250 and that is made within nine days of an election shall be reported to the commission not later than 24 hours after the expenditure is made." There being no objection, Conceptual Amendment 1, to Version E, was adopted. 8:38:03 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG removed his objection to the motion to adopt the proposed committee substitute (CS) for HB 409, Version 26-LS1495\E, Bullard, 3/2/10, as a work draft. There being no further objection, Version E was before the committee. 8:38:40 AM CHAIR LYNN moved to adopt Amendment 2, labeled 26-LS1495\E.1, Bullard, 3/3/10, which read as follows: Page 4, following line 9: Insert a new bill section to read:  "* Sec. 7. AS 15.13.067 is amended to read: Sec. 15.13.067. Who may make expenditures. Only the following may make an expenditure that is not an  independent expenditure in an election for candidates for elective office: (1) the candidate; (2) an individual; (3) a group that has registered under AS 15.13.050; and (4) a nongroup entity that has registered under AS 15.13.050." Renumber the following bill sections accordingly. Page 4, line 29, through page 5, line 6: Delete all material. Renumber the following bill sections accordingly. Page 7, line 13: Delete "AS 15.13.067 and 15.13.140(a) are" Insert "AS 15.13.140(a) is" REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG objected for discussion purposes. 8:39:32 AM MR. SICA explained that at the last hearing, the committee adopted an amendment that inserted "independent" before "expenditure" and "expenditures", and unintentionally did not speak to the fact that there are expenditures beyond independent expenditures, for example, expenditures made by "candidates or someone in coordination with a candidate." Amendment 2 relates to AS 15.13.067 and specifies who may make expenditures that are not independent expenditures. 8:40:50 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG noted grammatical changes currently proposed in Version E, throughout the language in Section 9, on page 4, line 29, through page 5, line 6: "[IN]" would be changed to "on". He said that is an important change that would be lost if Amendment 2 is adopted. He said he thinks that the bill drafter probably wants to delete the reference on page 6, line 5, to AS 15.13.067(3). 8:42:41 AM ALPHEUS BULLARD, Attorney at Law, Legislative Legal Council, Legislative Legal and Research Services, Legislative Affairs Agency, indicated that Representative Gruenberg's suggestion to leave the grammatical changes in the bill would do no harm. 8:43:13 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to adopt Conceptual Amendment 1 to Amendment 2, so that Section 9 of the bill would not be deleted, [and the reference in Section 9 to AS 15.13.067(3) would remain in Version E]. CHAIR LYNN asked Mr. Bullard if Conceptual Amendment 1 to Amendment 2 speaks to the heart of the bill and is necessary. 8:45:58 AM MR. BULLARD answered that Conceptual Amendment 1 to Amendment 2 would have no substantive effect, and while it may be "nice" for all grammar in statute to be perfect, it is not legally necessary. 8:46:29 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON objected to Conceptual Amendment 1 to Amendment 2. He said the new Section 7 proposed in Amendment 2 seems to conflict with Section 9, because the language in each varies regarding those who can make expenditures. MR. BULLARD clarified that Section 9 speaks to who may make expenditures on behalf of a candidate, while the proposed new Section 7 "is a little bit more global," because "it speaks to who may make expenditures that are not independent expenditures under the chapter, not just on behalf of a candidate." In response to a follow-up question, he said while paragraph (1), in Section 9, addresses expenditures authorized by or on behalf of a candidate, paragraph (2) proposes that only a group's campaign treasurer may make expenditures for that group. He said under the proposed Section 7 in Amendment 2, a group campaign treasurer would be allowed to make campaign expenditures, if that group is registered. 8:52:26 AM MR. BULLARD, in response to Chair Lynn, reiterated that Conceptual Amendment 1 to Amendment 2 would have no substantive effect of which he is aware. 8:52:41 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG noted that the language in the aforementioned AS 15.13.067 is included in the proposed new Section 7 in Amendment 2. He asked Mr. Bullard why it is important to take out the reference to AS 15.13.067(3), as proposed in Version E. 8:54:11 AM MR. BULLARD explained that in Version E, AS 15.13.067 would be repealed, which is why the reference to that statute would be removed. REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG reiterated that if Amendment 2 is adopted, reference to that statute would be in the bill. 8:54:37 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG withdrew [Conceptual] Amendment 1 to Amendment 2. 8:54:48 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to adopt Amendment 2 to Amendment 2, so that Section 9 of the bill would not be deleted, and the reference in Section 9 to AS 15.13.067(3) would be left in Version E. 8:55:48 AM MR. BULLARD offered his understanding that Amendment 2 to Amendment 2 is the same conceptual amendment as was the withdrawn Conceptual Amendment 1 to Amendment 2. In response to a follow-up question, he said he would describe the reference [to AS 15.13.067(3), on page 5, line 5, of Version E], as a "helpful reference." He stated that currently a group that makes expenditures is required to be registered under AS 15.13.050, whether or not that is referenced in 15.13.067. 8:57:12 AM REPRESENTATIVE P. WILSON said she does not understand why [the reference to AS 15.13.067] is being retained when it is covered in another statute. REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG opined that it is helpful to have reference to current law in this section. 8:57:44 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON objected to Amendment 2 to Amendment 2. 8:57:54 AM A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Gatto, Gruenberg, and Petersen voted in favor of Amendment 2 to Amendment 2. Representatives Johnson, Seaton, Wilson, and Lynn voted against it. Therefore, Amendment 2 to Amendment 2 failed to be adopted by a vote of 3-4. CHAIR LYNN said he would like the committee to focus on the substance of the bill rather than "tweaking the grammar." 8:58:52 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG removed his objection to Amendment 2. 8:59:07 AM REPRESENTATIVE GATTO noted that throughout Version E, references to candidate, group, nongroup entity, and individual were replaced with the term, "person"; however, the proposed Amendment 2 includes all those eliminated terms. He asked if that is intentional. 9:00:06 AM MR. BULLARD responded as follows: That language does different things in different sections of the bill. In Section 1, that's a section that just provides to whom the chapter is applicable. There, by removing that language, "candidate", "group", "nongroup entity", "municipality", or "individual", ... it makes clear that AS 15.13 - state elections - applies to all persons equally. In the amendment, for example, the restored Section 7 speaks to who may make expenditures that are not independent expenditures: a candidate, individual, group, or nongroup entity. I did not want there to be any risk that there may be some perceived loophole that a corporation or a union - the subject of Citizens United - would be able to make ... expenditures. Citizens United deals only with independent expenditures. That's why that language is restored. 9:01:16 AM CHAIR LYNN asked if there was any further objection to Amendment 2. No objection was stated, therefore, Amendment 2 was adopted. 9:01:34 AM CHAIR LYNN moved to adopt Amendment 3, labeled 26-LS1495\E.2, Bullard, 3/8/10, which read as follows: Page 4, following line 9: Insert a new bill section to read:  "* Sec. 7. AS 15.13 is amended by adding a new section to read: Sec. 15.13.068. Expenditures and contributions by  foreign nationals. (a) A foreign national may not, directly or indirectly, in connection with an election under this chapter, make a contribution or expenditure or make an express or implied promise to make a contribution or expenditure. (b) In this section, "foreign national" includes (1) a foreign government, every political subdivision of a foreign government, every official, agent, or representative of a foreign government, and every agency, corporation, or instrumentality of the foreign government or of a political subdivision of a foreign government; (2) a person outside of the United States, unless it is established that the person is an individual and a citizen of and domiciled in the United States, or that the person is not an individual and is organized under or created by the laws of the United States or of any state or other place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and has its principal place of business in the United States; (3) a partnership, association, corporation, organization, or other combination of persons organized under the laws of or having its principal place of business in a foreign country; or (4) a domestic subsidiary of an entity described in (1) - (3) of this subsection or a domestic corporation controlled by an entity described in (1) - (3) of this subsection, if that entity finances, participates in, or selects a person who participates in the making of a contribution or an expenditure of the domestic subsidiary or domestic corporation. (c) The provisions of this section apply only to the extent permitted by federal law." Renumber the following bill sections accordingly. 9:01:44 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON objected for discussion purposes. 9:01:49 AM MR. SICA noted that since the adopted Amendment 2 added Section 7, the Section 7 in Amendment 3 would most likely be changed to Section 8. He said Amendment 3 essentially parallels federal law on prohibition of foreign nationals making independent expenditures. He noted that there is a memorandum in the committee packet with further details. CHAIR LYNN said his prime concern relates to the issue of foreign nationals influencing elections. 9:02:43 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON recalled that the committee had heard from [Mr. Ptasin], an attorney from the Office of the Attorney General who represents the Alaska Public Offices Commission (APOC), who had testified that it would be difficult to take a violation to either APOC or the state court without language in state law paralleling existing federal law. 9:03:51 AM MR. SICA noted that Mr. Ptasin was available telephonically to answer questions. 9:04:03 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON removed his objection to Amendment 3. There being no further objection, Amendment 3 was adopted. 9:04:10 AM MR. SICA directed attention to Amendment 4, labeled 26- LS1495\E.3, Bullard, 3/8/10, which read as follows: Page 5, line 22, following "the": Insert "name and city and state of residence or  principal place of business, as applicable, of each of  the" Page 5, line 24: Delete ", with the words "top five  contributors."[.]" Insert "." Page 6, following line 9: Insert a new subsection to read: "(d) To satisfy the requirements of (a)(2)(C) of this section and, if applicable, (a)(2)(D) of this section, the following statement or statements must be read, in a manner that is easily heard, or placed in the communication so as to be easily discernable, or, in a communication that is transmitted by a method that includes both audio and video components, be read in a manner that is easily heard and placed in the communication so as to be easily discernable: This communication was paid for by (person's name and city and state of principal place of business). The top contributors of (person's name) are (the name and city and state of residence or principal place of business, as applicable, of the largest contributors to the person under AS 15.13.090(a)(2)(D))." MR. SICA explained that if Amendment 4 was adopted, Section 10(a)(2)(D), on page 5, beginning on line 22, would read as follows: (D) identify the name and city and  state of residence or principal place of business, as  applicable, of each of the person's five largest  contributors under AS 15.13.040(e)(5), if any, during  the 12-month period before the date of the  communication. CHAIR LYNN said Amendment 4 would add the audio component to campaign advertising. 9:06:16 AM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON said he thinks the audio would be read so fast that it would not be discernable. People who want to know who sponsors a campaign advertisement can go to a website to find out that information. He said he does not want to clutter the air or obliterate the message, and he warned that doing so could lead to law suits. He said he does not support listing the top contributors. 9:09:33 AM CHAIR LYNN moved to adopt Amendment 4 [text provided previously], then he withdrew his motion to adopt Amendment 4. 9:10:00 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to adopt Amendment 5, [which is identical to the withdrawn Amendment 4]. REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON objected. 9:10:35 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG spoke to Amendment 5. He said the proposed disclaimer is shorter than existing law, which will save time, because it will not require that the physical street or post office box be read - only the company name, city, and state would have to be read. 9:11:12 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to adopt a conceptual amendment to Amendment 5, which would insert "three" between "The top" and "contributors", and would not require a company's full name. As an example of the latter, Representative Gruenberg said The Coca-Cola Company could shorten its name to Coca-Cola. 9:12:05 AM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON objected to the conceptual amendment to Amendment 5, saying it would make no difference. 9:12:42 AM CHAIR LYNN noted that [Representative Johnson has experience related to television and radio]. 9:13:07 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG maintained that the conceptual amendment to Amendment 5 would shorten the process, and further changes in that direction could be made with further amendments. 9:13:46 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG in response to Representative Gatto clarified the changes that would be made by the proposed conceptual amendment to Amendment 5. 9:14:41 AM A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Gruenberg, Petersen, Seaton, Wilson, and Gatto voted in favor of the conceptual amendment to Amendment 5. Representatives Johnson and Lynn voted against it. Therefore, the conceptual amendment to Amendment 5 was adopted by a vote of 5-2. 9:15:24 AM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON maintained his objection to Amendment 5 [as amended]. REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG stated that the purpose of the proposed bill is to provide transparency. He said Amendment 5, as amended, would help those who are visually impaired know who is behind a (television) advertisement, because they would be able to hear the names of campaign contributors announced. 9:17:42 AM MR. BULLARD, in response to Representative Seaton, directed attention to the following language in Amendment 5, as amended: "(d) To satisfy the requirements of (a)(2)(C) of this section and, if applicable, (a)(2)(D) of this section, the following statement or statements must be read". Mr. Bullard explained, "The last two words - 'if applicable' - make that second required disclosure of the top contributors applicable only if the entity has contributed. If there are no contributors, there is no need to disclose the contributors." REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked if that provision would still be in the bill without Amendment 5, as amended. MR. BULLARD directed attention to language on page 5, [lines 22- 24], of Version E, which read as follows: (D) identify the person's five largest  contributors under AS 15.13.040(e)(5), if any, during  the 12-month period before the date of the  communication, with the words "top five contributors."  MR. BULLARD stated that the words, "if any" serve that same function. 9:19:06 AM MR. BULLARD, in response to Representative Johnson, said he is not sure how the language of Amendment 5, as amended, would be interpreted if there were 10 contributors donating exactly the same amount. 9:19:45 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said he thinks that issue is not problematic, because APOC would issue some kind of regulation on the subject. He said, "Anytime you have a number there, that's something that's going to have to be interpreted." CHAIR LYNN suggested the line could be drawn by determining the six largest corporations, and that that could be done by regulation. 9:20:54 AM REPRESENTATIVE GATTO said if there were six contributors who all gave the same highest amount, they would all be tied for first and, thus, would all have to be listed. Then, if there were two contributors who gave less than the six contributors gave, but the same amount as each other, they would be have to be listed in second place, and so on, he said. REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG pointed out, "That's in the bill itself, not in the amendment." 9:21:17 AM A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Gruenberg, Petersen, Seaton, and Gatto voted in favor of Amendment 5, as amended. Representatives Wilson, Johnson, and Lynn voted against it. Therefore, Amended 5, as amended, was adopted by a vote of 4-3. 9:22:34 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG, in response to Representative Seaton, said the adopted Amendment 5, as amended, speaks only to listing contributors during an audio portion of an advertisement. He said it does not relate to other language in the bill related to numbers of contributors, but said he would not object to a conforming amendment. 9:23:02 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON moved to adopt Conceptual Amendment 6, so that any references to the top five contributors in Version E would be changed to the top three contributors. There being no objection, Conceptual Amendment 6 was adopted. 9:24:02 AM REPRESENTATIVE PETERSEN moved to adopt Amendment 7, labeled, 26- LS1495\E.5, Wayne/Bullard, 3/8/10, which read as follows: Page 6, line 4: Delete "a new subsection" Insert "new subsections" Page 6, following line 9: Insert a new subsection to read: "(d) If a foreign government holds more than a 10 percent ownership interest in a person paying for a communication under (a) of this section, the foreign government must be clearly identified in the communication as a partial owner of the person. If a foreign government holds more than 50 percent of the ownership interest in a person paying for a communication under (a) of this section, the foreign government must be clearly identified in the communication as the majority owner and controlling interest holder of the person. A foreign government identified in a communication under this subsection must be identified by the foreign government's common or usual name. In this subsection, "foreign government" includes every political subdivision of the foreign government, every official, agent, or representative of the foreign government, and every agency, corporation, or instrumentality of the foreign government or of a political subdivision of the foreign government." REPRESENTATIVES SEATON and WILSON objected for discussion purposes. REPRESENTATIVE PETERSEN said there are many companies from around the world who get involved with the extraction of Alaska resources, and in many instances, these corporations form an Alaskan corporation subsidiary. He opined that it is important that citizens of Alaska know when a foreign-based corporation is making expenditures to influence an Alaska election. He said Amendment 7 allows for transparency. 9:25:44 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON offered his understanding that by adopting Amendment 3 previously, the committee adopted the federal prohibition on any such subsidiary, which is why he objects to Amendment 7. 9:26:40 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG questioned if Amendment 7 is wholly unnecessary or just partly. 9:27:25 AM MR. BULLARD relayed that Amendment 7 applies to entities that the prohibition in Amendment 3 does not address. He explained that Amendment 3 speaks to entities that are controlled by a foreign national, while Amendment 7 speaks to foreign governments that hold more than a 10 percent ownership interest. He emphasized that there is a difference between the two. 9:28:10 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG offered his understanding that the language in Amendment 7 that is redundant and should be deleted is that which addresses a foreign government that holds more than 50 percent of the ownership interest in a person paying for a communication. MR. BULLARD said Representative Gruenberg is correct. In response to a query from Representative Gruenberg as to whether the last sentence of Amendment 7 should also be removed, he stated: The topic is covered, but there is no common definition provided for the chapter, so without further review of how these two work together, it would be my recommendation if you wish to adopt the substance of Amendment 7 ..., that you leave that ultimate sentence. 9:31:33 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to adopt an amendment to Amendment 7, to delete the following language: If a foreign government holds more than 50 percent of the ownership interest in a person paying for a communication under (a) of this section, the foreign government must be clearly identified in the communication as the majority owner and controlling interest holder of the person. There being no objection, the amendment to Amendment 7 was adopted. 9:33:29 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON cited language in Amendment 3, which read as follows: (b) In this section, "foreign national" includes (1) a foreign government, every political subdivision of a foreign government REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked, "How is that not what we're talking about in Amendment 7?" MR. BULLARD responded as follows: It is absolutely what is discussed in Amendment 7, but that is not a definition that is provided for all of AS 15.13; that is confined to that particular statutory section. 9:34:34 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON removed his objection to Amendment 7, as amended. [Representative Wilson's previously stated objection was treated as removed.] There being no further objection, Amendment 7, as amended, was adopted. 9:34:55 AM REPRESENTATIVE PETERSEN moved to adopt Amendment 8, labeled 26- LS1495\E.6, Wayne/Bullard, 3/8/10, which read as follows: Page 3, line 27, following "contributor": Insert "; (6) for a person that is a for-profit  entity, the address used by the person for federal  income tax purposes, if different than the address  provided under (1) of this subsection" Page 5, line 21, following "business": Insert "if the person is a nonprofit entity, or  the address used by the person for federal income tax  purposes if the person is a for-profit entity" 9:35:06 AM REPRESENTATIVE SEATON objected for discussion purposes. REPRESENTATIVE PETERSEN explained the reason for Amendment 8 is because there are corporations who move their home offices to a foreign location for the purposes of avoiding income taxes. 9:37:30 AM MR. BULLARD, in response to Representative Seaton, said the language in Version E - which requires each person required to file an expenditure report under this section to include the name, address, principal occupation, and employer of the individual filing the report - is found on page 3, lines 8-9. Amendment 8 would require that if that person has a different address for tax purposes, that that address would be the address used instead. REPRESENTATIVE SEATON questioned how it would be possible to determine if a person is correctly reporting an address. In response to Representative Petersen, he offered his understanding that under the proposed bill, foreign nationals and foreign corporations are already not allowed to make campaign contribution expenditures. 9:40:29 AM MR. BULLARD, in response to Representatives Seaton and Petersen, stated that if the sole purpose of Amendment 8 is to identify companies that have taken their tax address offshore, it is his understanding that any business or entity that has provided an offshore address would be prohibited, not only under federal law, but also under Amendment 3. CHAIR LYNN offered his understanding that Amendment 8 is not needed. 9:41:05 AM REPRESENTATIVE PETERSEN withdrew his motion to adopt Amendment 8. 9:41:18 AM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON moved to adopt Conceptual Amendment 9, to change Section 8 in Version E so that it read as follows: *Sec.8.AS 15.13.084 is amended to read: Sec. 15.13.084. Prohibited expenditures. A person may not make an expenditure (1) anonymously or using a fictitious name or using the name of another person. REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON explained that Conceptual Amendment 9 would remove all exceptions to the provision prohibiting expenditures made anonymously. 9:43:11 AM MR. BULLARD related: The U.S. Supreme Court, in [McIntyre, Executor of Estate of McIntyre, Deceased v. Ohio Elections Commission], recognized a certain right for individuals to make certain anonymous contributions if they limited limited rights, and that's what Section 15.13.084 currently provides for. It's crafted to the ... individual who's making certain sort of de minimis contributions for billboards, et cetera. It ... does not apply to ... people spending great amounts of money or persons other than individuals. REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON remarked that buying a full-page newspaper advertisement anonymously is neither inexpensive nor de minimis. 9:44:23 AM REPRESENTATIVE GATTO said it is common to see names like "Americans for Progress" or "Americans for Health" and wonder who is behind the name. He said he thinks Representative Johnson is "on to something here," and he related that he does not like anonymous advertising. 9:44:57 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG emphasized his support of Amendment 9. REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to adopt an amendment to Conceptual Amendment 9 to add a severability clause so that if any provision in the proposed legislation is declared unconstitutional, it shall not affect the remainder of the bill. He asked Mr. Bullard to provide a legal memorandum to the next committee of referral - the House Judiciary Standing Committee - regarding the aforementioned McIntyre case and how it relates to "this point." 9:46:00 AM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON said he supports the proposed amendment to Conceptual Amendment 9. 9:46:11 AM CHAIR LYNN announced that there being no objection, the amendment to Conceptual Amendment 9 was adopted. CHAIR LYNN asked if there was any objection to Conceptual Amendment 9, [as amended]. There being none, it was so ordered. 9:47:09 AM MR. BULLARD, in response to Representative Seaton, confirmed that he would send a legal memorandum to the House Judiciary Standing Committee explaining the intent of the amendment to Conceptual Amendment 9. 9:48:43 AM CHAIR LYNN, after ascertaining that there was no one else who wished to testify, closed public testimony. 9:48:54 AM REPRESENTATIVE P. WILSON directed attention to advice given by Mr. Bullard in the last paragraph of a memorandum, dated March 3, 2010, [included in the committee packet], which read as follows [original punctuation provided]: Similarly, if all independent expenditures must be reported to the Alaska Public Offices Commission within 24 hours of being made, there is no need to require an independent expenditure report to include expenditures "not yet reported that [were] made before the filing of the report." This sentence was included in HB 409 (26-LS1495\R) to ensure against the possibility that, in the sentence's absence the statute could be interpreted to permit expenditures that are made 10 days before an election to not be reported until the day following the election, where an expenditure made within nine days of an election would have to be reported within 24 hours of the expenditure being made. If all independent expenditures must be disclosed within 24 hours, this sentence is no longer necessary for the purposes for which it was originally included, is redundant, and should be removed from the bill. REPRESENTATIVE P. WILSON asked if that issue had been addressed or if another amendment was necessary. 9:49:41 AM MR. BULLARD said he believes that was reconciled through [Amendment 3, labeled 26-LS1495\R.3, Bullard, 3/1/10]. 9:50:00 AM REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON said he will be working on another amendment in the next committee of referral regarding expenditures made to influence specific legislation and "other things that don't appear in the election." He offered an example. CHAIR LYNN said he understands what Representative Johnson is saying and concurs. 9:51:58 AM REPRESENTATIVE P. WILSON said she does not like misleading information. 9:52:54 AM REPRESENTATIVE PETERSEN opined that the committee has made some good changes to the proposed legislation. 9:53:12 AM REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG moved to report the proposed committee substitute (CS) for HB 409, Version 26-LS1495\E, Bullard, 3/2/10, as amended, out of committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes. There being no objection, CSHB 409(STA) was reported out of the House State Affairs Standing Committee.