CSSB 8 - MINIMUM REQUIRED PLUMBING FACILITIES Number 0104 VICE-CHAIRMAN HALCRO announced the committee's first order of business is CSSB 8(FIN), "An Act relating to the minimum plumbing fixtures required for females and males in the state plumbing code; and providing for an effective date." He indicated the intention is to hear from the legislation's sponsor, discuss and possibly adopt a amendment proposed by Chairman Rokeberg, but not move the bill at this hearing. Number 0119 HANS NEIDIG, Legislative Administrative Assistant to Senator Dave Donley, Alaska State Legislature, came forward on behalf of the bill sponsor. Mr. Neidig informed the committee that Senator Donley had been detained in the Senate Finance Standing Committee and sent his apologies. Mr. Neidig indicated his testimony would be brief because of other business before the committee. He pointed out that Dwight Perkins, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Labor, and Al Dwyer [Director, Division of Labor Standards and Safety] of the department, were present to assist with technical questions. Mr. Neidig explained that SB 8 would amend existing plumbing codes to increase the number of women's facilities in assembly places. The legislation would only to apply to new construction and buildings where capacity would be increased after remodeling. Senator Donley believes that such a measure is necessary to respond to the congestion women experience in women's facilities at a public events and in public buildings. MR. NEIDIG noted he is sure everyone has witnessed or experienced that congestion, whether attending a sporting event, concert, convention or any other public event. He said Senator Donley believes that this is not a satisfactory situation and the problem must be remedied. Referring to the sponsor statement, Mr. Neidig commented there are a number of good reasons why this legislation is needed but indicated he would not read these reasons to the committee in the interests of time. He noted Senator Donley believes this legislation is reasonable in light of the evidence collected. Washington State has the highest ratio of women's to men's facilities at 4 to 1. Senate Bill 8 only calls for 2.7 women's facilities to 1 men's facility, at its highest ratio. The legislation only represents a modest increase in the number of women's facilities but the sponsor believes these increases are in the best interests of Alaskans. [The sponsor statement for CSSB 8(FIN) read: Senate Bill 8 amends existing plumbing code in AS 18.60.705 to more closely resemble the national standard and increase the minimum number of women's toilet facilities in assembly places. SB 8 will only apply to new construction and buildings that have been remodeled to increase occupancy capacity. Senate Bill 8 amends current statute and specifically addresses the number of toilet facilities provided for women in "assembly places." The current table in statute does provide a slightly elevated number of facilities for women in comparison to those provided for men, but the ratio does not meet the demand. SB 8(FIN) will amend table A-29-A currently in statute to increase the minimum number of women's toilets. Common sense tells us there is a serious problem with a shortage of female facilities in large assembly buildings. Extremely long lines outside the women's restroom at sporting events, concerts and other events are common. Senate Bill 8 will reduce the current excessive waiting time to use the facilities for women who attend large public events in buildings constructed or expanded after January 1, 2000. The basis of the current building code for plumbing fixtures, water flows and usage is from research done in 1924 by the U.S. Bureau of Standards. Our society has changed significantly since 1924 when women rarely ventured outside the home. In 1999, women are in public every day. They go to ballgames, festivals, concerts, stadiums, arenas, assembly halls, conference halls, plays, movie theatres, churches, etc.... Unlike 1924, in 1999 there are no public places or places or work that you will not find women. Women have health problems that require their more frequent use of restroom facilities. One study reported that 50% of women over the age of 18 have an incontinence problem. Childbirth is the largest contributing factor to this and when such women are forced to stand in long lines to use the bathroom, they can be in considerable pain. Additionally, it physically takes longer for women to use restroom facilities. A study done by Cornell University determined men averaged 45 seconds and women averaged 80 seconds to "go to the bathroom." Another similar survey found that men average 47 seconds in the restroom while women take 91 seconds. Other states have already enacted "potty parity" laws. In Tennessee and six other states, the ratio is 2:1. In Texas the ratio is not less than 2:1 in facilities where the public congregates. Minneapolis and St. Paul, Minnesota have a 3:1 ration while Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania has a ratio of 3.75:1. Washington State has the highest ratio of women's to men's facilities of 4:1 in all public buildings. SB 8(FIN) only requires up to a 2.7:1 ratio depending on the size of the facility.] Number 0270 REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI asked the difference between a water closet and a lavatory. MR. NEIDIG replied it is his understanding a lavatory is a wash basin or sink, and a water closet would be the toilet facility. REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI confirmed from Mr. Neidig, however, that they are still called water closets. Number 0345 DWIGHT PERKINS, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Labor, came forward. He stated the department's staff in the field has heard these concerns. The department has no opposition to the bill and thinks it is a good piece of legislation. VICE-CHAIRMAN HALCRO confirmed no one wished to testify on SB 8. The vice-chairman requested that Ms. Seitz, aide to the House Labor and Commerce Standing Committee, explain the proposed amendment and its merits. The proposed amendment, labeled 1-LS0074\W.1, Bannister, 4/26/99, read: Page 2, line 5: Delete "casinos"" Insert "casinos," when the category is applied to auditoriums, convention halls, stadiums, and casinos," Number 0482 JANET SEITZ, Legislative Assistant to Representative Norman Rokeberg, Alaska State Legislature, came forward to explain the amendment as aide to the House Labor and Standing Committee. She stated the proposed amendment is "W.1" in the committee members' bill packets. She indicated the May 6, 1999, opinion from Terry Bannister, Legislative Counsel, Legislative Legal and Research Services, Legislative Affairs Agency, and the April 27, 1999, memorandum from Al Dwyer, Director, Division of Labor Standards and Safety, Department of Labor, might be helpful in explaining the terms. [Ms. Bannister's 5/6/99 memorandum read: You have asked how dance floors and lodge rooms would be treated if the amendment described above as "W.1" were adopted. The following is my reading of the bill and the amendment. The bill changes the plumbing fixture requirements of one category of Table A - 29 - A of the 1997 edition of the Uniform Building Code. That category establishes plumbing fixture requirements for auditoriums, convention halls, dance floors, lodge rooms, stadiums, and casinos. As the bill reads now, the bill's proposed plumbing fixture ratios apply to all of these facilities in the category. If the proposed amendment W.1 is added to the bill, the ratios identified in the bill will apply only to auditoriums, convention halls, stadiums, and casinos. For the other subjects not covered by amendment W.1 (dance floors and lodge rooms), the ratios in Table A - 29 - A, unchanged by the bill, would apply.] [Mr. Dwyer's 4/27/99 memorandum read: There is no definition of "dance floor" or "Lodge room" in the UBC [Uniform Building Code]. However, based on my own experience as a Building Official and on advice from Chris Roust, CBJ [City and Borough of Juneau] Building Official, a dance floor is a portion of the floor area specifically designated for dancing. A lodge room is a room in a private club that is used for club rituals, wedding receptions etc. (usually not the bar area).] MS. SEITZ explained that the amendment would remove dance floors and lodge rooms from the entities covered by the new table in SB 8. She indicated the path to this end is a somewhat roundabout. The language on page 2, lines 4 and 5, of the legislation refers to assembly places and lists the various types [CSSB 8(FIN), page 2, lines 4-5: ""Assembly places--Auditoriums, convention halls, dance floors, lodge rooms, stadiums and casinos" the ratios"]. According to the bill drafter [Ms. Bannister], this language must remain in its current form because this is the term used on the table, Table A-29-A. Therefore, Ms. Bannister's suggestion to accomplish Chairman Rokeberg's purpose is to insert a comma after "casinos" on line 5 and add the amendment language, "when the category is applied to auditoriums, convention halls, stadiums, and casinos,", thus leaving out dance floors and lodge rooms. Ms. Seitz noted Ms. Bannister's memorandum points out that this would leave dance floors and lodge rooms under the current table, not under the legislation's revised table. Number 0600 REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI mentioned "dance floor", noting that is not a room or an auditorium, it is a floor. She commented there are no water closets or lavatories anywhere on a dance floor. REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA questioned that a dance floor is a portion of a room. MS. SEITZ answered that Mr. Dwyer's memorandum indicates there is no definition of "dance floor" or "lodge room" in the building code. She referred to Mr. Dyer's explanations of both terms. Ms. Seitz explained Chairman Rokeberg feels organizations like the Moose Lodge, for example, which are usually small groups, would be better off with the old table if they wished to renovate, or build a new building. Ms. Seitz communicated that this is because the old table requires fewer plumbing facilities and would therefore result in lower building costs. REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI indicated she still had some confusion regarding water closets and dance floors, but was not going to be concerned about it. VICE-CHAIRMAN HALCRO confirmed there were no further questions for Ms. Seitz. He stated he would entertain a motion to adopt Amendment 1. Number 0710 REPRESENTATIVE MURKOWSKI moved to adopt Amendment 1, 1-LS0074\W.1, Bannister, 4/26/99. There being no objection, Amendment 1 was adopted. VICE-CHAIRMAN HALCRO announced SB 8 would be held.