HB 201-RESIDENCY REQ: HUNTING, TRAPPING, FISHING  1:58:04 PM CHAIR MCKAY announced that the final order of business would be HB 201-RESIDENCY REQ: HUNTING, TRAPPING, FISHING. 1:58:35 PM REPRESENTATIVE REBECCA HIMSCHOOT, Alaska State Legislature, as prime sponsor, presented HB 201. She explained the source and goals of HB 201 are to resolve the concerns of her constituents and to provide a potential solution. She explained that a residency law to hunt and fish does not have an annual residency term. She explained residency of six months to get the permanent fund dividend (PFD) should be the standard; exemptions would be military deployment, education, and medical leave. She highlighted that the problem is that out-of-state fishers and hunters don't know how long they need to reside in Alaska to become a resident and pay different permit fees. She sourced an example from the Alaska State Troopers who have a difficult time ascertaining how long a person that is hunting and/or fishing has legally obtained residency. She said the ultimate goal of HB 201 is to manage the resource and make sure year-round residents have access to those resources with slightly lower [permit] fees. She asserted the assemblies from Petersburg, Sitka, Craig, Yakutat, as well as, Prince of Wales [Island] are all in unanimous support of HB 201 as well as the Safari Club of Alaska. 2:03:44 PM THATCHER BROUWER, Staff, Representative Rebecca Himschoot, Alaska State Legislature, on behalf of Representative Himschoot, prime sponsor provided a sectional analysis of HB 201 [included in a committee packet] which read as follows [original punctuation provided]: Section 1 amends AS 16.05.400 by adding a new subsection that requires a person issued a permanent identification card may only sport fish, hunt or trap as long as the person meets the residency requirements outlined in the bill. Section 2 amends AS 16.05.415(a) to require an individual, to qualify for a resident hunting, trapping and sportfishing license, to be physically present at all times during the 12 months preceding the application, and if absent, only absent as allowed for someone who is eligible for a permanent fund dividend (AS 43.23.0008). Section 3 amends AS 16.05.415(e) to require an alien, to qualify for a resident hunting, trapping and sportfishing license, to be physically present at all times during the 12 months preceding the application, and if absent, only absent as allowed for someone who is eligible for a permanent fund dividend (AS 43.23.0008). Section 4 adds a new subsection to AS 16.05.415 directing the commissioner to adopt regulations under AS 44.62 for determining eligibility of a person to receive a resident license. Section 5 adds a new section to uncodified law allowing the Department of Fish and Game to adopt regulations necessary to implement the bill. Section 6 establishes an immediate effective date for section 5 of the bill. Section 7 establishes a January 1, 2025, effective date for the remainder of the bill. 2:05:37 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER recalled his past experiences of obtaining a fishing and hunting license and asked if HB 201 might slow down the process and questioned the zero fiscal note. He observed that there were no statistics to indicate why there is a zero fiscal note. REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT explained that under HB 201, a person applying for a hunting and fishing license in Alaska would need to be eligible for the PFD, but would not necessarily collect the dividend. She said out-of-state hunters and fisherman are not affected by HB 201. She recounted that people in her district are finding it harder and harder to fill their freezers for the year because of additional pressure on the resources. 2:08:11 PM REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE indicated HB 201 would be problematic in terms of AS 43.23.008, which limits residency. He noted that certain professions require workers to be absent from the state. He opined that HB 201 has some holes in it. 2:09:29 PM REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT said she has also been excluded from the PFD in certain years during a two-year fellowship with the National Science Foundation. 2:10:23 PM REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER pondered if applicants should be trusted on their merit or if a fiscal note might be necessary to enforce proof of residency. REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT confirmed residency is taken on a person's word given to the Alaska State Troopers. 2:12:08 PM SCOTT NEWMAN, representing self, provided his experience as a lifelong Alaskan from Petersburg, commercial fisherman, pilot, hunting guide, and assembly member in the Petersburg Borough. He testified in support of HB 201 specifically for the residency requirement. He insisted that some seasonal residents claim they have paid their dues but are clearly not [year-round] residents. He insinuated these people were not Alaskans and should not have the same privileges to hunt and fish as permanent Alaska residents. He reiterated the requirement to apply for the PFD is not the same as a hunting and fishing license and there is no enforcement of this loophole. 2:15:10 PM LEIF WILSON, representing self, related that as a life-long Alaskan and lodge owner/pilot, he is testifying in support of HB 201. He said he was dismayed that people are taking advantage of Alaska residency. He said a client from Georgia became a resident and began hunting and fishing after spending a year in Alaska and obtained a resident license. He said the client spends a month or a few weeks a year in Alaska and is following the law. He objected to snowbirds that do not live in Alaska at least half of the year who benefit from the hunting and fishing regulations. 2:18:49 PM KURT WHITEHEAD, representing self, opined that the advisory council was not addressing the number one problem in Pince of Wales Island (POW), which is the term, "domicile." He expressed concern that there are not enough members of the POW Advisory Council that are year-round residents. He maintained many persons in POW only come up for the summer to fish and do not contribute to the local economy. He expressed his thanks to Representative Himschoot. 2:25:17 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER asked if an individual would have to forfeit their hunting rights, in addition to their PFD, if they left the state for a period of time. 2:27:03 PM REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT responded by defining one "exception" as a member who provides for family members. 2:27:12 PM REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER opined that the zero fiscal note is problematic. He noted the penultimate paragraph of HB 201 states a fish and game permit would have to be updated but would cost a great deal of money. 2:28:12 PM COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG explained how current fees work for fishing and hunting licenses. He said HB 201 would require hunters and fishers to maintain their residence in Alaska under the PFD criteria. He said the essence of HB 201 is to allow a certified person to be checked against the PFD to also be a licensed hunter or fisher. In response to another question, he said that the criteria to prove residency in the field is very loose and is up to the legislature to decide. 2:30:29 PM CHAIR MCKAY was reminded of the red-flag [gun] law, under which a person could "rat out" your neighbor. 2:30:40 PM REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER questioned how HB 201 could be effective in the field. 2:31:28 PM AARON FRENZEL, Deputy Director, Major of the Alaska Wildlife Troopers, answered how enforcement is handled by the Wildlife Troopers across the state. He described residency is checked and enforced in the field by context. He reflected that many residents have contacted the Alaska Wildlife Trooper to report suspicious illegal hunting which will begin an investigation. 2:33:19 PM REPRESENTATIVE DIBERT asked how long a person can be absent from the state and still claim residency. 2:33:51 PM MAJOR AARON FRENZEL replied that he has been asked this question repeatedly in the miliary and clarified there is no limit on the time someone has to live in the state to be a resident. He said if someone claims Alaska as their permanent domicile their isn't much that can be done by law enforcement to challenge their residency status. 2:34:22 PM CHAIR MCKAY used an example of a recreational vehicle (RV) owner, who would only reside in Alaska for June and July, harvest fish and game, and then return to the Lower 48 and not be qualified for the PFD. 2:35:10 PM REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE illustrated the problem with HB 201 is that it would tie hunting and fishing licensing to the PFD. He stated opposition to the bill. 2:37:11 PM REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT responded to Representative McCabe that Alaskans, living here year-round, place a high value on their resources and incur a high cost of living standard. She maintained that it is a choice to stay or leave the state. She noted that college students fall under the current exceptions of licensees. 2:38:15 PM REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE noted that exemptions in HB 201 allow for higher education but seminaries aren't included. 2:39:14 PM REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT reiterated that as an Albert Einstein Distinguished Educator Fellow of the National Science Foundation, she had been excluded from collecting the PFD during her time in Washington D.C. She said some residents will always be left out of certain programs in order to enjoy the benefits of traveling outside of the state. 2:40:36 PM REPRESENTATIVE MEARS asked Major Frenzel if there was a residency requirement to hunt and fish. 2:41:34 PM MAJOR AARON FRENZEL explained there are three things enforcement looks for in a conviction: the first, is a person that hasn't lived in the state for 12 months; the other way is called, "the smoking gun," where a resident from another state retains benefits from that state while claiming residence in Alaska; the third reason is someone whom retains two domiciles. He explained some situations are easier to enforce than others. 2:43:10 PM COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG defined what "residency" means to ADF&G and said there needs to be a clearer definition. 2:44:30 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER asked if a person forgets to fill out a PFD application would lose their hunting license. 2:44:57 PM COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG explained the residency requirement for the PFD is to intend to stay in Alaska for 12 months. 2:45:26 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER interrupted Commissioner Vincent-Lang to ask if people are taken at their word when verifying residency. 2:45:54 PM REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT added that under HB 201 nothing changes in terms of the PFD and hunting/fishing licenses. Her hope is that there would be less need for enforcement as a result of HB 201. 2:46:30 PM REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER offered his understanding HB 201 has the intent of closing a loophole but said the problem is many hunters and fishers aren't being honest. He suggested an alternate way to alleviate the problem could be to impose a fish export tax. 2:47:36 PM COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG divulged a fish export tax has been discussed at ADF&G for a long time, but that is a policy issue that the legislature would have to enact. Commissioner Vincent- Lang suggested another issue for the legislature to solve are senior license requirements, which are problematic because they are lifelong and have been a major issue at ADF&G. 2:48:59 PM REPRESENTATIVE ARMSTRONG asked the age an individual would have to be to get a permanent senior license and whether HB 201 would change that age. 2:49:21 PM COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG explained that HB 201 would only change the permit application for the permanent license, which would have the same requirements as the PFD application. 2:49:46 PM REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT conveyed that a person who applies for permanent status, under HB 201, is a one-time thing and you would never have to re-apply. 2:50:11 PM REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER directed attention to page 2, Section 4, and asked the sponsor of HB 201, Representative Himschoot how proof of residency would be enforced for people claiming residency in other states. 2:51:02 PM MAJOR FRENZEL replied that other states' residency databases are available but the Division of Wildlife Troopers does not have the resources to investigate each application. 2:51:54 PM REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER stated his assumption the Permanent Fund Division handles verification databases, and he suggested law enforcement should have the same access to that database. REPRESENTATIVE HIMSCHOOT deferred to Major Frenzel. 2:52:54 PM MAJOR FRENZEL responded that the division of troopers does currently work with the Permanent Fund Division investigators but cannot make these investigators be agents for the troopers. 2:53:17 PM REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE pointed out Canadian fishers would be exempt and unable to fish in Alaska if HB 201 were to pass. 2:53:46 PM COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG said Alaska has a reciprocal fishing agreement with the Yukon Territory. He offered his understanding that Canadians would be excluded under HB 201, but he said he would need to check with the Department of Law. 2:54:40 PM REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER cited that ranked choice voting was very expensive to train staff and to implement. He asked why there was no fiscal note for HB 201 reflecting the cost of training. COMMISSIONER VINCENT-LANG said HB 201 is fiscally responsible from the department's perspective. 2:56:09 PM CHAIR MCKAY announced HB 201 was held over.