Legislature(1993 - 1994)
03/12/1993 03:50 PM Senate HES
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
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+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
SENATE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL SERVICES COMMITTEE
March 12, 1993
3:50 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Senator Steve Rieger, Chairman
Senator Bert Sharp, Vice-Chairman
Senator Loren Leman
Senator Mike Miller
Senator Jim Duncan
Senator Johnny Ellis
MEMBERS ABSENT
Senator Judy Salo
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 79(STA)
"An Act setting termination dates for various boards,
commissions, councils, agencies, committees, and programs of
state government; repealing obsolete statutes relating to
the State Fire Commission and the Board of Electrical
Examiners; repealing obsolete statutes relating to
termination of agency programs and activities; increasing to
10 years the normal maximum interval for review of boards,
commissions, and other entities that are subject to sunset
reviews; and providing for an effective date."
SENATE BILL NO. 101
"An Act relating to eligibility for and payments of public
assistance; and providing for an effective date."
PREVIOUS SENATE COMMITTEE ACTION
SB 79 - See State Affairs minutes dated 2/10/93 and 2/17/93.
SB 101 - See HESS minutes dated 3/10/93.
WITNESS REGISTER
Randy Welker, Legislative Auditor
Legislative Audit Division
P.O. Box 113300
Juneau, Alaska 99811-3300
POSITION STATEMENT: Gave sponsor statement for CSSB
79(STA).
Jan Hansen, Director
Division of Public Assistance
Department of Health & Social Services
P.O. Box 110640
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0640
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions relating to SB 101.
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 93-23, SIDE A
Number 001
CHAIRMAN RIEGER called the Senate Health, Education and
Social Services (HESS) Committee to order at 3:50 p.m.
The first order of business was CSSB 79(STA) (BOARDS/
COMMISSIONS/COUNCILS/AUTHORITIES), sponsored by request of
the Legislative Budget and Audit Committee. RANDY WELKER,
Legislative Auditor, Legislative Audit Division, said the
bill would change the review cycle for the sunset process
from a four year cycle to a ten year cycle. He said since
1977, the division has completed over 100 sunset reviews.
There has been a lot of progress in the improvement
operation of many boards and commissions. Most people
recognize that the sunset process doesn't go very far in
eliminating boards and commissions but has had a significant
impact on the operations of those boards. Mr. Welker said
the bill attempts to spread out all the boards and
commissions that are subject to sunset to a ten year cycle.
The advantages would be that it would lessen the demand on
moderate resources of having to look at many of the boards
and commissions on a too frequent basis. He said there is a
lot of legislative time devoted to the continuous
introduction of bills, continuing boards and commissions,
the hearing testimony process. Should problems arise, any
legislator can request a special audit of boards and
commissions.
There being no questions of committee members, CHAIRMAN
RIEGER said he would like to hold the bill as there are
people who haven't had the opportunity to get their comments
to the committee.
Number 074
Chairman Rieger announced that SB 101 (ELIGIBILITY FOR
PUBLIC ASSISTANCE) would be heard next. He asked JAN
HANSEN, Director, Division of Public Assistance, Department
of Health & Social Services, to come before the committee to
answer questions relating to the legislation. Chairman
Rieger asked Ms. Hansen to explain page 2, Section 3. Ms.
Hansen said that section concerns the department adopting
regulations. Currently, the needs standard and payment
standard are exactly the same. The legislation establishes
the needs standard and repay. Ms. Hansen said with the
legislation the department is proposing to create a
reduction in their payment. Currently, the needs standard
would be at the level it is and the department would pay
less. This would allow the department regulations so that
they could increase the needs standard. Ms. Hansen said the
department is looking at ways to create work incentives so
that people on welfare who work would get to keep some of
the money that they earned. The department is trying to
look for a way to do that without it costing a lot of money.
CHAIRMAN RIEGER said he received a phone call from a person
in a rural village who described a problem where they had a
baby sitter who had to quit because the extra income would
put them out of the eligibility standard for their AFDC.
Ms. Hansen said the bill addresses that problem slightly in
that if a person's income was within a few dollars of being
eligible and the baby-sitting would make a person
ineligible, they would be able to still qualify. The bill
would allow a person who has a little higher income to still
qualify for a small grant. She said at a given point when a
person goes to work, their earned income makes them
ineligible. Chairman Rieger asked if AFDC doesn't tapper
off with increased income. Ms. Hansen said AFDC supplements
what a person has. If a person has $500 in income, it will
be supplemented up to the standard.
Ms. Hansen explained that currently in federal regulations
if people are working they get to keep some of what they
earn, $30 and a third of the remainder, but only for four
months. The department wants to expand that incentive, but
that isn't allowed under federal law. It can only be done
under a waiver. Under a waiver you can only do it for half
of your case load under an experimental project. There have
been indications from the Clinton Administration that some
provisions could change which might allow the state to
change that provision.
Chairman Rieger asked what increases there are in other
programs. He asked what else is happening with the Health
and Social Service budget. Ms. Hansen said other things
that are occurring that are part of the department's whole
package have been to the Jobs Program which is the basic
Welfare to Work Program. It is being expanded by federal
mandate. This year there has been an average of 930 clients
each month. Next year that will rise to 1,340 which is the
required number to meet federal targets. Ms. Hansen said
next year the program has to serve more unemployed parents
rather than single parent families because of another
federal regulation change. The department is required to do
more work over and above the job training, job search, work
experience, and adult basic education. The department will
be expanding the work experience component, will be serving
more people and unemployed parents. The adult basic
education component is being expanded because people have to
be brought up to a 8.9 literacy level and then to a G.E.D.
level.
Ms. Hansen said the department is slightly increasing the
amount of supportive services in the Jobs Program.
Supportive services is funding which goes for things like
work clothes, car repair, or bus fare. Ms. Hansen said the
governor's budget is proposing five positions for what is
called "self sufficiency in our front line offices." The
first time when a client comes in to apply for AFDC, they
wouldn't just discuss whether the person is eligible. A ten
minute component would be added to discuss what their goals
and strategies are for getting off of welfare. Other things
that may be discussed are whether the client needs Adult
Basic Education, day care, or substance abuse help. The
Jobs Program only serves 16 percent of the welfare
recipients. Ms. Hansen said there are many clients who want
to be served under the Jobs Program and are disappointed
because they can't get into the program.
Number 287
SENATOR ELLIS asked when the rateable reduction becomes
effective. Ms. Hansen said it would be effective July 1.
Senator Ellis asked how much time people would have to
adjust to the new check amount. Ms. Hansen said the
department's intention is to notify the clients after the
bill passes the legislature. That would give the clients a
minimum of six weeks. She explained that whenever the
department does a mass change, a computer notice is
generated. As the benefit is changed, the computer
automatically tells the person what their grant was and what
it will be. There is text in the notice that explains why.
Senator Ellis asked how Section 8 housing works. Ms. Hansen
said the amount the client pays is a percentage of their
income. As their AFDC income goes down, their rent would be
slightly adjusted downward.
Senator Ellis asked how many adults and children are on
AFDC. Ms. Hansen said there were 20,000 children and 12,000
adults in 1992. The figure is probably higher for the
current year. She said the total cost of AFDC for FY 93,
including the department's supplemental, will be $120
million. On top of that, when the department calculates the
proposed caseload increases for next year at about 11
percent and the COLA if it is not suspended, the projected
cost for FY 94 would be $137 million. If the changes in the
bill were implemented, it would bring the FY 94 AFDC budget
to $124 million. Ms. Hansen referred to the APA Program and
said there is adult public assistance and then there is old
age assistance hold harmless. The two together is the
figure that creates the APA figure. She said it will result
in a slightly higher figure paid in FY 94 than in FY 93.
Just for adult public assistance without the old age
assistance hold harmless, there would actually be a slight
reduction in dollars in FY 94. In FY 93, it will be $34.8
million for adult public assistance. The proposed budget
with the COLA and rateable reductions for FY 94 is $33.7
million. There was discussion regarding a chart the members
had in their committee packets.
Number 413
Senator Ellis asked Ms. Hansen how much federal money the
state would be turning away if the bill were to become law.
He asked her to speak to the fiscal notes. Ms. Hansen
explained that in the AFDC Program the reduction, if the
bill were to become law, would be $12,651,000 total. She
said that would be 50 percent federal and 50 percent general
fund. Ms. Hansen said the savings to the APA Program would
be $5,134,000 and would be all general funds because of the
different structures between the APA Program and the AFDC
Program.
Senator Ellis asked Ms. Hansen to review the fiscal notes.
Ms. Hansen referred to the first fiscal note and said it is
for the AFDC Program. The amount of savings that is
attributable to the rateable reduction for FY 94 is $8.6
million. She noted that there are five fiscal notes as
there are various components of the bill. The second fiscal
note is suspending the APA COLA and the dollar amount
related to the suspension is $607 thousand. Ms. Hansen said
the third fiscal note is to implement the rateable reduction
in the APA Program which would produce a savings of $4.051
million. The forth fiscal note is the interim assistance
reimbursement portion. It creates a cost shift of what is
currently $434 thousand general funds to become $434
thousand of federal funds. The fiscal note shows zero, but
there is $434 thousand general fund savings. Chairman
Rieger indicated there is a misunderstanding in the
numbering of the fiscal notes. Ms. Hansen said the fifth
fiscal note relates to the restructuring of the needs
standards for AFDC unemployed parents. It produces a
savings of $1.944 million. She said the last fiscal note
relates to the funds that are directly attributable to
suspension of the COLA for AFDC which is $2.107 million.
Number 531
SENATOR MILLER moved that SB 101 be passed out of committee
with individual recommendations. There were several
objections.
SENATOR ELLIS said he has several amendments but they are in
rough draft form. He asked if he could have more time to
prepare amendments. CHAIRMAN RIEGER said he would be
willing to hold the bill until the following Monday.
SENATOR MILLER moved and asked unanimous consent that he be
allowed to withdraw his motion. Hearing no objection, the
motion carried.
Senator Ellis referred to the bill and said it represents
about seven policy calls which have been considered by the
previous administrations. He said he is concerned about all
seven changes in a single year. Senator Ellis said he would
like to know what the underlying policy reasons are for the
cuts.
Number 579
SENATOR SHARP asked what the COLA difference was between FY
92 and FY 93. Ms. Hansen said the amount added was 3
percent over the previous year and was granted January 1,
1993.
TAPE 93-23, SIDE B
Number 001
Ms. Hansen indicated the 3 percent is a COLA on the total
amount paid, federal and state shares.
There was general discussion regarding budget increases and
decreases in state departments and programs.
CHAIRMAN RIEGER adjourned the Senate HESS Committee meeting
at 3:47 p.m.
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