Legislature(2007 - 2008)BARNES 124
03/19/2008 01:00 PM House RESOURCES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Confirmation Hearing(s)|| Board of Fisheries | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE
March 19, 2008
1:04 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Carl Gatto, Co-Chair
Representative Craig Johnson, Co-Chair
Representative Anna Fairclough
Representative Bob Roses
Representative Paul Seaton
Representative Peggy Wilson
Representative Bryce Edgmon
Representative David Guttenberg
Representative Scott Kawasaki
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S)
Board of Fisheries
Melvan E. Morris Jr. - Kodiak
John E. Jensen - Petersburg
William S. Brown - Juneau
- CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
No previous action to report
WITNESS REGISTER
WILLIAM S. BROWN, Appointee
to the Board of Fisheries
Alaska Department of Fish & Game
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Board of
Fisheries.
JOHN E. JENSEN, Appointee
to the Board of Fisheries
Alaska Department of Fish & Game
Petersburg, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Board of
Fisheries.
MELVAN E. MORRIS JR., Appointee
to the Board of Fisheries
Alaska Department of Fish & Game
Kodiak, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Board of
Fisheries.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CO-CHAIR CRAIG JOHNSON called the House Resources Standing
Committee meeting to order at 1:04:28 PM. Representatives
Seaton, Roses, Edgmon, Fairclough, Wilson, Gatto, and Johnson
were present at the call to order. Representatives Guttenberg
and Kawasaki arrived as the meeting was in progress.
^CONFIRMATION HEARING(S)
^Board of Fisheries
1:04:28 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON announced that the committee would continue its
consideration [from 3/17/08] of the appointments of Mr. Melvan
Morris Jr., Mr. John Jensen, and Mr. William Brown to the Board
of Fisheries. [Packets contained biographical information on
the appointees.]
1:04:39 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON asked Mr. Brown to state why he would like to
be on the Board of Fisheries and tell about himself.
WILLIAM S. BROWN, Appointee to the Board of Fisheries, Alaska
Department of Fish & Game, said he has lived in Alaska since
1991. He was a "Navy brat" who grew up all over. He received a
Ph.D. in economics from the University of Colorado in 1977 and
taught economics at the university level for 23 years, the last
9 of which were at the University of Alaska-Southeast in Juneau.
One of his main teaching fields was resource and environmental
economics. He left the university in 2000 and now runs a
fishing reel repair shop in Juneau. He has been an avid sport
fisherman since catching his first fish at age four and fishing
may be his main passion in life. In the summer he fishes three
or four times a week and he travels in the winter to fish. Over
the years he has sport fished throughout the world, catching
marlin in Mexico, Nile perch in Egypt, and taimen in Mongolia.
MR. BROWN stated he believes he can offer three main things to
the board. First, his economics background allows him to see
the costs and benefits of alternative decisions, as well as to
understand the economics behind various allocation proposals
presented to the board. He emphasized that while he is an
economist and understands the power of economic reasoning, he
also knows the economy is composed of people. People, culture,
and history are every bit as important as economics when making
fish board decisions. Second, his passion for fishing brings
with it a passion to protect the resource and assure that future
generations have as many fish to catch, consume, and to sell as
there are today. He said he understands the concept of
sustainable harvest and supports it without reservation. Third,
he will come to the board without an agenda. He is not a
commercial fisherman or a charter guide; he does not make his
living from fishing. He is an avid sport fisherman, but he buys
fish in winter and recognizes the importance of commercial
fishing to the state and of subsistence fishing to Alaska
residents.
1:07:33 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO asked if it takes a Ph.D. to fix a fishing reel.
MR. BROWN responded he taught for 23 years and that is long
enough to do anything. He was a tenured full professor and
enjoyed the university. It was time to leave the university but
not Juneau. He said his passion is fishing, he collects old
fishing tackle, and no one in town fixed fishing reels. Now it
is not a hobby, it is a business and he makes as much fixing
fishing reels as he did as a tenured professor.
CO-CHAIR GATTO inquired whether there is compensation for
members of the Board of Fisheries.
MR. BROWN understood there is per diem. In further response to
Co-Chair Gatto, Mr. Brown said he did not know how much the per
diem is and affirmed that it is not an issue for him. He said
he works and makes plenty of money, and that the problem-solving
and intellectual stimulation he got at the university he will
now get from serving on the Board of Fisheries. Allocation
proposals are important and are hard decisions to make, and he
would like to do that.
1:09:41 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON commented that he thinks Mr. Brown will
make a great addition to the board. He noted that costs and
benefits are linear, whereas on the Board of Fisheries things
are not linear and do not add up. It is making the best
decision possible with the best possible science and not
everyone will be pleased with the decision.
MR. BROWN noted he is not a slave to economics. He uses
economics to lend insight into the problem and it will always
help in making decisions. However, he is sure there will be
lots of decisions that are not efficient in an economic sense.
He said he was trying to get to that when he stated that people,
culture, and history are just as important as raw numbers;
however, trying to make decisions without any biological data or
economic data is not good.
1:11:37 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG asked if Mr. Brown will be
representing a specific seat [on the Board of Fisheries].
MR. BROWN replied not that he understands. There are five seats
on the board and he is taking one of them. It happens to be
that the person he would be replacing is also from Juneau and
was primarily a sport fisherman but also did commercial and
charter fishing in the past. Other than academics, Mr. Brown
said his experience is as a sport fisherman.
1:12:16 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG related that there are issues in the
Interior dealing with allotment, allocation, and bypass. He
said his concern is having a viewpoint on the Board of Fisheries
that represents all users and the health of the entire fishery.
He is looking forward to someone coming to this board that is
able to analyze the whole picture and not represent one type of
fishing over another. He inquired whether Mr. Brown has any
background in fisheries in his professional world.
MR. BROWN answered no, other than teaching courses in resource
economics which included fisheries. He has not served on a
board of fish before. He said he is coming at this as someone
who is passionate about preserving the resource and passionate
about fishing. He said he is a quick study and this is
something he cares about.
1:15:02 PM
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH requested Mr. Brown to address how he
would work toward a solution on a polarized issue that may go
beyond fisheries and how would he ensure that everyone has the
opportunity to speak about their position on the issue.
MR. BROWN responded he suspects it happens frequently that
people come in with a predisposition and assumption that they
will dislike what another person has to say. There will have to
be decisions made that not everyone likes, but if they
understand the reasoning behind the decision - if the discussion
is transparent and the rationale is transparent - that is the
best a person can do. He said he does not pretend that he can
please everyone. "When you deal with people that have different
views, as long as they think you are fair, that is the best you
can do."
1:17:21 PM
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH acknowledged that one of the
responsibilities of serving on the Board of Fisheries is to
protect the fishing assets of the state. She said she is
looking for people who can analyze the process, debate it, hold
their own gun at why they believe, and articulate to the
audience their reasoning for the position that they take. She
asked Mr. Brown how he will handle an issue similar to the
Pebble Mine and prioritize his responsibilities to the state.
MR. BROWN replied that what he knows about the Pebble Mine is
what he reads in the newspaper which has little detail. If the
board was asked to take a position for or against the Pebble
Mine, all he could do is study the issue as much as possible and
come to a rational decision on it. He said mining today
pollutes less than it used to, but he does not know whether
salmon streams would remain safe. Regardless of the position
taken by the board, he would make sure all the involved parties
knew exactly why the board got to its conclusion - the data that
was looked at, how the data was analyzed, what competing use was
compared, and that sort of thing.
1:19:34 PM
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH referenced the opposition to the other
two nominees expressed on [3/17/08] from people in the
Matanuska-Susitna Valley. She asked Mr. Brown what process he
would use for gathering information to address the issue of
returning salmon to Matanuska-Susitna Valley streams.
MR. BROWN answered the history must be looked at, along with the
number of fish that are getting upriver to spawn. This is a
number issue, he said. The data is really difficult to assess
when there is mixed stock and some of the salmon species are
endangered and some are not. He said if he were the czar in
making the decision, he would make it a point that all user
groups got their fair share. However, the problem is that
everyone wants more. As long as it can be ensured that next
year there will be at least as many salmon as this year -
sustainable harvesting - then that is the right track. Whatever
decision is made - a few thousand pounds less to one group or a
few more days opening to another group - someone is going to be
upset. The best the board can do is show why it made the
decision and that the decision was not arbitrary or capricious.
1:21:35 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WILSON asked whether Mr. Brown thinks of himself
as a fair person.
MR. BROWN responded yes. He surmised the context of the
question is whether a decision he might make is more for
commercial or more for subsistence or something like that. He
said he does not have an agenda; he does not make his money from
any of those industries. As an economist and a world citizen he
recognizes that Alaska is going to feed the world with salmon
and he wants that commercial industry to survive, plus he likes
to eat good salmon in the winter when he does not sport fish.
Subsistence is a reason he moved to Alaska; a person can live
off the land in Alaska. Yes, he thinks he is a fair person.
1:24:59 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON noted that salmon is only one of many
fishery issues before the Board of Fisheries. He recounted the
establishment of the new state waters fisheries in marine waters
in 1993. He asked whether Mr. Brown supports a slower paced
fishery over a longer period of time versus one where all the
gear is allowed for a much faster paced fishery over a shorter
length of time.
MR. BROWN surmised Representative Seaton was referencing the
halibut fishery that used to have 24- or 48-hour openings a few
times during the summer but is now open much of the year.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON said the state took management of the
Pacific cod fishery from the federal government because federal
government management of the cod fishery was "catch as much as
you can as quick as you can." It was becoming a very short
fishery and for a long period of time the local communities did
not have access to that fishery. A state guideline policy was
set up to manage everything within a three-mile distance of
shore, with the exception of halibut which is a federally
managed species. The guidelines established the use of gear
that had low bycatch and limited the amount of gear so the
fishery would be stretched out for a longer period of time.
This resulted in less chance of overharvest and gave the local
communities access to the fishery. He asked whether this fits
into Mr. Brown's idea of economics as far as aiding Alaskans to
participate in a fishery.
MR. BROWN stated not only does he favor what Representative
Seaton is saying, it makes sense economically because it is more
efficient. Pulse fishing is an inefficient way to catch fish
and it is bad for the people. If he understands what is being
said, it is a slam-dunk for the economics and it makes sense for
the communities.
1:30:15 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO inquired what questions Mr. Brown would ask of
someone who was presenting a proposal to the board to transplant
geoducks from a place where they occur naturally to a place
where they do not occur naturally.
MR. BROWN replied that is pretty much what has been done with
oysters. The first question would be, Is there going to be
environmental harm? What would the geoducks displace? What is
the waste going to be? The second issue if it is a legislator
is, What are the financial interests involved? He said he is
glad shellfish farming is allowed in Alaska, but there are
environmental concerns so the state needs to be careful.
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON thanked Mr. Brown for his testimony.
1:32:31 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON requested Mr. Jensen to state why he wants to
be re-appointed to the Board of Fisheries.
JOHN E. JENSEN, Appointee to the Board of Fisheries, Alaska
Department of Fish & Game, responded, "I love it." He said he
was born and raised in Petersburg and is a third generation
Alaskan. He started commercial fishing at age 15 and has owned
and operated many different commercial fishing vessels and has
participated in various areas throughout the state. He is
currently the vice chair of the Board of Fisheries, president of
the halibut and sablefish committee for the Alaska Seafood
Marketing Institute (ASMI), and president of the Southeast
Alaska Regional Seafood Development Association.
1:33:49 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES inquired how Mr. Jensen balances his long-
standing special interest and economic benefit from commercial
fisheries against the needs of sport, subsistence, and personal-
use fisheries throughout the state.
MR. JENSEN answered he has been a subsistence user and a sport
fisherman all his life, but how he makes his living is
commercial fishing. He said he believes he is a fair person and
he listens to all information presented - public and written
testimony and staff comments. He takes everything into
consideration and believes he evaluates things fairly. A lot of
the time he weighs everything heavily on the Alaska Department
of Fish & Game's assessment because the department is the one on
the ground assessing the fisheries. In further response to
Representative Roses, Mr. Jensen said he has been on the board
for six years and his third term is over at the end of June.
1:35:42 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked whether there are any past decisions
that Mr. Jensen subsequently regretted and, if so, why.
MR. JENSEN responded he has discussed this with other board
members quite a bit. There may have been some bad calls, but he
does not believe he has made any serious mistakes. The
fisheries in Alaska are healthy and they are retaining that
level, but there are a few places in the state that have a
little bit more problems than others. He said there may be a
few things in some of his decisions, but not the whole thing.
He said he thinks the board has done really well.
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES inquired whether Mr. Jensen considers the
board to be currently well balanced with a diversity of opinions
and positions.
MR. JENSEN replied he believes the board is well balanced right
now and the members work well together even though members do
not often agree on everything.
1:37:51 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON noted that it appears from Mr. Jensen's
résumé that he has not participated in the salmon fisheries
since 1996, other than running a tender.
MR. JENSEN answered correct. In further response to
Representative Seaton, Mr. Jensen said his main income is
currently from the Southeast Alaska Dungeness crab fishery and
when there is a king crab season in Southeast he will
participate in that, along with the tanner crab season. He has
a relatively small individual fishing quota (IFQ) for halibut
that is getting smaller every year.
1:39:51 PM
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH requested Mr. Jensen to speak to the
Matanuska-Susitna issue as brought up by witnesses at the
[3/17/08] hearing. Additionally, she asked what process Mr.
Jensen would go through for a polarized issue to determine the
value of the resource and which Alaskans will receive that
resource.
MR. JENSEN replied he was surprised at the opposition from the
Matanuska-Susitna Valley. He said he thought the board did the
right thing. There are several issues involved. In the last 10
years there have been large over-escapements in the Kenai and
Kasilof rivers. At the same time the Yentna and the "Mat-Su"
have not had very good science showing whether or not they are
getting their escapements. There are issues with whether the
escapement test methods are accurate. At that meeting the board
decided to manage the fisheries for escapement goals in the
Kenai and Kasilof rivers and to make at least the lower end of
the escapement goals in the Yentna River. That made it seem
like the board gave the commercial fishermen a leg up over
everyone else; the commercial fishermen are the only ones that
could catch that amount of fish to stop these over-escapements
in the Kenai and Kasilof rivers. The state's biggest population
resides in the Matanuska-Susitna area and there is an increased
demand for that fish. The records the board looked at during
that meeting show that from 1977 to 1995 the total Upper Cook
Inlet sport fish harvest was up 385,000. From 1996 to 2006 the
average was in the neighborhood of 570,000 fish. So, he said he
thinks the board did the right thing when it made that decision
and he thinks there is more escapement there than the department
sees. The sport fishing results show that there is definitely
an increase in catch of the fish, but that goes along with the
increase in demand for the fish. Regarding the Chukchi Sea,
Pebble Mine, and other issues where the Board of Fisheries has
any say, Mr. Jensen said he believes the board should have all
the information in front of it before making a decision. No
decisions should be based on rhetoric and hearsay. He said he
likes to look at the information and see what is involved in the
permitting process. Once all the data is in front of the board,
then an intelligent decision can be made.
1:44:46 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG said his question is about how the
internal function of the board operates and how Mr. Jensen
operates inside of that. "When there ... is an issue before the
board and there is no user group represented on the board and it
is in opposition to someone that is a user group on the other
side of the issue, do you ever find yourself representing
somebody that is not represented on the board against another
member?" he asked.
MR. JENSEN answered no, he approaches all the proposals and
makes all his decisions with an open mind. He does not come to
a meeting with his mind made up on an issue, although he might
have some preconceived notions about what is going on. He said
he listens to all the data that is given to the board and he
tries to make his decisions in favor of the resource. After
that, the board's biggest job is allocation amongst the user
groups and he tries his best to be as fair as he can be.
1:46:22 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG said his concern is when no one is
there speaking for someone who might not have a lobbyist or user
group at the board meeting. Who speaks for the people that are
not there, he asked.
MR. JENSEN responded that generally every user group has some
representation there. When making allocation decisions the
board uses a list of eight evaluation criteria and each one of
those criteria is addressed on the record. The criteria go from
value to the state, value to the communities, value to the local
area, the history of the fisheries, the participation in the
fisheries, and so on. Another guideline the board follows,
especially with salmon issues, is the Sustainable Salmon
Fisheries Management Policy.
1:48:10 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES inquired whether Mr. Jensen had any comment
on the new financial disclosure requirements as compared to what
they were before.
MR. JENSEN replied his wife helps him with this and she said it
was much harder to fill out [the form] this time than it was
before and it took about four hours to do.
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked whether Mr. Jensen has heard any
comments from other board members that they are reconsidering
serving on the board because the disclosures now go too far into
confidential and personal information.
MR. JENSEN answered he has not heard any comments that severe.
1:49:53 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO inquired whether the eight criteria mentioned by
Mr. Jensen are weighted equally.
MR. JENSEN said he believes they were designed to be weighted
fairly and he tries to look at both sides of the issue when he
is addressing the criteria. One answer may be good for a
commercial fisherman but not for a sport fisherman, so he tries
to make it so it balances out.
REPRESENTATIVE WILSON disclosed that Mr. Jensen is a
constituent. She said she thinks he is doing a good job and
appreciates that he tries to be fair and look at all of the
facts before making a decision.
1:51:23 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON requested Mr. Jensen to address the following
quote that was attributed to him during testimony on [3/17/08]:
"If you don't have a limited entry permit, you are not entitled
to more fish."
MR. JENSEN stated he made a quote, but that was not the quote.
"We were talking about increasing numbers of people ... in
different user groups; for example ... sport fishing can keep
increasing ... as the population does. ... What I said in that
quote was that commercial fishermen have CFEC [Commercial
Fisheries Entry Commission] permits and ... there is a finite
limit on the amount of permits. So ... everybody else can grow
in numbers, but the commercial fisherman can't."
1:52:30 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EDGMON observed that Mr. Jensen is chairman of
the restructuring committee. He inquired what this committee
does and what its charge is.
MR. JENSEN responded that a few years ago the board started
getting proposals that did not quite fit in with the rest of the
proposals, and the board figured they deserved a closer look.
For example, there are people in Bristol Bay who feel a longer
boat would be better for facilitating better quality fish. Boat
length has been 32 feet since statehood, at least. So, that was
put into the restructuring committee. Another issue in the
restructuring committee is dual permits, which is still on the
table. One person can own two permits and in Bristol Bay the
owner of two permits is entitled to another unit of gear, which
is 50 fathoms, so he or she would essentially be fishing a 200
fathom net instead of a 150 fathom net. But, at the same time,
having two permits results in taking another boat and another
100 fathoms out of the fishery. So, in a way it reduces effort
but in another way it consolidates the fishery. There is
another meeting in April [2008]. So far [the board] has passed
only one official restructuring proposal, which was brought
forth by the Kodiak setnetters to allow one person to own two
setnet permits and operate them.
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON noted his appreciation of Mr. Jensen's
testimony and past service.
1:55:13 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON requested Mr. Morris to state why he wants to
be re-appointed to the Board of Fisheries.
MELVAN E. MORRIS JR., Appointee to the Board of Fisheries,
Alaska Department of Fish & Game, replied he considers the board
a public service and something he can do as a retired person
from the industry and previous commercial fisheries biologist.
He enjoys looking at the issues and working with the people. It
is a good way to terminate a career as an Alaskan in Alaska
fisheries.
1:56:23 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked how Mr. Morris, when making
decisions, balances his own financial interests in the seafood
industry with other interests like sport fishing and
subsistence.
MR. MORRIS answered M & M Marketing is not exactly a company, it
is a name for his activity. It is a sales and services company,
there are no tangible assets to it. As far as Cook Inlet, he
provides quality control in one plant once the fish are
processed. So, he said, there is no conflict as to what he can
do in making decisions as to whether M & M Marketing is going to
benefit.
MR. MORRIS addressed Representative Guttenberg's previous
question about how do people get represented at Board of
Fisheries meetings. First, the proposals come out in August.
Many people write in with their thoughts on a proposal or
proposals, so they do not have to be at the meeting to be well
represented. The board gets stacks of correspondence up to and
throughout the meeting. He said he thinks the process is good
and the committee process is good. The people that are at the
meeting participate and are able to listen to the board members
and ask questions of the board members.
MR. MORRIS, in regard to his ability to consider all the issues
when making decisions, noted that the board gets reports from
the Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G), listens to public
testimony, and receives letters. Board members ask a lot of
questions, he said, and he calls on people who are not speaking
so he can hear what everyone has to say about an issue.
1:59:59 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES recited the public process just spelled out
by Mr. Morris and inquired whether Mr. Morris would characterize
his representation on the board as being perfectly fair and
balanced among all users.
MR. MORRIS noted there is also the deliberation process where
board members listen to each other. Many times the deliberation
process provides a lot of information and helps him and other
board members to make up their minds. All those things have to
come into play because that it is part of the process. As to
whether he can be fair in making up his mind, he said he must
first consider the resource. The resource, the habitat, and the
environment all come first, then subsistence, and then the user
groups. When he makes those considerations and then goes into
allocations, the participation of the user groups in the meeting
is especially important, whether through letters or personal
representation, because no one is an expert on all the issues
throughout the state as it pertains to user groups.
2:02:13 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked whether Mr. Morris has ever made any
decisions while on the board that he later wished he had done
differently.
MR. MORRIS explained that the board has two processes - agenda
change requests (ACRs) and emergency petitions. After a
proposal is published people can express their concerns about
something that has been done through an agenda change request.
This allows the board to take up the issue again, even if a
regulation was made just a few months before. Or, if it is an
issue that clearly appears to have some ramifications for which
concerns are expressed, the board can take it up as an emergency
petition at any time. Therefore, what the board does is not
necessarily written in stone. There have been times when he
felt the board needed to accept ACRs, he said. For example, the
board felt the Adak state waters cod fishery had not slowed down
enough to be truly a state waters fishery and the board is still
looking at issues and has taken up a number of ACRs for those.
So he does not necessarily have to live with a mistake because
it can be taken up again through these processes, he said.
2:04:45 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES inquired whether Mr. Morris has any comment
on the new financial disclosure requirements as compared to what
they were before.
MR. MORRIS answered he hopes he filled out the right forms
because he did not see a whole lot of difference. He did not
see anything that would cause him to feel he did not want to
continue on the board. He thinks the board is too important and
he is assuming the information is confidential.
2:05:45 PM
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON related the concern expressed during previous
testimony [on 3/17/08] regarding Mr. Morris's business
ownership. Does M & M Marketing have a business license, he
asked.
MR. MORRIS responded no, he determined he did not need one.
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON inquired whether M & M Marketing generates
revenue.
MR. MORRIS replied that at times he can generate revenue if he
does brokering or something like that. There are no fixed
assets or employees, it is strictly a name for himself.
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON asked whether Mr. Morris has ever made
decisions on the board affecting the fisheries of any of his
clients.
MR. MORRIS answered yes, two or three years ago there was a
proposal to open a state waters pollock fishery off of Seward.
He had sold some pollock two or three years ago for a company
that had ownership of a small plant there. He said he recused
himself from dealing with that proposal.
2:07:51 PM
MR. MORRIS, in response to Co-Chair Gatto, confirmed he is the
president [of M & M Marketing] and has no employees.
CO-CHAIR GATTO observed that Mr. Morris's résumé states he is
the president rather than the owner of [M & M Marketing]. He
said this could be misleading because knowing someone is the
owner of a business is more important than knowing he or she is
employed by a business. He inquired whether Mr. Morris
accidently left that off or felt that it was not anything
significant.
MR. MORRIS said he had both owner and president on one business
card, but on the next batch he just used president. He said as
far as he is concerned they are interchangeable.
CO-CHAIR GATTO noted he is referring to the résumé that Mr.
Morris submitted and the committee does not have Mr. Morris's
business card. He asked whether Mr. Morris felt it unnecessary
to state he was the owner of the business.
MR. MORRIS responded yes, he considered it unnecessary because
on the first two lines of his ethics disclosure form he stated
his sources of income include his seafood marketing company, M &
M Marketing.
2:10:10 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GUTTENBERG inquired whether Mr. Morris is still
involved in Wakefield Seafoods.
MR. MORRIS replied no, not really. He is only a distant
observer of the crab fisheries now. Of course, the Board of
Fisheries does make regulations regarding the crab fishery.
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH requested Mr. Morris to respond to
those people who are opposing his confirmation.
MR. MORRIS answered everyone has the right to their own opinion,
but some of the statements were inaccurate. He understands that
someone with local knowledge believes in what he or she is
saying, even when ADF&G's data or research biologists are saying
something different, because the local person is on the grounds
and is not catching fish and is concerned. He said he can only
deal with the issue from the perspective of the tools that are
available to him and the tools he can give the biologists to
deal with the issues. He said he does not have a problem with
people speaking against him and if they can make a good
argument, then the committee should probably not vote for him.
But, in his opinion, he has done a good job and will continue to
do a good job and he looks forward to serving another three
years.
2:13:20 PM
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH related that sport fishermen from the
Matanuska-Susitna area testified that Mr. Morris's decisions
affected the [salmon] runs into their area. She requested Mr.
Morris to address the fishermen's feeling that they did not
receive a fair appropriation of the asset.
MR. MORRIS responded he is unsure which decisions the sport
fishermen are referring to that would have impacted their
ability to get fish up in the inlet. He said he did vote
against expanding the commercial fishery for coho salmon, and
that did go down. He would have supported expanding the bag
limit from two to three for coho salmon, except ADF&G was
opposed to it because the department could not make in-season
adjustments. He supported the yield stock of concern on the
Yentna River for a number of reasons. Accurate data is needed
because the counter on the river may be under counting by 50
percent or more, and there are also some issues with pike and
beaver dams. He supported being able to deal with those issues.
He said the board made a closure on the commercial fishery in
the Central District of the Upper Cook Inlet so that when the
setnetters were not fishing the driftnetters would not be able
to fish in the corridor. Overall, the board had to make a
balance. As pointed out by Mr. Jensen, there are over-
escapement issues on the Kenai and Kasilof rivers. In order to
address those issues, which have amounted to around 700,000 fish
a year for the last 10 years, the board had to give some
flexibility to the fisheries managers, but the board made
certain that the management plans did not change from the aspect
of providing escapement to the upper inlet. The board received
data from the staff that showed the sport fish harvest in the
upper inlet has increased 55 percent over the last 10 years.
Therefore, he does not know what proposals were being spoken to.
In every case he felt he took the side of the resource and then
made a fair and equitable sharing of that resource by the
stakeholders.
2:17:22 PM
REPRESENTATIVE FAIRCLOUGH asked how Mr. Morris, as a board
member, prioritizes the fishery resource against other needs
across the state. She further asked whether Mr. Morris believes
mining can be accomplished without adverse effects to the
fisheries.
MR. MORRIS stated he was in Alaska during the territorial days.
Alaska became a state because of wanting to be independent of
the government telling the state what it could do, he related,
although that is still being seen in places like the Arctic
National Wildlife Refuge. The state's resources should be ours
to use as long as they are used wisely. He said he cannot give
any valid assessment as to what would happen if the Pebble Mine
is opened, but he can say he is in favor of seeing Alaska's
resources utilized as long as they are protected. Mining is a
nonrenewable resource and fish are renewable and the fish must
be protected first. Any mining or harvesting of nonrenewable
resources has to be secondary to the renewable resources, but
there is a permitting process in place. He said Representative
Edgmon is correct that the Board of Fisheries did not take an
action last year in Dillingham. The proposal that was before
the board would have allowed the board to develop a resolution
against the mine. The board instead formed a habitat committee
and this committee participated in all the meetings of the
Department of Natural Resources (DNR) and whoever else, and then
the committee reported back to the board. After the first
series of meetings it was determined that, at this point in
time, the safeguards for the mine are inadequate to ensure the
mine could proceed without having additional concerns for the
[fishery] resource.
2:21:46 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO pointed out that a substantially high percent of
the people in his Matanuska-Susitna district are sport
fishermen. He inquired whether Mr. Morris said the fish are up
55 percent in Upper Cook Inlet.
MR. MORRIS replied no, he had said the sport fish harvest is up
55 percent. In further response, Mr. Morris reaffirmed his
belief in local knowledge and clarified he is not saying that
someone can catch 55 percent more fish than he or she used to.
He said he is merely explaining that when the board made
decisions, this is some of the data that was before the members.
It was not all of the data, but he assumed it was accurate.
2:23:26 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES asked what the percentage of change was in
the commercial take for that same region over that same time
period.
MR. MORRIS said that information was in "RC 83" which was given
out at the meeting. He said he thinks the fact that the
Northern District became a stock of concern for yield concern
pretty much tells that the harvests of the commercial fishery
were certainly down, but he will have to look for the paperwork.
REPRESENTATIVE ROSES requested Mr. Morris to submit the
paperwork for the record if he is able to find it because it
would be helpful to know what happened with the commercial catch
in relation to the sport catch.
MR. MORRIS reiterated that the reason the Yentna River became a
stock of concern was because of the failing harvest and he
believes it came down something like 78 percent, but he will
have to do a little digging.
2:25:28 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON noted that six guidelines were adopted in
1993 for establishing new state waters fisheries. He asked
whether the board applies those guidelines when it works on
management regimes such as starting a completely new state
waters fishery or restructuring.
MR. MORRIS answered he is not familiar with them. He said the
only state waters fishery initiated since he has been on the
board is the Adak pea cod fishery where the board was concerned
about hitting the "jeopardy bar" regarding the Steller sea lion
and the Endangered Species Act. The board adopted basically the
same fishery that was in existence except pulling the entire
allocation into the state waters fishery. From there the board
made some tweaks and modifications to make it more favorable for
the state waters fishermen.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON suggested Mr. Morris pull up those
guidelines to see if they are still in effect and whether they
are something the board can utilize in the development of other
saltwater fisheries. In response to Mr. Morris, Representative
Seaton said he believed the guidelines were in policy as opposed
to regulation.
2:29:08 PM
CO-CHAIR GATTO moved that the House Resources Standing Committee
forward the names of Mr. William Brown, Mr. John Jensen, and Mr.
Melvan Morris Jr. to a joint session for consideration. There
being no objection, the names of Mr. Brown, Mr. Jensen, and Mr.
Morris were advanced.
CO-CHAIR JOHNSON thanked Mr. Morris for his service to the
country as a veteran as well as to the state.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Resources Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:30 p.m.
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