Legislature(1997 - 1998)
04/19/1997 01:45 PM House RES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE
April 19, 1997
1:45 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Bill Hudson, Co-Chairman
Representative Scott Ogan, Co-Chairman
Representative Beverly Masek, Vice Chair
Representative Ramona Barnes
Representative Fred Dyson
Representative Joe Green
Representative Irene Nicholia
Representative Reggie Joule
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative William K. ("Bill") Williams
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
CONFIRMATION HEARINGS:
Alaska Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission
Marlene A. Johnson - Juneau
Bruce Twomley - Juneau
- CONFIRMATIONS ADVANCED
Board of Fisheries
Larry J. Engel - Palmer
Robert E. (Ed) Dersham - Anchor Point
- CONFIRMATIONS ADVANCED
Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
Mary Coffey Marshburn - Homer
- CONFIRMATION ADVANCED
WITNESS REGISTER
MARLENE A. JOHNSON, Appointee
to the Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission
9505 Antler Way
Juneau, Alaska 99801
Telephone: (907) 789-4833
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the CFEC.
JERRY McCUNE, President
United Fishermen of Alaska
211 Fourth Street, Suite 112
Telephone: (907) 586-2820
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of Marlene Johnson and
Bruce Twomley as appointees to the CFEC.
BRUCE TWOMLEY, Appointee
to the Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission
P.O. Box 020972
Juneau, Alaska 99802-0972
Telephone: (907) 789-6160 (wk); 586-3251 (hm)
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the CFEC.
LARRY ENGEL, Appointee
to the Board of Fisheries
P.O. Box 197
Palmer, Alaska 99645
Telephone: (907) 745-4132
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Board of
Fisheries.
MARY COFFEY MARSHBURN, Appointee
to the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
P.O. Box 277
Homer, Alaska 99603
Telephone: (907) 235-7978
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the AOGCC.
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 97-46, SIDE A
Number 0001
CO-CHAIRMAN BILL HUDSON called the House Resources Standing
Committee meeting to order at 1:45 p.m. Members present at the
call to order were Representatives Hudson, Ogan, Masek, Barnes,
Dyson and Nicholia. Representatives Joule and Green arrived at
1:46 p.m. and 1:47 p.m., respectively.
CONFIRMATION HEARINGS
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON announced the committee would consider two
nominees for the Board of Fisheries, two for the Alaska Commercial
Fisheries Entry Commission, and one for the Alaska Oil and Gas
Conservation Commission. They would not vote for the nominees but
would pass them out of committee for full consideration of the
House and Senate. (Resumes were provided for all appointees.)
Alaska Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission
Number 0205
MARLENE A. JOHNSON, Appointee to the Alaska Commercial Fisheries
Entry Commission (CFEC), came forward to testify, saying she knew
most of the members there. She told members she'd been interested
in fisheries all of her life. A lifelong Alaskan from Southeast
Alaska, she'd served in several capacities and in several areas in
the fishing industry, including being the chairperson of a
processor, serving with fishermen, working with individual
fisheries for years, and being a license vendor. Because she has
lived in a fishing village, fishing has been very much a part of
her life. She has also served on the School of Fisheries and Ocean
Sciences advisory board since it was formed, which she believes has
been eight years, and she will serve another two years. Ms.
Johnson expressed interest in "conservation of our resource" and in
ensuring that the fisheries are economic for fishermen.
Number 0343
CO-CHAIRMAN SCOTT OGAN asked how many collective years of
experience they would have on the commission, assuming that Ms.
Johnson was confirmed.
MS. JOHNSON described herself as the "new kid on the block." She
said Commissioner Twomley, the chairman, has served since 1982, and
Commissioner Anderson has served four years. Members have 16 or 17
years' combined experience, with most of it contributed by Mr.
Twomley.
Number 0417
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked Ms. Johnson to provide her background of
past commercial fishing experience and to explain why she is
qualified for this job.
MS. JOHNSON indicated she'd worked for what is now "Columbia Wards
Fisheries," and she also mentioned Coastal Glacier Seafoods and
Excursion Inlet Packing Company. She'd done accounting and
commercial settlements for crab fishermen, halibut fishermen and
salmon fishermen, for example, which was her experience in the
early days. Her brothers and sisters were commercial fishermen
most of their lives; however, they've either died or retired.
MS. JOHNSON advised members that she was then on the Sealaska
Corporation board, and she was its chairperson for a number of
years. She stated, "We acquired Ocean Beauty Seafoods, which was
a conglomerate and had a number of - 18 - companies underneath it.
I was the chairman of the board of Ocean Beauty Seafoods, also, and
served on the executive committee. So I've worked in that
capacity, in the processing."
Number 0528
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN said there are inherent conflicts coming up with
the takeover of fisheries management by the federal government, as
well as possible conflicts relating to sovereignty issues, for
example. He believes these possibly threaten the existence of
commercial fishing, and they undermine the value of permits. He
noted that Ms. Johnson had been a board member of the Alaska
Federation of Natives (AFN).
MS. JOHNSON indicated she'd not only been a board member of the AFN
but had helped to form it. She mentioned the Tlingit and Haida
Central Council, Executive Committee, as well.
Number 0592
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked whether Ms. Johnson has any conflicts with
past associations and the possible threat to commercial fisheries.
MS. JOHNSON replied, "No. ... I don't see any conflict whatsoever.
I think the state needs to manage the fisheries. I think, if
possible, the state should contract with the federal government for
whatever they have in managing the fisheries. And I feel very
strongly about that. ... My being a member of the Native community
does not affect that at all. I don't think in the long run that,
at least in my area, ... that my corporation would support that at
all."
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked whether she'd taken an oath to do that.
MS. JOHNSON said yes.
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked whether she'd defend the constitution as
written.
MS. JOHNSON replied, "Absolutely, absolutely. I have no problem
with that."
Number 0656
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON offered his opinion that Ms. Johnson has the
ability to "professionally administer between really varying,
different opinions, particularly on the board of directors of the
various Native associations." He said over the years he has
observed this, and he believes Ms. Johnson has always been a
professional.
Number 0687
REPRESENTATIVE REGGIE JOULE said he is glad to see Ms. Johnson
going into something like this. He indicated his belief that Ms.
Johnson fully recognizes the commitment of time and energy
required. He said to Ms. Johnson, "And on the other boards and
commissions that I've sat with you on, in addition to being busy
doing other things, you've always managed to be a leader in
everything ... that you've done." He said he expects that probably
will continue.
REPRESENTATIVE JOULE stated, "I guess I am a little concerned about
the questions around Alaska Natives that are going to be serving on
our boards and commissions and whether or not the conflict with
regards to Indian country -- because I think that question can be
asked to any resident of the state, both sides of the aisle." He
said he understands the concern, and maybe it has to be stated for
the record. However, if that is the case, then maybe they should
ask that question of people who may be representing the Alaska
Outdoor Council or commercial fisheries, or ask it of whoever else
has a stake in the outcome of the decision of the Venetie case,
rather than specifically asking Alaska Natives just because it is
called "Indian country."
Number 0804
REPRESENTATIVE FRED DYSON responded that he appreciates
Representative Joule's concern, but his own sense is that there is
nothing racist about the question.
REPRESENTATIVE JOULE said he understands that.
REPRESENTATIVE DYSON said if the co-chair hadn't asked the
question, he himself would have; his perception at this time is
that the AFN has an official position that the state constitution
must be modified. He said, "And I think it was a legitimate
question to ask this apparently very qualified nominee, if there is
a conflict between that organization that you're not only a part of
but are a founder of and their position and the oath of office
you've taken. And I think you satisfied that question very well.
And it is a tough question to ask, and a delicate one; I appreciate
it coming up."
REPRESENTATIVE DYSON commented that he would do the same thing with
any nominee who was part of an organization. He mentioned
consumptive use; he recalled that this committee got into that when
a person who'd been part of an organization took exception to what
the constitution says. Representative Dyson concluded by saying,
"I think the question is legitimate. I will share your objection
and jump up and holler if I sense that any of the questions here
are unfair, ... based on race. And I appreciate your sensitivity."
Number 0906
REPRESENTATIVE RAMONA BARNES requested clarification on Ms.
Johnson's comment about the "state contracting with the federal
government to manage."
Number 0926
MS. JOHNSON replied, "Those fisheries in the federal waters. I'm
talking about the halibut and ... the IFQ [Individual Fishery
Quota] programs and those that ... are landed in our state and not
taken to Canada, that we need to have a way to enforce our laws
with the federal government. And I think we need to find a way to
do that."
Number 0948
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked whether Ms. Johnson was speaking about the
halibut subsistence fisheries.
MS. JOHNSON replied, "No, Mr. Chairman. I'm not speaking about
subsistence in any way. And I want that very clear." She said the
AFN's position is on subsistence; they don't have a position on
commercial fisheries. Ms. Johnson stated, "I feel my role is
dealing with commercial fisheries, not with the subsistence
fishery."
Number 0998
JERRY McCUNE, President, United Fishermen of Alaska (UFA), came
forward to testify, specifying that the UFA's position is to
support both nominees for the CFEC. He said they'd been quite
comfortable with Bruce Twomley's position on protecting the state's
rights on all the issues, including the James (ph) case and limited
entry. He stated, "So I think Bruce has done a tremendous job."
MR. McCUNE said that after talking to Marlene Johnson and talking
to 21 different groups around the state, they're all comfortable
that she'll do a good job on the commission, if confirmed. He
noted that most members are direct stakeholders; they have permits
or are directly tied to commercial fishing.
Number 1068
BRUCE TWOMLEY, Appointee to the Commercial Fisheries Entry
Commission (CFEC), came forward to testify. Originally appointed
to the CFEC by then-Governor Hammond in late 1982, he subsequently
was appointed chair by then-Governor Sheffield and had been
reappointed since that time. He stated, "I've been very happy to
serve on the commission. Prior to serving on the commission, I
used to sue state and federal governments for a living and also
represented individual fishermen before the commission. And so I
have some sense about how agencies affect real people, and I have
a sense of how to avoid mistakes that I've seen other agencies
make. And I think the area where I can make the primary
contribution is in doing adjudications. We are primarily
administrative law judges."
MR. TWOMLEY spoke on behalf of Marlene Johnson, saying "she brings
a special background to our jobs as administrative law judges
because she has been one, on a number of occasions in the past, and
she served on the Labor Relations Board, for example."
MR. TWOMLEY stated, "And so, primarily, what we have to do is apply
the law as you have written it. And the job ... is a fairly
confining job in that respect, although what isn't confined is the
amount of work. ... There is a lot of it, and it's a job that I
have found very rewarding, and I certainly appreciate ... your
attention to this matter."
Number 1170
REPRESENTATIVE DYSON stated for the record that he is holds a
limited entry permit. He commented, "And I don't believe I have a
conflict of interest in voting on this, although with your long
length of service, my fair treatment before the board might ... be
taken to predispose me in your favor. But I don't think that I do
have a conflict, but I'll bow to the rule of the chair."
Number 1198
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON observed that over the years, Bruce Twomley has
been a powerful advocate for the fishermen and fisherwomen of this
state, on whose behalf he has taken on the Internal Revenue
Service, for example. He expressed appreciation for that.
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON advised members that there was no one else to
testify on these two candidates. He requested that all members
provide their signatures on the appropriate documents.
Board of Fisheries
Number 1231
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON announced the committee would next consider the
two appointees to the Board of Fisheries. Although Larry Engel was
on teleconference, Ed Dersham was unavailable for the
teleconference that day.
Number 1254
LARRY ENGEL, Appointee to the Board of Fisheries, testified via
teleconference from Palmer. Born and raised in a rural setting
near Seattle, Washington, he was involved in his family's
commercial fishing activity in the San Juan Islands as a teenager.
He came to Alaska in 1958 with the U.S. Navy and was stationed in
Kodiak. He has lived in Alaska ever since, with the exception of
time spent in Washington state to further his education.
MR. ENGEL began working with the Department of Fish and Game in
1960; he worked there every year until 1992, more than 30 years.
Shortly after retirement, he worked as a fishery advisor for the
Matanuska-Susitna Borough, through a professional services
agreement. In February 1994, he was appointed to the Board of
Fisheries by then-Governor Hickel. He'd served a three-year term
and is now being considered for a second term.
MR. ENGEL said he believes he has the credentials, the desire, the
abilities, and the skills to perform the difficult task asked of a
Board of Fisheries member, and he is willing to do it. He stated,
"The resource has been very kind to me. As I've indicated, more
than 30-some years I've been involved in fisheries; I've been able
to support my family, raised two fine young sons to ... young
adulthood. And now I have the time to give back to that resource,
in a voluntary capacity, some of which it's given to me."
Number 1356
REPRESENTATIVE JOE GREEN informed members that feedback he'd
received has been very complimentary, indicating there is fairness,
objectivity, and preparation, and indicating Mr. Engel has been an
outstanding board member in his first three years.
Number 1385
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked whether anyone else had questions. He
said his own observation over the years has been a testament to Mr.
Engel's fairness. He acknowledged that it is an extremely
difficult job to do, as evidenced by conflicts between commercial
fishing and subsistence or sport fishing, for example. He said he
has always felt strongly that professionalism within the CFEC needs
to be maintained. He said they have an "awesome job" of trying to
allocate on a fair-minded basis. He thanked Mr. Engel.
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON again noted that Robert E. (Ed) Dersham from
Anchor Point wasn't available on line that day. (Committee packets
contained a resume, a press release from the Governor's office, and
an endorsement from the Alaska Outdoor Council; the latter two
documents refer to other appointees as well.) Co-Chair Hudson
advised members that the Speaker of the House has spoken quite
highly of Mr. Dersham.
Number 1462
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN recalled that they'd heard from Mr. Dersham in the
House Special Committee on Fisheries. He confirmed that Speaker
Gail Phillips had spoken highly of him; she'd indicated Mr. Dersham
always had a level head when things got "hot" on contentious
issues, he was statesmanlike, and he could negotiate tough
decisions.
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON indicated that portion of the hearing was
concluded.
Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
Number 1497
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON announced the final item of business was
consideration of the confirmation of Mary Coffey Marshburn to the
public seat on the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission.
Number 1530
MARY COFFEY MARSHBURN, Appointee to the Alaska Oil and Gas
Conservation Commission (AOGCC), came forward to testify. She
explained that the AOGCC's role is, for the benefit of Alaska's
people, to ensure efficient depletion of the state's hydrocarbon
resources. They do so by preventing waste, both on the surface and
below ground, and by maximizing ultimate recovery of the resource
and protecting the opportunities of other owners to produce. They
do this through a variety of methods, including permitting systems,
reservoir surveillance, joint plans of development and field
inspections. These help ensure good design of wells and control in
production.
MS. MARSHBURN stated her belief that a commissioner's role benefits
from a broad perspective. On the three-member commission, with a
geologist, an engineer and a public member, the positions
complement each other. She referred to her 12 years as a municipal
clerk and said that position is part of the legislative branch of
government, serving as a focal point for representation of the
public interest and dealing with the Administration on a daily
basis.
MS. MARSHBURN explained, "During those 12 years, I developed the
ability to deal with all of the segments that I just described, to
communicate effectively. I learned that there's obviously more
than one view to an issue, more than one solution. I was
responsible for developing the community councils program, the
ombudsman program, the computerized voting program that you have
today. So I'm familiar with program development and also
intimately, from those years, aware of protecting public interest."
Number 1629
MS. MARSHBURN continued, "The last two years have been spent with
the Oil and Gas Policy Council, taking them from the administrative
order through the completion of their work, and that was basically
a review of all of the state's petroleum policies. ... It was a
two-year effort and included examining the fiscal system, all of
the resources, the leasing policy, the regulatory environment,
North Slope gas commercialization and a number of other issues. It
culminated in the writing of two reports, and I think that all
members of the legislature got copies of those reports."
MS. MARSHBURN said she brings this knowledge of the broader policy
areas to the AOGCC. She believes members must have integrity, a
judicious temperament and the ability to listen to and examine all
sides. She believes her background as a municipal clerk and with
the policy council brings the needed abilities to the commission.
MS. MARSHBURN stated, "I'm obviously not a geologist. I'm not an
engineer. I don't have the technical background. My background is
business administration. I do have the ability, at least
conceptually, to understand technical relationships. And probably
equally important, I'm not afraid to ask questions for explanation
by people who do have the background; that I do."
Number 1733
REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked what Ms. Marshburn's personal position
was on Lease Sale 85.
MS. MARSHBURN asked whether that was on the lower peninsula.
REPRESENTATIVE BARNES said yes.
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "The AOGCC is not involved in leasing. I am
a resident of Homer. My position was that the lease sale should
have gone forward."
Number 1749
REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked whether there were two, 85 and 85A.
MS. MARSHBURN said she believed 85 was the federal lease sale and
85A was on the southern peninsula. "I'm not sure which number is
which," she added.
MS. MARSHBURN said she had attempted to individually meet as many
House Resource Committee and Senate Resource Committee members as
possible because she is new to the process. In the course of that,
three concerns were brought forward. She explained, "I was asked
by one legislator if I had been given a particular direction, a
particular agenda, when I was asked to accept the appointment. And
the answer is no, I wasn't. No one ever asked me or told me that
there was a particular path they wanted me to pursue. If that had
been the case, I wouldn't be here."
MS. MARSHBURN continued, "The second thing that raised concern was
[by] Representative Hodgins, because he is from the peninsula, and
one other legislator whose name I can't recall, was I think what
Representative Barnes is talking about, which is the fact that I am
from Homer. There is a segment of that population which believes
that the oil and gas industry cannot develop responsibly and should
not develop. And I was asked my opinion on that, or my feelings.
And I have seen responsible development. I know that they can. I
think mistakes are far too costly for any industry, and not just in
terms of dollars."
MS. MARSHBURN continued, "And the third concern that has been
brought up was brought up by Representative Green and by Senator
Leman, both of whom are engineers, and that's the vacancy in the
engineer's position on the commission. Chairman Johnston and I
will both be glad when that position is filled. There is plenty of
work to go around for everyone. I think that all boards, all
commissions, including the legislature, function better with their
full complement."
Number 1840
REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked Ms. Marshburn to answer her question
regarding her personal position on Lease Sales 85 and 85A.
MS. MARSHBURN said she thought she had. She stated, "My position
is that the lease sale should have gone forward."
REPRESENTATIVE BARNES said, "Both."
MS. MARSHBURN stated, "I am not as familiar with the federal lease
sale. I can speak only to the one that was a state lease sale on
the lower peninsula."
Number 1861
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked how Ms. Marshburn learned about the
position.
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "The Governor asked me if I would consider
appointment to the commission."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN stated his understanding that she had worked
with the current Governor when he was mayor of Anchorage and also
had worked on his campaign.
MS. MARSHBURN responded, "No, sir, that's not 100 percent correct.
I was the borough clerk in Anchorage the first time the Governor
ran for public office. I believe it was the first time; it was
when he ran for the assembly. I did not work with him when he was
mayor. ... My family moved to Homer in the late '70s, and I was
living in Homer during his term of office as mayor. Yes, I did
work on his campaign."
Number 1894
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked, "If you are apparently pretty well-
known with the Governor, do you feel there's any possible conflict
of trying to remain independent, as you would have to as a member
of this commission, from the Governor?"
MS. MARSHBURN said no. She said she had received no direction, nor
was there discussion of what she is to do, other than doing the
best job she can. "No, I don't have a problem with independence,"
she added.
Number 1922
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked about the membership and relationship of
the position she was being nominated to fill.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN reported that in 1978, the concept changed
from being a division within the Department of Natural Resources
(DNR) to becoming an independent, quasi-judicial commission, with
the new name, "Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission." He
stated, "And with that, they established a triad similar to the
Texas Railroad Commission. There would be one who was an expert in
surface and subsurface engineering; one who would be a specialist
in geological considerations; and the third need be neither, and
would be ... kind of a public member. And the concept, I think,
was that you'd have two `technocrats' and one who was kind of
looking at the rest of the spectrum."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN noted that they have staff as well. They are
charged with conservation of waste, which is producing a reservoir
in the most efficient manner so the least amount of hydrocarbons
remain, and protecting correlative rights between lease A and lease
B, for example.
Number 1996
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked whether this small commission advocates or
looks after the interests of the state as well, as far as
conservation is concerned.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN replied, "They shouldn't look after our
interests any different than any other land owner." He said by
their charge, they would have to look at what is good for all land
owners as far as reservoir management and, for example, to prevent
problems between leaseholders. "And that is why there is a
setback," he said. "There is a requirement that the bottom hole
wells be set back 500 feet from the property to prevent correlative
rights interference. But we, in their eyes, should be no different
than any other land owner -- or actually not land owner, because so
few of our subsurface rights go with the surface rights, but as any
other leaseholder."
Number 2041
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN stated, "You're quoted in the Alaska Journal of
Commerce saying that you want to work with the Department of
Natural Resources to see how you can cooperate, work together more.
How do you describe the responsibilities of the commission towards
the Department of Natural Resources?"
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "The statutes indicate the Department of
Natural Resources is given no status above any other, as
Representative Green has described. We have a - I'd like to think
- a complementary relationship with the Department of Natural
Resources. I know there has been considerable discussion about the
relationship in the short time I've been with the commission. I
have no true personal experience with that. I know that the
commission in the past has been affiliated with Natural Resources,
with Commerce and now with the Department of Administration. I
think that there is a need to maintain, obviously, the independence
of the commission. Any appearance of impropriety on the part of
industry needs to be avoided. And so I think that the relationship
with the Department of Natural Resources, there's a need to be very
sensitive to that. Right now, we share data with them. There is
communication back and forth on a staff level. To my knowledge, we
have a good working relationship with them."
Number 2103
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked, "Is that relationship any different than
any relationship with ARCO, BP, Exxon or any other oil or gas
operators in Alaska?"
MS. MARSHBURN responded, "The AOGCC has a good relationship with
industry. One of the things that I have done in the short time
I've been with the commission is to spend time with industry, with
Revenue, with Resources, and ask about (indisc.--coughing), its
necessity, its responsiveness, the product that it delivers, those
kinds of things. And industry feels that the AOGCC is necessary,
and they are impressed with the way in which it does its business.
It takes roughly, I think, five days from application to approval
for a permit to drill. It's a very responsive agency, and it has
a good relationship with industry."
Number 2137
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN said he was wondering whether the relationship
with the Department of Natural Resources is different from the
relation with BP, Exxon or any other producer.
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "No, not according to statute. They are to
be treated equally."
Number 2156
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked how long the vacancy on the AOGCC has
existed.
MS. MARSHBURN said she could not say for sure, although it was
probably about nine months.
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN noted that the vacant position requires a
professional engineer, including education and background, but that
her position does not.
MS. MARSHBURN concurred.
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked whether Ms. Marshburn has experience with
petroleum engineering or geology.
MS. MARSHBURN said the extent of it is that she took geology
courses in college.
Number 2196
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN stated, "You know, we're very concerned here about
that vacant position and the fact that it hasn't been appointed.
Have you had any conversations with the Administration about
filling that appointment?"
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "I have telephoned; both Chairman Johnston
and I have talked to the Governor's boards and commissions office,
which is the office that takes care of those sorts of things. They
have assured us that they are working on candidates for the
position, that this is not something which has been dropped by the
wayside. Beyond that -- that's the extent of my information."
Number 2218
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN stated his belief that it has been dropped by the
wayside. He expressed concern about not having the well-rounded
commission called for in statute. He asked whether Ms. Marshburn
had an opinion on why no appointment had been made.
MS. MARSHBURN said she honestly did not, nor did she believe it was
her place to ask details of the Administration about it. She
restated that both she and the chairman will be glad when the
position is filled. "All bodies operate better when you've got
everybody on board," she said. "We have very good staff engineers,
as Representative Green may remember, but obviously the third
position is of value."
Number 2280
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked Ms. Marshburn to explain the difference in
degree between her work as a special assistant to the commissioner
of the Department of Commerce and Economic Development and this
quasi-judicial position.
MS. MARSHBURN clarified, "I was not a special assistant to the
commissioner of Commerce, though I did assist him in some of those
things. My job specifically was the project coordinator for the
Oil and Gas Policy Council. This position is a position wherein
judgment is exercised. There are specific statutes that govern the
parameters of this position and of what this board must do. It
needs to interpret those statutes and those regulations. That
position did not. That position was a position of facilitation of
research, of writing."
Number 2316
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN referred to a letter dated March 13, 1997, to Dan
Donkle. He asked whether it is unusual for a quasi-judicial
officer to sign a document on behalf of another commissioner.
MS. MARSHBURN asked for clarification.
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN stated, "Well, the letter is signed by you for
David Johnston, and signed by you as a commissioner."
MS. MARSHBURN replied that Mr. Johnston was out of the office at
the time. As he agreed with the letter, she signed it for him.
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN asked whether Mr. Johnston had reviewed the letter
or given her permission to sign.
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "I would have to say no, not specifically.
My understanding, as I recall, he agreed with that course of
action; we had discussed that course of action and that letter.
The letter was drafted at his request and as a result of our
discussion. That is the only letter that I've signed for him."
Number 2369
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN referred to Ms. Marshburn's comments that she
and Mr. Johnston would be glad when the third seat is filled. He
asked whether she believes it would be improper, as a close friend
of the Governor's since she had worked on his campaign, to express
that open desire to the Governor for a more concentrated effort.
He stated, "I think there has been correspondence with the Governor
that there are qualified engineers that could be appointed and are
willing to serve."
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "The last time I talked to the Governor was
in December of last year. I haven't seen him since. I have
expressed the desire to the boards and commissions office that we
will be glad when that position is filled. I would be happy to
tell the Governor that, `Yes, we will be happy when the position is
filled.'"
Number 2414
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN questioned the time lag and suggested it might
be good to become proactive as a member of the commission to fill
that other seat through a discussion with the Governor. He asked
whether Ms. Marshburn believes that would be appropriate.
MS. MARSHBURN said yes.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked whether that meant she would do so.
MS. MARSHBURN said yes.
Number 2448
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN referred to a "decision regarding
jurisdiction, and this is a fairly lengthy hearing that was held
between the Department of Natural Resources and the Conservation
Commission." He asked whether Ms. Marshburn was familiar with that
document.
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "Only superficially, Mr. Chairman. It is on
my desk to read, but no, I have not read that yet."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said, "One of the orders in there - it was
actually a finding, number 174, which reads in part, and if I can
quote: `The DNR argues that voluntary unitization -- unitized
state leases are solely within the purview of DNR and that the
commission has extremely limited or even nonexistent jurisdiction
to address issues ...." [Cut off mid-speech by tape change]
TAPE 97-46, SIDE B
Number 0006
MS. MARSHBURN stated, "Prefacing my answer with the fact that I
have not read the document, I'm not familiar with it and I have a
limited amount of time on the commission, the statutes have said
that we are to be concerned with waste. So at first glance, I
would think that waste would be a consideration within the Prudhoe
Bay Unit, would be a consideration of the commission."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said, "I certainly subscribe to that, too,
because they are different and yet the commissioner has actually
indicated that in the Prudhoe Bay Unit, the conservation commission
has perhaps no jurisdiction, certainly limited jurisdiction, on
matters of conservation within the unit. So do I hear you saying
that you would take issue with that and argue against that?"
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN acknowledged that Ms. Marshburn hadn't read
the document, and he pointed out that that was a quote from it. He
stated, "And that was one of the major contentions within this
hearing, that there were two agencies here exerting jurisdiction.
And from the voluntary unitization or the organization of `who owns
what amount of what they're going to do as a single lease,' then,
that's one thing, and that certainly is DNR; but the actual
conservation of the reservoir, as I heard you say, I think, that
you feel that that is in the purview of the AOGCC."
MS. MARSHBURN responded, "At first glance -- I would have to say
yes. Obviously, I would need to know more about what we were
talking about, but yes."
Number 0068
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked whether Ms. Marshburn is familiar enough
with voluntary or compulsory unitization to know the difference.
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "I am superficially familiar with the
difference between voluntary and compulsory. I've not been
involved at this point in either; we've not gotten into that."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked, "If there was an issue of prevention of
waste which would require that a leaseholder over here, as part of
this full reservoir, was not willing to operate in the most
efficient manner, by unitization there is a - and this is called
the hammer - there is a law that allows the conservation commission
to force unitization of the substances under the prevention of
waste concern. That's compulsory unitization."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN continued, "Voluntary unitization is when
everybody just signs up to the document as they did at Prudhoe Bay.
That's a voluntary unit. We have no compulsory unitization in this
state. My concern is, knowing and on the basis that you may wonder
yet, and you're going to have to check this out, but believe me,
you would have the hammer, would you concur with the conservation
department or the AOGCC that that should stay within the
conservation commission and not, in any way, be misconstrued by DNR
that they have that authority?"
MS. MARSHBURN asked whether Representative Green was referring to
compulsory unitization.
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said yes.
Number 0130
MS. MARSHBURN responded, "Yes, I think so."
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said, "Whether it be a gas cap or an oil rim,
it's got to be voluntary if they, as a land owner, and that's all
they are, are involved."
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "My reading, what reading I have done of
their statutes as relates to unitization, and then as of the AOGCC
statutes that relate to unitization -- I would have to say yes."
Number 0149
REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said, "Governor Knowles has repeatedly
mentioned that he wants to make Alaska open and ready for business
and wants to cooperate with the oil and gas industry. And yet we
know that you helped on the Governor's election and that you
obviously are a friend, or at least more than a casual
acquaintance." He expressed concern that as a member of the AOGCC,
she has "police power" and does not have the right to say this will
be done in cooperation to make things better for the oil industry.
He stated, "You have the objective and the responsibility to act as
a policeman of that industry. Do you see any conflict now?"
MS. MARSHBURN said no. She advised members that the Governor's
campaign is not the only campaign she worked on. "And obviously I
have friends in all walks of life," she said. "I am not beholden
in any way to the Governor or to anyone else whose campaign I
worked on. I accepted and am interested in this appointment
because I think I can do the job, and I think I can do a good job,
and that I bring value to this commission. I don't see any
conflict."
Number 0218
REPRESENTATIVE BARNES asked, "This letter that you signed, what was
conservation order number 391?"
MS. MARSHBURN replied, "With Dan Donkle; this was the Dan Donkle
conservation order." She said she would have to look at it; it was
an order the commission signed after holding a hearing with Mr.
Donkle, who had requested unitization into the North Cook Inlet
Unit. There was a procedural question, and that was whether to
proceed with hearing the case on the merits. "And the commission
determined that that was not the case," she said. Ms. Marshburn
advised members that it is up for rehearing, and she expressed
reluctance to discuss it further.
Number 0257
CO-CHAIRMAN OGAN said Commissioner Johnston had told legislators,
in response to direct questions, that he neither saw that letter
nor gave Ms. Marshburn permission to sign it. He asked whether she
believes it is appropriate to be signing her name on letters he has
not seen or given her permission to sign.
MS. MARSHBURN said no. She said Commissioner Johnston had
discussed the letter and that he had requested that it be drafted.
"It was a procedural matter," she said. "I signed the letter; it
would appear that that is a mistake. It has not been brought to my
attention by Commissioner Johnston or by anyone else at the
commission office. This is the first time that it has been brought
up. But obviously no, that's not the case. That's the only time
and the only reason that I signed anything for him."
Number 0297
REPRESENTATIVE IRENE NICHOLIA said, "I don't think that we should
go by hearsay of what was said between members," she said.
Referring to Mr. Johnston, she stated, "If he had a problem with
that, then the letter should have been in front of us today."
Number 0326
REPRESENTATIVE JOULE commented on the awesome responsibility of the
appointees.
Number 0344
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON advised the committee that in accordance with AS
39.05.080, the committee had reviewed the qualifications of all the
nominees and recommended that the appointments be forwarded to a
joint session for consideration. He emphasized that the forwarding
and members' signatures did not reflect any intent to vote for or
against these individuals in further confirmation sessions.
ADJOURNMENT
CO-CHAIRMAN HUDSON adjourned the House Resources Standing Committee
meeting at 2:42 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|