Legislature(1993 - 1994)
03/04/1993 03:00 PM House L&C
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE COMMITTEE
STANDING COMMITTEE
March 4, 1993
3:00 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Rep. Bill Hudson, Chairman
Rep. Joe Green, Vice Chairman
Rep. Joe Sitton
Rep. Brian Porter
Rep. Eldon Mulder
MEMBERS ABSENT
Rep. Jerry Mackie
Rep. Bill Williams
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
*HB 113: "An Act regulating the solicitation of
contributions by charitable organizations and paid
solicitors and the solicitation of sales by
telephonic means; and amending Alaska Rules of
Civil Procedure 79 and 82."
MOVED FROM COMMITTEE
*HB 158: "An Act making appropriations for contract
settlement costs and cost-of-living adjustments
for public employees who are members of certain
collective bargaining units; and providing for an
effective date."
MOVED FROM COMMITTEE
(* First public hearing.)
WITNESS REGISTER
REP. RON LARSON
Alaska State Legislature
State Capitol
Juneau, Alaska 99801-1182
463878
Position Statement: Prime Sponsor of HB 113
JIM FORBES
Assistant Attorney General
Department of Law
1031 West 4th, Suite 200
Anchorage, Alaska 99501-1994
269-5100
Position Statement: Answered questions on HB 113
RICK GILMORE, President
Better Business Bureau
4011 Artic Blvd.
Anchorage, Alaska 99502
562-0704
Position Statement: Answered questions on HB 113
NANCY USERA, Commissioner
Department of Administration
P.O. Box 110200
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0200
465-2200
Position Statement: Testified in support of HB 158
DON VELESCO, Business Manager
Public Employees Local 71
2510 Arctic Blvd.
Anchorage, Alaska 99503
Position Statement: Testified on HB 158
CHERYL FRASCA, Division Director
Division of Budget Review
Office of Management and Budget
Office of the Governor
P.O. Box 110020
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0020
465-4681
Position Statement: Commented on HB 158 and offered two
amendments
BRIAN ROGERS
Vice President for Finance
University of Alaska
910 Yukon Drive
Fairbanks, Alaska 99775-2388
474-7448
Position Statement: Commented on HB 158
DON DEITZ
Alaska's Regional Port
Port of Anchorage
2000 Anchorage Port Road
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
337-1258 (H) 272-1531 (W)
Position Statement: Available for questions; did not
testify
PREVIOUS ACTION
BILL: HB 113
SHORT TITLE: CHARITABLE & TELEPHONIC SOLICITING/SALES
BILL VERSION:
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) LARSON
TITLE: "An Act regulating the solicitation of contributions
by charitable organizations and paid solicitors and the
solicitation of sales by telephonic means; and amending
Alaska Rules of Civil Procedure 79 and 82."
JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION
02/01/93 199 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)
02/01/93 199 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, FINANCE
02/10/93 290 (H) JUD REFERRAL ADDED,FOLLOWING L&C
03/04/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17
BILL: HB 158
SHORT TITLE: APPROP: CONTRACT SETTLEMENT COSTS
BILL VERSION:
SPONSOR(S): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR
TITLE: "An Act making appropriations for contract settlement
costs and cost-of-living adjustments for public employees
who are members of certain collective bargaining units; and
providing for an effective date."
JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION
02/15/93 348 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S)
02/15/93 348 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, FINANCE
02/15/93 348 (H) GOVERNOR'S TRANSMITTAL LETTER
03/04/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 93-18, SIDE A
Number 006
VICE CHAIRMAN GREEN opened the House Labor and Commerce
committee meeting. He informed the members that they would
be hearing HB 113 first.
HB 113: CHARITABLE & TELEPHONIC SOLICITING/SALES
Number 015
REP. RON LARSON, PRIME SPONSOR of HB 113, gave a brief
history as outlined in his sponsor statement (Attachment 1).
The bill, in short, would establish regulations on
telephonic solicitation and charitable solicitation.
Number 088
REP. SITTON asked what type of enforcement capability would
the state have on outfits operating out-of-state.
Number 096
REP. LARSON said this piece of legislation would cover the
out-of-state solicitation, and he mentioned that Mr. Forbes
from the attorney general's office could explain the
technical aspects of how that could be done.
REP. SITTON said there were a number of exemptions and
inquired if Mr. Forbes would be able to answer questions
about that as well.
REP. LARSON responded that he would.
Number 104
REP. PORTER commented on Rep. Sitton's inquiry. He said he
had understood the bill to be an attempt to get at the
fraudulent solicitors rather than those organizations that
may just be bothersome. He asked Rep. Larson if that was a
fair analysis of HB 113.
REP. LARSON answered affirmatively.
Number 127
JIM FORBES, ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL, GENERAL CIVIL
SECTION, DEPARTMENT OF LAW, testified via teleconference,
said he was the attorney general assigned to the fair
business practices section in Anchorage. He informed the
committee that this section of the attorney general's office
covers statewide and anti-trust and consumer protection
problems.
MR. FORBES clarified the section in the bill regarding
exemptions by explaining that this section was meant to help
weed out the smaller organizations that have not been a
problem.
MR. FORBES went on to say that the problems this bill
attempts to address deal with charitable solicitation fraud
and telemarketing fraud. Often these solicitations involve
the use of false information that cannot be readily verified
over the telephone, which is why the telephonic nature of
the fraud needs to be addressed. The bill helps the law
enforcers on the charitable solicitation side by giving them
the way to require registration of all entities engaged in
charitable fundraising in the amount of over five thousand
dollars a year.
MR. FORBES provided examples of fraudulent operations in
Alaska to illustrate how this requirement, as outlined in HB
113, would help the law enforcers catch fraudulent operators
or deter misconduct.
MR. FORBES stated that HB 113 would make engaging in
fundraising without filing registration papers a
misdemeanor. If an organization was found to be dealing in
fraudulent operation, that would mean they had filed
fraudulent registration. This amounts to unsworn
falsification under existing law and would have the same
criminal deterrent.
MR. FORBES said he was optimistic that HB 113 would help
address the two-fold problem in the charitable fundraising
industry. He explained the first problem as being that the
"phoney" charities are taking money from those that
otherwise may give to legitimate charities.
The second problem deals with consumer confidence. MR.
FORBES pointed out that with an increased amount of fraud
there is a decrease in consumer confidence; as a result,
people are less likely to trust the legitimate
organizations. He concluded that as a result of the
regulations outlined in HB 113, consumers may have more
confidence in charitable giving, thus giving more.
MR. FORBES continued his testimony outlining the problems of
the telemarketing industry. He referenced and elaborated on
Rep. Larson's comments regarding the psychological angle
used by the telemarketers.
MR. FORBES explained that HB 113 would require telemarketers
to register and have a contract with a prospective customer.
This aspect of the bill was patterned after a Florida law.
If a fraudulent telemarketer crossed state lines, they would
be guilty of a Class B felony.
Number 305
REP. GREEN asked Mr. Forbes if there was a proposal that
would help assure people that they should sign a contract
when dealing with these telemarketing organizations.
Number 318
MR. FORBES said there was and stated that they planned to
continue in a vigorous public education campaign with
respect to the issues stated above. He further stated that
the assistant attorney general's office has an excellent
working relationship with the Better Business Bureau of
Alaska and together they can monitor the situation and put
out press releases, etc.
Number 330
REP. MULDER asked how this would affect businesses, such as
telephone companies, or other organization involved in
telemarketing activities.
Number 332
MR. FORBES pointed out that newspaper sales, sales of
telephone answering services, cable television or any
organization regulated by the Public Utilities Commission
are exempt from HB 113.
Number 342
REP. PORTER asked if an individual would be guilty of a
crime if they were to place an ad in the paper to sell a car
and in the same day make the same proposition to three
people.
Number 352
(Vice Chairman Green noted that Rep. Hudson had joined the
committee at 3:30 p.m.)
Number 363
REP. PORTER pointed out that it was most likely a technical
matter. Referencing page 1, Section 1 (a), he noted that it
does not distinguish the caller. He went on to say he
assumed the intent of that section was for the initiator of
the call to register.
Number 374
MR. FORBES agreed with Rep. Porter's interpretation of the
intent. He added that a he did not believe that "you can't
sell that car to two or more people on the same terms
because you've only got one car."
Number 380
REP. PORTER asked for further clarification regarding the
wording "attempt to sell" and "person" in Section 1 (a).
Number 387
MR. FORBES said he felt that this concern could be dealt
with by adding another exemption and added that he felt that
would be appropriate.
Number 392
REP. SITTON reiterated his concern about prosecuting out-of-
state offenders and asked what kind of cooperation there
would be in other states.
MR. FORBES said that most states are cooperative right now
and it is the best interest of all to find the offenders.
Number 406
RICK GILMORE, PRESIDENT OF THE BETTER BUSINESS BUREAU,
testified in favor of HB 113. He reported that the bureau
office receives approximately three thousand calls a month
and a minimum of fifty to sixty percent of those calls deal
directly with sweepstakes and charities. He pointed out
that Alaskans are especially susceptible to this type of
telemarketing because people are used to ordering things by
catalog.
Number 419
REP. HUDSON asked for some examples of persons or businesses
that would register.
MR. GILMORE said that most telemarketing organizations
operate out of Nevada. He pointed out that Nevada has laws
similar to those outlined in HB 113. He said his hope would
be that once this law was enacted, it would deter fly-by-
night telemarketers from operating in Alaska.
Number 442
MR. FORBES pointed to exemption number 16 in answer to Rep.
Porter's earlier questions.
Number 450
REP. GREEN asked if the penalties were severe enough.
Number 455
MR. FORBES answered that the legislature could make the
penalties more severe, but there are provisions in the law
that carry heavier penalties for multiple offenses.
Number 473
REP. PORTER moved HB 113 with a zero fiscal note and
individual recommendations. No objections were heard; it
was so ordered.
HB 158: APPROP: CONTRACT SETTLEMENT COSTS
Number 484
COMMISSIONER NANCY USERA, COMMISSIONER, DEPARTMENT OF
ADMINISTRATION, presented the monetary terms of the labor
contract recently negotiated and gave the following
description of the types of employees covered under this
appropriation: classified, nonsupervisory, and blue and
gray collar employees of the executive branch.
Classifications include cooks, custodians, equipment
operators and skilled crafts. The employees work primarily
for the Departments of Transportation & Public Facilities,
Administration, Corrections, and Health and Social Services.
There are approximately 1,634 employees represented by the
Public Employees Local 71.
COMMISSIONER USERA went into some detail regarding
management's goals in coming to this agreement and the
contract agreement itself. (These are on file in the
committee room.)
Number 585
COMMISSIONER USERA noted that the agreement includes a
provision to refund the costs to employees who were required
to obtain a commercial driver's license as a condition of
employment. She noted renewals will be at the expense of
the employee.
Number 599
CHAIRMAN HUDSON inquired if that new requirement was the
result of the federal law change.
Number 604
DON VELESCO, MANAGER, PUBLIC EMPLOYEES LOCAL 71, stated that
the federal government does require persons driving certain
vehicles to have a commercial license. Mr. Velesco further
stated that the federal government controls the purse
strings on some of the projects, so the state then enacted a
law to require this.
Number 611
REP. PORTER asked if the license was portable.
COMMISSIONER USERA responded that it was.
COMMISSIONER USERA testified that the other large item in
the agreement was the health insurance escalator which
raises the state's contribution to $500.00 a month.
Number 638
REP. GREEN asked why the funding was coming from several
different sources.
TAPE 93-18, SIDE B
Number 001
CHERYL FRASCA, DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET,
OFFICE OF THE GOVERNOR, responded that the funding
composition for the salary increase was the same as the
funding composition to pay the salaries normally.
Number 060
REP. MULDER expressed concern over there being no savings in
this contract.
Number 069
COMMISSIONER USERA noted that there were no wage escalator
associated with this contract; reduction of a holiday saves
money; and a real monetary value to change the cola date
from January 1 to July 1 also adds up to a savings for the
state.
Number 109
COMMISSIONER USERA stated that it is her belief that health
care in this nation is going to change so dramatically that
in the long-run the state will realize a cost savings.
Number 160
REP. GREEN asked what happens if health care costs skyrocket
instead of come down.
COMMISSIONER USERA responded that in two years the contract
will be up.
Number 180
REP. GREEN expressed concern that this sets precedent.
Number 189
COMMISSIONER USERA said she believes that the precedent set
is a positive and realistic one.
Discussion ensued concerning strategy and details regarding
the contract settlement.
Number 279
REP. HUDSON asked how the amount of health insurance the
state has agreed to provide compares to other public
employers or other unions the state has bargained with.
COMMISSIONER USERA stated that the only one she knew of that
was higher was the Anchorage employees. She further stated
that the committee should remember that the Local 71
"bought" this health coverage by giving up other priorities.
Number 317
REP. MULDER asked where Commissioner Usera felt the state
stood in comparison to other employers as far as benefits.
COMMISSIONER USERA said she felt at this time the state was
providing a great benefit package, but for the record she
wanted to note that this package has been put together in
increments over the years. Furthermore, the commissioner
wanted to note that the state was in a position in the late
1970's where it was scrambling to find and retain a skilled
workforce given the high wages paid on the slope.
Number 349
REP. MULDER asked if the state had looked into going out to
bid for an insurance carrier.
Number 353
COMMISSIONER USERA answered that the state was currently
looking at a variety of options.
Number 357
REP. SITTON congratulated the unions and the administration
on the process and end result of the negotiated settlement
they came to.
Number 371
CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked what kinds of considerations could be
looked at for noncovered employees; i.e., legislative staff.
Number 372
COMMISSIONER USERA responded that she agreed wholeheartedly
that this was an area of importance to both the noncovered
employee and management.
CHAIRMAN HUDSON noted that the administration had proposed
two amendments to the bill, and a third one would be
presented by the university.
Number 439
MR. VELESCO testified that he disagreed with the
commissioner on characterizing the amount of health
insurance payments as being one of the finest. Mr. Velesco
noted that the union he represents has different needs based
on the kind of work done.
Number 502
REP. PORTER asked if Local 71 ratified this agreement.
MR. VELESCO replied yes.
Number 507
MS. FRASCA offered two amendments affecting Sections 3 and 4
of the bill. Basically, these amendments were revised
estimates of the number of employees affected by this
agreement.
Number 524
BRIAN ROGERS, VICE PRESIDENT FOR FINANCE, UNIVERSITY OF
ALASKA, testified that the amendments before the committee
represented the obligation the university had to the members
of the Alaska Community College Federation of Teachers.
Number 567
REP. PORTER asked if the university system had binding
arbitration.
Number 568
MR. ROGERS answered that they do have binding arbitration to
deal with any disputes under the collective agreement, but
they would not proceed to binding arbitration except by
mutual consent if they were to fail to reach agreement.
Number 623
REP. SITTON moved amendments 1, 2, 3 and 4, with fiscal
notes and asked unanimous consent. There were no
objections; it was so ordered.
Number 638
REP. PORTER moved for passage of CSHB 158(L&C)am with
individual recommendations and zero fiscal notes. There
were no objections; it was so ordered.
CHAIRMAN HUDSON adjourned the meeting at 4:40 p.m.
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