Legislature(2017 - 2018)GRUENBERG 120

02/01/2018 11:00 AM House FISHERIES

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11:07:45 AM Start
11:08:47 AM Presentation by John Jensen, Chairman, Board of Fisheries
11:50:15 AM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ Presentation by John Jensen, Chairman, Board of TELECONFERENCED
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
              HOUSE SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON FISHERIES                                                                            
                        February 1, 2018                                                                                        
                           11:07 a.m.                                                                                           
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
Representative Louise Stutes, Chair                                                                                             
Representative David Eastman                                                                                                    
Representative Jonathan Kreiss-Tomkins                                                                                          
Representative Mike Chenault                                                                                                    
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
Representative Geran Tarr                                                                                                       
Representative Mark Neuman                                                                                                      
Representative Zach Fansler                                                                                                     
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
PRESENTATION:  BOARD OF FISHERIES                                                                                               
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
No previous action to record                                                                                                    
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
JOHN JENSEN, Chairman                                                                                                           
Alaska Board of Fisheries (BOF)                                                                                                 
Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G)                                                                                        
Petersburg, Alaska                                                                                                              
POSITION STATEMENT:  Provided a presentation on the Board of                                                                  
Fisheries' (BOF) role and process.                                                                                              
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
11:07:45 AM                                                                                                                 
CHAIR  LOUISE  STUTES  called  the  House  Special  Committee  on                                                             
Fisheries  meeting  to  order  at  11:07  a.m.    Representatives                                                               
Eastman  and   Stutes  were  present   at  the  call   to  order.                                                               
Representatives  Chenault  and   Kreiss-Tomkins  arrived  as  the                                                               
meeting was in progress.                                                                                                        
^Presentation by John Jensen, Chairman, Board of Fisheries                                                                      
   Presentation by John Jensen, Chairman, Board of Fisheries                                                                
11:08:47 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR STUTES announced  that the only order of  business would be                                                               
a Presentation  by John Jensen,  Chairman of the Alaska  Board of                                                               
Fisheries (BOF), on the board's role and its general process.                                                                   
11:09:20 AM                                                                                                                   
JOHN  JENSEN,   Chairman,  Alaska  Board  of   Fisheries,  Alaska                                                               
Department  of   Fish  &   Game,  turned   to  slide   2,  titled                                                               
"Presentation   Outline"   which   read  as   follows   [original                                                               
punctuation provided]:                                                                                                          
     Function and composition of Board                                                                                          
     ?Steps in board process                                                                                                    
     ?Input on board decisions                                                                                                  
          ?Legal and policy factors                                                                                             
          ?Statutes and regulations                                                                                             
          ?Policies and findings                                                                                                
          ?Getting involved                                                                                                     
11:10:03 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN asked about  the Board of Fisheries' (BOF)                                                               
workload.   Based  on Mr.  Jensen's  experience, he  asked if  he                                                               
thought  the  board's  workload has  recently  increased  or  has                                                               
stayed the same.                                                                                                                
MR JENSEN  answered that  the workload  has "pretty  much" stayed                                                               
the same  during the  15 years he  has served on  the board.   He                                                               
explained that  the BOF considers  a different area of  the state                                                               
every three years  with the Upper Cook Inlet  area meeting taking                                                               
12 to 14  days to complete.   The board recently met  in Sitka to                                                               
consider Southeast Alaska shellfish  and finfish and that meeting                                                               
also took 14 days to complete,  he said.  He concluded that board                                                               
meetings seem to be holding steady.                                                                                             
11:11:11 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  commented that  a meeting ranging  from 7                                                               
to 14 days can be fatiguing for  anyone.  He asked if the BOF has                                                               
discussed  the  possibility  of regional  boards  to  reduce  the                                                               
MR. JENSEN answered  that he has not heard much  about that idea.                                                               
He  recalled  that  it  was previously  discussed.    He  thought                                                               
perhaps Governor Hammond had suggested  regional boards to assist                                                               
the board, but the idea never went anywhere.                                                                                    
11:11:58 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  asked about  the idea  of having  the BOF                                                               
operate on  a five-year  cycle as opposed  to the  current three-                                                               
year cycle.                                                                                                                     
MR JENSEN  said he has heard  a lot about that  idea; however, he                                                               
thought  it  would  cause more  emergency  petitions  and  agenda                                                               
change requests.                                                                                                                
11:12:38 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  asked which of the  following two options                                                               
would  be better:  changing  to a  5-year  cycle or  establishing                                                               
regional boards.                                                                                                                
MR.  JENSEN answered  that he  does not  like either  of the  two                                                               
options.  He said he thinks  that the regional board concept is a                                                               
good one to  consider; however, he would have to  know more about                                                               
it before he could form an opinion.                                                                                             
11:13:17 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN reviewed slide 3,  titled "Main function of the Board:                                                               
Allocation"   which  read   as   follows  [original   punctuation                                                               
     The  third  element  of Alaska's  fisheries  management                                                                    
     model  is  the  Alaska  Board  of  Fisheries?The  Board                                                                    
     members?appointed by the Governor  and confirmed by the                                                                    
     legislature, represent a broad  array of fishing groups                                                                    
     and  other   interests.  By  taking  on   the  task  of                                                                    
     resolving  fishery   disputes,  the  Board   takes  the                                                                    
     politically-charged issue  of allocation away  from the                                                                    
     fishery  managers and  politicians.?.The separation  of                                                                    
     allocation and  conservation decisions is  critical for                                                                    
     achieving  sustainable  fisheries   in  the  state  and                                                                    
     elsewhere ?                                                                                                                
MR.  JENSEN said  the Alaska  Department of  Fish &  Game (ADF&G)                                                               
does  not want  to  allocate fish  in  its fisheries'  management                                                               
role.  Further, the [state's]  founding fathers decided to remove                                                               
it from the legislature's authority, he stated.                                                                                 
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN said  he was curious about  the meaning of                                                               
the  board's   determination  that   "a  stock  has   been  fully                                                               
MR. JENSEN  answered that  when "a stock  is fully  allocated" it                                                               
means   that  all   the   user   groups,  including   commercial,                                                               
subsistence, personal use, and sport  fishery groups are catching                                                               
the amount available to catch.                                                                                                  
11:14:30 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE  EASTMAN  related  his understanding  that  "fully                                                               
allocated"  would mean  all the  fish  have been  broken down  to                                                               
various user groups.                                                                                                            
MR. JENSEN answered  yes; that was an appropriate way  to put it.                                                               
He acknowledged  that salmon runs  fluctuate, with big  years and                                                               
small years.  He said that  if the available surplus is harvested                                                               
it means it has been fully utilized.                                                                                            
11:15:14 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN reviewed  slide 4,  titled "Board  Composition" which                                                               
read, in part, as follows:                                                                                                      
     The  Board  of  Fisheries  composed  of  seven  members                                                                  
     appointed by  the Governor, subject to  confirmation by                                                                    
     a majority of  the members of the  legislature in joint                                                                    
     The Governor shall appoint each  member on the basis of                                                                  
     interest in  public affairs, good  judgment, knowledge,                                                                  
     and ability  in the field  of action of the  board, and                                                                  
     with  a view  to  providing diversity  of interest  and                                                                  
     points of view in the membership.                                                                                        
     The appointed members shall be residents of the state                                                                      
       and shall be appointed without regard to political                                                                       
     affiliation or geographical location of residence.                                                                         
MR. JENSEN referred to the graphics  on the slide and stated that                                                               
the governor appoints  board members by April  1, the legislature                                                               
confirms members  after conducting  joint session  hearings, with                                                               
the BOF  comprised of  seven members  who serve  staggered 3-year                                                               
terms starting July 1.                                                                                                          
11:15:50 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN reviewed  slide 5,  titled "Major  Steps in  Proposal                                                               
Process" which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                 
     1. Call for Proposals                                                                                                      
     2. Distribution of Proposals                                                                                               
     3. Public Review and Comment                                                                                               
     4. Board Regulatory Meeting                                                                                                
     5. Implementation                                                                                                          
MR. JENSEN  explained that individuals  must submit  proposals by                                                               
April 10 or the closest weekday  to that date.  The proposals are                                                               
then compiled, booklets are distributed,  and the board's support                                                               
staff oversees the  public review and comment period.   The board                                                               
typically holds three to four meetings  per year.  It takes up to                                                               
90 days to  implement any regulations [adopted by  the board], he                                                               
11:16:42 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR STUTES asked whether proposals  are accepted at the meeting                                                               
or must they be made in advance.                                                                                                
MR.  JENSEN answered  that  the proposals  must  be submitted  by                                                               
April  10, in  advance of  the  October board  meeting, which  is                                                               
considered  a "work  session."   The  board  meets officially  in                                                               
December.   He recalled that this  year the board took  up Prince                                                               
William  Sound proposals  in  Valdez.   He  described an  "agenda                                                               
change  request (ACR)"  as another  way to  submit proposals  for                                                               
board consideration.  The ACRs  must be  submitted by  August and                                                               
each  is reviewed  during  the board's  October  work session  to                                                               
determine whether the proposal meets  the board's criteria and if                                                               
so, the board subsequently schedules  the proposal in the meeting                                                               
cycle for that year.                                                                                                            
CHAIR  STUTES asked  how far  in  advance the  board's agenda  is                                                               
MR. JENSEN  answered that  typically the  board plans  its venues                                                               
and schedules two years in advance.                                                                                             
11:18:21 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN asked for  further clarification as to the                                                               
reason  why  a  proposal  would  be  due  by  April  but  not  be                                                               
considered until the October meeting.                                                                                           
MR.  JENSEN  answered  that  this allows  time  for  the  board's                                                               
support  staff to  compile  and organize  the  proposals for  the                                                               
following year; and to allow  the public an opportunity to submit                                                               
11:19:03 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN asked  for the number of ACRs  and if they                                                               
are typically frequent or rare.                                                                                                 
MR. JENSEN recalled  that this year the board  considered 15 ACRs                                                               
during its  October work  session meeting  and this  year perhaps                                                               
six emergency petitions were acted on.                                                                                          
11:19:40 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN  reviewed slide 6,  titled "Board of  Fisheries 3-Year                                                               
Meeting  Cycle"  which  read  as  follows  [original  punctuation                                                               
     Meeting Cycle: 2017/2018, 2020/2021, etc.                                                                                  
     Area (Species):                                                                                                            
          Southeast/Yakutat Areas (All Finfish, Shellfish)                                                                      
          Prince William Sound Area (All Finfish)                                                                               
       Dungeness   Crab,    Shrimp,   and   Miscellaneous                                                                       
          Shellfish (Statewide)                                                                                                 
     Meeting Cycle: 2018/2019, 2021/2022, etc.                                                                                  
     Area (Species):                                                                                                            
        Alaska Peninsula/Aleutian Island/Chignik/Bering                                                                         
          Sea Areas (All Finfish)                                                                                               
          Arctic/Yukon/Kuskokwim Areas (All Finfish)                                                                            
          Bristol Bay Area (All Finfish)                                                                                        
          Statewide Provisions (Finfish)                                                                                        
     Meeting Cycle: 2019/2020, 2022/2023, etc.                                                                                  
     Area (Species):                                                                                                            
          Cook Inlet Area (All Finfish)                                                                                         
          Kodiak Areas (All Finfish)                                                                                            
          King and Tanner Crab (Statewide)                                                                                      
     Board of Fisheries 3-Year Meeting Cycle                                                                                    
MR. JENSEN commented  that the board holds  its statewide meeting                                                               
in Anchorage in mid-March.                                                                                                      
11:20:14 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN  reviewed  the  "proposal  form"  on  slide  7.    He                                                               
explained that the submitter must  identify the regulation he/she                                                               
would  like changed,  the  user  type, the  area,  the issue  the                                                               
submitter  would   like  addressed,  the  reason   why,  and  any                                                               
recommended  solution.    He  explained  that  the  form  can  be                                                               
submitted by individuals or groups.                                                                                             
11:20:50 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR STUTES asked whether the form is available online.                                                                        
MR. JENSEN answered yes.                                                                                                        
11:20:54 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN discussed slide 8,  titled "Source of Proposal for the                                                               
2017/2018  Meeting Cycle"  which consisted  of a  pie-chart graph                                                               
depicting the percentage of proposals  submitted by group for the                                                               
2017/2018  meeting.     He  reported  the   number  of  proposals                                                               
submitted   to   the   board,  including   fishery   groups   and                                                               
associations, 47;  federal regional advisory councils,  2; tribal                                                               
governments or organizations,  9; and BOF, 5.   The BOF proposals                                                               
refer  to the  ACRs considered  during the  board's work  session                                                               
that  resulted  in  proposals.    He  continued  identifying  the                                                               
numbers  of   proposals  submitted,  including  the   ADF&G,  37;                                                               
individuals, 112;  and local fish  and game  advisory committees,                                                               
11:21:34 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN  referred  to  slide   9,  titled  "Board  Regulatory                                                             
Meeting" which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                 
     Typical agenda for board meetings                                                                                        
     ?Ethics disclosures                                                                                                        
     ?ADF&G staff reports                                                                                                       
     ?Oral public testimony (up to two days)                                                                                    
     ?Committee of the Whole or committees                                                                                      
     ?Deliberation on proposals                                                                                                 
     ?Miscellaneous Business                                                                                                    
11:21:48 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR STUTES referred  to the previous slide [8].   She asked for                                                               
an example of an "individual proposal."                                                                                         
MR.  JENSEN recalled  an individual  proposal  considered at  the                                                               
Sitka hearing, that  a woman requested that the  board put annual                                                               
limits on non-residents  for black cod in Southeast  Alaska.  The                                                               
board  deliberated and  adopted  the proposal,  which will  limit                                                               
non-residents to eight black cod annually, he said.                                                                             
CHAIR  STUTES  remarked  that  the board  clearly  has  a  public                                                               
process and the public can make a difference.                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN  answered yes.   He  remarked that  he likes  to allow                                                               
everyone  an  opportunity  to speak  twice  and  encourages  user                                                               
groups to  work out solutions.   He  recalled a meeting  in which                                                               
the board  had anticipated it would  be "really in a  battle over                                                               
the user groups"  of seine, troll and gillnet fisheries.   By the                                                               
time the board got to  deliberations, the groups had already met,                                                               
resolved issues,  dropped some proposals,  and had agreed  on the                                                               
approach to  take for  the next  three years.   He  remarked that                                                               
since  he  lives in  that  area,  he  cannot participate  in  the                                                               
deliberations on any proposals from Sitka.                                                                                      
11:23:36 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR  STUTES  asked  whether  board  members  find  conflict  of                                                               
interest issues difficult.  She  related her understanding of why                                                               
the  member  declaring  a  conflict   of  interest  cannot  vote;                                                               
however,  she   wondered  if   excluding  board   members  during                                                               
discussions was counterproductive.                                                                                              
MR. JENSEN  agreed, noting  that his expertise  is the  reason he                                                               
serves on  the board.   He  suggested that  Chair Stutes  was the                                                               
sponsor of a  bill that would allow board members  who declared a                                                               
conflict to  deliberate and not  vote, which would  be beneficial                                                               
to  the board  [if the  passed].   He said  he was  excluded from                                                               
participating in 53  of 145 proposals before the  board this year                                                               
since either  he or his  family members participate  in fisheries                                                               
affected by the proposals.                                                                                                      
MR.  JENSEN continued  to the  discuss slide  9 and  directed the                                                               
committee's  attention  to the  fifth  bullet  "Committee of  the                                                               
Whole process  or committees."   He stated that the  committee of                                                               
the whole process  was new during his time on  the board and that                                                               
it  is working  well. He  continued that  the committee  of whole                                                               
process allowed everyone  to speak again, but that  it is limited                                                               
to new  information and  intended for  the resolution  of complex                                                               
issues.    He  recalled  at  the last  meeting  eight  groups  of                                                               
proposals were  discussed and deliberated.   The last  item would                                                               
be  to discuss  miscellaneous  business, which  could be  carried                                                               
over to the next meeting, if necessary.                                                                                         
11:26:07 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN referred to slide  10, titled "Proposal Outcomes," and                                                               
to a chart titled "Board  of Fisheries Proposal Outcome 2016/2017                                                               
Meeting  Cycle."   This  chart shows  the  outcome of  proposals,                                                               
including that approximately 36.2  percent passed, 27 percent had                                                               
no action  since similar proposals  were acted on, and  some were                                                               
amended, [or failed].                                                                                                           
MR.  JENSEN  referred to  slide  11,  titled "Sources  of  Public                                                             
Input" which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                   
     ?General public                                                                                                            
     ?Local governments                                                                                                         
     ?Tribal groups, village councils                                                                                           
     ?Fishery groups and associations                                                                                           
     ?Industry groups                                                                                                           
     ?Local fish and game advisory committees                                                                                   
       (84 statewide)                                                                                                           
MR.  JENSEN said  he advises  everyone who  testifies that  their                                                               
testimony provides  the most  valuable input for  the board.   He                                                               
characterized public  participation as  being paramount  for good                                                               
11:27:33 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN referred  to slide  12, titled  "Local Fish  and Game                                                               
Advisory Committees,"  and to  the table  listing local  fish and                                                               
game advisory committees (advisory  committees) by community.  He                                                               
reported that  the 84 advisory committees  stretch throughout the                                                               
state, including  [9] committees in  the Arctic region,  and [15]                                                               
in  the Interior  region.   He  commented that  he considers  the                                                               
advisory committees as very valuable resources.                                                                                 
11:27:52 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN referred  to  slide 13,  titled,  "Sources of  Agency                                                               
Input" which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                   
      Alaska Dept. of Fish & Game                                                                                               
           Commercial Fisheries Division                                                                                        
           Sport Fish Division                                                                                                  
           Subsistence Division                                                                                                 
      Dept. of Law                                                                                                              
        Dept. Public Safety/Division of Alaska Wildlife                                                                         
      Commercial Fisheries Entry Commission                                                                                     
      North Pacific Fishery Management Council (federal)                                                                        
      Office of Subsistence Management (federal)                                                                                
MR. JENSEN  remarked that the  board also manages a  crab fishery                                                               
in the Bering Sea for the federal government.                                                                                   
11:28:30 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN  referred to  slide  14,  titled, "Legal  and  Policy                                                               
Considerations   (for   Board   decisions)"  which   listed   the                                                               
authorities   for   board   decisions,   including   the   Alaska                                                               
Constitution,  international   treaties,  court   rulings,  board                                                               
regulations and policies, and Alaska statutes.                                                                                  
11:28:49 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN referred to slide 15, titled "Alaska Constitution"                                                                   
which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                          
     Fish,  forests,  wildlife,  grasslands, and  all  other                                                                    
     replenishable  resources belonging  to the  State shall                                                                    
     be   utilized,  developed,   and   maintained  on   the                                                                    
     sustained  yield  principle,   subject  to  preferences                                                                    
     among beneficial uses                                                                                                      
     (Article 8, Section 4)                                                                                                     
11:29:01 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN reviewed slides 16-17, titled "Alaska Statutes" and                                                                  
"Alaska Statutes (cont.)" which read as follows [original                                                                       
punctuation provided]:                                                                                                          
     ?Board of Fisheries Authority (AS 16.05.221;                                                                               
      AS 16.05.251)                                                                                                             
          "Conservation and Development"                                                                                        
     ?Powers and Duties of the Commissioner (AS 16.05.050                                                                       
     ?Alaska Administrative Procedures Act (AS 44.62)                                                                           
      Open Meetings Act (AS 44.62.310)                                                                                          
     ?Executive Branch Ethics Act (AS 39.52)                                                                                    
     Alaska Statutes (cont.)                                                                                                    
     ?Allocation Criteria (AS 16.05.251(e) and #91-129-FB),                                                                     
     including -                                                                                                                
          ?history of each fishery                                                                                              
          ?number of participants                                                                                               
          ?importance for personal and family consumption                                                                       
          ?availability of alternative resources                                                                                
          ?importance in local, regional, and state economy                                                                     
          ?importance for providing recreational                                                                                
     ?Management of Wild and Enhanced Stocks (AS 16.05.730)                                                                     
     ?State Subsistence Law (AS 16.05.258)                                                                                      
MR. JENSEN pointed out that the board frequently uses the                                                                       
allocation criteria in AS 16.05.251(e) for guidance.                                                                            
11:29:53 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN directed  attention  to the  flowchart  on slide  18,                                                               
titled  "Determining  Subsistence   Uses,"  which  describes  the                                                               
decision process for determining subsistence  uses.  He said that                                                               
the board uses the flowchart  to ensure that the subsistence laws                                                               
are applied appropriately.                                                                                                      
MR.  JENSEN reviewed  the first  item, which  read, "Is  the fish                                                               
stock  or game  population in  a  Nonsubsistence Area?"   If  the                                                               
answer is no, it leads to the  next block, which read "Is there a                                                               
Customary and Traditional  use?"  He said there  is almost always                                                               
customary and  traditional use.   If  yes, it  leads to  the next                                                               
block that read, "Is there  a harvestable surplus?"  He explained                                                               
that the board  considers the health of the  stock and determines                                                               
whether a  harvestable surplus  is available.   The next  step is                                                               
"What is  the amount reasonably necessary  for subsistence uses?"                                                               
The  board  makes  that  finding   with  the  assistance  of  the                                                               
[Division] of  Subsistence, noting  that the  board uses  a range                                                               
instead of setting a specific  amount.  He added that subsistence                                                               
users were  usually within  the established range.   He  read the                                                               
next three  flowchart boxes, "Harvestable surplus  allows for all                                                               
or some  uses;" "Harvestable surplus allows  for only subsistence                                                               
uses;" and "Harvestable  surplus not sufficient to  allow for all                                                               
subsistence  uses."   He  directed attention  to  the third  one,                                                               
"Harvestable surplus not sufficient  to allow for all subsistence                                                               
uses," which  means that the  board must  [adopt] a Tier  II use.                                                               
He  recalled that  since  he has  served on  the  board this  has                                                               
happened once, in Nome.                                                                                                         
11:31:34 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE  EASTMAN referred  to the  last slide,  [slide 17]                                                               
and asked what it takes to reallocate a harvest to personal use.                                                                
MR.  JENSEN  said  that  happens   whenever  the  board  makes  a                                                               
regulation or when  ADF&G opens or closes a  fishery by emergency                                                               
order  (EO).   He explained  that generally  individuals who  are                                                               
eligible  for  a sport  fishing  license  are also  eligible  for                                                               
personal  use and  subsistence  in  Alaska.   He  did not  recall                                                               
specifically  taking  that action,  to  reallocate  a harvest  to                                                               
personal use.                                                                                                                   
11:32:45 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  asked what the biggest  "roadblock" would                                                               
be if  the board were to  go through the process  to reallocate a                                                               
harvest  to  personal  use; for  example,  would  the  department                                                               
recommend not doing it or would  it be more likely that the board                                                               
would decide not to do so.                                                                                                      
MR. JENSEN answered  that the department would  probably weigh in                                                               
on it,  although, typically  the department  has "no  opinion" on                                                               
allocation issues;  thus, the board  would decide.   He explained                                                               
that  it essentially  means  taking the  resource  from one  user                                                               
group and  giving it to another  user group, which is  the reason                                                               
the board developed the eight allocation criteria.                                                                              
11:33:49 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR STUTES  asked for a  definition of subsistence use  and how                                                               
it differs from personal use.                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN answered  that he  did not  think it  was defined  in                                                               
Alaska  unless the  board has  decided on  a Tier  II subsistence                                                               
allocation.   He explained  that residents  are treated  the same                                                               
unless  they live  in a  non-subsistence  area like  Juneau.   In                                                               
those  instances,  residents  must   go  outside  their  area  to                                                               
participate in subsistence fishing.                                                                                             
CHAIR STUTES  further asked whether those  residents are eligible                                                               
for personal use fishing.                                                                                                       
MR. JENSEN answered yes.  In  further response, he agreed that it                                                               
depends  on the  location;  for example,  Juneau, Ketchikan,  and                                                               
Cook Inlet are  non-subsistence areas.  Residents  in those areas                                                               
can still  engage in  personal use fishing;  however, he  was not                                                               
clear on the specifics.                                                                                                         
11:34:50 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR  STUTES asked  for  a comparison  between  fish limits  for                                                               
personal use as compared to subsistence limits.                                                                                 
MR. JENSEN  answered that subsistence fishing  requires a permit;                                                               
for  example, if  individuals  want to  subsistence  fish on  the                                                               
Kenai River, they  would apply for a subsistence  or personal use                                                               
permit, that the limit by permit  is 50 salmon per household.  In                                                               
further response,  he offered  his belief  that the  permit would                                                               
fall under personal use.                                                                                                        
11:35:38 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE  CHENAULT offered  clarification  on personal  use                                                               
fisheries for the Kenai and  Kasilof rivers.  Currently in Kenai,                                                               
a household  is allowed 25 salmon  for personal use.   He further                                                               
stated  that the  head  of household  is allowed  a  limit of  25                                                               
[sockeye] salmon and  each additional family member  is allowed a                                                               
limit of  10 [sockeye] salmon.   Further, this  year participants                                                               
can keep a  king salmon.  In  years in which the  king salmon run                                                               
is weak,  [personal use permit  holders] are not allowed  to keep                                                               
king salmon  and must release any  they catch.  In  addition, the                                                               
personal  use permit  allows a  certain number  other species  of                                                               
fish, such as flounder.                                                                                                         
11:36:41 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR STUTES recalled that a  bill was introduced for legislative                                                               
consideration that would have  prioritized personal use fisheries                                                               
over any  other fisheries, including  subsistence.   She wondered                                                               
if  that would  have been  based on  the individual's  geographic                                                               
MR.  JENSEN responded  that it  could be  so.   He recalled  that                                                               
Southeast  Alaska  has limits  for  black  cod for  personal  use                                                               
fishing,  including  limits  for  gear  and  for  family  members                                                               
participating  in  the  fishery.   In  fact,  in  Petersburg,  in                                                               
Southeast  Alaska, families  can  participate in  a personal  use                                                               
gillnet fishery  for [sockeye]  salmon with a  limit of  30 fish.                                                               
The participants fill  out permit cards to  inform the department                                                               
how many fish they caught in the personal use fishery, he said.                                                                 
11:37:52 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  asked how much information  the board has                                                               
when it  determines the  harvest allocation.   For  example, many                                                               
people  in   the  Matanuska-Susitna  area  (Mat-Su)   who  cannot                                                               
participate  locally in  personal  use fisheries  drive to  other                                                               
areas in Alaska to fish, he said.                                                                                               
MR.  JENSEN   answered  yes;  the   board  tries  to   take  into                                                               
consideration participants  from areas not eligible  for personal                                                               
use  fishing  who will  travel  to  fish  in other  personal  use                                                               
fisheries.  He pointed out  that the board recently increased the                                                               
gillnet sockeye allocation [for personal use] on the Taku River.                                                                
11:40:00 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN asked whether  the board has specific data                                                               
on  Mat-Su  residents  who travel  elsewhere  to  participate  in                                                               
personal use fisheries.                                                                                                         
MR. JENSEN  responded that  the board obtains  its data  from the                                                               
department.     Further,  the  board  listens   to  the  advisory                                                               
committees and  takes into  consideration information  from other                                                               
11:40:51 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN asked how specific  the data would be, for                                                               
example,  how many  people from  the Mat-Su  fish in  a different                                                               
MR. JENSEN  responded that information is  available; however, it                                                               
is likely data  from the prior two years.   The information would                                                               
include the area  the permittee fished in and the  number of fish                                                               
taken.   He  commented that  members of  the advisory  committees                                                               
also participate in the fisheries.                                                                                              
11:41:52 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE  CHENAULT  asked  whether  there  was  a  specific                                                               
figure  of salmon  allotted  for  personal use  on  the Kenai  or                                                               
Kasilof fisheries.  He said he  had not specifically heard that a                                                               
figure is  set aside  for personal use,  such as  designating 600                                                               
[sockeye] salmon for personal use fishing on the Kenai River.                                                                   
MR. JENSEN answered that the  personal use fisheries are based on                                                               
the amount  of time  allotted for the  opening.   He acknowledged                                                               
that it  is sometimes very difficult  to tell when the  fish will                                                               
be available [in the river].                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE CHENAULT  remarked that he wished  the board would                                                               
pass  something because  people get  upset.   He [joked]  that he                                                               
wished the board  could teach the fish to show  up late on Friday                                                               
and stay through  Sunday afternoon.  That way,  everyone would be                                                               
happy, he said.                                                                                                                 
11:43:26 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN  referred to slide  19, titled "Board  Regulations and                                                               
Policies" which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                
     Sustainable Salmon Fisheries Policy (5 AAC 39.222)                                                                         
      Escapement Goal Policy (5 AAC 39.223)                                                                                     
       Mixed Stock Salmon Fisheries (5 AAC 39.220 and #93-                                                                      
      Emerging Fisheries (5 AAC 39.210)                                                                                         
MR.  JENSEN  commented  that  the  sustainable  salmon  fisheries                                                               
policy under  5 AAC 39.222  is lengthy.   Although the  board has                                                               
considered  various proposals,  it has  been difficult  to change                                                               
the  policy.    He  pointed  out  that  the  mixed  stock  salmon                                                               
fisheries policy  basically sets  the policy to  determine "whose                                                               
fish  are  whose"  and  the  timing of  the  fisheries.    It  is                                                               
difficult to  manage fisheries to ensure  adequate escapement and                                                               
still provide  an opportunity  for all the  user groups  to catch                                                               
fish.   Turning  to the  bullet point  on emerging  fisheries, he                                                               
said that  a fishery  for market-type  squid in  Southeast Alaska                                                               
has been  developing but  it has  not yet  evolved.   Some issues                                                               
have arisen, for example, how  a winter net [seining] fishery for                                                               
squid might  also catch  king salmon and  affect the  king salmon                                                               
stocks, he said.                                                                                                                
11:45:51 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN reviewed  slide 20,  titled  "Procedures for  out-of-                                                               
cycle  actions"  which  read  as  follows  [original  punctuation                                                               
     Board of Fisheries Agenda Change Request Policy                                                                          
       (5 AAC 39.999)                                                                                                         
     Allows for out of cycle action for:                                                                                        
     1. Conservation purpose                                                                                                    
     2. Correct errors                                                                                                          
     3. Unforeseen effect                                                                                                       
     4. Not mostly allocative                                                                                                   
       (form available)                                                                                                         
     And for coordination with federal agencies, programs,                                                                      
     and laws                                                                                                                   
     Joint Board Emergency Petition Policy(5 AAC 96.625(f))                                                                   
     Allows for out of cycle action for:                                                                                        
     1. Unforeseen event that threatens resource                                                                                
    2.   Unforeseen    situation   that    would   preclude                                                                     
     biologically allowable resource harvest                                                                                    
     Subsistence Proposal Policy(5 AAC 96.615(a))                                                                             
     Allows for out of cycle action:                                                                                            
        1. For fish and game populations not previously                                                                         
     2. If expedited review required                                                                                            
         Category 2 measures in BS/AI King/Tanner crab                                                                        
     fishery(5 AAC 39.998)                                                                                                    
     Allows for out of cycle action:                                                                                            
       1. For achieving consistency with federal Fishery                                                                        
     Management Plan                                                                                                            
11:46:51 AM                                                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN referred to slide 21, titled "Getting Involved" which                                                                
read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                
     1) Get on Boards mailing list                                                                                              
     2) Submit written comments on proposals                                                                                    
     3) Submit own proposal                                                                                                     
     4) Attend Board meetings and present testimony                                                                             
     5) Join or attend local fish and game advisory                                                                             
     6) Join an industry or stakeholder group                                                                                   
MR. JENSEN  urged people to  participate and  said one way  is to                                                               
sign up  to be on  the board's mailing  list.  People  can submit                                                               
comments to  the board, and  comments submitted 15 days  prior to                                                               
the meeting  are considered on-time comments;  comments submitted                                                               
during  the meeting  are  considered record  comments  (RC).   He                                                               
remarked that the board set a  record by having over 400 comments                                                               
submitted at its Southeast Alaska meeting.                                                                                      
11:47:59 AM                                                                                                                   
MR.  JENSEN referred  to slide  22, titled  "Things to  Remember"                                                               
which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                          
      Be respectful of the people and process                                                                                   
      Facts to support opinions and new information                                                                             
      Be objective                                                                                                              
      Avoid adversarial debate                                                                                                  
MR. JENSEN referred  to slide 23, titled "Summary"  which read as                                                               
follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                        
      Structured process                                                                                                        
      Credibility critical                                                                                                      
      High level of public participation                                                                                        
MR. JENSEN offered that public participation was the key                                                                        
element of the board process.                                                                                                   
11:48:23 AM                                                                                                                   
CHAIR  STUTES remarked  that she  admires  board members  because                                                               
this is a voluntary board.  She  asked how many days per year Mr.                                                               
Jensen spends on board matters.                                                                                                 
MR.  JENSEN  answered  he  spends  365 days  per  year  on  board                                                               
CHAIR STUTES acknowledged the significant amount of time members                                                                
must dedicate to the board.  She expressed her gratitude to                                                                     
board members for their service.                                                                                                
11:49:10 AM                                                                                                                   
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS asked to echo that comment.  He                                                                   
thanked Mr. Jensen for his service as board chair.                                                                              
CHAIR STUTES thanked Mr. Jensen for his presentation.                                                                           
MR. JENSEN offered to assist the committee in the event a matter                                                                
11:50:15 AM                                                                                                                   
There being no further business before the committee, the House                                                                 
Special Committee on Fisheries meeting was adjourned at 11:50                                                                   

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
Board of Fisheries Presentation by John Jensen.pdf HFSH 2/1/2018 11:00:00 AM
Board of Fisheries