Legislature(1995 - 1996)
02/13/1996 10:40 AM House FIN
| Audio | Topic |
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE
FEBRUARY 13, 1996
10:40 A.M.
TAPE HFC 96 - 33, Side 1, #000 - end.
TAPE HFC 96 - 33, Side 2, #000 - #406.
CALL TO ORDER
Co-Chair Mark Hanley called the House Finance Committee
meeting to order at 10:40 A.M.
PRESENT
Co-Chair Hanley Representative Martin
Representative Mulder Representative Therriault
Representative Kelly Representative Navarre
Representative Grussendorf Representative Parnell
Representative Kelly
Representatives Kohring, Foster and Brown were not present
for the meeting.
ALSO PRESENT
Representative Jerry Sanders; Del Smith, Deputy
Commissioner, Department of Public Safety; Anne Carpeneti,
Assistant Attorney General, Criminal Division, Department of
Law; Jerry Luckhaupt, Attorney, Legislative Legal Counsel,
Legislative Legal Services; Mick Manns, (Testified via
teleconference), Alaska Miners Association, Fairbanks; John
Newell, (Testified via teleconference), Alaska Association
of the Chiefs of Police, Sitka; Sgt. Mike Corkhill,
(Testified via teleconference), President, Alaska Peace
Officers Association, Fairbanks.
SUMMARY
HB 75 An Act relating to criminal mischief.
HB 75 was HELD in Committee for further
consideration.
HOUSE BILL 75
"An Act relating to criminal mischief."
REPRESENTATIVE JERRY SANDERS explained that HB 75 would
label those who take cars belonging to others as "thieves",
not joy riders or pranksters. The legislation would
increase the penalty for the crime of vehicle theft to a
1
class C Felony with one minor exception (first offense snow
machines).
He noted that the bill would provide a strong deterrent for
those who might otherwise commit vehicle theft. Currently,
those caught "joy riding" can only be convicted of a Class A
Misdemeanor. He thought that current law provides no
deterrent for the car thief unless they cause $500 dollars
damage or it is their second offense.
Representative Sanders noted that by increasing the crime of
"joy riding" to a felony, HB 75 would provide a strong
deterrent, necessary to prevent youth from participating in
vehicle theft, and providing the justice system tools to
make youths responsible for their actions.
Representative Martin asked why the Governor had previously
vetoed the legislation. Representative Sanders responded
that the Governor understood that the legislation would
bring minors automatically into the district court. The
current proposed legislation would continue to make the
offense a felony, but would leave it in the juvenile court
system. He thought that compromise would make it
acceptable.
Representative Parnell asked the policy reason for leaving
them in juvenile court. Representative Sanders advised that
juveniles could be prosecuted in the district court with a
waiver. He encouraged first time offenders be handled with
discretion.
Representative Grussendorf questioned the large fiscal
notes. Representative Navarre recalled that the fiscal
impact was a major consideration in the Governor's prior
veto.
DEL SMITH, DEPUTY COMMISSIONER, DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY,
spoke in support of HB 75. He stated that the theft of
automobiles should be a felony crime and should be treated
as a theft, not "joy riding".
MICK MANNS, (TESTIFIED VIA TELECONFERENCE), ALASKA MINERS
ASSOCIATION, FAIRBANKS, spoke in support of the legislation.
He remarked that his group would like to have snow machines
included. He stated that a felony conviction should be
upheld on all thefts regardless of the cost of the vehicle.
Representative Sanders advised that the language on Page 1,
Line 13, "propelled vehicle" would cover other vehicles
beside automobiles.
2
JOHN NEWELL, (TESTIFIED VIA TELECONFERENCE), ALASKA
ASSOCIATION OF THE CHIEF'S OF POLICE, SITKA, concurred with
the previous testimony and felt that stealing automobiles
and propelled vehicles should be considered a serious theft.
He supported the Class C Felony charge. Mr. Newell spoke to
the fiscal note, stating that the Department of Corrections
note was unrealistic and suggested that Department should
have mechanisms to handle those changes.
Representative Navarre responded that departments which
would be fiscally impacted by passage of the legislation,
recognized that situation and provided a fiscal note to
reflect the impact. At this time, all correctional
facilities are over capacity resulting in day fines.
Representative Navarre pointed out that it was an over
simplification to state that costs could be "absorbed" into
that system. Representative Mulder countered that the
Department of Corrections fiscal note encumbered the entire
direct and indirect costs and that it should be rewritten to
more accurately reflect the true cost.
SGT. MIKE CORKHILL, (TESTIFIED VIA TELECONFERENCE),
PRESIDENT, ALASKA PEACE OFFICERS ASSOCIATION, FAIRBANKS,
spoke in support of the legislation, reiterating that a
person makes two major investments in their life, a house
and a vehicle. The trend in automobile theft should be
treated as a major offense.
Representative Parnell questioned the percentage of adults
who have stolen a vehicle and hence used that vehicle in
another crime. Sgt. Corkhill responded that number would
change from area to area. In Fairbanks, this would not
occur as much as it would in Anchorage because it is a
smaller community, without as much anonymity. He added that
there is a trend for juveniles to steal vehicles, taking
them into another community to sell. Sgt. Corkhill stated
that approximately 10% - 20% of the stolen vehicles would be
used in another crime.
ANNE CARPENETI, ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL, CRIMINAL
DIVISION, DEPARTMENT OF LAW, noted that the Department of
Law supports HB 75 and agrees that it would be appropriate
to raise the penalty to a "C" felony for the theft of an
automobile.
Ms. Carpeneti advised that the legislation would treat
juveniles who steal cars in the same manner as the law
treats juveniles who have stolen other property. The
"waiver" would be to the Superior Court, not to the District
Court. If the vehicle sustained $500 dollars or more
damage, and if it was a second offense or if it were an
emergency or police vehicle, the fine would then be a "C"
3
felony.
In response to Representative Therriault's question, Ms.
Carpeneti noted that the legislation would not deal with big
equipment. She added, that historically, theft was
explained by the need to show the intent to permanently
deprive that person of the property which was taken. "Joy
riding" was thought of more lightly, not causing harm to the
victim.
Representative Parnell referenced the Department of Law's
fiscal note, pointing out the increase of felons from 100 to
363 in the past year. He asked the number of cases
prosecuted which involve a previous felony charge. Ms.
Carpeneti offered to provide that information.
JERRY LUCKHAUPT, ATTORNEY, LEGISLATIVE LEGAL COUNSEL,
LEGISLATIVE LEGAL SERVICES, voiced concern with the current
language of the bill and the definitions within. The bill
is not achieving its full purpose. He stated that
Legislative Legal Services recommends language clarifying
that the theft of a vehicle would be a felony and then
stipulating specific exceptions. Mr. Luckhaupt added, using
the definition "commercial motor vehicle" excludes motor
homes, recreational vehicles and farm vehicles.
Ms. Carpeneti replied, the vehicle theft bill was drafted in
response to automobile theft. The Governor's version of the
bill wanted to carefully include specific vehicles as
defined as motor vehicles. She agreed that there may be
room for improvement with written language to indicate the
exclusion of certain other vehicles. The intent of the
Department was to clearly define automobiles.
Representative Sanders agreed to tighten the bill up in
order that it may smoothly move through both bodies of the
Legislature. Representative Parnell asked if it was
Representative Sanders intent to include snowmobiles and all
terrain vehicles in the legislation. Representative Sanders
noted that it was his intent to include those vehicles. Co-
Chair Hanley pointed out that is a source of the confusion,
as the current legislation excludes those concerns. Ms.
Carpeneti pointed out that the way the current legislation
is drafted, first offense theft of a snow machine would be a
class "A" misdemeanor unless there is $500 dollars or more
damage to the snow machine. She noted that snow machines
would include all-terrain vehicles, thus avoiding adverse
effects in the Bush areas.
Mr. Luckhaupt reiterated that the definitions are not clear
in representing the bills intent.
4
(Tape Change, HFC 95 - 33, Side 2).
Discussion followed among Committee members and Mr.
Luckhaupt in how to prepare the wording of the legislation
to include all the combined intentions. Mr. Luckhaupt
suggested that certain items be excluded.
Co-Chair Hanley requested a chart defining the types of
distinction between propelled vehicles and motor vehicles.
Representative Martin asked to go with the broadest
interpretation possible of "stealing" a vehicle. Co-Chair
Hanley countered that a "go cart" worth $150 dollars should
not be prosecuted the same as other felonies.
Representative Sanders noted that his original intent was to
keep the bill as "broad" as possible, although, if the
broadness would negate the bill, he would then support
narrowing it. Co-Chair Hanley recommended that Ms.
Carpeneti and Mr. Luckhaupt rewrite the legislation to more
clearly specify the language "motor vehicle". He asked
additional clarification of what the current fiscal notes
include.
HB 75 was HELD in Committee for further discussion.
ADJOURNMENT
The meeting adjourned at 11:50 A.M.
HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE
FEBRUARY 13, 1996
10:40 A.M.
TAPE HFC 96 - 33, Side 1, #000 - end.
TAPE HFC 96 - 33, Side 2, #000 - #406.
CALL TO ORDER
Co-Chair Mark Hanley called the House Finance Committee
meeting to order at 10:40 A.M.
PRESENT
Co-Chair Hanley Representative Martin
Representative Mulder Representative Therriault
Representative Kelly Representative Navarre
Representative Grussendorf Representative Parnell
Representative Kelly
Representatives Kohring, Foster and Brown were not present
for the meeting.
ALSO PRESENT
5
Representative Jerry Sanders; Del Smith, Deputy
Commissioner, Department of Public Safety; Anne Carpeneti,
Assistant Attorney General, Criminal Division, Department of
Law; Jerry Luckhaupt, Attorney, Legislative Legal Counsel,
Legislative Legal Services; Mick Manns, (Testified via
teleconference), Alaska Miners Association, Fairbanks; John
Newell, (Testified via teleconference), Alaska Association
of the Chiefs of Police, Sitka; Sgt. Mike Corkhill,
(Testified via teleconference), President, Alaska Peace
Officers Association, Fairbanks.
SUMMARY
HB 75 An Act relating to criminal mischief.
HB 75 was HELD in Committee for further
consideration.
HOUSE BILL 75
"An Act relating to criminal mischief."
REPRESENTATIVE JERRY SANDERS explained that HB 75 would
label those who take cars belonging to others as "thieves",
not joy riders or pranksters. The legislation would
increase the penalty for the crime of vehicle theft to a
class C Felony with one minor exception (first offense snow
machines).
He noted that the bill would provide a strong deterrent for
those who might otherwise commit vehicle theft. Currently,
those caught "joy riding" can only be convicted of a Class A
Misdemeanor. He thought that current law provides no
deterrent for the car thief unless they cause $500 dollars
damage or it is their second offense.
Representative Sanders noted that by increasing the crime of
"joy riding" to a felony, HB 75 would provide a strong
deterrent, necessary to prevent youth from participating in
vehicle theft, and providing the justice system tools to
make youths responsible for their actions.
Representative Martin asked why the Governor had previously
vetoed the legislation. Representative Sanders responded
that the Governor understood that the legislation would
bring minors automatically into the district court. The
current proposed legislation would continue to make the
offense a felony, but would leave it in the juvenile court
system. He thought that compromise would make it
acceptable.
6
Representative Parnell asked the policy reason for leaving
them in juvenile court. Representative Sanders advised that
juveniles could be prosecuted in the district court with a
waiver. He encouraged first time offenders be handled with
discretion.
Representative Grussendorf questioned the large fiscal
notes. Representative Navarre recalled that the fiscal
impact was a major consideration in the Governor's prior
veto.
DEL SMITH, DEPUTY COMMISSIONER, DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY,
spoke in support of HB 75. He stated that the theft of
automobiles should be a felony crime and should be treated
as a theft, not "joy riding".
MICK MANNS, (TESTIFIED VIA TELECONFERENCE), ALASKA MINERS
ASSOCIATION, FAIRBANKS, spoke in support of the legislation.
He remarked that his group would like to have snow machines
included. He stated that a felony conviction should be
upheld on all thefts regardless of the cost of the vehicle.
Representative Sanders advised that the language on Page 1,
Line 13, "propelled vehicle" would cover other vehicles
beside automobiles.
JOHN NEWELL, (TESTIFIED VIA TELECONFERENCE), ALASKA
ASSOCIATION OF THE CHIEF'S OF POLICE, SITKA, concurred with
the previous testimony and felt that stealing automobiles
and propelled vehicles should be considered a serious theft.
He supported the Class C Felony charge. Mr. Newell spoke to
the fiscal note, stating that the Department of Corrections
note was unrealistic and suggested that Department should
have mechanisms to handle those changes.
Representative Navarre responded that departments which
would be fiscally impacted by passage of the legislation,
recognized that situation and provided a fiscal note to
reflect the impact. At this time, all correctional
facilities are over capacity resulting in day fines.
Representative Navarre pointed out that it was an over
simplification to state that costs could be "absorbed" into
that system. Representative Mulder countered that the
Department of Corrections fiscal note encumbered the entire
direct and indirect costs and that it should be rewritten to
more accurately reflect the true cost.
SGT. MIKE CORKHILL, (TESTIFIED VIA TELECONFERENCE),
PRESIDENT, ALASKA PEACE OFFICERS ASSOCIATION, FAIRBANKS,
spoke in support of the legislation, reiterating that a
person makes two major investments in their life, a house
7
and a vehicle. The trend in automobile theft should be
treated as a major offense.
Representative Parnell questioned the percentage of adults
who have stolen a vehicle and hence used that vehicle in
another crime. Sgt. Corkhill responded that number would
change from area to area. In Fairbanks, this would not
occur as much as it would in Anchorage because it is a
smaller community, without as much anonymity. He added that
there is a trend for juveniles to steal vehicles, taking
them into another community to sell. Sgt. Corkhill stated
that approximately 10% - 20% of the stolen vehicles would be
used in another crime.
ANNE CARPENETI, ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL, CRIMINAL
DIVISION, DEPARTMENT OF LAW, noted that the Department of
Law supports HB 75 and agrees that it would be appropriate
to raise the penalty to a "C" felony for the theft of an
automobile.
Ms. Carpeneti advised that the legislation would treat
juveniles who steal cars in the same manner as the law
treats juveniles who have stolen other property. The
"waiver" would be to the Superior Court, not to the District
Court. If the vehicle sustained $500 dollars or more
damage, and if it was a second offense or if it were an
emergency or police vehicle, the fine would then be a "C"
felony.
In response to Representative Therriault's question, Ms.
Carpeneti noted that the legislation would not deal with big
equipment. She added, that historically, theft was
explained by the need to show the intent to permanently
deprive that person of the property which was taken. "Joy
riding" was thought of more lightly, not causing harm to the
victim.
Representative Parnell referenced the Department of Law's
fiscal note, pointing out the increase of felons from 100 to
363 in the past year. He asked the number of cases
prosecuted which involve a previous felony charge. Ms.
Carpeneti offered to provide that information.
JERRY LUCKHAUPT, ATTORNEY, LEGISLATIVE LEGAL COUNSEL,
LEGISLATIVE LEGAL SERVICES, voiced concern with the current
language of the bill and the definitions within. The bill
is not achieving its full purpose. He stated that
Legislative Legal Services recommends language clarifying
that the theft of a vehicle would be a felony and then
stipulating specific exceptions. Mr. Luckhaupt added, using
the definition "commercial motor vehicle" excludes motor
homes, recreational vehicles and farm vehicles.
8
Ms. Carpeneti replied, the vehicle theft bill was drafted in
response to automobile theft. The Governor's version of the
bill wanted to carefully include specific vehicles as
defined as motor vehicles. She agreed that there may be
room for improvement with written language to indicate the
exclusion of certain other vehicles. The intent of the
Department was to clearly define automobiles.
Representative Sanders agreed to tighten the bill up in
order that it may smoothly move through both bodies of the
Legislature. Representative Parnell asked if it was
Representative Sanders intent to include snowmobiles and all
terrain vehicles in the legislation. Representative Sanders
noted that it was his intent to include those vehicles. Co-
Chair Hanley pointed out that is a source of the confusion,
as the current legislation excludes those concerns. Ms.
Carpeneti pointed out the way the current legislation is
drafted, first offense theft of a snow machine would be a
class "A" misdemeanor unless there is $500 dollars or more
damage to the snow machine. She noted that snow machines
would include all-terrain vehicles, thus avoiding adverse
effects in the Bush areas.
Mr. Luckhaupt reiterated that the definitions are not clear
in representing the bills intent.
(Tape Change, HFC 95 - 33, Side 2).
Discussion followed among Committee members and Mr.
Luckhaupt in how to prepare the wording of the legislation
to include all the combined intentions. Mr. Luckhaupt
suggested that certain items be excluded.
Co-Chair Hanley requested a chart defining the types of
distinction between propelled vehicles and motor vehicles.
Representative Martin asked to go with the broadest
interpretation possible of "stealing" a vehicle. Co-Chair
Hanley countered that a "go cart" worth $150 dollars should
not be prosecuted the same as other felonies.
Representative Sanders noted that his original intent was to
keep the bill as "broad" as possible, although, if the
broadness would negate the bill, he would then support
narrowing it. Co-Chair Hanley recommended that Ms.
Carpeneti and Mr. Luckhaupt rewrite the legislation to more
clearly specify the language "motor vehicle". He asked
additional clarification of what the current fiscal notes
include.
HB 75 was HELD in Committee for further discussion.
9
ADJOURNMENT
The meeting adjourned at 11:50 A.M.
10
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