Legislature(2023 - 2024)BARNES 124
03/26/2024 08:00 AM House COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Presentation(s): Addressing Deaths in Department of Corrections Custody and Proposed Solutions | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE COMMUNITY AND REGIONAL AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE
March 26, 2024
8:02 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative CJ McCormick, Chair
Representative Kevin McCabe, Vice Chair
Representative Tom McKay
Representative Thomas Baker
Representative Justin Ruffridge
Representative Rebecca Himschoot
Representative Donna Mears
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
PRESENTATION(S): ADDRESSING DEATHS IN DEPARTMENT OF CORRECTIONS
CUSTODY AND PROPOSED SOLUTIONS
- SCHEDULED BUT NOT HEARD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
No previous action to record
WITNESS REGISTER
MEGAN WALLACE, Chief Counsel
Legislative Legal Services
Legislative Affairs Agency
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on the legality of
hearing the presentation on deaths in the Department of
Corrections.
ACTION NARRATIVE
8:02:46 AM
CHAIR MCCORMICK called the House Community and Regional Affairs
Standing Committee meeting to order at 8:02 a.m.
Representatives McKay, Baker, Ruffridge, Himschoot, Mears,
McCabe, McCormick were present at the call to order.
^PRESENTATION(S): Addressing Deaths in Department of
Corrections Custody and Proposed Solutions
PRESENTATION(S): Addressing Deaths in Department of Corrections
Custody and Proposed Solutions
8:02:46 AM
CHAIR MCCORMICK announced that the only order of business would
be a presentation on deaths in Alaska prisons by the American
Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) of Alaska.
8:03:40 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE stated that before proceeding with today's
agenda, he wanted to address a matter of concern regarding the
presentation and the invited testifiers. He said it had come to
his attention that the individuals present were actively
involved in an active death lawsuit against the State of Alaska,
and while it's the committee's job to deliberate various topics,
it's important to acknowledge that [the legislature] is not a
judicial body or court of law. He asserted that today's
presentation pertain directly to facts alleged in ongoing
lawsuits. The 2015 report appears to be an exhibit to the
complaint in James Rider v. State of Alaska, which the ACLU is a
party to. He added that Mason's Manual of Legislative Procedure
("Mason's") rule 111 regarding reference to questions before the
court clearly advises that any matter awaiting adjudication
should not be debated or discussed in the legislative body. He
opined that participating in any conversation about this subject
might unintentionally make [members] witnesses to the ongoing
proceedings. Given the legal implications, he objected to
proceeding on this matter until the legal proceedings are
resolved.
8:04:54 AM
The committee took an at-ease from 8:04 a.m. to 8:18 a.m.
8:18:35 AM
CHAIR MCCORMICK said although he appreciated the remarks by
Representative McCabe, the committee would proceed with the
presentation as scheduled.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE maintained his objection.
8:19:27 AM
REPRESENTATIVE RUFFRIDGE requested that Legislative Legal
Services be made available so that he could make an informed
decision before voting on the matter and ask questions about the
legal memorandum ("memo"), dated 3/25/24 [hard copy included in
the committee packet], referenced by Representative McCabe.
8:20:10 AM
The committee took an at-ease from 8:20 a.m. to 8:22 a.m.
8:22:27 AM
CHAIR MCCORMICK noted that the committee had been joined by
Megan Wallace, Legislative Legal Services.
REPRESENTATIVE RUFFRIDGE highlighted the 2015 Department of
Corrections (DOC) report that was referenced in the legal memo.
He asked whether Mason's Manual addresses public documents that
are listed as an exhibit in a lawsuit and questioned whether
such documents can be discussed in committee.
8:23:29 AM
MEGAN WALLACE, Legislative Legal Services, Legislative Affairs
Agency (LAA), stated that the procedural restriction in Mason's
advises the legislature to refrain from debating or discussing
something that's awaiting active adjudication before a judicial
tribunal. She acknowledged that the 2015 DOC report is
available to the public, and that the litigation appears to
reference the report and use its recommendations as a basis for
arguments against the department's policies and procedures. The
question as to whether to delve into the report and its relation
to the pending litigation is at the discretion of the
legislature and the committee, she concluded.
8:25:13 AM
REPRESENTATIVE RUFFRIDGE said he was trying to differentiate
between discussing a public report versus discussing the details
of a specific case. He opined that [discussing the report]
would be appropriate since it is a publicly available document.
He asked whether discussing the specific lawsuit was at issue,
or whether it's discussing anything "in" the lawsuit [that's
problematic].
MS. WALLACE said Mason's guidance refers to any matter awaiting
adjudication; consequently, it depends on what's being
adjudicated in court. she reiterated that it was be the
committee's responsibility to ascertain whether the presentation
would discuss these issues or the practices of the State of
Alaska that may or may not be negligent or may have resulted in
liability, which she described as a "blurrier" area of
interpretation.
REPRESENTATIVE RUFFRIDGE pointed out that the lawsuit referenced
in the legal memo sought, in addition to compensatory damages, a
review of DOC, an audit of finances, a review of programming,
medical screening practices, suicide watch protocol, staffing
practices, and staffing shortages. He expressed concern that
the ACLU's presentation appeared to discuss many of the same
issues in the proposed solutions.
8:29:01 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE asked whether any questions asked by
committee members or testifiers in today's hearing could be used
in the court of law to support either side of the lawsuit.
MS. WALLACE answered yes, as any testimony or information shared
would be part of the public record that either party could
access. She noted that it would be up to the court to determine
whether anything discussed could be admitted as evidence.
8:30:11 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE asked whether the court could interpret a
committee member's comment as reflective of the entire
legislature.
MS. WALLACE opined that it would not be an accurate reflection
to say that "the legislature believes X, Y, and Z" based on [the
comments] of a singular committee. Nonetheless, she reiterated
that Mason's speaks to the risk of discussing matters that are
pending active adjudication in court.
8:31:33 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MCKAY recalled an example involving a dispute
between oil companies over road access on North Slope and asked
whether Ms. Wallace was familiar with that recollection.
MS. WALLACE answered no, she was not familiar with it.
REPRESENTATIVE MCKAY said he shared that example to illustrate
that the legislature's actions can be used in court.
8:33:14 AM
The committee took a brief at-ease at 8:33 a.m.
8:34:46 AM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Himschoot, Mears,
and McCormick voted in favor of suspending Mason's Manual of
Legislative Procedure Rule 111 for the purpose of hearing the
ACLU's presentation. Representatives McKay, Baker, Ruffridge,
and McCabe voted against it. Therefore, rule 111 was not
suspended by a vote of 4-3.
8:35:24 AM
The committee took a brief at-ease at 8:35 a.m.
8:35:34 AM
CHAIR MCCORMICK stated that he wanted to personally apologize to
the ACLU and to the individuals who had called in to testify.
In addition, he apologized on behalf of the Alaska State
Legislature for showing citizens how difficult it is to
illuminate the crisis of deaths in Alaska's correctional system.
He pointed out that he had not expected this from his vice chair
and apologized for failing Alaskans and allowing them to die in
custody.
8:36:20 AM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Community and Regional Affairs Standing Committee meeting was
adjourned at 8:36 a.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| HCRA ACLU Supporting Document 1 3.26.24.pdf |
HCRA 3/26/2024 8:00:00 AM |
|
| HCRA ACLU Supporting Document 2 3.26.24.pdf |
HCRA 3/26/2024 8:00:00 AM |
|
| HCRA ACLU Supporting Document 3 3.26.24.pdf |
HCRA 3/26/2024 8:00:00 AM |
|
| HCRA ACLU Presentation 3.26.24.pdf |
HCRA 3/26/2024 8:00:00 AM |
|
| HCRA Rep. McCabe Legal Memo 3.26.24.pdf |
HCRA 3/26/2024 8:00:00 AM |
|
| HCRA Supporting Document - AFN Resolution 3.26.24.pdf |
HCRA 3/26/2024 8:00:00 AM |