Legislature(2005 - 2006)BELTZ 211

03/30/2006 01:30 PM Senate LABOR & COMMERCE

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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
Including But Not Limited to:
Heard & Held
Moved SB 307 Out of Committee
Bill Postponed
Heard & Held
                    SB 272-MORTGAGE LENDING                                                                                 
CHAIR CON BUNDE announced SB 272 to be up for consideration.                                                                    
SENATOR RALPH SEEKINS moved to adopt  CSSB 272, version C, as the                                                               
working  document.  There  were  no  objections  and  it  was  so                                                               
AMY SEITZ, staff to Senator  Wagoner, sponsor of SB 272, reviewed                                                               
changes in  the CSSB  272, version  C, at  length. She  said that                                                               
page  1 had  a  new Section  1 that  added  mortgage lenders  and                                                               
mortgage  brokers into  the definition  of financial  institution                                                               
and  that licensing  requirement  language was  added  on page  2                                                               
clarifying that this  covered persons doing business  from out of                                                               
state.  Section  06.60.020.  Exemptions, exempts  a  person  from                                                               
getting  a  license for  six  or  fewer  loans every  12  months,                                                               
although  he  is   not  exempt  from  the   business  duties  and                                                               
restrictions  under   this  chapter.  Language  was   moved  from                                                               
subsection 3 into subsection 2  that subjects a person to general                                                               
supervision,  regulations and  examination.  References to  audit                                                               
were deleted in  both subsections. The word "kickback"  on page 3                                                               
in  subsection  7  was  deleted.  Subsections  10  and  11  under                                                               
exemptions  were  deleted, but  their  ideas  were put  into  new                                                               
Section  06.60.025  that  deals with  employees  and  independent                                                               
contractors and clarifies that even  though they are not required                                                               
to get  their own separate  licenses, they are still  required to                                                               
follow  the  rules under  this  chapter.  The licensee  would  be                                                               
responsible for any breaking of the rules.                                                                                      
MS. SEITZ  said on page  4 new  language was inserted  in Section                                                               
06.60.030  (6)   that  clarifies   what  other   information  the                                                               
department may  be requiring for  the application and  in Section                                                               
06.60.040. Investigation:  "license" was changed  to "application                                                               
fee". On page  5, Section 06.60.050, language was  changed to say                                                               
that persons  applying for a  dual license  didn't have to  pay a                                                               
dual  fee. Section  06.60.060. Bonding:  language was  changed in                                                               
subsection  (b) to  say that  either the  department or  a person                                                               
could  collect fees.  Section  06.60.070  (a) language  clarified                                                               
that  a complete  application,  the required  bond,  any fees  or                                                               
assessments  had  to  be  turned into  the  department  before  a                                                               
license  was  granted or  denied.  "Disapproved"  was changed  to                                                               
"deny an  applicant to license" in  subsection (b) on page  6 and                                                               
several places throughout the bill.                                                                                             
MS.  SEITZ  continued  saying  that  "approved"  was  changed  to                                                               
"granting"  in  Section 06.60.080  and  that  subsection (1)  now                                                               
included investigative costs  so the applicant would  have to pay                                                               
all  the required  fees and  the investigative  costs. Subsection                                                               
(2)  added  "or  other  principals"  to  the  list  of  what  the                                                               
financial  responsibility   would  be.  Subsection   (3)  changed                                                               
language from "disapprove" to "deny".  Also on page 6, in Section                                                               
06.60.090 "disapprove"  was changed to  "denial". On page  7, she                                                               
said the  language was changed  in Section 06.60.110 on  how long                                                               
the license would be in effect.                                                                                                 
2:41:10 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR BUNDE interrupted to ask if everyone had received the CS.                                                                 
MS. SEITZ replied that she had sent  a copy to everyone she had a                                                               
fax number for. She continued  saying that language was clarified                                                               
saying the  department could  not accept  a transfer  without the                                                               
provisions  in  subsection  (b)  of  Section  06.60.110.  Section                                                               
06.60.210  changed an  "application  fee" to  an "annual  license                                                               
fee"   because  the   license  is   being   discussed,  not   the                                                               
application. Section  06.60.240 conformed with  previous language                                                               
to include "control of licensee" in  the title. The change has to                                                               
be written  notice and 30 days  instead of 10 days.  This section                                                               
also has a new subsection (b).                                                                                                  
She  said  that  Section  06.60.250.  Records  of  licensee:  had                                                               
significant  changes  and  added  subsections  (b)  through  (e).                                                               
Section 06.60.260  (2) was rewritten  to read more  smoothly with                                                               
the  reference to  the statute  at the  beginning instead  of the                                                               
end. Section  06.60.270. Disqualified persons added  a member and                                                               
a sole proprietor to the list  of people who this paragraph deals                                                               
with. In  subsection (c) language  was changed from  "an officer,                                                               
director, or  other person"  to "a  person". Under  (1) -  what a                                                               
disqualified person means  - was changed to just  reference "if a                                                               
person is convicted  of" because the Department of  Law felt that                                                               
would cover  a better variety  of people than  previous language.                                                               
It also added a new subsection, (c).                                                                                            
MS.  SEITZ  continued  her  review saying  on  page  10,  Section                                                               
06.60.280 on  minimum net  worth had  inadvertently been  left in                                                               
and that was deleted completely.                                                                                                
2:45:05 PM at ease 2:45:47 PM                                                                                               
CHAIR BUNDE  announced that  he needed to  go to  another meeting                                                               
and he  would turned the  gavel to  Vice Chair Seekins  who would                                                               
continue  going  through the  new  CS,  but  because of  the  new                                                               
information, the bill would not move today.                                                                                     
MS. SEITZ continued her explanation of  the CS saying on page 12,                                                               
Section 06.60.340.  Revocation and  suspension of a  license: had                                                               
clarifying language  in the beginning  paragraph (A) and  (C). It                                                               
now   reads   "Investigation   and   examination."   instead   of                                                               
"Examination  of   licensee."  Subsection   (a)  also   had  some                                                               
clarifying language, although the content wasn't changed.                                                                       
Going to  page 13, Ms.  Seitz said,  subsection (b) was  added to                                                               
Section  06.60.350, the  false information  section. On  page 14,                                                               
Subsection   (6)  was   added  under   compliance  with   federal                                                               
requirements in Section 06.60.410  that states "any other federal                                                               
law  or  regulation"  to  cover everyone.  On  page  17,  Section                                                               
06.60.500.  Cease  and  desist   orders:  was  shortened  to  one                                                               
sentence. The  old Section 06.60.510 was  deleted and renumbered.                                                               
Section  06.60.520. Responsibility  of  licensee for  violations:                                                               
and Section  06.60.540. Civil penalty  for violations:  were new.                                                               
On  the  same  page  under  "additional  enforcement  provisions,                                                               
actions,  and   rights,"  subsection   (c)  was   added.  Section                                                               
06.60.600, Authorization  of program administration fee:  was new                                                               
and dealt with  which applications would apply  to the $10-dollar                                                               
application  fee;  the  old   Section  06.60.600  became  Section                                                               
06.60.610.   Section    06.60.700.   Application    to   Internet                                                               
activities: clarifies that this  chapter also applies to Internet                                                               
businesses. On page  22, new Section 4 added a  new subsection to                                                               
AS 45.50.481. She concluded saying those were all the changes.                                                                  
2:51:16 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SEEKINS said  he had a question about page  19 on Section                                                               
06.60.610 that said the department  can contract with an agent to                                                               
collect  a fee,  but it  appeared to  him (b)  said if  the agent                                                               
collects the  fee and  doesn't turn  them in,  the effect  is the                                                               
same as if they hadn't been collected.                                                                                          
2:52:23 PM                                                                                                                    
MARK  DAVIS, Division  of Banking  and Securities,  Department of                                                               
Commerce,  Community &  Economic  Development (DCCED),  explained                                                               
that the state  didn't want to be liable if  an agent didn't turn                                                               
in the  fees and  the sovereign  immunity of  the state  could be                                                               
used in this instance.                                                                                                          
SENATOR  SEEKINS   said  he  thought  it   violated  the  age-old                                                               
principal of  "I am responsible for  my agent." He said  he would                                                               
feel more comfortable having the state collect the fees, itself.                                                                
MR. DAVIS agreed with his  concern in a regular business context,                                                               
but explained  that this is the  same process used by  the Alaska                                                               
Department of Fish  and Game (ADF&G) that collects  fees by using                                                               
SENATOR SEEKINS  remarked that maybe  they would have to  go back                                                               
and fix that, too.                                                                                                              
MR.  DAVIS said  if  he  had a  complaint  that  someone was  not                                                               
collecting fees, the bill is  worded so that the department would                                                               
investigate that  complaint and then  it would move to  cease and                                                               
desist on the license immediately.                                                                                              
SENATOR SEEKINS asked if he had any other comments.                                                                             
MR. DAVIS replied first by thanking  all the staff who had worked                                                               
on the  legislation. He thought it  was the same bill  in spirit,                                                               
but  now it  was tightened  up.  He said  it still  allows for  a                                                               
variety  of  mortgage companies  and  supports  the inclusion  of                                                               
mortgage companies  as financial  institutions, to make  sure all                                                               
the banking authority  that his division has could  be applied if                                                               
necessary to these companies. Because  Alaska has never regulated                                                               
mortgage companies, there would be a  bit of a learning curve, as                                                               
it had with payday lending last  year. He said that Alaska is the                                                               
last  state to  not have  any regulation  and this  gives it  the                                                               
ability  to   enforce  federal  law,   a  positive   aspect.  The                                                               
exemptions  are  there because  of  federal  law and  regulation.                                                               
However, if he found a  violation from an exempt institution that                                                               
was supervised by  the office that controlled  the currency, once                                                               
the bill  passes, he  would be  able to make  a complaint  to the                                                               
Office of the Comptroller of the  Currency (OCC) and right now he                                                               
does not have that authority.                                                                                                   
SENATOR SEEKINS asked if he didn't  have the ability to forward a                                                               
complaint now.                                                                                                                  
MR. DAVIS  replied that he  routinely forwards complaints  to the                                                               
OCC, but  he couldn't say someone  was in violation of  any state                                                               
law. The Government Accountability  Office (GAO) this week issued                                                               
a  report   saying  the  OCC   consumer  complaint   process  was                                                               
improving,  but more  was  needed.  The GAO  wanted  to see  more                                                               
cooperation between  the OCC and  state banks  and commissioners;                                                               
he was assuming that would occur and this bill would help.                                                                      
2:57:15 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SEEKINS said  he heard that Mr. Davis  received around 20                                                               
complaints a  year on mortgage lending  and he asked if  that was                                                               
MR.  DAVIS replied  that the  numbers were  a little  larger than                                                               
that  and they  concerned  national  banks, independent  mortgage                                                               
companies and some state chartered institutions.                                                                                
SENATOR SEEKINS looked at Section  06.60.020. Exemptions: on page                                                               
2  and  asked  how  many  exceptions  had  been  the  subject  of                                                               
MR.  DAVIS  said he  couldn't  really  guess,  but he  thought  a                                                               
substantial portion had complaints. He  was not trying to endorse                                                               
the exemptions.  He explained  that he  and the  Attorney General                                                               
signed  the amicus  briefs opposing  the OCC  regulations in  the                                                               
Wachovia Connecticut case, but that lost in court.                                                                              
SENATOR SEEKINS said  he was worried about how  many people would                                                               
slip through the loopholes in this bill.                                                                                        
MR.  DAVIS  added  that  his   division  has  a  lack  of  direct                                                               
supervision  over  a national  bank  that  would run  a  mortgage                                                               
company as  a subsidiary or  is an  affiliate of a  national bank                                                               
holding  company. However,  once  the  bill is  in  place, if  he                                                               
received a legitimate complaint against  such an entity, he could                                                               
say it violates this law and that could be forwarded to the OCC.                                                                
SENATOR  SEEKINS  said he  looked  back  to 2004  when  Household                                                               
Finance  settled with  48 different  state attorneys  general for                                                               
close  to  $500 million  and  in  January 2006,  when  Ameriquest                                                               
settled  with  49  state  attorneys   general  for  around  $3.25                                                               
MR. DAVIS  added that  he participated  in that  last settlement,                                                               
but  it was  difficult  because Alaska  doesn't  have a  mortgage                                                               
SENATOR  SEEKINS asked  if Alaska  participated in  the Household                                                               
Finance lawsuit.                                                                                                                
MR. DAVIS replied that he didn't know.                                                                                          
SENATOR  SEEKINS  asked  if   these  companies  have  independent                                                               
contractors working with them.                                                                                                  
MR.  DAVIS   replied  that  some   companies  operate   by  using                                                               
independent contractors;  a change he  was pleased to see  in the                                                               
imputed liability section  declares that once you  are a licensee                                                               
subject to this bill, you  are talking about contractor licensing                                                               
on  page  4  and  you  would  agree  to  have  that  employer  or                                                               
contractor accept liability for his  actions much in the same way                                                               
that a  lawyer is responsible for  the actions of a  paralegal in                                                               
his or her office.                                                                                                              
SENATOR  SEEKINS asked  if  those  independent contractors  could                                                               
slip through the exemption statute.                                                                                             
MR.  DAVIS replied  that he  didn't  think they  would, but  that                                                               
might be litigated.                                                                                                             
SENATOR SEEKINS thanked  him for his testimony and  said he would                                                               
hear further testimony from offnet.                                                                                             
3:01:42 PM                                                                                                                    
KEVIN  BREELAND, President,  Alaska Mortgage  Bankers Association                                                               
(AMBA), said he is a  minority partner in Residential Mortgage in                                                               
Anchorage. He  said AMBA supported SB  272, but he noted  that he                                                               
was  not working  from the  CS and  AMBA had  expressed the  same                                                               
concerns regarding the exceptions. The  bill was not perfect, but                                                               
it was a good start.                                                                                                            
3:04:00 PM                                                                                                                    
JOHN  CARMAN,  Chair,   Legislative  Committee,  Alaska  Mortgage                                                               
Bankers  Association, said  he is  also a  partner in  Home State                                                               
Mortgage. He  believed that this  bill was a very  positive first                                                               
step and  was very needed  in the mortgage industry.  He prepared                                                               
his first  mortgage loan in  Alaska in 1972  and he had  seen the                                                               
landscape change  dramatically from one  where 90 percent  of the                                                               
loans were  done by regulated  banks to  one where 90  percent of                                                               
the loans are prepared by unregulated entities.                                                                                 
He also pointed out that Alaska  now has no mortgage statute. The                                                               
strongest point of  this bill is having  some enforcement agency,                                                               
in  this  case  the  Division  of Banking,  that  will  have  the                                                               
authority to  look at lenders where  90 percent of the  loans are                                                               
done. His  biggest fear for the  bill is that it  will be delayed                                                               
and it was needed years ago, not years from now.                                                                                
3:07:20 PM                                                                                                                    
DOUG ISAACSON,  President, Gold Coast  Mortgage, said he  is also                                                               
President  of the  Alaska Association  of  Mortgage Brokers,  and                                                               
that he  appreciated the amount  of work  that had gone  into the                                                               
rewriting  of this  bill,  but  he still  has  issues. He  shared                                                               
exemption concerns  with the chair  and Mr. Breeland.  He thought                                                               
some had identified this bill as  a positive first step, but that                                                               
was misleading  if it  wasn't done  right. As  the last  state to                                                               
take up licensing, Alaska has plenty  of models to look at to see                                                               
how they  have performed in other  states. If the statute  is not                                                               
done  right the  first  time,  he was  concerned  that the  small                                                               
brokers  would  be put  out  of  business  because of  the  costs                                                               
incurred in the  bill. For instance, a small  broker like himself                                                               
who closes  under 10 loans  a month still  must pay the  cost for                                                               
the division  to come to an  outlying area such as  Fairbanks and                                                               
that can become very expensive.                                                                                                 
He  also took  exception with  the idea  that 90  percent of  the                                                               
loans  are done  by unregulated  agencies. In  the Lower  48, his                                                               
information states that it's only  70 percent, but in Alaska, the                                                               
number is reversed and "It's  the regulated agencies that do most                                                               
of  the  loans in  Alaska."  They  need  to  make sure  there  is                                                               
opportunity for redress by the public.                                                                                          
MR. ISAACSON said the Alaska  Association of Mortgage Brokers has                                                               
been in favor  of reasonable licensing that  protects the public,                                                               
provides proper  oversight, and  enhances professionalism  of the                                                               
industry. However,  certain questions  still arise;  for example,                                                               
when a  small segment in Alaska  is penalized with a  $10-fee. In                                                               
Fairbanks  most loans  are closed  through financially  regulated                                                               
institutions  and they  would not  be charged  this fee,  but the                                                               
small broker  would be.  That difference could  be used  by other                                                               
realtors as a reason to not use his company.                                                                                    
MR. ISAACSON also  pointed out that government  loans do comprise                                                               
a bulk  of the mortgage process  and it has restrictions  on what                                                               
fees can  be paid for by  the buyer. He wondered  if there should                                                               
be  a discussion  with the  government  agencies to  see if  that                                                               
would even  be allowed.  If it's  not allowed,  he asked  if that                                                               
would remove  that loan option  from some borrowers  putting them                                                               
in  a discriminatory  situation  - contradicting  the purpose  of                                                               
this bill, which is to protect the public.                                                                                      
He  asked why  appraisers  are elevated  and  others, like  title                                                               
companies,  are   third  parties  or  why   home  inspectors  and                                                               
surveyors are disregarded and he  asked why the state is becoming                                                               
the  collecting agent.  He actually  suggested  deleting the  fee                                                               
collection section.                                                                                                             
MR. ISAACSON  also asked  what happens  if the  appraiser doesn't                                                               
provide a  competent report and a  new one has to  be ordered and                                                               
why  would  it   take  90  days  for  the  division   to  make  a                                                               
determination  if  a  background check,  including  FBI  records,                                                               
could be  made on the  Internet in 72  hours. He thought  30 days                                                               
was a more reasonable timeframe.                                                                                                
3:14:21 PM                                                                                                                    
One last  issue Mr.  Isaacson questioned  was what  authority the                                                               
state has to  monitor compliance with federal  regulations and if                                                               
it has the  authority, would it need more than  the projected two                                                               
to three  people the division is  saying it needs. Would  it have                                                               
to  supply  proper  training,   supervision  and  competency  for                                                               
monitoring the  federal requirements.  So, he was  concerned that                                                               
this bill was  not truly revenue neutral. He  concluded that this                                                               
bill  was  going  in  the  right  direction,  but  he  asked  the                                                               
committee to consider it along with his testimony.                                                                              
3:16:03 PM                                                                                                                    
LAURIE   HOLTE,   officer   of   Residential   Lending   Mortgage                                                               
Operations, Alaska Housing  Finance Corporation (AHFC), supported                                                               
the concept  of the proposed  legislation. She said that  AHFC is                                                               
not  a  direct source  of  residential  loans,  but it  offers  a                                                               
variety  of  loan programs  that  are  aimed at  increasing  home                                                               
ownership  primarily for  low-to-moderate income  individuals and                                                               
families. The  programs are made  available to  Alaskan residents                                                               
through 19 approved lenders statewide. She said:                                                                                
     Alaska is  the only remaining  state in the  Union that                                                                    
     does  not require  licensing  of  the mortgage  lending                                                                    
     community.  A  recent  review  of  the  deed  of  trust                                                                    
     recording  statistics indicate  that  not counting  the                                                                    
     many   recognized  lenders   that   do  operate   under                                                                    
     supervision,  regulation, or  examination  by state  or                                                                    
     federal  regulatory body  or agency,  over 125  lenders                                                                    
     representing  over $1.4  billion in  loan activity  for                                                                    
     calendar year  '05 are operating  in the  state without                                                                    
     supervision.   A   significant  number   are   Internet                                                                    
     lenders. The $1.4 billion  is considered substantial in                                                                    
     comparison    to    total   estimated    activity    of                                                                    
     approximately $4.4  billion. AHFC applauds  the efforts                                                                    
     of  the mortgage  lending community  in its  efforts to                                                                    
     provide  needed  protection  for  Alaska's  home-buying                                                                    
     public and  regulatory oversight of its  lenders. Thank                                                                    
     you very much; that ends my comments.                                                                                      
3:18:22 PM                                                                                                                    
BARBARA  WORLEY,  Director  of  Lending,  Anchorage  Neighborhood                                                               
Housing  Services  (ANHS),  said   it  is  a  private  non-profit                                                               
organization that  provides outreach services to  the underserved                                                               
public - to  people who most likely would not  be able to realize                                                               
home ownership without its assistance.  She said the trend is for                                                               
non-profits  to  be  highly   scrutinized  especially  under  the                                                               
Sarbanes-Oxley Act  that requires  better accounting  and control                                                               
for non-profits. Because of its  funding sources, ANHS is already                                                               
subject to monitoring  and audits by the  Department of Treasury,                                                               
HUD,  Alaska  Housing,  Neighbor  Works  America,  the  IRS,  the                                                               
Municipality of Anchorage,  and it is required to  have an annual                                                               
independent audit and single audits  on federal and state grants.                                                               
She felt that ANHS is  already regulated enough as its financials                                                               
are also open to public  scrutiny based on public funding sources                                                               
and certifications  it holds as  a non-profit. She  informed them                                                               
that ANHS is also sits on  the "Don't Borrow Trouble Alaska Anti-                                                               
Predatory  Lending  Campaign" board,  which  is  seeing a  steady                                                               
increase  in  complaints  about  out-of-state  and  a  few  local                                                               
MS. WORLEY  said she was  concerned about the  exemptions section                                                               
(b)  on  page 2  that  states  a  qualified individual  means  an                                                               
individual  whose income  is 60  percent  or less  of the  median                                                               
income in the United  State, who is over 60 years  of age, or who                                                               
has a disability. But she said  ANHS also serves Alaskans who are                                                               
more  than 60  percent up  to 115  percent of  the area's  median                                                               
income  and  Native  Corporations or  housing  authorities  serve                                                               
Native folks  who are  eligible to  receive their  Native housing                                                               
funds. She  was concerned about  that 60 percent. In  closing she                                                               
     I  am in  favor of  responsible legislation  that would                                                                    
     require mortgage licensing  without limiting the access                                                                    
     to affordable loan programs  to the underserved segment                                                                    
     of  the public  and feel  that we're  already regulated                                                                    
     and  by adding  an additional  layer of  regulation, it                                                                    
     would  cause less  services to  be  provided with  more                                                                    
     funding spent  on regulation and which  could result in                                                                    
     an additional barrier to affordable housing.                                                                               
3:24:07 PM                                                                                                                    
KEN   GAIN,  Secretary   Treasurer   and  Legislative   Chairman,                                                               
Independent Lenders of Alaska, said  he is also president of Cash                                                               
Now  Financial. He  said  he  has already  testified  and sent  a                                                               
lengthy letter to the committee  responding to some of the issues                                                               
raised. He  wanted to be  available for questions to  that letter                                                               
and to  make some  minor points. He  believed that  Doug Isaacson                                                               
was incorrect  in how  the $10 application  fee would  be applied                                                               
and said he  thought the fee would be charged  on all residential                                                               
loans whether or not the entity was licensed.                                                                                   
MR. GAIN  said in  his letter  of March  15 that  he was  a small                                                               
company  that had  experienced examinations  by the  division and                                                               
felt  if your  records are  in  reasonable order  and you're  not                                                               
committing fraud,  it doesn't take them  very long to do  one. He                                                               
calculated the  license fee,  bond, and  the loss  of one  or two                                                               
days per year  for an examination would cost about  $1,500 a year                                                               
and  he didn't  think  that was  excessive. He  said  no one  has                                                               
testified that  there shouldn't be  a bill.  This is a  good bill                                                               
and it is supported by several  of the organizations that will be                                                               
regulated  by  it,  as  well  as  the  Division  of  Banking  and                                                               
Securities that will  have to administer it.  People keep raising                                                               
questions, and  while they may  be well-meaning, it may  have the                                                               
effect  of delaying  the  bill so  there won't  be  any tools  to                                                               
address the problem for several years.                                                                                          
3:27:45 PM                                                                                                                    
JOHN MARTIN, Alaska  Mortgage Solutions, Anchorage, said  he is a                                                               
small  lender  and broker  and  was  a  member of  several  other                                                               
mortgage organizations.  He said he  just got the  recent changes                                                               
to the  bill and  he wanted  the chance to  review them  and come                                                               
back to the committee with his comments.                                                                                        
3:29:25 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SEEKINS thanked  him for his comments  and indicated that                                                               
there was no  further testimony and that SB 272  would be held in                                                               
committee. There  being no  further business  to come  before the                                                               
committee, he adjourned the meeting at 3:31:07 PM.                                                                            

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