Legislature(2023 - 2024)BARNES 124

03/21/2024 01:00 PM House TRANSPORTATION

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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Delayed to 15 Minutes Following Session --
+= HB 332 SALE OF ALASKA RAILROAD TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
*+ SB 141 NAMING RAYMOND & ESTHER CONQUEST BRIDGE TELECONFERENCED
<Bill Hearing Canceled>
-- Invited & Public Testimony --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= HB 386 OBSTRUCTION OF PUBLIC PLACES; TRESPASSING TELECONFERENCED
Moved HB 386 Out of Committee
**Streamed live on AKL.tv**
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
            HOUSE TRANSPORTATION STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                           
                         March 21, 2024                                                                                         
                           1:37 p.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Kevin McCabe, Chair                                                                                              
Representative Sarah Vance, Vice Chair                                                                                          
Representative Tom McKay                                                                                                        
Representative Craig Johnson                                                                                                    
Representative Jesse Sumner                                                                                                     
Representative Louise Stutes                                                                                                    
Representative Genevieve Mina                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 332                                                                                                              
"An Act relating to the sale of the Alaska Railroad; and                                                                        
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 386                                                                                                              
"An  Act relating  to the  obstruction of  airports and  runways;                                                               
relating to  the obstruction of highways;  establishing the crime                                                               
of obstruction of free passage  in public places; relating to the                                                               
obstruction  of   public  places;   relating  to  the   crime  of                                                               
trespassing;  relating to  the obstruction  of navigable  waters;                                                               
and providing for an effective date."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED HB 386 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE SUBSTITUTE FOR SENATE BILL NO. 141(TRA)                                                                               
"An Act naming the Raymond and Esther Conquest Bridge."                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     - BILL HEARING CANCELED                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 332                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: SALE OF ALASKA RAILROAD                                                                                            
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) SUMNER                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
02/20/24       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/20/24       (H)       TRA, FIN                                                                                               
03/07/24       (H)       TRA AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/07/24       (H)       <Bill Hearing Canceled>                                                                                
03/21/24       (H)       TRA AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 386                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: OBSTRUCTION OF PUBLIC PLACES; TRESPASSING                                                                          
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
02/21/24       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
02/21/24       (H)       TRA, JUD                                                                                               
03/12/24       (H)       TRA AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/12/24       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/12/24       (H)       MINUTE(TRA)                                                                                            
03/14/24       (H)       TRA AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/14/24       (H)       Scheduled but Not Heard                                                                                
03/19/24       (H)       TRA AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
03/19/24       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/19/24       (H)       MINUTE(TRA)                                                                                            
03/21/24       (H)       TRA AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JESSE SUMNER                                                                                                     
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  As prime sponsor, presented HB 332.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CLARK BICKFORD, Staff                                                                                                           
Representative Jesse Sumner                                                                                                     
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Gave the sectional analysis for HB 332, on                                                               
behalf of Representative Sumner, prime sponsor.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CLARK HOPP, Chief Operating Officer                                                                                             
Alaska Railroad Corporation                                                                                                     
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Answered questions during the hearing on HB
332.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:37:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  KEVIN  MCCABE  called the  House  Transportation  Standing                                                             
Committee meeting to  order at 1:37 p.m.   Representatives Vance,                                                               
McKay,  Sumner, Mina,  and McCabe  were  present at  the call  to                                                               
order.   Representatives  Stutes and  C. Johnson  arrived as  the                                                               
meeting was in progress.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
                 HB 332-SALE OF ALASKA RAILROAD                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:38:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE announced that the  first order of business would be                                                               
HOUSE BILL  NO. 332, "An Act  relating to the sale  of the Alaska                                                               
Railroad; and providing for an effective date."                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:39:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JESSE  SUMNER, Alaska State Legislature,  as prime                                                               
sponsor,  presented HB  332.   He  shared  the sponsor  statement                                                               
[included  in  the  committee  packet],  which  read  as  follows                                                               
[original punctuation provided]:                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     This  legislation represents  a critical  turning point                                                                    
     for  our  state,  unlocking  economic  potential  while                                                                    
     ensuring  protections for  the  interests of  Alaskans.                                                                    
     For  years,   the  Alaska   Railroad  has   served  our                                                                    
     communities,   but  it   has  not   reached  its   full                                                                    
     potential.   Operating  under   state  ownership,   the                                                                    
     railroad has faced limitations  in terms of investment,                                                                    
     innovation,   and   strategic  expansion.   This   bill                                                                    
     initiates  a careful,  responsible process  to transfer                                                                    
     the  Alaska Railroad  to a  private buyer  committed to                                                                    
     the railroad's success.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     This   legislation  protects   Alaska's  interests   in                                                                    
     several  ways.  The  potential   buyer  must  agree  to                                                                    
     operate the railroad  for at least 50  years and assume                                                                    
     existing  contracts,   providing  continuity   for  our                                                                    
     communities  and businesses.  The  purchase price  must                                                                    
     exceed  the  fair market  value  or  the state's  total                                                                    
     investment in the  railroad, ensuring taxpayers receive                                                                    
     a  fair return.  The legislature  retains the  ultimate                                                                    
     authority  to  approve  or  reject  a  sale  agreement,                                                                    
     safeguarding   public  interest.   By  establishing   a                                                                    
     resource  development  agreement, this  bill  positions                                                                    
     the Alaska Railroad to be  a key catalyst for unlocking                                                                    
     responsible, sustainable expansion  of our state's vast                                                                    
     resources.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Additionally, this  process will  streamline governance                                                                    
     and  inject much-needed  private sector  expertise into                                                                    
     the  railroad's  operations.  The bill  recognizes  the                                                                    
     potential   for  modernization,   expansion,  and   the                                                                    
     creation  of new  Alaskan jobs  through this  strategic                                                                    
     sale.  I  recognize  that  any  change  in  the  Alaska                                                                    
     Railroad's status  raises questions and  concerns. This                                                                    
     bill addresses  those with care, through  a transparent                                                                    
     process  focused   on  obtaining  the   best  long-term                                                                    
     outcome for our state. I  urge my colleagues to join me                                                                    
     in voting in favor of  this legislation, allowing us to                                                                    
     write  the  next  successful   chapter  in  the  Alaska                                                                    
     Railroad's history.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:41:29 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CLARK BICKFORD, Staff, Representative  Jesse Sumner, Alaska State                                                               
Legislature, on  behalf of Representative Sumner,  prime sponsor,                                                               
gave  the  sectional  analysis  for   HB  332  [included  in  the                                                               
committee packet],  which read  as follows  [original punctuation                                                               
provided]:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Sections  1-3. Amends  uncodified law  of the  State of                                                                  
     Alaska                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Section 1.                                                                                                               
     This section  mandates the sale of  the Alaska Railroad                                                                    
     by setting  strict timelines for the  governor to issue                                                                    
     a  request  for  proposals  and   enter  into  a  sales                                                                    
     agreement.  The buyer  of the  railroad must  commit to                                                                    
     continuing  operations  for  a  minimum  of  50  years,                                                                    
     assume all  existing contracts  of the  Alaska Railroad                                                                    
     Corporation, and pay a  purchase price exceeding either                                                                    
     the  fair market  value of  the railroad  or the  total                                                                    
     amount  the state  has invested  in  the railroad.  The                                                                    
     sale agreement is subject  to legislative approval, and                                                                    
     the Alaska Railroad Corporation  is restricted from any                                                                    
     actions  that  could   diminish  the  railroad's  value                                                                    
     before the sale. The state  shall retain an easement on                                                                    
     Alaska Railroad right-of-way  lands for transportation,                                                                    
     communication, and transmission  purposes. The governor                                                                    
     must  commission   a  fair  market  appraisal   of  the                                                                    
     railroad,  report on  both the  appraisal and  the sale                                                                    
     procedures to the legislature  and adopt regulations to                                                                    
     implement this  act. Upon completion  of the  sale, the                                                                    
     Alaska  Railroad  Corporation  will be  dissolved,  and                                                                    
     nonessential railroad  property will be  transferred to                                                                    
     the Department  of Natural Resources. The  sale process                                                                    
     is  exempt from  standard state  procurement codes  and                                                                    
     regulations governing the  Alaska Railroad Corporation.                                                                    
     Finally, the  sale of the  railroad is  contingent upon                                                                    
     the  execution  of  a resource  development  agreement,                                                                    
     which  is likely  outlined in  a subsequent  section of                                                                    
     the bill.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Section 2.                                                                                                               
     This section underscores  the strong connection between                                                                    
     the sale  of the Alaska  Railroad and the  state's goal                                                                    
     of  promoting  resource  development. It  requires  the                                                                    
     buyer of the  Alaska Railroad to enter  into a resource                                                                    
     development agreement  with the  state within  180 days                                                                    
     of  the  sale.  This  agreement  must  demonstrate  the                                                                    
     buyer's commitment to actively  invest in expanding and                                                                    
     improving  the railroad  to better  facilitate resource                                                                    
     development projects within the state.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     The agreement  must contain  key elements,  including a                                                                    
     state  pledge  to  allocate  a   portion  of  the  sale                                                                    
     proceeds  (subject  to legislative  appropriation)  for                                                                    
     railroad  modernization,  expansion,  and  maintenance,                                                                    
     specifically  including  new  rail lines  for  resource                                                                    
     access. The  buyer commits to  working with  the state,                                                                    
     local communities, and  other stakeholders to determine                                                                    
     strategic locations for  new railroad infrastructure to                                                                    
     support resource development.  The buyer will regularly                                                                    
     report to the state  and legislature on the agreement's                                                                    
     implementation,   including    construction   progress.                                                                    
     Finally,  the  agreement  must outline  a  process  for                                                                    
     resolving any potential disputes  between the state and                                                                    
     the  buyer.   Similar  to  the  sales   agreement,  the                                                                    
     resource  development  agreement  requires  legislative                                                                    
     approval.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Section 3.                                                                                                               
     This  section establishes  a  process  to identify  and                                                                    
     categorize all assets belonging  to the Alaska Railroad                                                                    
     Corporation.  The  governor  is tasked  with  compiling                                                                    
     this inventory,  which must include all  real property,                                                                    
     personal property, and  intangible assets. The governor                                                                    
     must  then determine  which assets  are  vital for  the                                                                    
     railroad's operation and  classify the remaining assets                                                                    
     separately.  This comprehensive  report is  due to  the                                                                    
     Legislative  Budget and  Audit Committee  by August  1,                                                                    
     2024.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Importantly,   the   Legislative   Budget   and   Audit                                                                    
     Committee  has the  authority to  recommend changes  to                                                                    
     the     governor's     asset     identification     and                                                                    
     classification.  This  likely  provides  an  additional                                                                    
     layer   of  oversight   and  scrutiny   to  the   asset                                                                    
     identification   process   in   preparation   for   the                                                                    
     railroad's sale.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Section 4.                                                                                                               
     Establishes that the Act will take place immediately.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:45:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE invited questions from committee members.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
1:46:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STUTES questioned the ultimate goal of the bill.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SUMNER  replied  that  the  actual  sale  of  the                                                               
railroad and the  direction it is headed  in resource development                                                               
should be up for  debate.  He indicated that the  bill was a good                                                               
way to initiate a discussion.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE added  that the railroad had not built  a single new                                                               
track since the 1980s.   He said the best transportation facility                                                               
in  the  state,  other  than the  Alaska  Marine  Highway  System                                                               
(AMHS), was the railroad, which has  not kept up with the state's                                                               
needs.  He opined that something  needed to be done, which starts                                                               
with  a  conversation, and  he  indicated  that  the bill  was  a                                                               
motivational bill.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STUTES  said she understood  that the bill  was an                                                               
"attention getter."                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:48:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA  shared that she  looked into the  history of                                                               
the Alaska Railroad  Corporation (ARRC) and that  after the sale,                                                               
it  took  two years  for  the  state to  buy  it  due to  various                                                               
economic concerns.   She asked  whether resource  development was                                                               
part of the statutory responsibility of ARRC.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SUMNER offered to follow up on the inquiry.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MINA  requested to  learn  more  about what  ARRC                                                               
isn't  doing currently,  potential  management  changes, and  its                                                               
lack of goals relating to resource development.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SUMNER  offered his  belief that  ARRC had  done a                                                               
decent job the past 40 years, but  there is much more that it can                                                               
do, and he reiterated that something else needed to be done.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA  asked whether anything in  statute prevented                                                               
ARRC from doing something.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SUMNER  answered no.  He  shared his understanding                                                               
that there  was a  process in  statute and  offered to  follow up                                                               
with the requested information.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
1:52:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE  explained that in statute  years ago, ARRC                                                               
was required every  five years to present a  request for proposal                                                               
(RFP), an  appraisal, and three  possible buyers.  He  added that                                                               
it had been reduced by the  legislature to a yearly report, which                                                               
was neglected  in past years and  for that reason, he  was unsure                                                               
what the  value was.   He believed that  the railroad was  not in                                                               
debt,  making  a cost  neutral  asset  that  was not  hurting  or                                                               
helping the state.   He acknowledged that there was  a history on                                                               
what ARRC was supposed to do in reference to looking for buyers.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:53:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   VANCE  said   she  appreciated   creativity  for                                                               
business  purposes and  to ignite  economic  stability.   Without                                                               
making it  available, there  was no way  to know  about potential                                                               
buyers.   She said  she was  in favor  of empowering  the private                                                               
sector,  adding that  government needed  to get  out of  the way.                                                               
She  referenced the  Kenai  Peninsula and  the  bonding deal  and                                                               
asked for the bill sponsor's  vision for not losing the important                                                               
relationship with the tourism industry.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SUMNER responded that he  did not want to lose the                                                               
profitable  aspect  of  tourism.   He  welcomed  additional  bill                                                               
language from committee members.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  VANCE   sought  to   understand  the   makeup  of                                                               
railroads  across  the  nation  and  how  they've  been  able  to                                                               
increase  economic  development.   She  asked  whether most  were                                                               
private companies dealing in contracts, or state corporations.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:57:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.   BICKFORD  offered   to  follow   up   with  the   requested                                                               
information.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   SUMNER  shared   his  belief   that  state-owned                                                               
corporations were not common.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:57:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE  offered his understanding that  Amtrak was                                                               
the only government-owned railroad in  the Lower 48, possibly the                                                               
only government-owned passenger railroad.   He shared an anecdote                                                               
about interested buyers, which, he believed, should be explored.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:58:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA asked  how the sale of ARRC  would impact the                                                               
long-term  goal  of  the  Alaska-Alberta   Railway  (A2A).    She                                                               
acknowledged  the longer-term  goal of  connecting Alaska  to the                                                               
Lower 48.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SUMNER  said  he   thought  that  was  a  nuanced                                                               
question, and he would look into it more.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:00:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA  reported that ARRC was  the only state-owned                                                               
railroad.  She asked what would happen to the land ARRC owns.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:01:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CLARK   HOPP,   Chief    Operating   Officer,   Alaska   Railroad                                                               
Corporation,  to  Representative Mina  stated  that  the loss  of                                                               
revenue  from   nonoperational  lands  would  be   a  concern  in                                                               
privatizing the railroad.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA said she was  trying to compare privatization                                                               
versus  state owned.   She  inquired  about the  benefits of  the                                                               
railroad being in coordination with the state.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. HOPP  provided historical context,  indicating that  the goal                                                               
was to  have a steady  source of income.   He declined  to answer                                                               
how a private company would operate in Alaska.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MINA  pointed out  that  many  union workers  are                                                               
employed by  the railroad, and  if there  were a sale,  she asked                                                               
what would happen with union contracts.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. HOPP responded  that it was hard to answer  that question, as                                                               
it is a long ways away.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:04:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SUMNER directed  attention  to Section  1 of  the                                                               
bill, indicating  that the contracts  would continue,  as opposed                                                               
to liquidating railroad employees.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:05:13 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE expressed concern about  the deep-draft port in Port                                                               
Mackenzie, Alaska,  which was  not connected by  rails.   He said                                                               
there  were highly  interested governments  and  many reasons  to                                                               
complete the rail  through Canada to the Lower 48,  such as clean                                                               
Alaska coal to the power plant  in North Dakota.  He acknowledged                                                               
that the dream was big   just like  the state.  He noted that the                                                               
Alaska  Constitution required  the development  of resources  for                                                               
maximum yield and sustainability, and  he stressed that it cannot                                                               
be done without transportation.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:07:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STUTES said  this was  a great  encouragement for                                                               
development  and commended  the  bill sponsor  for  the "wake  up                                                               
call" to ARRC and to the legislators.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:07:40 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE questioned  the opportunities for businesses                                                               
to partner  with the  railroad and  asked how  easy it  would be.                                                               
She indicated  that opportunities  were being  passed by  for far                                                               
too long and she asked what else could be done.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  MCCABE   said  many  entities   are  interested   in  Port                                                               
Mackenzie; however, they would not  be realized without the rail.                                                               
He said  once the railroad starts  to earn revenue, the  84 miles                                                               
of the northern rail extension and  the rail into Canada could be                                                               
furthered.   He said there are  many moving pieces that  need the                                                               
railroad to be on board.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:10:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCKAY commented that  considering the eight Arctic                                                               
nations, Russia had  the most development in the  Arctic.  Should                                                               
there  be advancement,  he  said  rail to  Prudhoe  Bay could  be                                                               
linked  to Chicago.    He  encouraged not  to  let  Russia get  a                                                               
foothold  and  commended  the  forward   thinking.    He  further                                                               
highlighted the importance of a strong foothold.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE  highlighted the significant  pressure on  roads and                                                               
concerns about the  impact by big trucks.  The  railroad could be                                                               
a  big  mitigating  factor,  he  said.   He  suggested  that  the                                                               
railroad could  be a solution  for hauling  gold.  He  added that                                                               
Alaska  was uniquely  situated to  help its  Indo-Pacific Allies.                                                               
Alaska has the largest antimony  deposit in the U.S., which could                                                               
be shipped  to allies,  he noted.   He said  resource development                                                               
creates new wealth and diversification.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:15:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STUTES asked  how much it costs to  build one mile                                                               
of railroad track.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE estimated $247 million  for 32 miles, which could be                                                               
highly inflated.   He said  that according to a  private company,                                                               
$400,000 per mile could be  done, whereas another estimate was $1                                                               
million per mile.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:16:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE announced that HB 332 was held over.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
        HB 386-OBSTRUCTION OF PUBLIC PLACES; TRESPASSING                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:17:00 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE announced that the  final order of business would be                                                               
HOUSE  BILL NO.  386,  "An  Act relating  to  the obstruction  of                                                               
airports and  runways; relating to  the obstruction  of highways;                                                               
establishing the crime  of obstruction of free  passage in public                                                               
places; relating  to the obstruction  of public  places; relating                                                               
to  the crime  of  trespassing; relating  to  the obstruction  of                                                               
navigable waters; and providing for an effective date."                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:17:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  VANCE  moved  to  report  HB 386  out  of  committee  with                                                               
individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA objected.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:17:52 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA spoke  to her objection.   She questioned the                                                               
role in  balancing community safety,  individual safety,  and the                                                               
right to  assembly.  She  said the  testimony that she  heard was                                                               
primarily in  opposition to the bill  due to its broad  nature in                                                               
relation  to  First Amendment  rights.    She  said she  was  not                                                               
confident  that the  bill  would lead  to  de-escalation and  she                                                               
reflected that it was too broad.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:20:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STUTES expressed  concern that  she did  not hear                                                               
one  single testimony  in favor  of the  bill, which  could be  a                                                               
solution  looking for  a  problem.   She  commented  on the  vast                                                               
nature of the proposed legislation.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:21:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  MCKAY highlighted  the  riots  from 2020,  noting                                                               
that  entire  cities and  blocks  were  destroyed.   He  said  he                                                               
believed that the legislation was  to ensure that nothing similar                                                               
happens in Alaska.  He spoke  against certain acts of protest and                                                               
stated that he supported the bill.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:23:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  C.  JOHNSON clarified  that  it  had happened  in                                                               
Alaska.   He  recalled a  group  that chained  themselves to  the                                                               
railroad to  prevent timber  sales in the  Tongass in  the 1970s.                                                               
He  expressed  concern that  Alaska  was  a "stand  your  ground"                                                               
state.   He  said he  would hate  to see  a shootout  between two                                                               
groups who were  both in the right.   He opined that  a bill like                                                               
this would make obstruction of commerce unacceptable in Alaska.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:26:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE pointed  out that it was already  a crime to                                                               
chain  oneself to  the  railroad.   One  cannot obstruct  someone                                                               
else's right  to freedom of movement,  she said.  She  pointed to                                                               
Section 2 which would criminalize  with a class 2 felony, similar                                                               
to  the religious  liberty bill  that was  recently passed.   She                                                               
said that  she viewed the bill  as a matter of  public safety and                                                               
opined  that it  would  not limit  the  constitutional rights  of                                                               
Alaskans.  She  agreed with the right to  peacefully assemble and                                                               
referenced her community of Homer.   She opined that the bill was                                                               
simple and straightforward  and aligned with other  areas of law.                                                               
She stated that she would help protect Alaskans.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:28:59 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  MCCABE stated  that  one man's  protest  is another  man's                                                               
vandalism.    He questioned  where  one  right ends  and  another                                                               
begins.   He shared  examples of  blocking fishermen  or blocking                                                               
ambulances.  He  added that the attorney general  viewed the bill                                                               
as a  preventative bill.  He  commented on the "protest  du jour"                                                               
and put forth consideration for the  rights of people who need to                                                               
get to work or pick their children up from school.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:31:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA  said she appreciated the  conversation.  She                                                               
agreed that there  was violence and destruction  of property, but                                                               
she believed  that there  were ways to  enforce the  violation of                                                               
property rights  in those  circumstances.   She responded  to the                                                               
scenario  in which  boats were  blocked from  fishing, suggesting                                                               
that it  does not happen.   She reiterated her concern  about the                                                               
broadness  of the  bill and  the importance  of protecting  First                                                               
Amendment  rights.    She  encouraged  committee  members  to  be                                                               
mindful  and   she  believed  that  most   protestors  would  let                                                               
emergency services through.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
2:34:29 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR MCCABE commented that if  the Glenn Highway was blocked off                                                               
during afternoon  traffic, one would  not know that there  was an                                                               
ambulance in  the back  of the traffic  line, and  the protestors                                                               
might not  know.  He  said the  ability to arrest  protestors and                                                               
move them  out of the  way could help,  and he stressed  the need                                                               
for more discussion.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MINA maintained her objection.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:35:58 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll call  vote was taken.  Representatives  C. Johnson, McKay,                                                               
Vance, Stutes, Sumner, and McCabe  voted in favor of reporting HB
386  from  committee.   Representative  Mina  voted  against  it.                                                               
Therefore, HB 386 was reported out of the House Transportation                                                                  
Standing Committee by a vote of 6-1.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:37:28 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no further business before the committee, the House                                                                 
Transportation Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:37                                                                 
p.m.                                                                                                                            

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB332 Ver A 3.13.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
HB 332
HB332 Ver A Sponsor Statement 3.13.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
HB 332
HB332 Ver A Sectional Analysis 3.13.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
HB 332
HB332 Ver A Fiscal Note DNR 3.13.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
HB 332
CSSB 141VerB 2.27.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
CSSB 141.VerB.Sponsor Statement.2.27.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
CSSB 141.VerB.Explanation of Changes.2-27-24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
CSSB141.VerB.SectionalAnalysis.2.27.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
CSSB141.verB.SupportingDocuments.JointResolution.2.27.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
CSSB141.verB.SupportingDocuments.Meeting Minutes.2.27.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
CSSB 141.VerB.Fiscal Note DOT.1.19.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
SB 141
HB332 Supporting Documents 3.20.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
HB 332
HB332 Opposing Documents 3.21.24.pdf HTRA 3/21/2024 1:00:00 PM
HB 332