Legislature(2017 - 2018)GRUENBERG 120

01/25/2018 01:30 PM House MILITARY & VETERANS' AFFAIRS

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Please Note Time Change --
*+ HJR 17 HMONG VETERANS MILITARY BURIAL RIGHTS TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
+= HB 178 NAMING PORTIONS OF VETERANS HIGHWAYS TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
          HJR 17-HMONG VETERANS MILITARY BURIAL RIGHTS                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:46:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR TUCK  announced that the  first order of business  would be                                                               
HOUSE  JOINT RESOLUTION  NO. 17,  Encouraging  the United  States                                                               
Congress to  pass legislation giving full  military burial rights                                                               
to Hmong veterans of the Vietnam War.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:47:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GERAN  TARR,   Alaska  State  Legislature,  prime                                                               
sponsor of  HJR 17, noted  HB 125 -  introduced and heard  by the                                                               
committee  last year  - also  addressed honoring  the service  of                                                               
Hmong veterans  who live in  Alaska.  She informed  the committee                                                               
during  the Vietnam  War the  Central  Intelligence Agency  (CIA)                                                               
recruited Hmong people  in Laos for their assistance  in the U.S.                                                               
war  effort, including  fighting alongside  American soldiers  on                                                               
the Ho Chi  Minh trail and transporting downed  pilots to medical                                                               
treatment.  She  said the Hmong soldiers fought  honorably and it                                                               
is  estimated  that 100,000  Hmong  soldiers  were recruited  and                                                               
trained.   Representative Tarr directed  the committee to  HJR 17                                                               
on page 2, line 7, which read:                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     approximately 40,000 Hmong soldiers lost their lives                                                                       
     defending democracy                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TARR  said after the  war ended and  the communist                                                               
regime took  power, the  Hmong people were  no longer  welcome in                                                               
their homeland and  many became refugees in  Thailand and various                                                               
other locations,  including Alaska.   She said  she was  proud to                                                               
represent thousands  of Hmong/Americans  living in  her district,                                                               
and   other  large   populations  are   represented  by   several                                                               
legislative districts in  Anchorage.  However, the U.  S. has not                                                               
fulfilled  its  promise  to grant  Hmong  soldiers  full  veteran                                                               
recognition.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TARR  again referred  to  proposed  HB 125  which                                                               
would  place a  veteran designation  on the  driver's license  of                                                               
former  Hmong soldiers.   She  said  HJR 17  would extend  burial                                                               
rights  at  Arlington  National Cemetery  to  Hmong  veterans,  a                                                               
change  that has  been supported  at  the federal  level by  U.S.                                                               
Senators Lisa Murkowski, Dan Sullivan,  and others.  She quoted a                                                               
living Hmong  soldier's statement  from an article  [document not                                                               
provided]  as follows:   "Burial  rights would  mean getting  the                                                               
respect  and the  dignity that  he and  his fellow  fighters feel                                                               
they've earned."  Representative  Tarr stressed the importance of                                                               
honoring  commitments  and said  support  from  the Alaska  State                                                               
Legislature, along  with similar  resolutions from  other states,                                                               
is  needed  to  urge  for  federal  legislation  to  extend  full                                                               
military burial rights.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:52:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked if  veteran status for burial rights                                                               
at Arlington National Cemetery would  allow burial rights in Fort                                                               
Richardson National Cemetery.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TARR  deferred the  question to the  Department of                                                               
Military & Veterans' Affairs (DMVA).                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX  commented  that  General  Vang  Pao,  the                                                               
leader of  the Hmong soldiers  who died  about five or  six years                                                               
ago, asked to be buried  at Arlington National Cemetery; however,                                                               
his  request was  denied despite  intervention from  U.S. Senator                                                               
Lisa Murkowski.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  PARISH, in  response  to Representative  Saddler,                                                               
said  his research  suggests  burial rights  would  apply at  any                                                               
national cemetery.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TARR agreed.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:55:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR TUCK opened public testimony.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:55:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ROBERT DOEHL,  Deputy Commissioner, Commissioner's  Office, DMVA,                                                               
stated DMVA and the Alaska  Veterans' Advisory Council, Office of                                                               
Veterans  Affairs, DMVA,  support HJR  17 and  HB 125.   He  said                                                               
Hmong  were integral  in saving  downed American  aviators during                                                               
the Vietnam War,  and sometimes ten Hmong would  perish for every                                                               
American saved.   He  said, "In short,  Hmong died  defending and                                                               
trying to save  American lives; if they died  with American lives                                                               
they should  get to  rest in  the same  hallowed ground  as those                                                               
American warriors."  Mr. Doehl  pointed out 50 years have passed,                                                               
noting recognition  of the  Filipinos who served  with the  U. S.                                                               
during World  War II was  also delayed, but  for less time.   [On                                                               
1/24/18]  forty-five  Alaska Air  National  Guard  airmen in  the                                                               
210th Rescue Squadron  returned home from deployment  and he said                                                               
one  of the  reasons  airmen return  home safely  is  due to  the                                                               
support they  receive from  the people  living in  the deployment                                                               
location,  and  he  restated  DMVA's  support for  HJR  17.    In                                                               
response  to   Representative  Saddler,  he   confirmed  national                                                               
cemetery  eligibility would  apply  to  Fort Richardson  National                                                               
Cemetery.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  LEDOUX   asked  why  there  is   reluctance  from                                                               
Congress to address this issue.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. DOEHL opined there is concern  "the Hmong did not raise their                                                               
hand and  take the  same oath  to support  and defend  the United                                                               
States as U.S. servicemembers do."                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
1:57:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VERDIE BOWEN,  Director, Office of Veterans'  Affairs, DMVA, said                                                               
he did  not know why  there is  resistance from Congress  on this                                                               
issue; in  fact, the  issue is discussed  in committee  each year                                                               
but  does not  receive  enough support  in the  U.  S. House  and                                                               
Senate.   He agreed  the possible reason  is that  Hmong soldiers                                                               
did not  receive an oath at  enlistment.  Mr. Bowen  recalled the                                                               
100,000-member  Vietnamese army  in  Laos was  held  back by  the                                                               
30,000-member  Hmong  army managed  by  General  Powell.   Noting                                                               
Hmong army enlistment,  he related children who  were tall enough                                                               
to  utilize a  M1  Garand or  M1 carbine  rifle  were taken  from                                                               
school  and enlisted  in  the  army; thus,  there  is  no way  to                                                               
properly  document  those who  were  recruited.   The  Office  of                                                               
Veterans'  Affairs  has  worked   with  the  Hmong  community  to                                                               
identify  25 people  who served  in the  Hmong army.   Mr.  Bowen                                                               
advised Arlington  National Cemetery  has already  recognized the                                                               
service of  members of the  Hmong army with a  memorial dedicated                                                               
in  1997,  which  indicates  Hmong army  members  deserve  to  be                                                               
interred in  national cemeteries.   Mr. Bowen pointed  out burial                                                               
rights for  members of the  Hmong army  should not be  delayed or                                                               
the effort will  be too late for many, as  happened in many cases                                                               
of Alaska  Territorial Guard  members.   He opined  Alaska should                                                               
provide  a reference  point for  its congressional  delegation to                                                               
take to  Congress and ask that  this honor be given  to those who                                                               
have served.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SPOHNHOLZ  asked whether Hmong veterans  have been                                                               
identified by working directly with the Hmong community.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BOWEN said  yes;  DMVA  utilized the  same  program used  to                                                               
identify Alaska Territorial Guard  members, which allows officers                                                               
who  served in  the Hmong  army  to identify  others who  served.                                                               
This  program was  used last  year in  preparation for  the Hmong                                                               
veteran driver's license designation.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE PARISH  postulated children were  conscripted into                                                               
the army, and  asked for the difference  between conscription and                                                               
enlistment.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BOWEN said  the system  was  an involuntary  draft and  some                                                               
individuals received no training before  they were sent to defend                                                               
or rescue downed pilots.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  PARISH asked  whether efforts  have been  made to                                                               
extend to the Hmong all of  the benefits available to any veteran                                                               
who voluntarily or involuntarily enters U.S. military service.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. BOWEN  advised at this  time the  only two benefits  the DMVA                                                               
has [attempted  to] extend are  the driver's  license designation                                                               
and  burial  rights.    In  further  response  to  Representative                                                               
Parish,  he   added  Alaska,   California,  and   Minnesota  have                                                               
established Hmong Memorial Day;  furthermore, each state supports                                                               
a  national program  to allow  Hmong soldiers  to be  interred in                                                               
national cemeteries.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:05:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MAY RAMIREZ-XIONG testified  in support of HJR 17.   [Much of her                                                               
oral  testimony  was indiscernible,  and  she  was provided  with                                                               
contact  information  for  submitting written  testimony.]    Her                                                               
written testimony  was received by  the committee and it  read as                                                               
follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Hi, my name is May Ramirez-Xiong.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Today, I  called in to  make a public testimony  on HJR
     17, but the  connection with my cellular  phone was not                                                                    
     good, and I  was asked to send my  testimony in writing                                                                    
     to this email. I will try  to stay as close as possible                                                                    
     to my phone testimony.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I  believe I  speak not  only for  myself, but  also on                                                                    
     behalf  of  every veteran  and  civilian,  who has  any                                                                    
     respect  and/or understanding  of  what it  is like  to                                                                    
     have  a family  member serving  our country.   That the                                                                    
     right thing to do is  to honor every veteran who fought                                                                    
     for our  country as we  honored our own  veterans. That                                                                    
     for the same  reason we honored our  fallen heroes, the                                                                    
     people that served, the ones  who fought to protect our                                                                    
     country, and  for every  veteran who  paved the  way to                                                                    
     give  our country  and our  people  the life,  liberty,                                                                    
     freedom and justice for all,  that we extend this honor                                                                    
     to the Hmong Veterans of the Vietnam War as well.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     For the  veterans who served  the purposed  outlined in                                                                    
     the  Soldier's  Creed,  to   "stand  ready  to  deploy,                                                                    
     engage, and  destroy, the enemies of  the United States                                                                    
     of America in close  combat." The Hmong Veterans served                                                                    
     this purposed for our Country during the Vietnam War.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     This  war  left  not  only  scars  in  our  hearts,  it                                                                    
     sacrificed our  people, and  it is  a part  of American                                                                    
     history.  A  part  of  me that  I  knew  little  about,                                                                    
     because  this  part  of  history   was  not  taught  in                                                                    
     schools. It  was the "Secret  War", and  no recognition                                                                    
     were  given  to  the  Hmong people.  The  Hmong  people                                                                    
     fought  and continued  fighting long  after the  United                                                                    
     States pulled  out. The United States of  America is my                                                                    
     Country.  My  Country that  my  father  and many  Hmong                                                                    
     Veterans fought  to defend, and many  Hmong people died                                                                    
     serving our country.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     While  language  barriers   have  prevented  the  Hmong                                                                    
     Veterans from expressing their  concerns about the lack                                                                    
     of  dignity and  respect they  have received,  the only                                                                    
     way to  make it right  for them  is to be  their voice,                                                                    
     because they  fought for mine.  Many who fought  in The                                                                    
     Secret War has  already passed away and  very few Hmong                                                                    
     Veterans of  the Vietnam War  are still alive  today. I                                                                    
     do not believe that  many Hmong Veterans would consider                                                                    
     burial  at  Arlington  due   to  superstitions  of  the                                                                    
     fengshui   considering  burials,   and  many   may  not                                                                    
     considered  this   an  option   at  all.   However,  my                                                                    
     testimony  is  not  just  about  the  burial  of  Hmong                                                                    
     Veterans of the Vietnam  War at Arlington Cemetery, but                                                                    
     about the honor, dignity, and respect for those men.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     To  invalidate  the  rights  that  were  promised  four                                                                    
     almost  five  decades  ago  demonstrates  the  kind  of                                                                    
     people  we   are.  We  are perceived  to   make  broken                                                                    
     promises,  is this how  we treat  the very people  that                                                                    
     fought for  our country?  I am born  and raised  in the                                                                    
     United States of America. I  am an American. And, if we                                                                    
     are  anything that  we  say we  are,  we would  provide                                                                    
     Freedom,  Liberty and  Justice  for  all.  Dignity  and                                                                    
     respect  should be  awarded to  all soldiers,  even the                                                                    
     foreign-born  soldier  that fought  alongside  American                                                                    
     soldiers, because they served the same purpose.                                                                            
     The United  Stated should extend this  right to include                                                                    
     the Hmong  Veterans of the  Secret War. They  should be                                                                    
     honored even if they were  not born on U.S. soil. Hmong                                                                    
     Veterans fought for this land,  and their families died                                                                    
     for our soil. They may not  have sworn with their right                                                                    
     hands as  American Soldiers do  (I was not  born during                                                                    
     that  era, I  would  not  have seen  this)  but I  know                                                                    
     they stood by the Solder's Creed:                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     I am an American Soldier.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     I am a warrior and a member of a team.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I serve the people of the United States, and live the                                                                      
     Army Values.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     I will always place the mission first.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I will never accept defeat.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     I will never quit.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     I will never leave a fallen comrade.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     I am disciplined, physically and mentally tough,                                                                           
     trained and proficient in my warrior tasks and drills.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     I always maintain my arms, my equipment and myself.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     I am an expert and I am a professional.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     I stand ready to deploy, engage, and destroy, the                                                                          
     enemies of the United States of America in close                                                                           
     combat.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     I am a guardian of freedom and the American way of                                                                         
     life.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     I am an American Soldier.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Because my  father was  one of  the Hmong  Veterans who                                                                    
     fought  this War.  They were  warriors  and members  of                                                                    
     U.S. teams.  They served  the people  of the  U.S., and                                                                    
     lived the values. They have  put the mission first, and                                                                    
     did not accept defeat, they  did not quit. They carried                                                                    
     fallen  comrades to  safety; they  were the  expert and                                                                    
     the professional  who was ready to  deploy, engage, and                                                                    
     destroy the enemies of the  U.S.A in close combat. They                                                                    
     were the  guardian of freedom  and the American  way of                                                                    
     life, they were American  Soldiers even before stepping                                                                    
     on  American soil.  We owe  it to  what remains  of the                                                                    
     Hmong Veterans of the Vietnam  War - The Secret War, to                                                                    
     give them  what we  promised. I'm sad  to say  that the                                                                    
     longer we  wait to make  a change, the  less meaningful                                                                    
     it  would be  for  anyone else.  It's  to show  dignity                                                                    
     and respect  for  those  who fought.  It  only  matters                                                                    
     while they're still alive. Lets  not wait until they're                                                                    
     all  gone,  to  approve something  they  were  promised                                                                    
     decades ago.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR TUCK handed the gavel to Vice Chair LeDoux.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:11:44 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHARLIE  XIONG, calling  from  California,  attempted to  provide                                                               
testimony.  [Due to technical  difficulties Mr. Xiong's testimony                                                               
was indiscernible.]                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
To  address technical  difficulties,  a series  of at-eases  were                                                               
taken from 2:13 p.m. to 2:19 p.m.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:19:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MAI  XIONG attempted  to provide  testimony.   [Due to  technical                                                               
difficulties Ms. Xiong's testimony was indiscernible.]                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:20:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PASERT  LEE [Much  of Mr.  Lee's testimony  was not  discernible;                                                               
however, the portions of his  testimony transcribed here indicate                                                               
he was  in support of  HJR 17.]  indicated that from  1961-75 the                                                               
Central  Intelligence  Agency  (CIA) recruited  Hmong  people  to                                                               
rescue American  pilots who  had been  shot down.   He  said that                                                               
Hmong people  protected Highways 7 and  4, as well as  the Ho Chi                                                               
Minh Trail.   He  spoke of  the 36,000  Hmong soldiers  that died                                                               
during the  Vietnam War compared  to the relatively  fewer 58,000                                                               
American soldiers that died there.   He said he hopes that HJR 17                                                               
passes for the Hmong living in Alaska.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:23:28 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR LEDOUX  announced  that public  testimony  on HJR  17                                                               
would remain open.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER spoke  of  the urgent  need  to pass  the                                                               
resolution as soon as public testimony is heard.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR LEDOUX agreed.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
[HJR 17 was held over.]                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HJR017 Sponsor Statement 1.20.18.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HJR 17
HJR017 Supporting Document- S.1179. 1.20.18.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HJR 17
HJR017 Fiscal Note 1.24.18.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HJR 17
HB178 ver M.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 178
HB178 Supporting Document-Support Letters 1.24.18.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 178
HB178 Fiscal Note-MVA 1.19.18.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 178
HB178 Fiscal Note-DOT 1.19.18.pdf HMLV 1/25/2018 1:30:00 PM
HB 178