Legislature(2023 - 2024)BARNES 124

04/28/2023 03:15 PM House LABOR & COMMERCE

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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ HB 166 PFAS USE FIREFIGHTING TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+ HB 124 LICENSE REQUIREMENTS: COMM. DRIVERS TELECONFERENCED
Moved HB 124 Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= HB 21 SCHOOL/UNIVERSITY EMPLOYEE HEALTH INSUR TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+= SB 55 EXTND BDS: MEDICAL, DIRECT-ENTRY MIDWIVES TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSSB 55(FIN) Out of Committee
                  HB 166-PFAS USE FIREFIGHTING                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:20:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SUMNER announced  that the next order of  business would be                                                               
HOUSE BILL NO. 166, "An  Act relating to firefighting substances;                                                               
and providing for an effective date."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:20:47 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  WILL STAPP,  Alaska State  Legislature, as  prime                                                               
sponsor, introduced  HB 166.   He stated that  perfluoroalkyl and                                                               
polyfluoroalkyl substances (PFAS) are  harmful chemicals known to                                                               
cause  cancer,  even  in  small  dosages.   He  said  that  these                                                               
substances are  used in  firefighting foams,  and they  seep into                                                               
drinking water.   He  stated that  HB 166  would end  this usage,                                                               
with the exception  of oil and gas facilities,  which would still                                                               
be permitted as there is no alternative at this time.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
3:23:26 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CLIFTON COGHILL,  Staff, Representative Will Stapp,  Alaska State                                                               
Legislature, on  behalf of  Representative Stapp,  prime sponsor,                                                               
gave  the sectional  analysis for  HB 166  [copy included  in the                                                               
committee  packet] which  read as  follows [original  punctuation                                                               
provided]:                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Sec. 1 of the bill creates a new section:                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
          Sec. 46.03.340(a): Everyone outside  the oil & gas                                                                    
          industry must  stop using PFAS-  containing foams,                                                                    
          unless federal law preempts Alaska law.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
          Sec.  46.03.340(b): People  fighting fires  in the                                                                    
          oil  &  gas  industry  may  continue  using  PFAS-                                                                    
          containing foams until  an alternative is approved                                                                    
          by regulation.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
          Sec.  46.03.340(c):  The  state fire  marshal  can                                                                    
          determine  there is  a  safe  and effective  PFAS-                                                                    
          free foam for fighting oil or gas fires if the                                                                        
          alternate  foam is  listed by  an organization  in                                                                    
          OSHA's  Nationally  Recognized Testing  Laboratory                                                                    
          Program.  The fire  marshal must  require the  new                                                                    
          foam by regulation, with a stated effective date.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
       Sec. 46.03.340(d): DEC must take up to 40 gallons                                                                        
         per year of PFAS containing firefighting foam                                                                          
          from Alaskans for disposal.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
      Sec. 2 of the bill sets an effective date of January                                                                      
     1, 2024.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:24:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   FIELDS   asked   whether   similar   legislation                                                               
introduced the previous year could  have potentially included the                                                               
oil and gas industry.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STAPP answered  that  changes  from the  previous                                                               
legislation  have been  made; however,  he expressed  uncertainty                                                               
concerning  the   past  legislation   because  of  a   change  in                                                               
sponsorship.  In  response to a follow-up question,  he said that                                                               
HB  166  would   be  a  good  first  step   in  eliminating  PFAS                                                               
contamination.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FIELDS asked  whether the  bill would  compliment                                                               
the new Environmental Protection Agency regulations.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP answered yes.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
3:27:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CARRICK questioned the amount  of PFAS used by the                                                               
oil and gas industry.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP answered that he  is unsure.  In response to                                                               
a  follow-up question,  he said  that oil  and gas  fires have  a                                                               
greater level of combustion.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:29:39 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
LLOYD NAKANO,  Director and Alaska  State Fire  Marshal, Division                                                               
of  Fire and  Life Safety,  Alaska Department  of Public  Safety,                                                               
answered  that   oil  and  gas  fires   take  significantly  more                                                               
resources  to put  out,  and the  foams  used to  do  so are  not                                                               
currently replaceable.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:30:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  CARRICK  asked  why  a standard  higher  than  40                                                               
gallons for disposal was not chosen.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STAPP  answered  that the  disposal  methods  are                                                               
unique, and many  places which require PFAS removal  are in rural                                                               
Alaska.   He offered  to follow  up with  the committee  with the                                                               
many  other reasons  that the  40-gallon amount  was chosen.   In                                                               
response to a follow-up question,  he said that rural Alaska does                                                               
not have the same resources available for disposal.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:32:09 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RUFFRIDGE asked what options exist for disposal.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
3:32:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ANDY  MILLS,  Legislative  Liaison,   Special  Assistant  to  the                                                               
Commissioner, Office  of the  Commissioner, Alaska  Department of                                                               
Transportation   and  Public   Facilities,   answered  that   the                                                               
department has submitted a fiscal  note for PFAS disposal because                                                               
of the high  amount of PFAS that  is used at airports.   He added                                                               
that in the past, villages  in rural Alaska received firefighting                                                               
materials,  including PFAS  foams amounting  to approximately  40                                                               
gallons.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
3:36:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FIELDS asked  whether  the oil  and gas  industry                                                               
sprays  PFAS  containing  foams as  part  of  their  firefighting                                                               
training exercises.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
3:36:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SUZANNE   CUNNINGHAM,  Government   Relations  Liaison,   Alyeska                                                               
Pipeline Service Company, answered that  she could not answer for                                                               
the entire industry.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
3:37:02 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  FIELDS  asked  whether Alyeska  Pipeline  Service                                                               
Company has used PFAS-containing foams for training purposes.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MS. CUNNINGHAM answered no.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:37:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  PRAX  asked  whether  PFAS foam  would  still  be                                                               
eligible for  the purpose of  preventing a fire from  starting in                                                               
the event an oil or gas truck was overturned.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP answered that he  is unsure.  In response to                                                               
a  follow-up   question,  he  said   that  all   PFAS  containing                                                               
substances would be banned except for oil and gas facilities.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  PRAX noted  that  he has  served  as a  volunteer                                                               
firefighter  and expressed  concern  about  the possibility  that                                                               
firefighting foams  may not be  available for fire  prevention in                                                               
the event of an oil or gas spill.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
3:41:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER  asked for  a definition  of "firefighting                                                               
substance."                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NAKANO answered  that it  is not  an official  term used  by                                                               
firefighters.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
3:42:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE WRIGHT  asked whether  there are other  terms that                                                               
can be used instead of "firefighting substances."                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NAKANO answered  yes.    He said  that  he  would look  into                                                               
terminology being used by other states.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
3:42:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER  asked  whether the  bill  sponsor  would                                                               
oppose the addition of definitions to the bill.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  STAPP  expressed  support  for  the  addition  of                                                               
definitions for clarity to the proposed legislation.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked how  the fire marshal's office would                                                               
determine a safe and effective alternative to PFAS foams.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NAKANO answered  that it  would use  products listed  by the                                                               
National  Laboratories which  meet  the  Occupational Safety  and                                                               
Health Administration's standards  for firefighting capabilities.                                                               
In response to  a follow-up question, he said that  he is working                                                               
with  other  firefighting  agencies  in the  state  to  determine                                                               
effective and safe alternatives.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
3:45:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RUFFRIDGE asked whether  there is a possibility to                                                               
work with other states on disposal.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP expressed uncertainty.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
3:46:42 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE PRAX  asked whether  a safe  method with  the same                                                               
effectiveness  as PFAS  foams has  been  determined for  aircraft                                                               
fires.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MR. NAKANO answered that this is  in the developmental stage.  In                                                               
response  to   a  follow-up  question,   he  said   that  airport                                                               
firefighters are still covered by federal regulations.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
3:47:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE PRAX asked  whether there is a risk  that the PFAS                                                               
foams  exceeding the  40-gallon limit  would not  be disposed  of                                                               
properly.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  MILLS answered  that 40  gallons  is the  best estimate  for                                                               
rural  communities.   He added  that, in  some communities,  this                                                               
amount has already  been used or lost.  In  response to a follow-                                                               
up question,  he said that the  department was unable to  come up                                                               
with a method to account for every industry.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:52:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked whether  the bill would only include                                                               
PFAS which are part of Operation Code-Red.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP  answered that the  bill would apply  to all                                                               
communities.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
3:53:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SUMNER announced that HB 166 was held over.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB 124 Support Letter Teamsters 3.27.23.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 Sectional Analysis version A.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 Support Letter Alaska Chamber 4.19.23.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 Sponsor Statement version A.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 version A.PDF HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 Alaska CDL Manual.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 DOLWD Press Release 4.11.2023.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 ELDT Info.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 Fiscal Note.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 eCFR 49 CFR 383.23 -- Commercial Driver's License.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 CH 104 SLA 1985.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 APM Article 4.11.2023.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 124 ADN Article 4.12.2023.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 124
HB 166A PFAS.PDF HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166
HB166 PFAS Sponsor Statement.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166
HB 166 PFAS Pollution Sectional Analysis.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166
HB166 Support.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166
HB 166 PFAS Fiscal note DPS.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166
HB 166 PFAS Fiscal Note DOT.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166
HB166 Support Letters.pdf HL&C 4/28/2023 3:15:00 PM
HB 166