Legislature(2009 - 2010)BELTZ 211
02/09/2009 01:30 PM Senate JUDICIARY
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Confirmation Hearing | |
| SJR3 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| *+ | SJR 3 | TELECONFERENCED | |
SJR 3-FIREARMS IN NATIONAL PARK
2:01:02 PM
CHAIR FRENCH announced the consideration of SJR 3.
SENATOR THERRIAULT, Sponsor of SJR 3, stated that the resolution
supports a Bush administration policy decision and urges the
Obama administration to continue and perhaps expand support of
that policy. He continued:
It is the intent of SJR 3 to show appreciation for the
change in National Park policy that now allows park
users to carry the firearms they need for personal
protection in National Parks.
Alaskans, who have in their state over 75 percent of
the National Park system, understand how important it
is to have personal protection in the wilderness.
Specifically in the parks in Alaska I am more
concerned about protection against the wild critters
that live there. Whereas in other areas of country
protection of the National Park system may be from
other people who are in the park system. The bill
affirms that progress has been made to allow the
carrying of firearms under the previous administration
and encourages the new one to continue that.
Whether it's for bear protection, obtaining food in a
survival situation, or signaling for assistance when
needed, firearms have been on the hips and in the arms
of many Alaskans since the frontier was first
explored. This is just to encourage that the current
policy decision continues.
2:03:02 PM
CHAIR FRENCH observed that his bill packet has only the first
page of the "FAQ-Interior Firearms Policy Update" and the last
question doesn't have an answer. He asked Mr. Stancliff to
answer the question "Won't visitors and wildlife be endangered
by allowing concealed firearms in parks and refuges?"
DAVE STANCLIFF, Staff to Senator Therriault, replied there are
varying opinions on whether people should be able to carry
firearms in national parks. As the sponsor indicated, his
research revealed some tragedies that probably would not have
occurred had people been able to defend themselves against
wildlife. He also discovered that the ten most dangerous parks
are on the list because of dangers associated with drug
trafficking and assaults that have happened. So there are two
groups of people wanting protection for two different reasons
and the policy is under legal challenge.
The Brady group filed suit on December 30, 2008 after talking
with the new Interior Department appointee. Mr. Salazar
expressed strong support for Second Amendment rights and said he
is very comfortable with firearms in the hands of law abiding
citizens. He promised to look at the procedure to ensure that it
is being followed correctly, but gave no indication he would try
to reverse or politically disrupt the decision. Because the
Brady group has filed suit, the resolution is very timely.
MR. STANCLIFF described "guns in national parks" as a
philosophical issue and said that the pushback in Alaska is
significantly less than in the Lower 48. He referred to the two
young women who were lost in Denali Park last summer and said
they had no way of signaling, protecting themselves or obtaining
food. "It's a policy question, but as Alaskans I think we can
see both sides of it fairly clearly," he concluded.
CHAIR FRENCH asked if any Alaska parks are on the most dangerous
list.
MR. STANCLIFF said no; the ones that are listed are dangerous
because of people. The sponsor brought to his attention that
some of the most dangerous law enforcement assignments are to
park rangers in national parks.
SENATOR THERRIAULT clarified that the FAQ sheet was included in
the packet to answer specific questions about the issue of
"similar state lands." He isn't sure what the answer was to the
last question on the page.
CHAIR FRENCH said it was more of a rhetorical question than
anything else, but he would add that when he visited the Brooks
Lodge at Katmai he was stunned to learn that you couldn't carry
a firearm to protect yourself against bears. After several
visits he's changed his mind and believes it's really quite safe
if you obey certain rules. Referring to the Kenai and Russian
rivers, he said that Alaskans really have figured how and when
to use guns and when not to.
MR. STANCLIFF said it's important to note that the policy
doesn't apply to national parks in states that don't allow
individuals to carry concealed firearms. The rational was that
the federal government was looking carefully at what individual
states wanted.
CHAIR FRENCH questioned whether states could apply different
rules to different parks in the same state. For example, carve
out one rule for the Brooks Lodge [Katmai] and another for
Denali or Gates of the Arctic. In some places you may more
legitimately need a firearm to defend yourself or signal for
help.
2:11:05 PM
SENATOR ELTON said his sense of the purpose of a resolution is
to ask for a change. He questioned sending a resolution that
essentially says good job, keep it up.
SENATOR THERRIAULT responded there's an effort to undo the
federal regulation and the resolution basically puts the State
of Alaska on record saying it supports the Bush administration
policy decision and it conforms to Alaska law. Responding to the
Chair's question, he said the federal regulation allows a state
to carve out a particular park, just as Alaska allows concealed
carry, but not in a women's shelter or a court building. "We're
basically saying we support the step that was taken just
recently and we're encouraging the new administration to resist
the attempts to undo it. And to potentially even consider …
letting people carry openly in the parks where states allow
that."
2:14:11 PM
SENATOR ELTON suggested that with the exception of extending it
to non-concealed, the resolution is superfluous. He asked if
it's permissible now or if it has been permissible to carry a
rifle in a national park.
MR. STANCLIFF relayed a personal experience he had in Denali
Park. "The answer is you cannot be packing a rife in sight. If
you have a firearm in a park, they're going to probably make you
take the bolt out or break it down and put it in a location away
from where others will see it and maybe where you could avail
yourself to using it."
SENATOR ELTON recapped that it's okay to have a rifle in a park
so long as it's unloaded and the bolt has been removed.
MR. STANCLIFF clarified that he's referring to parks where
hunting isn't allowed, but he doesn't know anyone who would take
their rifle or shotgun into a park for fear of having it
confiscated.
SENATOR ELTON said so you can only carry a concealed firearm and
that's probably not possible with a rifle.
MR. STANCLIFF agreed it would be very difficult.
2:17:25 PM
SENATOR THERRIAULT added that Alaskans are generally supportive
of the change the federal government made and so it's
appropriate for the state government to weigh in and encourage
the new administration not to undo it. Also, the policy is very
similar to what the BLM and the U.S. Forest Service have on
carrying firearms.
SENATOR ELTON said he appreciates the clarification and he would
just note that the U.S. Forest Service and BLM allow hunting
while national parks do not.
2:18:39 PM
SALLY GIBERT, ANILCA Coordinator, Office of Project Management,
Department of Natural Resources, clarified that all the national
park preserves and all the national parks that were created
under ANILCA are open to hunting. Therefore they are open to
carrying firearms. "This resolution as well as the original Bush
administration regulations only apply to the pre-statehood pre-
ANILCA parks, which include basically the old core of Mount
McKinley National Park, old Glacier Bay, old Katmai and Sitka
and Klondike."
CHAIR FRENCH said so under the new regulations I can take a gun
climbing and shoot avalanches.
MS. GIBERT said yes as long as they're concealed.
CHAIR FRENCH asked her to clarify that the state or park
director could carve out a section of the river near the Brooks
Lodge as a no gun zone.
MS. GIBERT said yes the federal government defers to the state;
the park service can go along with whatever the state allows.
The same with the McNeil River, she said.
2:20:43 PM
CHAIR FRENCH announced he would hold the resolution until the
next meeting [Wednesday].
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