03/28/1996 08:50 AM Senate FIN

                                                                               
       CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 259(HES)                                         
       "An Act extending  the termination  date of the  Alaska                 
       Commission  on Aging;  and providing  for  an effective                 
  date."                                                                       
                                                                               
  Alison Elgee,  Department of Administration  was invited  to                 
  join the  committee.   She indicated  service on  the Alaska                 
  Commission on Aging.  This commission has  been in existence                 
  since  about  1981.   It  was  formerly known  as  the Older                 
  Alaskans Commission.  Legislative  Audit conducted a  sunset                 
  review this  year and for  the second time  recommended this                 
  commission be removed  from the sunset review  provisions or                 
  if  that was unacceptable the sunset date be set at the year                 
  2003.  The Governor introduced the legislation to remove the                 
                                                                               
                                                                               
  commission from the sunset review.  When Senate H&SS took it                 
  up they  were uncomfortable  with the  complete removal  and                 
  adopted the committee substitute  now before this committee.                 
  She said she did  not believe they understood the  audit was                 
  actually  recommending a  date further  out.  She  said they                 
  would prefer to  have the commission removed  as Legislative                 
  Audit  had  recommended  because  of  the work  required  in                 
  conducting a  sunset review.   There were  two auditors  for                 
  most  of two months.  There is a better utilization of those                 
  resources. Co-chairman Halford  indicated that he  supported                 
  the existence of the commission.  Auditors should be able to                 
  decide to what extent they go into  audits on things they do                 
  not find anything initially and do not get requests to spend                 
  a lot  of time on.  Senator Frank felt this may not lie with                 
  their  professional practices.   They  are  certified public                 
  accounts and they have rules and regulations they have to go                 
  by  even  if  they  feel  it  is  not  necessary  under  the                 
  circumstances.   Perhaps the  law should be  modified.   Co-                 
  chairman Halford said  they could be exempted from the audit                 
  requirement  without  exempting them  from  the sunset  law.                 
  Senator Frank concurred.                                                     
                                                                               
  Senator Sharp asked about  the fiscal notes since the  costs                 
  are  already in  the budget.   Co-chairman  Frank asked  Ms.                 
  Elgee about the positive fiscal note  since it is already in                 
  the budget.  She said the  feeling of Tam Cook was that  the                 
  fiscal note should represent the amount of money to be taken                 
  out of the budget should it actually be chosen to sunset the                 
  commission.  It is  footnoted to show that those  monies are                 
  contained in  the  Governor's budget.   Co-chairman  Halford                 
  asked if  this was really  a zero fiscal  note and she  said                 
  that as long  as the  commission was continued  it would  be                 
  zero.  If  the commission is  eliminated the money would  be                 
  deleted represented in the fiscal note.  Co-chairman Halford                 
  said he wanted a new fiscal note  reflecting the way the law                 
  read and she said a new zero one would be submitted.                         
                                                                               
  Senator Frank said maybe the  sunset date should be extended                 
  and rather than get into what types of audits should be used                 
  good judgment should be used about which things need  closer                 
  and  more periodic  review  and  which  things  need  to  be                 
  reviewed less often.   Senator  Phillips said the  auditor's                 
  recommendation was the year 2003.                                            
                                                                               
  Senator Frank moved  technical amendment to change  the year                 
  "2000" to  "2003" and  the objection  of Senator Rieger  was                 
  duly noted.   He said no commission should  have more than a                 
  four year  sunset.  It is  a useful, subtle  control on what                 
  goes on in various commissions even if the sunset process is                 
  not exercised.   It  is not  wise to  have sunsets  that are                 
  longer than four  years.  Senator  Rieger said there is  not                 
  enough energy, time  and money for  the auditors to look  at                 
  certain things and so it is a tradeoff.  Senator Rieger said                 
  extensive audits do not  have to be required and  the budget                 
                                                                               
                                                                               
  and  audit  committee  should decide  which  sunset programs                 
  require an  audit and  which ones do  not.  It   could  be a                 
  routine question brought to members of the  commission as to                 
  which sunset audits should  be done and the rest  would just                 
  be  a bill  passing without the  backup of  an audit.    Co-                 
  chairman Halford concurred.  Budget  and Audit should make a                 
  conscious decision rather than a  blanket decision that says                 
  anything coming up  for sunset gets  a full audit.   Senator                 
  Phillips  said if the auditors were present the matter could                 
  be fixed internally.   Senator Zharoff  said this was not  a                 
  runaway commission  and the  reports indicate  a good  track                 
  record.  It seems that an audit can be requested at any time                 
  if any discrepancies or problems are heard of.   He asked if                 
  a sunset is  not automatically  up for review.   He  concurs                 
  with the proposal of Senator Frank.                                          
                                                                               
  The  committee  voted on  Senator  Frank's motion  to change                 
  "2000" to   "2003" and  by a vote  of 4  - 3 the  motion was                 
  adopted.    Senator Sharp  moved  CSSB 259(FIN)  and without                 
  objection it  was reported  out with  zero fiscal  note from                 
  Department of Administration and individual recommendations.