03/13/2014 01:30 PM Senate LABOR & COMMERCE

          SB 190-DELEGATION OF GUIDE-OUTFITTER DUTIES                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
2:33:47 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR DUNLEAVY  announced the  consideration of  SB 190.  "An Act                                                               
permitting certain persons  who are not licensed by  the Big Game                                                               
Commercial  Services  Board to  provide  or  assist in  providing                                                               
certain  guide  services."  He  noted that  this  was  the  first                                                               
hearing and there was a new committee substitute (CS).                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
2:34:02 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  MICCICHE moved  to  adopt  CS for  SB  190, labeled  28-                                                               
LS1466\U, as the working document.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR DUNLEAVY objected for discussion purposes.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
2:34:23 PM                                                                                                                    
GARY  ZEPP,   Staff,  Senator   Charlie  Huggins,   reviewed  the                                                               
following  changes between  Version  A and  Version U:  [Original                                                               
punctuation provided.]                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Section 1 (a), page 1, lines 5-9:                                                                                          
        · Lines 5-7, the verbiage was reworded and lines 8                                                                      
          and 9 were deleted because this is already                                                                            
          included in AS 08.54.790 (9)(c) 'Definitions"                                                                         
          section.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Section 1(b), page 1, lines  10-14 & continuing on page                                                                    
     2, lines 1-2,  the verbiage was reworded  to insure the                                                                    
     legislation wasn't  allowing unlicensed  personnel more                                                                    
     authority than the licensed personnel.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR DUNLEAVY removed his objection. Finding no further                                                                        
objection, Version U was adopted.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
2:36:24 PM                                                                                                                    
MR. ZEPP introduced SB 190 speaking to the following sponsor                                                                    
statement   and   sectional    summary:   [Original   punctuation                                                               
provided.]                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     Senate  Bill 190,  version U,  authorizes a  Registered                                                                    
     Guide-Outfitter   to   delegate   certain   duties   to                                                                    
     unlicensed personnel, as long  as a licensed registered                                                                    
     guide-outfitter   or  class   A   assistant  guide   is                                                                    
     physically  present for  certain  delegated duties.  In                                                                    
     addition,  it  authorizes  unlicensed personnel  to  be                                                                    
     compensated for carrying out those delegated duties.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     Current  Alaska  statutes  (AS  08.54)  prohibit  these                                                                    
     activities.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Example 1:  A registered  guide out-fitter  cannot hire                                                                    
     unlicensed personnel  to pack  meat from the  field and                                                                    
     receive compensation.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     As you can  imagine, it is difficult  to find personnel                                                                    
     to  work   for  free!  This  legislation   would  allow                                                                    
     unlicensed personnel, including  local residents, to be                                                                    
     hired and  compensated for packing meat  from the field                                                                    
     without having to obtain a license.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Example 2:  A registered  guide-outfitter or a  class A                                                                    
     assistant  guide cannot  delegate  guide services,  for                                                                    
     training purposes,  to unlicensed personnel  to perform                                                                    
     certain   tasks  while   either  a   registered  guide-                                                                    
     outfitter  or class  A  assistant  guide is  physically                                                                    
     present.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Note: The class A assistant guide must be:                                                                                 
        · Employed by and under the supervision of the                                                                          
          registered guide-outfitter who contracted for the                                                                     
          big game hunt; and                                                                                                    
        · Be licensed in the game management unit where the                                                                     
          hunt is conducted.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     This   makes  it   difficult  to   train  and   prepare                                                                    
     perspective guides  to further advance in  the Big Game                                                                    
     Guiding industry  when they  cannot be  compensated for                                                                    
     carrying  out those  duties. Not  many people  work for                                                                    
     free!                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     This   creates  an   apprentice   structure  to   allow                                                                    
     unlicensed  personnel to  be prepared  for and  qualify                                                                    
     for the 'assistant guide" level in the industry.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Under  current statutes:  An assistant  guide candidate                                                                    
     must  have   at  least  60   days  of   Alaska  hunting                                                                    
     experience and 30 days must  be in a hunting camp being                                                                    
     instructed by a licensed guide-outfitter.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     In summary, it  is difficult to find  personnel to work                                                                    
     for free  and it also  makes it difficult to  train and                                                                    
     prepare  perspective   guides  for  a  future   in  the                                                                    
     industry.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Sectional Summary                                                                                                          
     Section 1. Adds a  new statutory section, AS 08.54.635,                                                                  
     that allows  the Big Game Commercial  Services Board to                                                                    
     adopt  regulations   permitting  a   registered  guide-                                                                    
     outfitter  to  delegate  certain guide  services  to  a                                                                    
     person  not  licensed  under AS  08.54.  Provides  what                                                                    
     guide   services   may    be   delegated.   Establishes                                                                    
     conditions  on  the  delegation  of  services.  Permits                                                                    
     unlicensed  persons  to  assist  in  providing  certain                                                                    
     guide  services. Requires  unlicensed  persons to  meet                                                                    
     standards  adopted by  the board  before providing,  or                                                                    
     assisting   in  providing,   guide  services.   Permits                                                                    
     unlicensed persons providing  or assisting in providing                                                                    
     guide services to be compensated.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Section 2. Conforms AS 08.54.720(a)  to the addition of                                                                  
     AS 08.54.635 in sec. 1 of the bill.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Section  3. Amends  AS 08.54.740(a)  to provide  that a                                                                  
     registered guide-outfitter  is equally  responsible for                                                                    
     a violation  of a state  or federal wildlife,  game, or                                                                    
     guiding  statute or  regulation committee  by a  person                                                                    
     while  that  person  provides guide  services  for  the                                                                    
     guide-outfitter under the new section AS 08.54.635.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
2:39:27 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR OLSON asked if there was any opposition to the bill.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR ZEPP replied he hadn't heard anything negative.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  OLSON asked  if affected  guides had  voiced support  or                                                               
opposition.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. ZEPP  replied he reached out  to all the stakeholders  he was                                                               
aware   of   including   the  Alaska   Wildlife   Troopers,   the                                                               
professional  licensing operations  manager  for  DCCED, the  Big                                                               
Game  Commercial  Services  Board, the  Alaska  Outdoor  Council,                                                               
Safari Club  International, and  the Alaska  Professional Hunters                                                               
Association. So far he's heard nothing but support.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
2:41:17 PM                                                                                                                    
CABOT PITTS,  representing himself, Wasilla, Alaska,  said he's a                                                               
registered   guide  and   outfitter  and   a  member   of  Alaska                                                               
Professional Hunters Association. He plans  to use packers in his                                                               
business and believes that they  need to be compensated for their                                                               
work. He asked the committee to support SB 190.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:42:24 PM                                                                                                                    
JOE   KLUTSCH,  representing   himself,   King  Salmon,   Alaska,                                                               
testified in support of SB 190. He  said he's been a guide for 34                                                               
years and  he started as  a packer. Most  of the best  guides and                                                               
many  of  the  Native  guides were  packers  before  they  became                                                               
registered  and  master  guides.  He  described  the  bill  as  a                                                               
technical correction to solve the  problem facing both registered                                                               
guides and the packers that help them.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR OLSON  asked if he'd  had any trouble with  citations and                                                               
overly aggressive game wardens.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR. KLUTSCH replied he wasn't aware of anything like that.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:45:43 PM                                                                                                                    
KELLY  VREM Chair,  Big Game  Commercial Services  Board, Sutton,                                                               
Alaska,  testified in  support of  SB 190.  He said  he's been  a                                                               
guide  or assistant  guide  since  1973 and  packers  have had  a                                                               
history in  guiding since  before statehood.  It has  always been                                                               
the accepted  practice to  hire a packer  and the  assumption was                                                               
that it  was legal. It  was therefore  quite a surprise  to learn                                                               
that the practice was illegal.  SB 190 will legitimize this long-                                                               
standing practice in the guiding industry, he said.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
He explained  that in 1989  and 1990  the Alaska Senate  formed a                                                               
task force  on guiding that  defined transporters and  guides and                                                               
the  privileges  for  each one.  They  decided  that  entry-level                                                               
guides and/or  laborers didn't  rise to  the level  of licensure,                                                               
but  this   wasn't  clarified  in  the   definition  section,  AS                                                               
08.54.790. He  said the bill  is a technical correction  and he'd                                                               
heard no objection.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. VREM suggested  inserting the term "assistant  guide" on page                                                               
2, line 1, to allow that person to supervise a trainee.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
2:48:35 PM                                                                                                                    
JOE  WANT,  representing  himself,  Fairbanks,  Alaska,  said  he                                                               
doesn't disagree  with the  concept of  the legislation,  but the                                                               
wording in  subsection (b) gives  too much latitude to  the guide                                                               
that is  delegating authority. He  stressed that a  packer should                                                               
not be directly  involved in the kill and that  the packer should                                                               
not make  decisions with  the client. The  guide should  make the                                                               
decisions.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
2:51:50 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR DUNLEAVY  announced he would  hold SB 190 in  committee for                                                               
further consideration. Public testimony was open.