02/28/2022 01:30 PM Senate JUDICIARY

               SB 31-PROHIBITING BINDING CAUCUSES                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:34:13 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HOLLAND announced  the consideration of SENATE  BILL NO. 31                                                               
"An Act  relating to binding votes  by or for a  legislator under                                                               
the Legislative Ethics Act."                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
[CSSB 31(STA) was  before the committee. The  bill was previously                                                               
heard on 5/10/21, 2/2/22, 2/11/22,  and 2/16/22. Public testimony                                                               
was heard and closed on 2/2/22.]                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:34:42 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR  HOLLAND  moved  to  adopt  Amendment  1,  work  order  32-                                                               
LS0303\B.1.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
                                              32-LS0303\B.1                                                                     
                                                     Klein                                                                      
                                                   2/18/22                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
                          AMENDMENT 1                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
    OFFERED IN THE SENATE                BY SENATOR HOLLAND                                                                     
     TO:  CSSB 31(STA)                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Page 1, line 9:                                                                                                            
          Delete "a bill, appointment, veto, or other                                                                           
     measure"                                                                                                                   
          Insert "an appropriations bill or a matter                                                                            
     governed by the uniform rules of the legislature"                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER objected for discussion purposes.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
1:34:58 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HOLLAND explained  that Amendment 1 would  narrow the scope                                                               
from  "any bill,  appointment, veto,  or other  measure" to  only                                                               
apply  to budget  and  procedural matters  since  those were  the                                                               
typical issues in a binding caucus agreement.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:35:21 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR KIEHL  offered his  view that Amendment  1 does  just the                                                               
opposite since  the Uniform Rules  govern every vote  and motion.                                                               
He asked for clarification on Amendment 1.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HOLLAND  asked his staff  to explain the  Legislative Legal                                                               
Services attorney's comments.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:35:57 PM                                                                                                                    
ED KING, Staff, Senator Roger  Holland, Alaska State Legislature,                                                               
Juneau,  Alaska, stated  that the  request  to Legislative  Legal                                                               
Services was to address only  budget bills and procedural matters                                                               
when drafting the language in Amendment 1.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:36:22 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  KIEHL  said he  was  impressed  by  the breadth  of  the                                                               
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:36:48 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  SHOWER  stated that  the  binding  caucus rule  required                                                               
members to  vote for the  budget and procedural  items, typically                                                               
housekeeping measures. He related that  the intent of Amendment 1                                                               
was to limit the bill to  budget and procedural votes. He said he                                                               
did not intend  for the bill to apply to  anything other than the                                                               
budget or procedural votes.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:38:11 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR HUGHES  offered her view  that the language "or  a matter                                                               
governed  by the  uniform  rules of  the  legislature" was  quite                                                               
broad.  She   asked  whether   the  legislative   legal  attorney                                                               
understood  it  was  related  to the  rulings  of  the  presiding                                                               
officer. She said  she understood the sponsor  indicated the bill                                                               
related  to votes  on the  budget  and rulings  of the  presiding                                                               
officer. She expressed concern that the language was broad.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HOLLAND stated that was not the intent of Amendment 1.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
1:38:55 PM                                                                                                                    
MR.  KING pointed  out  that the  bill  says it  is  on a  matter                                                               
relating  to  the  uniform  rules.  Thus, it  was  not  just  the                                                               
execution of  the rules  but would  apply to a  waiver of  the 55                                                               
rules, so Amendment 1 would  encompass any procedural matter that                                                               
comes to the floor for a vote.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
1:39:25 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  MYERS stated  that  Amendment 1  would  delete "a  bill,                                                               
appointment, veto  or other measure."  He recalled that  the veto                                                               
overrides  were held  out as  part of  the binding  caucus a  few                                                               
years  ago, although  it was  before his  legislative service  so                                                               
that he could be mistaken.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER responded  that the original agreement  was on the                                                               
budget and  procedural votes, but  it expanded to  other matters,                                                               
including the  veto override. He  stated that was the  genesis of                                                               
this bill.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:41:03 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR MYERS said  those remarks make him  question Amendment 1.                                                               
He suggested that it might be  better to leave the language as "a                                                               
bill,  appointment,  veto  or  other  measure."  He  related  his                                                               
understanding that the language  "or other measure" would include                                                               
the procedural votes.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER asked to have his  staff speak to whether the bill                                                               
should be  left as is or  if adding Amendment 1  would accomplish                                                               
the goal.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:42:44 PM                                                                                                                    
SCOTT   OGAN,   Staff,   Senator  Mike   Shower,   Alaska   State                                                               
Legislature,  Juneau, Alaska,  on behalf  of the  sponsor, stated                                                               
that in his experience binding  votes applied to procedural votes                                                               
on the  floor or  related to  the budget. He  noted that  when he                                                               
served in  the legislature, the  caucus would listen  to people's                                                               
concerns and  build consensus. He related  his understanding that                                                               
a  few  leaders  recently  dictated  the  caucus  policy  without                                                               
considering  member opinions.  He  deferred to  the committee  to                                                               
decide whether Amendment 1 would accomplish the goal.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:44:36 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR HUGHES  agreed that leadership viewpoints  change, but no                                                               
one should  be coerced  into voting. She  said she  preferred the                                                               
original language because it might apply to other votes.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
1:45:19 PM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR HOLLAND stated the goal of  Amendment 1 was to simplify the                                                               
bill, but it did not seem to do so. He withdrew Amendment 1.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
1:46:16 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  SHOWER  said  he  appreciated  the  discussion  and  the                                                               
opportunity to put some things on the record.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR SHOWER removed his objection.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:47:09 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR SHOWER  moved to  report SB  31, work  order 32-LS0303\B,                                                               
from  committee  with  individual  recommendations  and  attached                                                               
fiscal note(s).                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR HOLLAND heard  no objection, and CSSB  31(STA) was reported                                                               
from the Senate Judiciary Standing Committee.