Legislature(2005 - 2006)BUTROVICH 205
02/02/2005 01:30 PM Senate HEALTH, EDUCATION & SOCIAL SERVICES
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| SB60 | |
| SB22 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | SB 60 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | SB 22 | TELECONFERENCED | |
SB 22-MEDICAID COVERAGE FOR BIRTHING CENTERS
2:04:43 PM
RICHARD BENAVIDES, staff to Senator Bettye Davis introduced SB
22 and said Senator Davis feels strongly that SB 22 will help
control Medicaid costs. He added the facility fees for birthing
centers would always be lower than the hospital fees mainly
because birthing center births were low risk pregnancies.
CHAIR DYSON said the information he has seen indicates facility
charges for birthing centers and hospitals are comparative.
2:06:22 PM
MR. BENAVIDES submitted new information regarding cost
comparisons. He cited from the packet that Geneva Woods Birthing
Center, (Geneva Woods) charges a $1,500 facility fee, and
Providence Hospital facility fee is $4,000 excluding the
doctor's fee.
2:07:50 PM
CHAIR DYSON asked whether the hospital fee adds $1,000 for the
second night.
MR. BENAVIDES confirmed that and added there is no second night
at a birthing center because they are generally uncomplicated
births.
2:09:07 PM
CHAIR DYSON stated uncomplicated births with prepared parents at
a birthing center are adequate health care. He said the argument
is without the birthing center facility charge being Medicaid
reimbursement eligible, many poor people will have to choose the
more expensive hospital option, which then is Medicaid
reimbursable. He asked if any jurisdictions require birthing
centers have a formalized relationship with a hospital.
MR. BENAVIDES explained regarding complications, the mother
would transfer to a hospital.
2:11:13 PM
CHAIR DYSON noted many doctors and facilities have a formalized
relationship with a hospital. He expects the committee action
will be to refer SB 22 to the finance committee, which will then
deal with the more complicated issues such as the risk of SB 22
accelerating the Medicaid costs.
2:12:08 PM
CHAIR DYSON called Dr. Murray Butner to testify.
MURRAY BUTNER, MD, Cordova Community Medical Center, testified
that he has tried to refer some of his Denali Kid Care patients
to birthing centers but was informed that Denali Kid Care would
not cover the facility fee, thereby precluding the women from
choosing that option. He believes that SB 22 will save the state
substantial amounts of money.
CHAIR DYSON asked Dr. Butner if he had his child delivered in a
birthing center.
2:14:55 PM
DR. BUTNER answered yes. He stated his extensive knowledge of
the birthing process allowed him to choose the option. There are
pros and cons of birthing center births and of hospital births
but he expressed his opinion there should be an option for
Medicaid recipients.
CHAIR DYSON referred to a note he was handed that said state
Medicaid pays hospitals a reduced fee.
DR. BUTNER said he believes that to be true. He suggested that
somebody compare the facility costs and all associated fees with
the birthing center fee to get a true contrast.
2:16:49 PM
JENNIFER HELLER, registered nurse, Ilanka Health Center,
testified she called Providence Hospital and was quoted $3400
for the facility fee. The facility fee is $1500 at Geneva Woods.
Her support for SB 22 is based on providing choices for women.
2:18:09 PM
HOLLY STEINER, New Life Midwifery representative stated she is a
labor delivery nurse and a certified midwife. She clarified that
the birth center fee is a one-time fee, which does not multiply
the next day. It is rare to have someone stay longer than 24
hours. Her practice turns women away on a regular basis that
cannot afford the midwife fee. These women want the birthing
center service but are not afforded that option. Her experience
is the same women are charged $10,000 by the hospital for their
births. Since Medicaid is paying for this, it is costing the
state unnecessarily.
2:20:04 PM
Statistics show that midwifery care has been proven around the
world. The goal is not to make money but to provide good care to
women and decrease the infant mortality rate. Since 1997
statistics show a rise in midwifery births in the Mat-Su area.
Since 2002 they have opened up one new birth center and three
new midwifery businesses in the valley. In Juneau and Anchorage,
statistics show the same pattern. In the long run this would
definitely save the state money.
2:22:18 PM
CHAIR DYSON informed the room that SB 22 would pass out of
committee today and those who want to testify may wait for the
hearing in the Senate Finance Standing Committee.
2:22:54 PM
BARBARA NORTON, Geneva Woods Birth Center representative,
testified Geneva Woods has a written transfer agreement with
Providence Hospital. It is a requirement for their national
accreditation. She stated that while the facility charges for
the hospital may be contracted at a lower rate, intervention
increases costs with unnecessary procedures such as epidurals
and induced labor. The national Cesarean section rate is 27
percent, while birthing center Cesarean rate is between 3-6
percent in Alaska. She believes midwifery care decreases the
risk of Cesarean sections, thereby saving costs. The State of
Florida Legislature passed a bill several years ago with a goal
of having a midwife attend 25 percent of births because they
recognized the significant cost savings. She wants to ensure
that low-income women are not being denied the opportunity to
have low intervention births.
2:25:58 PM
SENATOR GREEN asked Ms. Norton to clarify her reference to
insurance companies.
MS. NORTON said most insurance companies pay 80 percent but some
insurance companies pay 100 percent of the birthing center
facility fees because they want to encourage people to use that
option.
SENATOR GREEN cautioned the committee not to overlook the
possibility that the federal government would not reimburse the
state for birthing center fees.
2:27:36 PM
CHAIR DYSON said he considered the option of making SB 22
conditional that Medicaid be available for birthing centers that
have an agreement with a hospital or as part of the national
accreditation.
2:28:21 PM
CHAIR DYSON asked Jack Nielson when his department would finish
the regulations for birthing centers.
JACK NIELSON, Department of Health and Social Services (DHSS)
stated that once the law is passed making birthing centers a
covered service, DHSS would put together regulations for the
reimbursement methodology. He commented the department is unsure
of federal approval. It could be a time consuming process and it
could be a general fund program.
2:29:37 PM
SENATOR GREEN agreed with Chair Dyson that it was a good idea to
make SB 22 contingent on federal approval for the waiver for
inclusion.
CHAIR DYSON advised Jack Nielson and Jerry Fuller he understood
DHSS was coming forth with regulations for birthing centers and
that is wasn't contingent on SB 22.
JERRY FULLER, Department of Health and Social Services (DHSS)
referred to legislation passed last year, which moved birthing
centers from a registration process to a licensing process. He
is not sure where DHSS is in accomplishing that.
CHAIR DYSON asked him to find out where the process is.
2:30:52 PM
MR. FULLER advised DHSS is neutral on SB 22 and he and Mr.
Nielson were there to answer questions.
SHARON EVANS, midwife at Mat-Su Midwifery, testified in 2004,
218 Denali Kid Care births were done by five birth centers in
the Anchorage area. Her position is the state would save
approximately $2500 per patient if SB 22 becomes law. Based on
these numbers the state would have saved $545,000 just on the
218 births alone, excluding the supplemental hospital costs.
2:33:12 PM
She asked the committee to support SB 22 so that needy women
will have options and the State of Alaska would save money.
2:34:15 PM
KAYE KANNE, Midwife's Association of Alaska representative,
addressed the issue of the federal government not matching funds
and advised the association would continue to work with the
federal government regarding recognition of birthing centers.
Meantime the state would still realize a savings. The hospital
facility fee does not include mandatory fetal monitoring, IVs,
epidurals, and Cesarean section rates. The hospital in Juneau
charges a minimum of $10,000, not including the physician fee.
She advised that Shelby Larsen is the contact person at the
state regarding drafting of the birthing center regulations and
that the association is part of that project. DHSS is involved
in a major regulation project and the birthing centers would be
part of that but it would take time to complete.
2:37:36 PM
SENATOR ELTON confirmed the major regulation project at DHSS.
2:38:30 PM
JACK JACOB, MD, and newborn specialist advised the committee to
ask critical questions. He said the statistics that he has heard
from the birthing centers are incomplete regarding costs. He
asked the committee to take into account the complications that
occur from birthing center births.
2:40:19 PM
DR. JACOBS said in his experience there is nothing unsafe about
birthing center births. What is unsafe is the infrastructure in
the United States. Other countries have created sound
infrastructure regarding safe practices. His impression is that
the birthing centers do deliver high-risk mothers. He advised
the committee to gather more information regarding complication
rates and death rates.
2:42:04 PM
CHAIR DYSON asked Dr. Jacobs whether he is inferring that
birthing centers contribute to higher death rates.
DR. JACOBS answered if patients are screened correctly and if
they are low risk patients, then the death rate should be zero.
CHAIR DYSON asked Dr. Jacob if he knew of any cases where
complications were exacerbated because the mother went to a
birthing center.
DR. JACOBS answered yes and said it is because appropriate
screening and infrastructure does not exist.
CHAIR DYSON asked Dr. Jacobs if he would recommend birthing
centers have a formal relationship with a hospital.
DR. JACOB responded that the issue is complex. There are a few
highly urban countries in Europe that have a good model.
Chair Dyson asked Dr. Jacobs if he is inferring that birthing
centers should be close to a hospital.
2:44:50 PM
DR. JACOBS replied if a birthing center is not close to a
hospital, there needs to be specific plan.
CHAIR DYSON announced a brief recess for discussion.
2:45:31 PM
CHAIR DYSON called the committee back on record.
2:46:34 PM
SENATOR WILKEN moved SB 22 out of committee with individual
recommendations and attached fiscal note. He added his concern
regarding cost. He stated the Denali Kid Care program costs the
state far beyond what was expected. The Medicaid climate incurs
extraordinary costs out of the general fund budget.
2:48:41 PM
SENATOR ELTON offered the Senate Finance Standing Committee
would look at costs given the explosion in health care costs and
additional fees charged at facilities. He believes increasing
options introduces a competitive business. He stated his
estimation is that SB 22 would save the state money.
2:50:21 PM
CHAIR DYSON recognized no objections and SB 22 moved out of
committee.
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