04/04/2012 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES

        HJR 20-ROADLESS RULE & CHUGACH AND TONGASS HYDRO                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:20:16 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR  WAGONER announced  HJR 20  to be  up for  consideration                                                               
[CSHJR 20(ENE) was before the committee].                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  PASKVAN moved  to bring  SCS CSHJR  20( ),  version 27-                                                               
LS0554\B, before the committee for purposes of discussion.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR WAGONER objected.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:20:44 PM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE KYLE  JOHANSEN, Alaska State  Legislature, sponsor                                                               
of HJR  20, explained  that 14  out of 15  hydro projects  in the                                                               
Tongass  and  the Chugach  are  subject  to protection  from  the                                                               
roadless rule  in the Tongass  and Chugach National Forests  as a                                                               
general  blanket. This  resolution asks  to exempt  hydroelectric                                                               
projects from the roadless rule.  The bottom line is without this                                                               
exemption  their  stated  goal  of  50  percent  of  energy  from                                                               
renewables by 2025 as well as  the President's goal of 25 percent                                                               
of energy generated in the  US coming from renewable resources by                                                               
2025 might not happen.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
He asked  that Representative  Thomas and  his staff  broaden the                                                               
scope  of the  resolution by  explaining the  changes in  the new                                                               
Senate committee substitute (SCS).                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
4:22:16 PM                                                                                                                    
KACI  SCHROEDER,  staff  to Representative  Bill  Thomas,  Alaska                                                               
State  Legislature,  Juneau,  AK,  explained  that  most  of  the                                                               
changes in  SCS CSHJR 20( )  occur on pages  2 and 3. On  page 2,                                                               
line 6,  a "whereas" is  inserted that points out  that Southeast                                                               
Alaska  has  large mineral  deposits  and  asks for  leniency  in                                                               
building roads towards them.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:23:08 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  FRENCH   said  the  first   of  two   "whereas"  clauses                                                               
referenced  "roadless  areas",  the  definition of  which  is  in                                                               
federal regulations,  and the next "whereas"  clause speaks about                                                               
"wilderness" and  asked the relationship, overlap  and the degree                                                               
of similarity between "roadless areas" and "wilderness".                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHANSEN said  he would  get that  information to                                                               
him by  the end of  the day, but that  only the Secretary  of the                                                               
Department  of Agriculture  can say  "yes"  or "no"  to roads  in                                                               
roadless  areas. In  Senator Stedman's  district, a  hydroproject                                                               
would  have  to  appeal  specifically to  the  Secretary  of  the                                                               
Department  of Interior  to simply  open a  road that  is already                                                               
constructed in order  to get trucks and equipment up  to the dam.                                                               
That project  alone would  offset a large  amount of  diesel fuel                                                               
usage in the forest.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR FRENCH  said he  asked because  the first  "whereas" says                                                               
that 57  percent of the  acreage in  the Tongass is  roadless and                                                               
the   second  "whereas"   says  an   additional  35   percent  is                                                               
wilderness; and he  guessed he was being asked to  add 35 percent                                                               
onto 57  percent to come  up with 92  percent and he  was curious                                                               
about the  overlap. His  second question  was whether  the "seven                                                               
projects" on page 2 were since May 28, 2010.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN  replied that  was his  understanding; he                                                               
had  checked with  the Forest  Service and  the Southeast  Alaska                                                               
Power  Agency  this  morning  who said  those  facts  were  still                                                               
accurate.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR FRENCH  said he  needed some  context to  know if  it's a                                                               
punitive or reasonable request.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN  replied that  he didn't bring  people to                                                               
testify  per the  request of  the  chair, so  he couldn't  answer                                                               
that, but their real  fear is that 14 out of  the 15 projects are                                                               
"absolutely crucial" to getting  communities connected and off of                                                               
diesel.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:26:45 PM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR  FRENCH asked  if those  14 projects  can't be  developed                                                               
without relief from this rule.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHANSEN  replied  that  they  would  like  these                                                               
projects  to  be   exempt  from  that  rule,   because  they  are                                                               
important.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR WAGONER  said the  exemptions would have  to be  for the                                                               
life  of  the  projects  as  long as  they  are  operational  for                                                               
maintenance purposes  as well as  construction and  remarked that                                                               
Cooper Lake  behind Kenai Lake  is the  same type of  small hydro                                                               
project.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR FRENCH  noted that  the resolution  was unanimous  in the                                                               
other body.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:28:29 PM                                                                                                                    
At ease from 4:28 to 4:29 p.m.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
4:29:21 PM                                                                                                                    
CO-CHAIR WAGONER removed his objection.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR PASKVAN  moved to  report SCS CSHJR  20( ),  version \B,                                                               
from committee to the next  committee of referral with individual                                                               
recommendations  and  attached  fiscal  note(s).  There  were  no                                                               
objections  and  SCS  CSHJR  20   (RES)  moved  from  the  Senate                                                               
Resources Standing Committee.