03/06/2018 03:00 PM House HEALTH & SOCIAL SERVICES

         HB 290-CRIMINAL JUSTICE COMMISSION: MEMBERSHIP                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:11:35 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TARR announced  that the  next order  of business                                                               
would be HOUSE  BILL NO. 290, "An Act relating  to the membership                                                               
of the Alaska  Criminal Justice Commission; and  providing for an                                                               
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:11:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VALERIE  DAVIDSON,  Commissioner,  Office  of  the  Commissioner,                                                               
Department  of Health  and Social  Services  (DHSS), stated  that                                                               
favorable   consideration  for   the  proposed   bill  would   be                                                               
appreciated.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TARR noted  that  an additional  fiscal note  had                                                               
been received from the Alaska Judicial Council.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:12:58 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER  asked Commissioner Davidson how  her role                                                               
on  the advisory  committee  would  be enhanced  by  status as  a                                                               
voting member as opposed to that as an advisory member.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
COMMISSIONER  DAVIDSON  stated  that a  voting  membership  would                                                               
allow the  Department of Health  and Social Services to  weigh in                                                               
on   policy  decisions   considered  by   the  Criminal   Justice                                                               
Commission.     Although  both  voting  and   non-voting  members                                                               
participated in the  deliberations of the meetings,  those with a                                                               
vote have a  greater opportunity to influence the  outcome of the                                                               
policy decisions.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
4:14:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  moved to  adopt Amendment 1,  labeled 30-                                                               
GH2586\A.2, Radford, 3/2/18, which read:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 15:                                                                                                           
          Delete "nonvoting member, serving ex officio, who                                                                     
     is a"                                                                                                                      
          Insert "[NONVOTING MEMBER, SERVING EX OFFICIO,                                                                        
     WHO IS A]"                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2, line 17:                                                                                                           
          Delete "nonvoting member, serving ex officio, who                                                                     
     is a"                                                                                                                      
          Insert "[NONVOTING MEMBER, SERVING EX OFFICIO,                                                                        
     WHO IS A]"                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TARR objected for discussion.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:14:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  stated that  the proposed bill  would add                                                               
two  more  voting  members  appointed  by  the  governor  to  the                                                               
commission.   He  offered his  belief that  the Criminal  Justice                                                               
Commission  would  become more  a  reflection  of the  governor's                                                               
cabinet, pointing out that the  majority of the 13 voting members                                                               
of  the board  were  appointed  and served  at  the  will of  the                                                               
governor.   He  opined that  the  purpose of  the commission  was                                                               
larger than passing on the agenda  of the governor.  He suggested                                                               
that,  as the  reasons  offered by  Commissioner  Davidson for  a                                                               
voting  membership   were  in  line   with  the   two  non-voting                                                               
legislative members,  it would be  "only proper that we  also add                                                               
these two legislative members to  the voting category."  He added                                                               
that  it would  preserve the  larger role  of the  commission for                                                               
making   recommendations   inclusive   of  the   judiciary,   the                                                               
executive, and the legislative branches.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:16:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSTON asked  about  the  voting membership  of                                                               
other   boards  and   commissions  with   legislative  ex-officio                                                               
members.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:17:24 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  EASTMAN   directed  attention  to  a   memo  from                                                               
Legislative  Legal  Services and  stated  that  it would  not  be                                                               
improper  for  the Criminal  Justice  Commission  to have  voting                                                               
members from  all three  branches of government.   He  offered an                                                               
example of another commission which  had voting members from both                                                               
the House and the Senate.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSTON emphasized that  these were very distinct                                                               
commissions with  very different  missions and asked  for another                                                               
example.   She asked if  there were any state  policy commissions                                                               
on which the legislature had voting members.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN said that he  would also like to have that                                                               
information.   He  suggested that  there were  very few,  if any,                                                               
similar  commissions which,  by  design, were  reflective of  all                                                               
three   branches   of   government   and  had   more   than   one                                                               
representative from each.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
4:19:11 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER stated  that it  would take  a systematic                                                               
review  to  recognize which  commissions  and  boards had  voting                                                               
legislative members.   He stated  that, although  this commission                                                               
did  authorize  judiciary  votes,   it  denied  that  legislative                                                               
members  have  the   right  to  vote,  which  he   deemed  to  be                                                               
inconsistent.     He  declared  his  support   for  the  proposed                                                               
Amendment 1.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:19:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KITO shared  that  he had  been  appointed, as  a                                                               
voting  member, to  an advisory  committee to  the Department  of                                                               
Education and Early Development  for bond reimbursement and grant                                                               
review.   He  reported  that this  position  was identified  very                                                               
specifically  in  statute.    He offered  his  belief  that  this                                                               
commission  was "a  little  bit  broader" and  that  it became  a                                                               
legislative  policy call.    He  allowed that  there  could be  a                                                               
concern if  there were recommendations from  the Criminal Justice                                                               
Commission  to the  Legislature while  there were  legislators on                                                               
the commission  who had  already voted,  and the  Legislature was                                                               
aware of  the direction of  those votes.   He offered  his belief                                                               
that  there could  be  a conflict  if  legislators were  offering                                                               
recommendations and having  a vote on those  recommendations.  He                                                               
stated  that he  could  see  reasons for  both  allowing and  not                                                               
allowing members to have voting rights  and that it was up to the                                                               
committee members to determine whether it was appropriate.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
4:21:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CLAMAN offered his belief  that it was a conscious                                                               
choice by the  commission to not have legislators  vote, as these                                                               
were policy recommendations to the  legislature.  The expectation                                                               
was that  legislators would make their  vote in the Capitol.   He                                                               
offered   his  belief   that  the   commission  appreciated   the                                                               
perspective from legislators for how  things would be received in                                                               
the Capitol,  and that  a vote by  legislators on  the commission                                                               
"would probably unduly impact the  commission deliberations."  He                                                               
declared that he did not support the proposed amendment.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  expressed his  agreement that this  was a                                                               
policy call,  and that the  proposed policy  would be to  add two                                                               
more voting  members to the  commission.  He suggested  that this                                                               
would  offer the  opportunity for  the commission  to have  joint                                                               
representation from all three branches of government.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
4:23:43 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TARR offered  her belief  that her  service on  a                                                               
council as a  non-voting member and a  citizen legislator allowed                                                               
the  council to  more  easily reach  a quorum  when  she was  not                                                               
present.   She expressed concern  that legislative  members could                                                               
limit or  discourage conversation regarding proposals  related to                                                               
funding as it may be unpopular.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER pointed out  that the original premise for                                                               
the Criminal Justice Commission  did not include the Commissioner                                                               
of the Department  of Health and Social Services.   He mused that                                                               
the premise for  much of the state criminal policy  was that much                                                               
of the  criminogenic process  was based on  behavior.   He stated                                                               
that, to  the extent  that behavioral  health was  increasingly a                                                               
factor  in state  correctional policy,  the  Commissioner of  the                                                               
Department of  Health and Social Services  already had tremendous                                                               
influence on the dialogue and  the policies that were pursued had                                                               
far more  impact than an advisory  position.  He added  that many                                                               
commissioners  had   multiple  responsibilities  on   boards  and                                                               
commissions,  and that  the designee  often  represented them  at                                                               
board meetings.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:28:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSTON asked  what the  legislators brought  to                                                               
the table at the commission in order to be voters.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  stated that the question  for legislators                                                               
interested in service on the  Criminal Justice Commission was for                                                               
how active they should be, similar  to the question for the level                                                               
of  activity for  the Commissioner  of Department  of Health  and                                                               
Social Services.   He shared  that his  desire to serve  would be                                                               
prioritized differently,  dependent on  the role  as a  voting or                                                               
non-voting member.   He  declared that the  message he  wanted to                                                               
send  was for  the  "legislators  to be  just  as  active as  our                                                               
Commissioner."  He acknowledged  that, although legislators could                                                               
quash  discussion   based  on  funding  concerns   as  non-voting                                                               
members, giving  legislators the  vote "tells them  its important                                                               
and  that  it  also  encourages the  Commission  as  their  going                                                               
forward and making decisions to fully include the legislators."                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
4:31:21 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   JOHNSTON  opined   that  the   commissioner  was                                                               
bringing  access  to the  department,  whereas  a legislator  was                                                               
bringing a political  agenda with the possibility to  act on that                                                               
agenda.   She acknowledged that this  could go "both ways."   She                                                               
pointed  out  that,  as  voting  members,  the  legislators  were                                                               
responsible  for taking  the policy  of the  commission to  their                                                               
respective bodies.   If  they were  non-voting members,  they did                                                               
not have to champion the policy.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
4:33:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER  stated  that  it could  be  argued  that                                                               
legislators could  be some of  the most effective members  of the                                                               
Criminal Justice Commission, based  on their broad experience and                                                               
perspective   for   state   policy,   funding   constraints   and                                                               
opportunities, and the necessity  of coordinating different state                                                               
policy and law.  He pointed  out that legislators were a distinct                                                               
minority  on  the  commission,  and he  opined  that  two  voting                                                               
legislators would  not be  able to  drive the  agenda.   He added                                                               
that   the   commission   was    an   advisory   commission   for                                                               
recommendations.   He  noted that,  as the  judges would  also be                                                               
able to  take votes  on criminal justice  policy when  cases came                                                               
through  the  judicial system  they  would  also be  required  to                                                               
implement the same policies.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE CLAMAN  pointed out  that members of  the judicial                                                               
branch on  the Criminal Justice  Commission were  often declining                                                               
and recusing themselves from voting  because they believed it was                                                               
a  policy question  that they  may  be called  upon to  act in  a                                                               
judicial  capacity.   He stated  that the  judiciary viewed  that                                                               
these issues "could come before them  on the bench and they don't                                                               
want to have taken a position."                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER  responded that this was  the practice and                                                               
not the policy, and that this supported his argument.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHNSTON  asked   whether,  once  the  commission                                                               
adopted  a   policy,  a  legislator  would   be  responsible  for                                                               
championing this policy in the legislature.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:36:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  EASTMAN offered  his belief  that passage  of the                                                               
proposed Amendment  1 would still  allow that the now  two voting                                                               
legislators  would still  be "outnumbered  more than  two to  one                                                               
simply by the governor's cabinet."   He declared that it would be                                                               
na?ve  to assume  that  the  governor's cabinet  did  not have  a                                                               
political agenda.   He opined  that the commission  members would                                                               
be well qualified  and had a concern and passion  for the work of                                                               
the  commission.   He  stated  that this  was  an opportunity  to                                                               
encourage   that  commitment   and   passion   by  "making   [the                                                               
legislators] a  full voting member."   He stated that  having the                                                               
legislators as a lively part of  the discussion was a value to be                                                               
brought back to  the legislature after a  recommendation had been                                                               
made.  He  opined that no commission member  would feel obligated                                                               
to support  a recommendation from  the commission,  regardless of                                                               
their vote.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:39:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   TARR  maintained   her  objection   to  proposed                                                               
Amendment 1.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
4:39:57 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote was  taken.  Representatives Eastman and Saddler                                                               
(alternate)  voted  in favor  of  Amendment  1.   Representatives                                                               
Tarr,  Kito,  Claman  (alternate),  Johnston,  and  Edgmon  voted                                                               
against it.  Therefore, Amendment 1 failed  by a vote of 2 yeas -                                                               
5 nays.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:40:48 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took a brief at-ease.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
4:41:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TARR brought the committee back to order.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
4:41:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER  said  that  he  could  not  support  the                                                               
proposed bill.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN  said that  adding a  crime victim  to the                                                               
commission  as a  voting member  was good  and would  add to  the                                                               
diversity of  discussion, although he  was less convinced  to the                                                               
necessary addition  of the commissioner  of Department  of Health                                                               
and Social Services as a voting member.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
4:42:54 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SADDLER  said  that,  as he  had  overlooked  the                                                               
addition of  a crime  victim as  a member  of the  commission, he                                                               
would revise his position on the bill.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TARR pointed out that  it was usually necessary to                                                               
add two voting members to a  commission to maintain an odd number                                                               
of members.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
4:43:37 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  EDGMON  moved  to  report  HB  290,  Version  30-                                                               
GH2586\A, out  of committee  with individual  recommendations and                                                               
the accompanying fiscal notes.   There being no objection, HB 290                                                               
was  moved from  the House  Health and  Social Services  Standing                                                               
Committee.