Legislature(2017 - 2018)BARNES 124
02/13/2018 08:00 AM House COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB264 | |
| HJR30 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| += | HB 264 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HJR 30 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
HB 264-SHOPPING BAG FEES & RECYCLING
8:03:10 AM
CO-CHAIR PARISH announced that the first order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 264, "An Act relating to a fee for disposable
shopping bags; relating to the sale of reusable shopping bags;
relating to the recycling of disposable shopping bags; and
providing for an effective date."
8:03:32 AM
REPRESENTATIVE ANDY JOSEPHSON, Alaska State Legislature, as
prime sponsor, presented HB 264. He announced his staff would
offer answers to questions asked at the last hearing of HB 264,
on 2/10/18. He remarked that the research into the questions
brought to light that there were more communities seeking to ban
plastic bags than he had thought there were. He said he
believes a ban may be "the preferred route." He said he asked
Legislative Legal and Research Services how far out the
effective date could be, because a delayed effective date may
give communities more chance to prepare. He indicated that he
has not yet received an answer.
8:05:44 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS restated a question he had asked
on 2/10/18, which is whether plastic bags present more of a
problem than other forms of plastic or Styrofoam trash.
REPRESENTATIVE JOSEPHSON deferred to Ms. Delaney.
8:06:33 AM
LISA DELANEY, Staff, Representative Andy Josephson, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative Josephson, prime
sponsor of HB 264, said she has not been able to find statistics
specific to Alaska but is still seeking an answer for
Representative Kreiss-Tomkins.
REPRESENTATIVE KREISS-TOMKINS said the question is important to
his understanding the impetus of HB 264. He said he sees
Styrofoam as a greater problem in Southeast Alaska. He said he
is interested in solving "the greatest harm."
REPRESENTATIVE JOSEPHSON pointed to the handout in the committee
packet of answers that Ms. Delaney had compiled, and he said
[plastic bags] are second, after fishing gear, as attractants to
fish and birds.
8:08:43 AM
CO-CHAIR PARISH return to public testimony, [which had remained
open after commencing on 2/10/18].
8:09:29 AM
PATRICIA CUE testified in support of HB 264. She offered the
following information from the Environmental Working Group
regarding plastic bags: Americans use more than 100 billion
bags per year; use per person is more than 300 annually; average
length of use is 12 minutes; the expectancy of each bag is up to
1,000 years; during the 2011 International Coastal Cleanup,
volunteers collected 120,450 pounds of bags in the United
States; in the ocean bags break down into small, plankton-size
particles and can outnumber plankton 6:1, and the particles
collect toxins at levels up to 1 million times the level found
in sea water; marine wildlife often mistake plastic bags for
food, especially sea turtles hunting jellyfish; parts of plastic
bags have been found blocking the breathing passages and
stomachs of whales, dolphins, seals, puffins, and turtles; 85
percent of all sea turtles will be injured or killed by plastic,
including endangered leatherback turtles that summer in
Massachusetts Bay; and 80 percent of marine debris comes from
land-based waste - there are five "garbage patches" [gyres] in
the Pacific Ocean.
MS. CUE relayed that retail businesses spend more than $4
billion annually to provide plastic bags. She said at the time
the information was published by the Environmental Working
Group, nearly 100 cities, towns, and counties around the U.S.
had banned plastic bags around the U.S. - half of them in the
past year. She said she supports a total ban on plastic bags
and thinks "Alaska is capable of moving forward with this House
bill."
8:13:39 AM
DAVID NEES, Research Associate, Alaska Policy Forum, observed
that representatives from large grocery stores had not weighed
in on the issue. He said in Alaska there is a preference to use
local control over state government control. He acknowledged
that many communities in Alaska "have, indeed, enacted local
control measures." He noted that Washington, D.C., is the only
place that has imposed a fee on plastic grocery bags. He said
there are three states that have banned their use but "three
times as many states that prohibit the ban on plastic bags." He
related that four states decided that labeling plastic bags for
recycling purposes is "a much more effective way of having them
enter the environment." He clarified that the idea is to keep
plastic bags out of the environment by encouraging people to
recycle them. Mr. Nees reiterated that it is a small percentage
of the U.S. that has placed fees on plastic bags. He added that
some localities have enacted the fee, including Boulder,
Colorado, Brownsville, Texas, New York, New York, and Portland,
Maine. He repeated that elsewhere there are bans or
prohibitions against bans. He opined that recycling would be
more effective and "any cost that's incurred on this is going to
be passed on to the consumers, so it will have a negative
economic impact on the economy of Alaska." He concluded, "We're
not particularly in favor of this bill; we'd prefer a recycling
program."
8:16:25 AM
MR. NEES, in response to Representative Saddler, said his
research shows about 17 states have either "a ban or a ban" -
most want a recycling program. He offered his understanding
that charging a fee for a bag is opposed in one or two states -
mostly in large cities, such as New York City, where most people
walk to grocery stores and need something in which to carry
their groceries; in those areas the use of recyclable bags and
the recycling of plastic bags is encouraged. He offered to send
a link from the National Conference of State Legislatures (NCSL)
outlining this information.
8:18:31 AM
ANNEMIEKE POWERS testified that she is a small business owner
and engineer, who has worked for the past 25-plus years cleaning
up contaminated sites. She stated her main concern with plastic
bags is the long-term environmental and economic impact of
pollution. She said even when people properly dispose of the
bags, too many of them blow out of trash bins and landfills and,
because they are so lightweight, are easily transported by water
and wind. She asked, "Who's going to clean up the pollution and
who's going to pay for it?" She added that her professional
experience has shown that "it is cheaper to prevent pollution at
the source than to pay for cleanup after the fact," and a bag
ban or fee does just that. She said in 2016 the World Economic
Forum predicted that at current rates of pollution, the world's
oceans would contain more plastic by weight than fish by the
year 2050. She said this impairment to the oceans and fishes
could have an economic impact to Alaskans. She said protecting
the fishing industry was one of the main reasons the City of
Cordova imposed a bag ban in 2016.
MS. POWERS said the effect of plastic bags on the food chains of
land mammals has not yet been assessed. At the Matanuska-
Susitna (Mat-Su) Experimental Farm, plastic bags have been found
in the stomachs of caribou and moose. She said Alaskans rely on
"the beauty and health of our land and waters for tourism,
hunting, and fishing," and she said she thinks Alaska should be
proactive in protecting these resources. She continued:
Since plastic pollution is widespread and not the sole
responsibility of any one person, incorporation, or
nation, most cleanup costs will likely be borne by
government entities, which means it will eventually be
paid for by the tax payers; that means by you and by
me. And if we don't act, our kids and grandkids will
bear any even larger cost, because this pollution
problem is not going to go away by itself, but if we
don't do anything, it will only grow. Banning or
imposing a fee on these bags certainly does not
eliminate all plastic pollution, but it is a very
simple means of eliminating one, widely used source,
and it's an easy way to start, because it's something
that can be controlled by the individual. I can't
control how companies package their goods, but I can
control how I carry them from the store to my car. My
household stopped using plastic grocery bags years
ago, and honestly it has not been a hardship at all.
8:21:26 AM
MS. POWERS, in response to Representative Saddler, said she
heard from one woman involved in the plastic bag ban in Cordova
that the ban has been successful. She said the plastic bag ban
passed in Wasilla would not go into effect until July.
8:23:09 AM
KARLA HART testified in support of HB 264. She said she has
traveled extensively in West Coast communities before and after
they banned plastic bags, and she has traveled globally in
China, Russia, Estonia, Finland, and Switzerland, and in all
those places it is routine for people who want a shopping bag to
pay for a thicker, reusable one. She offered her understanding
that people don't have an issue with this routine. She said the
framework for opposition from the National Federation of
Independent Business (NFIB) seemed to be based on concern that
store clerks would have difficulty estimating how many bags
customers would need, and she opined that is a weak argument
indicating the NFIB does not "have much against this ban,"
because in most of the communities she has visited, customers
decide how many bags they want to pay for and how they want to
bag their goods. Ms. Hart noted that the City of Seattle, whose
population she said she thinks is greater than that of the
entire state of Alaska, has had a bag ban in effect since [July
1, 2012], and all the major retailers in Alaska, such as Fred
Meyer and Safeway, also operate in Seattle and are already able
to handle [the ban]. Ms. Hart urged the committee to [impose
the fee on plastic bags, as proposed under HB 264], and then to
"tackle other plastic waste that Representative Kreiss-Tomkins
mentioned." She added, "There are certainly other things, but
this is available; it's a low-hanging fruit to start making a
change."
8:25:37 AM
SUSIE HAYES, Volunteer, Valley Community for Recycling
Solutions; Member, Mat-Su Zero Waste Committee and Plastic Bag
Committee, said she has lived in Alaska for 30 years and worked
for the Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G) until
retirement two years ago. She said she participated in local
spring cleanups and picks up trash whenever recreating in
Alaska. She said there is a litter problem in the state, part
of which is plastic. She said people see plastic bags in trees
and along fences, but they don't see the remnants of plastic
bags that shred into small pieces and blow into creeks and
rivers and flow into the sea.
MS. HAYES expressed concern about "the amount of unnecessary and
... toxic waste going into landfills." She said plastic bags
may be reused in homes, but eventually they will take up space
in landfills. She said there are over 100,000 people in her
borough and growing, and if additional landfills are built, then
they will overtake trails and parkland. She opined that single
use plastic bags are not necessary and there are so many good
alternatives. Cloth bags can be used for years and easily
washed and air-dried; paper bags are an alternative that can be
repurposed, recycled, and burned. She said when she has offered
reusable bags to people, she has heard people decline the offer
because they say they already have reusable bags - they just
need the encouragement to use them. Ms. Hayes concluded by
asking the committee to listen to its constituents and construct
legislation that encourages shoppers to bring their own bags and
discourages stores from distributing any free plastic bags.
8:28:53 AM
JAMES SQUYERS testified in opposition to HB 264. He stated, "I
am appalled at the seemingly insatiable desire to increase the
size, scope, footprint, and influence of government. This is a
fine example of government overreach penalizing responsible
members of society for the actions of the irresponsible ones."
Mr. Squyers offered his understanding that there is already a
$100,000 fine established statewide for littering, which he said
is evident from all the signs posted. He suggested an effort be
made to "clean up the state one litterbug, one junkie, and one
totalitarian politician at a time." He encouraged the committee
chair to put the proposed legislation in a drawer and leave it
there. He remarked on the number of bills the legislature had
introduced with only a 90-day session scheduled.
8:30:09 AM
MR. SQUYERS, in response to Representative Saddler, confirmed
that stores in Rural Deltana issue plastic bags, and he
emphasized that those bags fit all his trash cans at home, thus,
"everything gets recycled out here."
8:30:43 AM
WILLIAM HARRINGTON opined that it is "the irresponsible use by
the people who get these plastic bags in the stores that are
causing the problem." He said the City of Spenard [plants]
flowers for the tourists every year, and at the end of the
season, those flowers are put into black plastic bags, loaded
into a truck, and taken to the dump. He said it seems crazy to
do that with organic material. He emphasized that it is not
just store bags that are causing the problem. He said he
recycles plastic store bags as garbage bags, and he questioned
who does not throw his/her garbage bags into a plastic bag of
some sort in the kitchen. He wished the committee good luck
with "all this."
8:32:55 AM
MICHELLE PUTZ, Member, Bags for Change, said there are about 40
people in the group and about a dozen volunteers, including
students. She said studies show that plastic is getting into
food sources; toxins from plastics are effecting reproductive
health in children and infants and could affect the health of
fish; plastic, which is made from petrochemicals, lasts forever
in the environment; plastic bags can damage and kill wildlife,
litter communities, and increase the amount of waste that must
be shipped south; and using sustainable bags is a sustainable
behavior that is "easy to choose and to change." She relayed
that she had spoken with a woman in Sitka whose boat almost ran
into the rocks when the motor sucked up a plastic bag and
overheated.
MS. PUTZ said Bags for Change is working to try to pass a fee
that would pay for tools and reduce electric rates. The group
conducted a reusable bag roundup and giveaway, as well as a
poster contest to help people remember to bring their reusable
bags when shopping. She said a fee may help with reduction of
plastic bag use, because it would incentivize behavior change
and force customers to make a conscious decision to purchase
bags. She added that it also gives people a choice. She said
there was a poll done in Sitka, and one of the questions asked
whether single use plastic bags should be "a), banned; b),
provided, but for a fee that would be used to support Sitka
schools and to reduce residents' electric costs; c), handed out
for free; or d), no opinion." She said the results will
hopefully be in, in the next couple weeks. She said the group
also held an informal poll on Sitka Chatters, a Facebook page
she described as not progressive, and the results were as
follows: 195 said take no action; and 225 said take action,
whether a ban or a fee.
MS. PUTZ, regarding HB 264, said she would like the words
"operate year-round" deleted from page 4, line 1. She said she
thinks whether or not a business operates all year, it should
help pay the fees. She opined that Alaska's visitors should
help pay the costs of "the things that we do in our
communities."
8:37:46 AM
CO-CHAIR PARISH, after ascertaining that no one else who wished
to testify, closed public testimony on HB 264.
CO-CHAIR PARISH announced that HB 264 was held over.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| HJR030 ver D 2.6.18.pdf |
HCRA 2/13/2018 8:00:00 AM |
HJR 30 |
| HJR030 Sponsor Statement 2.6.18.pdf |
HCRA 2/13/2018 8:00:00 AM |
HJR 30 |
| HB264 - Opposing Document - NFIB 2.13.18.pdf |
HCRA 2/13/2018 8:00:00 AM |
HB 264 |
| HB264 Supporting Document 2.13.18.pdf |
HCRA 2/13/2018 8:00:00 AM |
HB 264 |
| HB 264 Opposing Documents 2.13.18.pdf |
HCRA 2/13/2018 8:00:00 AM |
HB 264 |
| HJR030 Supporting Document - Gabby Weiss 2.13.18.pdf |
HCRA 2/13/2018 8:00:00 AM |
HJR 30 |