03/29/2011 08:00 AM House STATE AFFAIRS

        HB 182-ELECTRONIC DISTRIBUTION OF AGENCY REPORTS                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:35:31 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR LYNN  announced that the  next order of business  was HOUSE                                                               
BILL NO. 182, "An Act  relating to distribution of annual reports                                                               
by state agencies."                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
8:36:00 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN,  Alaska State Legislature,  presented HB
 as  sponsor.   He explained  that currently  statutes mandate                                                               
that  state  departments  disseminate  printed  copies  of  their                                                               
annual reports, which he said made  him question if the state was                                                               
keeping up with available technology.   He said he considered the                                                               
idea of  requiring every piece  of paper published to  be instead                                                               
sent  electronically,  with  paper  copies  sent  out  only  upon                                                               
request; however, he  was told by Legislative  Legal and Research                                                               
Services  that  doing so  would  require  months  of work  by  an                                                               
attorney  to find  all the  references to  print requirements  in                                                               
statute.    He  said  Legislative  Legal  and  Research  Services                                                               
recommended that  the scope  of the bill  be narrowed  to include                                                               
annual  reports,   and  to   write  the   language  so   that  it                                                               
"encompasses everything  rather than  specifically going  to each                                                               
individual  chapter."   Representative Johansen  said he  had the                                                               
bill drafted  using that recommendation,  but was torn  in making                                                               
that decision and would value the committee's feedback.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN  indicated that the  proposed legislation                                                               
could save the state a few  million dollars, and he ventured that                                                               
it  would result  in  agency  staff having  more  time for  other                                                               
tasks.   He acknowledged  that there may  be some  concerns about                                                               
people who  do not have access  to computers, but said  he thinks                                                               
the idea is  worth discussing.  He related that  a librarian told                                                               
him  that HB  182 could  result  in many  more people  requesting                                                               
copies  made at  the library,  but he  offered his  understanding                                                               
that  many  of  the  reports   are  those  given  solely  to  the                                                               
legislature that  the public  may not  even wish  to print.   For                                                               
example,  he noted  that Title  29  is printed  annually, and  he                                                               
offered his understanding  that the cost for  printing 400 copies                                                               
of it  this year  was approximately $4,900.   He  further related                                                               
that printed  on the front  of those  copies is a  message saying                                                               
that the actual statutes are not  enclosed but can be accessed on                                                               
line.   He said most of  the reports are already  being published                                                               
on line,  while printed  copies are still  being made  because of                                                               
statutory requirement.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:44:20 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   KELLER  thanked   Representative  Johansen   for                                                               
bringing  the bill  forward, and  he  talked about  the chaos  of                                                               
filing all the paperwork that is  received.  He asked the sponsor                                                               
if he  is open to an  amendment to build  a web page linked  to a                                                               
legislative home page that would have links to all the reports.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
8:46:35 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN answered  yes.  He said he  does not know                                                               
if the executive branch has a system like that currently.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
8:47:35 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REED HARRIS,  Staff, Representative  Kyle Johansen,  Alaska State                                                               
Legislature, on behalf of Representative  Johansen, sponsor of HB
,  told Representative  Keller  that currently  the Alaska  on                                                               
line public notice system, set  up under AS 44.62.175, is similar                                                               
to  a public  records clearing  house, and  could be  used as  an                                                               
example in drafting an amendment.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER  said [the executive branch]  is developing                                                               
that system,  and he concurred that  it would be a  good starting                                                               
point toward creating a system that held all reports.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHANSEN said  he  thinks that  would  be a  good                                                               
starting point.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
8:49:04 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG  related   that  during  the  Sixteenth                                                               
Alaska State  Legislature, legislation  was passed  that required                                                               
all the  departments to include  a disclaimer  as to the  cost of                                                               
making each  publication.   He said  mandating such  a disclosure                                                               
may provide  helpful information  to the House  Finance Committee                                                               
when  it comes  time to  pass the  budget.   He suggested  HB 182                                                               
could be amended to make that happen.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:51:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  directed attention to page  2, lines 6-                                                               
9, which provide the definition  of "state agency", and asked the                                                               
sponsor to consider adding the  Alaska Permanent Fund Corporation                                                               
and  the Alaska  Housing  Finance Corporation  (AHFC).   Next  he                                                               
suggested  compiling  a  list  of   all  the  publications  being                                                               
considered for conversion to  electronic publication to determine                                                               
if some  of them may be  publications people would still  want to                                                               
have printed  in hard copy.   He named  the annual report  of the                                                               
state as one such publication.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:53:02 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  JOHANSEN noted  that  there  are "thresholds  and                                                               
triggers" in  statute related to  how many reports there  are and                                                               
how much  those reports cost.   He said the Office  of Management                                                               
and  Budget's  fiscal note  is  indeterminate,  because the  cost                                                               
depends on  the number  of copies  printed.   He then  noted that                                                               
Representative  Hawker, who  is on  the House  Finance Committee,                                                               
signed on as a  co-sponsor of HB 182.  He  said he has confidence                                                               
in the work the House Finance Committee  will do on the bill.  He                                                               
acknowledged that  the Alaska Permanent Fund  Corporation has had                                                               
some concerns  related to  the bill,  and he  said he  would work                                                               
with the corporation to iron out those issues.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:55:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  PETERSEN said  he likes  the concept  of reducing                                                               
paper work.   In response  to Representative  Petersen's previous                                                               
remark about the librarian's comment,  he suggested that one copy                                                               
of each  report could be  sent to the  library for people  to see                                                               
there as a reference material.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN said he thinks  the concern that under HB
 some  people may  not have  access to  reports is  valid, but                                                               
said  he does  not think  giving  a copy  of all  the reports  to                                                               
libraries is  a good  idea.   He ventured  that most  reports are                                                               
accessed by those with computers in their offices.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:58:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. HARRIS  pointed out that the  language on page 2,  lines 1-5,                                                               
allows a member  of the public to order printed  copies of annual                                                               
reports  from  state agencies,  and  further  allows those  state                                                               
agencies to waive the fees if they  determine that to do so is in                                                               
the public interest.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE JOHANSEN  said he  envisions having a  public list                                                               
of all  copies made and waivers  granted.  He said  he thinks the                                                               
aforementioned language  would address  Representative Petersen's                                                               
previously stated concern.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:59:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON opined that  the annual revenue source book                                                               
is  vital  to  the  functioning of  the  legislature  and  should                                                               
continue to  be made available  in hard  copy.  Another  issue he                                                               
asked the  sponsor to consider  is that often charts  and graphs,                                                               
which often  designate certain  statistics through  color coding,                                                               
do not  read well when  printed in black and  white.  He  said he                                                               
would like  there to be some  way to guarantee that  reports with                                                               
such color  charts and  graphs are legible  for those  people who                                                               
have black  and white  printers and want  to print  those reports                                                               
from the on line source.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:02:05 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KELLER referred again  to the previously mentioned                                                               
Alaska On Line  Public Notice System, and talked  about many ways                                                               
to conduct searches on the system.   He indicated that the system                                                               
uses  Really  Simple Syndication  (RSS),  and  he explained  that                                                               
people can get the RSS feed on their computers.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:03:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  opined that there is  merit in "looking                                                               
into the suggestion  that this bill makes."  He  related that the                                                               
many parts  of the district  he represents are among  the poorest                                                               
in  Anchorage.   He  said  a few  years  ago,  the Federation  of                                                               
Community  Councils wanted  to switch  to 100  percent electronic                                                               
distribution  of community  council newsletters,  but that  would                                                               
not  work  in  his  district  where most  people  do  not  own  a                                                               
computer.   He said  he sent  out a survey  in a  newsletter, and                                                               
noted that a majority  of those who did respond did  not do so on                                                               
line.   He said the librarians  in his district are  "spread very                                                               
thin" already, and he expressed  concern that under HB 182, there                                                               
would  be  "more requests  on  librarians"  with no  extra  funds                                                               
offered, which would result in an unfunded mandate.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR LYNN said he cannot imagine a "run on libraries."                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said the chair might be surprised.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:06:39 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   P.  WILSON   questioned  Mr.   Harris'  previous                                                               
statement  that the  Alaska State  Archives is  required to  make                                                               
four copies of  [reports].  She explained that  that is difficult                                                               
to  believe because  of the  amount of  storage space  that would                                                               
require.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR.  HARRIS  said  he  does  not  know  the  exact  statute,  but                                                               
confirmed he read that requirement in statute.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  P.  WILSON  opined   that  the  committee  should                                                               
consider this issue in conjunction with HB 182.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:08:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR LYNN said  he likes HB 182.   He asked the  sponsor what he                                                               
wants to do with the bill before moving it out of committee.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:09:14 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   JOHANSEN,   regarding  Representative   Seaton's                                                               
concern  about  charts and  graphs  printed  on black  and  white                                                               
printers,  said he  thinks  there is  a way  to  figure out  that                                                               
issue.   He said Representative  Wilson made a valid  point about                                                               
the  storage of  archives, and  recalled  a recent  flood at  the                                                               
Alaska  State Archive  building  in Juneau,  when  people had  to                                                               
scramble to  save historical documents.   He asked  the committee                                                               
members to contemplate the changes needed  in HB 182, and said he                                                               
would send  his staff to  members' offices to work  on solutions.                                                               
He expressed  his willingness to work  on the bill over  the next                                                               
year.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR LYNN reiterated that he likes HB 182.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:11:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR LYNN announced that HB 182 was held over.