03/22/2005 08:00 AM House COMMUNITY & REGIONAL AFFAIRS
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB184 | |
| HB27 | |
| Adjourn |
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HB 184 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | HB 27 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 157 | TELECONFERENCED | |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE COMMUNITY AND REGIONAL AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE
March 22, 2005
8:08 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Kurt Olson, Co-Chair
Representative Bill Thomas, Co-Chair
Representative Pete Kott
Representative Gabrielle LeDoux
Representative Mark Neuman
Representative Sharon Cissna
Representative Woodie Salmon
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
HOUSE BILL NO. 184
"An Act relating to firearms."
- MOVED HB 184 OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 27
"An Act relating to an optional exemption from municipal
property taxes on certain residences of law enforcement
officers."
- MOVED CSHB 27(CRA) OUT OF COMMITTEE
SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 157
"An Act clarifying the powers of electric or telephone
cooperatives to become members of or own stock in other
entities."
- BILL HEARING CANCELED
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HB 184
SHORT TITLE: MUNICIPAL FIREARM ORDINANCES
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) CHENAULT
02/28/05 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/05 (H) CRA, JUD
03/22/05 (H) CRA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 124
BILL: HB 27
SHORT TITLE: MUNI PROP TAX EXEMPTION FOR POLICE HOMES
SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) CHENAULT, GRUENBERG
01/10/05 (H) PREFILE RELEASED 12/30/04
01/10/05 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/10/05 (H) CRA, FIN
02/15/05 (H) CRA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 124
02/15/05 (H) Heard & Held
02/15/05 (H) MINUTE(CRA)
03/22/05 (H) CRA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 124
WITNESS REGISTER
SUE WRIGHT, Staff
to Representative Mike Chenault
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented HB 184 on behalf of the sponsor,
Representative Chenault.
BRIAN JUDY, Alaska State Liaison
National Rifle Association (NRA)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 184.
JENNIFER YUHAS, Executive Director
Alaska Outdoor Council (AOC)
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 184.
STEVE VAN SANT, State Assessor
Division of Community Advocacy
Department of Commerce, Community, & Economic Development
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: During discussion of HB 184, cautioned the
committee with respect to the suggestion regarding local
communities not being able to tax firearms.
SCOTT HAMANN
Kenai, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 184.
REPRESENTATIVE MAX GRUENBERG
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Spoke as the prime co-sponsor of HB 184.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CO-CHAIR BILL THOMAS called the House Community and Regional
Affairs Standing Committee meeting to order at 8:08:04 AM.
Representatives Olson, Thomas, LeDoux, Neuman, Cissna, and
Salmon were present at the call to order. Representative Kott
arrived as the meeting was in progress.
HB 184-MUNICIPAL FIREARM ORDINANCES
CO-CHAIR THOMAS announced that the first order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 184, "An Act relating to firearms."
8:08:25 AM
SUE WRIGHT, Staff to Representative Mike Chenault, Alaska State
Legislature, explained that HB 184 would ensure that citizens
would be able to look to one law with regard to firearm
regulations. Currently, 18 communities that have law differing
from state statute regarding the use and carrying of firearms.
This legislation would bring uniformity to the state on the
matter of firearm regulations.
8:09:45 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA questioned what other areas of personal
choice for which the law is uniform throughout the state. She
questioned the purpose of local government if there is one law.
MS. WRIGHT related her personal experience in which she lives on
the "Duck Flats" in the City of Kenai. It's legal to discharge
a firearm on the Duck Flats, but not legal within other areas of
the city. She emphasized that there isn't a firm line or map
specifying where it's legal to discharge a firearm and where
it's not. However, one of the aggravating factors when one
defends himself or herself in an assault can be a local
ordinance. This law ensures uniformity, she emphasized.
8:12:05 AM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX commented that she has no problem with the
intent of HB 184. However, she said she isn't certain that it
actually accomplishes the intent because it's left to the courts
to determine what law is inconsistent with another law.
Representative LeDoux opined that a local law could never be
ruled inconsistent with a state law. Therefore, she suggested
that a more appropriate intent would be that "state law preempts
all local law with respect to firearms" and then specify what a
municipality may not enact or enforce. She further opined that
HB 184 is too open to interpretation to accomplish the goal.
MS. WRIGHT mentioned that there has been a proposed conceptual
amendment from the National Rifle Association (NRA), but the
sponsor chose not to [incorporate] it at this time. She
indicated that [the sponsor] elected to have it corrected in the
Senate. She related her belief that the proposed conceptual
amendment would appease Representative LeDoux's concern. She
offered to work with Representative LeDoux on this "and allow
the bill to pass out of committee."
8:14:28 AM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN said that he supports HB 184, which brings
clarity with regard to how guns can be handled in different
communities.
8:15:45 AM
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA pointed out that this matter would look
very different from different political views. She highlighted
that urban centers tend to be quite different than the outlying
areas, which may have different needs with regard to firearms.
If urban centers control what is happening at the state level,
rural areas could end up having laws that are abhorrent to local
populations. Therefore, in a state as diverse and large as
Alaska, it's better to have local government make decisions [on
this matter]. She opined that "big brother," as exemplified
with the federal government, is onerous. "I just think it's a
bad idea having big government dominating any kind of thing that
I can think of," she said.
8:18:37 AM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN opined that the bottom line is that
criminals don't obey gun laws. This legislation protects those
who use guns in the appropriate manner. Representative Neuman
highlighted the following language from the Alaska State
Constitution: "The individual right to keep and bear arms shall
not be denied or infringed by the State or a political
subdivision of the State."
8:20:02 AM
BRIAN JUDY, Alaska State Liaison, National Rifle Association
(NRA), urged support for HB 184, which strengthens and broadens
Alaska's existing firearm preemption statute. Mr. Judy provided
the following testimony:
The current law only narrowly limits local
governments' ability to impose two types of
restrictions. First, on the right to own or possess
firearms within a residence. And second, on the
transportation of unloaded firearms. Any other
restrictions may be imposed by local municipalities.
Further, the existing law would allow restrictions in
the two aforementioned categories if ratified by the
voters, and this is not right. Fundamental
constitutional rights of a minority should not be able
to be limited just because a majority of voters
support such a restriction. House Bill 184 will
provide for a standardization of all firearms laws
throughout the State of Alaska based on current and
future statutes enacted by the state legislature. It
would make null and void any local ordinances that are
more or less restrictive than current state law. And
it's important to emphasize, however, that this bill
will in no way lessen the current body of federal and
state firearms laws. The problem with local firearms
ordinances is one of sheer variety. Where no uniform
state laws are in place, the result can be a complex
patchwork of restrictions that change from one local
jurisdiction to the next. But it's unreasonable to
require citizens, whether they're residents or ...
persons visiting from out of state, to memorize a
myriad of varying laws. Where inconsistent ordinances
are in place, law-abiding citizens with no criminal
intent are placed in jeopardy of running afoul of
restrictions they don't even know exist. Further,
anti-gun proposals and restrictive ordinances at the
local level threaten honest firearm owners' rights and
the fundamental American principle of equal protection
under the law for all citizens. The necessary
criminal laws should be enacted on the state level
because the uniform application of law treats all
citizens fairly and because all citizens in the state
should benefit from and be protected equally by those
laws which are determined to be needed. Additionally,
House Bill 184 ... will allow law enforcement to
concentrate on the real criminal element ....
Enforcement of unwitting violations by otherwise law-
abiding citizens diverts scarce law enforcement
resources. Uniformity is what law-abiding citizens
and law enforcement officials need and deserve. To
prevent the problems associated with restrictive local
ordinances, 46 states have now enacted firearm
preemption laws. The current Alaska law is among the
weakest. On behalf of the NRA members and all firearm
owners in Alaska, I urge your support for this
legislation.
8:23:22 AM
MR. JUDY then turned to the earlier remark that in the future
urban centers could control rural areas. However, Mr. Judy
emphasized that laws passed by the legislature will impact the
entire state, regardless of this law. This legislation would at
least ensure that abhorrent laws wouldn't be passed in some
areas of the state. Mr. Judy then turned to Representative
LeDoux's comment with regard to the possible inconsistency that
the courts could create, with which he agreed. Mr. Judy also
agreed that there could be better language. This legislation,
he opined, uses language from Washington State's preemption law,
which was passed some time ago. Mr. Judy noted that he spoke
with the sponsor regarding a language [change]. However, he
agreed with the sponsor's desire to move the legislation today
and continue working on it through the process.
8:25:10 AM
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if Mr. Judy's language specifically
mentions preemption.
MR. JUDY suggested deleting the language that's inconsistent
with state law and use language that's more of a command. He
suggested the following language: "A municipality may not enact
or enforce any ordinance regarding the possession, ownership,
sale, transfer, use, carrying, transportation, taxation,
licensing, or registration of firearms."
REPRESENTATIVE LEDOUX asked if the proposed language should
specifically address concealed weapons.
MR. JUDY replied no, because [the legislation] is saying that
local municipalities can't enact or enforce any such ordinances.
The state law already addresses concealed firearms and how
firearms may be carried.
8:27:14 AM
JENNIFER YUHAS, Executive Director, Alaska Outdoor Council
(AOC), provided the following testimony:
On behalf of our board of directors of the Alaska
Outdoor Council representing over 54 member clubs and
nearly 4,000 associate members for a collective
membership of nearly 12,000 individuals, which is also
the recognized state association for the National
Rifle Association, I would like to thank
Representative Chenault for his sponsorship of HB 184
and offer our enthusiastic support of this
legislation. ... We support the amendments offered by
the NRA. House Bill 184 recognizes the
constitutionally guaranteed right of private
individuals to keep and bear arms and corrects any
oversight that may have been unintentionally
restrictive of that right. This legislation also
eliminates any possible confusion that may be caused
to the private law-abiding citizen as they exercise
that right. The committee has already discussed the
consequences of refusing to standardize firearm
possession jeopardizing those with the best intentions
to unrealistic expectations and unnecessarily
burdening our enforcement authorities. While many
matters should remain under local control, no
municipality should have the authority to restrict any
constitutionally guaranteed right to a U.S. citizen.
This committee will be upholding the creational
founding document of our great country and our state
by supporting this legislation today with its passage
and will enjoy the full support of the Alaska Outdoor
Council in doing so. Please pass this legislation
today.
8:28:55 AM
STEVE VAN SANT, State Assessor, Division of Community Advocacy,
Department of Commerce, Community, & Economic Development
(DCCED), said that he is present to answer questions and is not
taking a position on HB 184. However, he cautioned the
committee with respect to Mr. Judy's earlier suggestion
regarding local communities not being able to tax firearms
because that can fall under the sales tax ordinances throughout
the state.
8:29:40 AM
SCOTT HAMANN testified in support of HB 184. As a citizen of
Alaska, Mr. Hamann related that he travels throughout the state
and shouldn't have to be concerned with being pulled over and
found not to be abiding by the local law. He urged the
committee to pass HB 184.
8:31:16 AM
REPRESENTATIVE NEUMAN moved to report HB 184 out of committee
with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal
notes.
REPRESENTATIVE CISSNA objected.
8:31:22 AM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Neuman, Salmon,
Kott, LeDoux, Olson, and Thomas voted in favor of reporting HB
184 from committee. Representative Cissna voted against it.
Therefore, HB 184 was reported out of the House Community and
Regional Affairs Standing Committee by a vote of 6-1.
HB 27-MUNI PROP TAX EXEMPTION FOR POLICE HOMES
CO-CHAIR THOMAS announced that the final order of business would
be HOUSE BILL NO. 27, "An Act relating to an optional exemption
from municipal property taxes on certain residences of law
enforcement officers." [Before the committee is CSHB 27,
Version 24-LS0182\F, Cook, 2/14/05.]
8:32:29 AM
REPRESENTATIVE MAX GRUENBERG, Alaska State Legislature, prime
co-sponsor, reviewed the differences between the proposed
committee substitute (CS), Version F, and the original
legislation. On page 1, line 8, the language, "primary
permanent place of abode" was inserted in order to address the
primary place that the law enforcement officer lives. The
language on page 1, lines 8-10, specifies that no more than two
exemptions for the same property are allowed. The legislation
specifies that the ordinance can specify [that the eligible
area] falls into one or more of the categories listed on page 2.
Representative Gruenberg related that Chief Monegan, Anchorage
Police Department, was planning on testifying in support of HB
27, although he may be in court at this time. He related his
understanding that there is a plan to offer an amendment to
raise the exemption from "$10,000" to "$150,000", which he said
he would support.
8:35:36 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KOTT moved that the committee adopt Amendment 1
[labeled 24-LS0182\F.1, Cook, 3/1/05], which read:
Page 1, line 6:
Delete "$10,000"
Insert "$150,000"
REPRESENTATIVE KOTT stated that Amendment 1 would make the
proposed exemption in HB 27 conform to existing municipal
ordinances providing property tax exemptions for senior citizens
and disabled veterans.
There being no objection, Amendment 1 was adopted.
8:36:33 AM
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG noted that the committee packet should
include a resolution from Mountain View Community Council.
8:36:42 AM
REPRESENTATIVE KOTT moved to report CSHB 27, Version 24-
LS0182\F, Cook, 2/14/05, as amended, out of committee with
individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes.
There being no objection, CSHB 27(CRA) was reported from the
House Community and Regional Affairs Standing Committee.
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Community and Regional Affairs Standing Committee meeting was
adjourned at 8:37:02 AM.
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