Legislature(2015 - 2016)BARNES 124
03/30/2015 01:00 PM House RESOURCES
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HJR18 | |
| HB153 | |
| Confirmation(s): Fisherman's Fund Advisory and Appeals Council | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | HJR 18 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 153 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
HB 153-PALMER HAY FLATS GAME REFUGE
1:54:45 PM
CO-CHAIR TALERICO announced that the next order of business is
HOUSE BILL NO. 153, "An Act expanding the Palmer Hay Flats State
Game Refuge."
1:55:15 PM
REPRESENTATIVE JIM COLVER, Alaska State Legislature, as the
sponsor introduced HB 153, explaining it would expand the
boundary of the Palmer Hay Flats State Game Refuge. He said the
refuge was established in 1975 by the legislature and is an area
where the [1964] earthquake caused the land to drop two feet, so
what was once uplands became lowlands and wetlands. He said the
bill simply incorporates about 1,360 acres that were donated and
acquired between 1989 and 2013. Drawing attention to the maps
in the committee packet, he said the lands with [red hatching]
are the lands described and that would be added to the refuge by
the bill. He noted that the legal description has been vetted
four times and reviewed by the survey section at the Department
of Natural Resources (DNR). He said the area is important
habitat for waterfowl, shorebirds, and a number of species of
salmon and fish, as well as important winter range for moose. A
number of different user groups use the area, including hunters,
recreationists, and trappers, plus there is an advocacy group
called Alaskans for Palmer Hay Flats State Game Refuge. He said
there has been no opposition to the bill and there is support
from outdoor organizations, the Board of Game, local elementary
school kids, and the Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G).
He further pointed out that the bill has a zero fiscal note and
that a proposed committee substitute cleans up the legal
descriptions that are in the original bill.
1:59:25 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER moved to adopt the proposed committee
substitute (CS), labeled 29-LS0653\H, Bullard, 3/28/15, as the
working document. There being no objection, Version H was
before the committee.
1:59:56 PM
REPRESENTATIVE COLVER explained the proposed changes that
Version H would make to the original bill. He drew attention to
page 2, line 15, of the original bill which states "Section 28"
and noted that Version H, lines 15-16, clean up the language for
within Section 28 of Township 17 North, Range 1 East, Seward
Meridian, Lots 1-2, by adding the north half of the southwest
quarter to the string of legal descriptions. This is a
description of some of the new lands added. He then drew
attention to page 3 of Version H, lines 11, 15, and 18, which
correctly state "U.S. Survey No. 9023". He explained that this
survey number had transposed digits in the original bill and
that this survey was done for the conveyance of the railroad
from the federal government to the state.
DAVID SCOTT, Staff, Representative Jim Colver, Alaska State
Legislature, added that Legislative Legal and Research Services
is a little wary of these kinds of bills and wants them double-
checked multiple times by the various state departments.
2:02:26 PM
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON inquired whether access to private land
would be blocked by adding the new land to the refuge.
REPRESENTATIVE COLVER replied he does not believe so. He said
that as far as he knows there is no limitation to access and
moving around within this state land. It is simply that it is
designated as a game refuge.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON asked whether any of the refuge land is
off limits to motorized vehicles.
REPRESENTATIVE COLVER deferred to ADF&G, but said he doesn't
think so because otherwise the Alaska Outdoor Council would not
have endorsed the bill and the council's letter of support
references this.
REPRESENTATIVE JOHNSON specified he wants to be cautious that
there is no blocking of access to private land.
BRUCE DALE, Acting Director, Division of Wildlife Conservation,
Alaska Department of Fish & Game (ADF&G), responded that to the
department's knowledge there is no access blocked and that is
not the intent of the department. There should be free access
to any inholdings.
2:04:36 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON asked whether ADF&G or DNR has control of
the access, rights-of-way, and winter trails.
MR. DALE answered that snow machines are authorized from
November 9 to March 31 as long as there is sufficient snow
cover, and they can go anywhere they want. Four wheelers are
authorized on designated trails only and there are numerous
access points. There are some restrictions on outboard motor
horsepower on some of the waterways.
REPRESENTATIVE SEATON said he wants to make it clear that DNR
does have restrictions for overland permits on any wetlands and
generally it is winter compatible.
2:05:50 PM
REPRESENTATIVE TARR observed from the map that the parcel that
would be added on the east side of the refuge has privately
owned parcels abutting it on the south side. Noting that land
acquisition has been ongoing for a decade or more, she inquired
whether there will be an effort going forward to try to bring
these other private lands into the refuge.
MR. DALE replied he does not know of any efforts to bring those
particular lands into the refuge at this time.
2:07:07 PM
CO-CHAIR TALERICO opened public testimony.
ROD ARNO, Executive Director, Alaska Outdoor Council (AOC),
testified in support of HB 153 with the correction on the
boundaries. He noted that this area is on the edge of urban
sprawl and for that reason AOC supports adding this additional
protection of the areas that have been acquired. The addition
on the west side of lands up to Cottonwood Creek is a very
important access point for folks who hunt waterfowl and fish in
the Hay Flats area. This is important critical habitat for
protection, he said, and AOC supports that and supports the
management of access on that land.
2:09:12 PM
TOM ROTHE, Duck Hunter, testified in support of HB 153,
explaining he is a duck hunter and frequent Hay Flats user. He
urged the committee and the entire legislature to support this
bill because it clarifies things that have been lingering in
terms of management for a number of years. He is retired from
ADF&G after 25 years and part of what he did for ADF&G's
waterfowl program was to work with refuges and local landowners
to acquire some of these parcels in partnership with many other
entities. The purpose was largely to provide legal access to
the refuge. For example, Cottonwood Creek was secured and is a
legal access point. The property on the east side of the refuge
is the primary access point and was private land prior to its
acquisition. These parcels have been really important in
securing easy ways for the public to get in and ADF&G has done a
nice job of starting to improve those for users. A total of
2,400 acres has been acquired since 1990 and much of that is
tremendous habitat for waterfowl, moose, and salmon. All of
these acquisitions were done pretty much without the benefit of
appropriated funds from the state. Partners and federal wetland
grants brought over $1.4 million to the table for the benefit of
Alaskans. He offered his appreciation for Co-Chair Talerico's
bill for license fee increases [HB 137] because the fees for
duck stamps are applied for these kinds of things - seed money
to put together packages to get good habitat and public access.
Mr. Rothe pointed out that the landowners were all willing and
for the most part the properties are largely unbuildable because
they are wetlands. So, when approached, those folks received
good value for their properties as well as tax benefits in those
cases where there were donations. If included in the refuge,
these new acquisitions will not create any more restrictions on
those lands than is currently available. The refuge is managed
under a well-written management plan that looks at all the uses
that have been negotiated over the years with the public through
the public process. It sets up a regime to both protect habitat
and allow public uses. The most important parts of this bill
are that it fulfills promises made to those partners who stepped
up and put in over a million dollars, plus it consolidates
management authority in terms of enforcement, habitat
enhancement projects, or other things. He drew attention to the
letter of support from the Board of Game.
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER thanked Mr. Rothe for his thorough and
convincing testimony.
2:14:23 PM
HERMAN GRIESE, Alaskans for Palmer Hay Flats State Game Refuge,
testified in support of HB 153, saying his group has been
involved in the refuge for over 10 years trying to clean up the
trash and car bodies that were strewn throughout the access
points on the refuge. His group worked with granting agencies
to work with ADF&G to improve the access sites. For example,
along the Glenn Highway at the Reflections Lake turnout his
group is finishing a wildlife observation tower that will be
turned over to the state. The goal of his group is to maintain
opportunity for access by hunters, fishers, and trappers, as
well as by children from local schools for educational
opportunities. Another goal is to maintain the habitat value
for the wildlife and fisheries resources on the refuge. He said
his group enthusiastically supports this legislation. About 75
families and 25 donors are members of the group and have
provided many dedicated hours and about $800,000 has been
invested in the refuge to try to improve the looks, access, and
opportunities. Mr. Griese pointed out that there are two
particular sites. The primary access site on the west side is
at Cottonwood Creek and is under a DNR Interagency Land
Management Agreement (ILMA). Some of those investments and
access are still on that Interagency Land Management Agreement
(ILMA) land. He urged that these [ILMA] lands be added to the
boundary, saying that letters have been sent to the governor in
the past and, thanks to Mr. Rothe, people are now at the table
discussing that. Another site is on the eastern side. It can
be seen on the map that the boundary for the new change includes
several channels that are now dry for the most part and it would
be good if a line could be drawn across those channels and
include them as well. They were considered part of an omission
in the past because of wetland or water issues. But things are
changing as it is a very dynamic area and decades down the road
more changes will be looked at as well.
2:18:24 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER, regarding Mr. Griese's concerns about
improving the quality of access as part of this legislation by
bringing in this additional land, asked whether conversations
have been held with ADF&G or other state folks who would make
those recommendations to the legislature.
MR. GRIESE responded that his organization has been working very
closely with ADF&G, which is the regulatory agency on the access
for all these sites. He said there hasn't been any controversy
except for some of the areas where there is increasing use of
all-terrain vehicles on an existing and allowable trail. A
proposal is currently being looked at to deal with repairing
some of that damage, otherwise there is very close working
cooperation with ADF&G on that.
2:19:46 PM
REPRESENTATIVE TARR inquired whether the east side site
mentioned by Mr. Griese is a site currently under consideration.
MR. GRIESE answered that the area on the eastern end is not in
the current legislation. It has been proposed in years past and
his organization has written letters requesting that boundary
change. He said it's difficult to advise individuals entering
that eastern side as to where they are in the refuge because
there are islands of land that are in the refuge and channels
that are not. Now that it is all dry there is access in those
areas and people wanting to recreate there would like to know
whether or not they are in the refuge.
2:20:59 PM
LARRY ENGLE testified in support of HB 153, saying he is a long-
time user of the Palmer Hay Flats, including from before it was
designated a refuge. He noted that many of the things he was
going to bring up have already been discussed very clearly,
particularly Mr. Rothe's and Mr. Griese's discussions, so he
won't go into those details. He pointed out that many people
are unaware of HB 153, but that Proposal 105 submitted to the
Board of Game by Mr. Rothe did receive ample review by the
public throughout the state. Virtually everything he has heard
is positive for adding these fragmented lands to the refuge.
School kids have written letters, as have organizations,
individuals, and local advisory committees. He concluded by
reading from remarks made by ADF&G to the Board of Game:
"Adoption of this proposal would not result in significant cost
to the department. Instead, it may result in cost savings by
increasing management efficiency."
2:23:42 PM
CO-CHAIR TALERICO closed public testimony after ascertaining
that no one else wished to testify. He opened committee
discussion on the bill.
2:24:20 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER inquired as to what ADF&G thinks of the
testimony suggesting there may be additional fragmented lands in
both the eastern and western access areas that ought to be
considered for inclusion in HB 153.
MR. DALE replied that the division and the department have
suggested legislation in the past to include those lands. When
there is inconsistency in land ownership it makes it difficult
for both staff and the public to know where they are at and
which rules apply. Thus, including anything within the boundary
of the refuge would be supported.
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER asked why that wasn't included in this
particular bill given that legislation has been submitted in the
past.
MR. DALE offered his belief that the proposal submitted to the
Board of Game by Mr. Rothe did not include additional lands and
the board voted on the proposal as written.
BEN MULLIGAN, Legislative Liaison, Special Assistant to the
Commissioner, Office of the Commissioner, Alaska Department of
Fish & Game (ADF&G), confirmed the department has considered
legislation, but explained that Mr. Rothe's proposal was for the
lands that ADF&G knew were firm and had been vetted for knowing
that they are deed restricted. The Interagency Land Management
Agreement (ILMA) lands are still being discussed and are now DNR
general state lands, but ADF&G hasn't reached a point to be
comfortable enough to say yes for certain and go to the sponsor,
but it is definitely a conversation that will be had.
2:26:43 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER inquired whether ADF&G is comfortable with
those additional lands at this time.
MR. MULLIGAN replied not enough to suggest putting them in now.
The department needs to have an internal conversation and then
talk with the sponsor.
REPRESENTATIVE HAWKER inquired as to what happened with the
previous legislation that had proposed to do just that.
MR. MULLIGAN responded that no legislation had actually been
introduced, Mr. Dale was referencing ADF&G's own internal ideas
and not anything official into the legislature.
2:27:55 PM
CO-CHAIR TALERICO stated his intention to move the bill, noting
that the remarks have been very positive.
2:29:39 PM
REPRESENTATIVE HERRON moved to report Version H, the proposed
committee substitute labeled 29-LS0653\H, Bullard, 3/28/15, out
of committee with individual recommendations and the
accompanying [zero] fiscal note. There being no objection, CSHB
153(RES) was reported from the House Resources Standing
Committee.