04/23/2021 08:00 AM House LABOR & COMMERCE

             HB 146-DISCLOSURE OF WAGE INFORMATION                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:55:41 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS announced that the next order of business would                                                                 
be HOUSE BILL NO. 146, "An Act relating to disclosure of                                                                        
information   regarding  employee   compensation  by   employers,                                                               
employees, and  applicants for employment; establishing  the fund                                                               
for protection  of compensation disclosure rights;  and providing                                                               
for an effective date."                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
8:56:31 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 8:56 a.m. to 8:57 a.m.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
8:57:05 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SPOHNHOLZ   moved  to  adopt  the   proposed  committee                                                               
substitute (CS)  for HB 146, Version  32-LS0513\B, Wayne, 4/19/21                                                               
("Version  B"),  as  the  working   document.    There  being  no                                                               
objection, Version B was before the committee.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:57:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER, as prime sponsor,  introduced HB 146.  She                                                               
shared  that  the  proposed legislation  seeks  to  support  fair                                                               
hiring practices for the protection  of all Alaskan workers while                                                               
ensuring  that  employers  are  not  placed  at  unfair  risk  or                                                               
disadvantage.    She  said  that  the  first  component  is  "pay                                                               
privacy," a  provision under which employers  would be prohibited                                                               
from  requiring   an  applicant's   salary  history   during  the                                                               
application process.   She  said this  component would  allow the                                                               
employer and  applicant to focus  on qualifications,  which would                                                               
help  to ensure  that  salary history  doesn't  unduly affect  an                                                               
individual's economic  potential.  She  said that 27  states, and                                                               
many  cities,  have  a  similar   law,  and  the  U.S.  House  of                                                               
Representatives  recently passed  the Paycheck  Fairness Act;  if                                                               
that Act passes at the federal  level, HB 146 would ensure parity                                                               
between the state and federal law.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER said  the second component of  HB 146 could                                                               
be called "pay transparency," a  provision under which applicants                                                               
and/or employees  must be  allowed to  discuss their  salaries if                                                               
they  choose to  do  so.   She  stated  that  the National  Labor                                                               
Relations Act protects  this type of discussion,  as does decades                                                               
of  case law.   The  third component,  she said,  is called  "pay                                                               
posting."  Job announcements must include  a range of pay as well                                                               
as other compensation details; by  doing so, she said, applicants                                                               
won't misdirect  resources toward job openings  with compensation                                                               
that  doesn't  meet  their  needs.   This  component  would  also                                                               
benefit  employers,  she said,  by  helping  them avoid  spending                                                               
valuable  time interviewing  applicants  who ultimately  wouldn't                                                               
accept the  offer due to  pay.   She described sitting  on hiring                                                               
committees  and  spending many  hours  and  thousands of  dollars                                                               
recruiting  and interviewing  potential employees,  only to  have                                                               
the job offer  turned down because the applicant  wasn't aware of                                                               
the salary range prior to the offer.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   SNYDER  said   that   HB   146  would   disallow                                                               
retaliation against an  applicant or employee who  chooses to not                                                               
share  salary history  or  who chooses  to  share current  salary                                                               
information.   A small fine  for violations would  be implemented                                                               
under  HB  146, she  said,  with  the  revenues directed  to  the                                                               
undesignated general fund (UGF); the  fine could be avoided if an                                                               
employer   changes  their   practices  to   operate  within   the                                                               
parameters of  the proposed  legislation.   She stressed  that HB
  would not  require an  employer  to offer  any specific  pay                                                               
range or compensation package, nor  would it disallow an employer                                                               
to  amend compensation  after an  interview  has been  conducted.                                                               
"The range is a starting point;  it gives a potential applicant a                                                               
general idea  of where  the conversations  may begin,"  she said.                                                               
She  pointed  out  that  the provisions  would  not  disallow  an                                                               
employer  from asking  what  an  applicant's salary  expectations                                                               
would be, and that an applicant  may still choose to share salary                                                               
history.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:05:50 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER  shared  that there  is  growing  evidence                                                               
showing that  the issues which would  be addressed by HB  146 are                                                               
pervasive and  persistent.   She said  that on  the issue  of pay                                                               
privacy, nationally  representative studies from 2012,  2017, and                                                               
2019 show  that up to  47 percent  of respondents said  they have                                                               
been  asked about  past  wages.   A study  from  2011, she  said,                                                               
showed that half of all  workers reported that discussion of wage                                                               
and salary  information was either  discouraged or  prohibited by                                                               
their employers.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:08:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ALLIANA  SALANGUIT,  Staff,  Representative  Liz  Snyder,  Alaska                                                               
State Legislature,  presented the  sectional analysis for  HB 146                                                               
on behalf of Representative Snyder,  prime sponsor, which read as                                                               
follows [original punctuation provided]:                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Sec.  1:  Amends  AS  22.10.020.  Jurisdiction  of  the                                                                  
     Superior Court by establishing  that the Superior Court                                                                    
     has jurisdiction  over all causes of  action that arise                                                                    
     under  the  remaining law  sections  in  this bill.  An                                                                    
     aggrieved  employer  or  employee   may  apply  to  the                                                                    
     Superior Court for relief.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     Sec.  2:  Amends  AS  23.10  Employment  Practices  and                                                                  
     Working Conditions  by adding Article 9.  Disclosure of                                                                  
     Employee Compensation and the following sections:                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
       Sec. 23.10.700. Disclosure of Discussion Wages:                                                                        
     (a)  Requires  job  postings to  include  a  salary  or                                                                    
     salary range.  (b) Allows  applicants and  employees to                                                                    
     discuss current  wage, prohibits employers  from asking                                                                    
     applicants  about  their  salary history  with  another                                                                    
     employer                                                                                                                   
     (c) Clarifies  that nothing  in this  section obligates                                                                    
     an   employee   or    applicant   to   disclose   their                                                                    
     compensation, prohibits  an employee or  applicant from                                                                    
     voluntarily disclosing,  or prohibits an  employer from                                                                    
     using information  that is voluntarily  disclosed under                                                                    
     this  subsection  when  determining the  salary  of  an                                                                    
     employee or applicant.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     ? Sec.  23.10.705 Posting Summary Required  requires an                                                                  
     employer  to post  information  summarizing the  bill's                                                                    
     provisions.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     ?  Sec. 23.10.710  Retaliation Prohibited  prohibits an                                                                  
     employer  from  retaliating  against  an  employee  for                                                                    
     exercising a right under the bill.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     ?  Sec. 23.10.715  Damages  for  Retaliation allows  an                                                                  
     employee to file  a civil claim against  an employer if                                                                    
     the employer retaliates.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     ?  Sec.  23.10.720  Statute  of  Limitations  gives  an                                                                  
     employee  no more  than 3  years after  a violation  to                                                                    
     file a civil claim.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     ? Sec.  23.10.725 Penalty creates a  fine between $100-                                                                  
     $2000  for violations  and  directs  the Department  of                                                                    
     Labor   and  Workforce   Development  Commissioner   to                                                                    
     determine  the   amount.  An   employer  may,   at  the                                                                    
     discretion  of the  Commissioner,  reduce  the fine  or                                                                    
     correct the violation by conducting an audit.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     ?  Sec. 23.10.735  Regulations adds  language directing                                                                  
     the  Department  of  Labor  and  Workforce  Development                                                                    
     Commissioner to  implement and interpret this  bill and                                                                    
     adopt regulations accordingly.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     ?  Sec.   23.10.790  Definitions   exempts  independent                                                                  
     contractors from the  definition of "employee." Defines                                                                    
     an "employer"  as the state, the  University of Alaska,                                                                    
     the   Alaska   Railroad    Corporation,   a   political                                                                    
     subdivision of the state, and  a person who employs one                                                                    
     or more employees.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Sec.   3:  Adds   conforming  language   AS  22.10.020.                                                                  
     Jurisdiction of the Superior Court                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Sec.  4: Provides  for  an effective  date  of July  1,                                                                  
     2021.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:10:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER introduced her invited testifier.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:11:14 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HILARY  MORGAN,  Chief  Executive Officer,  Resourceful  Results,                                                               
LLC, testified  in support  of HB  146, which  she said  would be                                                               
helpful in  leveling the  playing field for  women and  people of                                                               
color in  finding and attaining  fair wage employment.   She said                                                               
that in  her former  position as CEO  of Young  Women's Christian                                                               
Association (YWCA) of Alaska she  worked on an initiative to help                                                               
close the  gender pay gap  and with  the Department of  Labor and                                                               
Workforce Development (DLWD) studying wages  in Alaska.  The data                                                               
showed that  for full time,  year-round workers, women  made less                                                               
than men  in every geographic  location and every  market sector,                                                               
and  that   the  wage  gap  persisted   regardless  of  industry,                                                               
education level, and  occupation.  She explained  that asking for                                                               
a   person's  salary   history   can  perpetuate   discriminatory                                                               
practices   instead  of   evaluating  an   applicant  on   merit.                                                               
Regarding  pay posting,  she said,  research has  shown a  double                                                               
standard  in  salary  negotiation  between  men  and  women,  and                                                               
between  white people  and  people of  color;  men who  negotiate                                                               
salary  are  seen as  "strong"  and  "closers," while  women  who                                                               
negotiate  are seen  as "bossy"  and not  being a  "team player."                                                               
When people  of color  negotiate salary,  she said,  they're most                                                               
often  seen  as  either  "overstepping"  or  "ungrateful."    She                                                               
pointed out that anyone who has  ever interviewed for a job knows                                                               
that asking  for salary range  during the interview  has negative                                                               
connotations.  She said that  managers know what the salary range                                                               
is  on  every job;  budgets  can't  be  done without  having  the                                                               
information before  advertising the  opening.  In  her experience                                                               
as a CEO,  she said, listing the salary range  in the job posting                                                               
streamlined the  application and interview process  and attracted                                                               
applicants comfortable  with the  range; while it  didn't inhibit                                                               
her from  offering an applicant a  higher wage, it did  limit her                                                               
ability  to "lowball"  an applicant.   She  expressed her  belief                                                               
that HB 146 would mitigate all of the issues she described.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:15:41 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE NELSON  asked whether the  intention of HB  146 is                                                               
to have  an individual reporting to  the DLWD that a  job posting                                                               
doesn't include salary information.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER  replied  yes.   She  explained  that  the                                                               
proposed legislation would give DLWD  the authority to decide how                                                               
best to address such complaints.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE NELSON asked whether DLWD  would be able to handle                                                               
the workload.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER referred  to the fiscal note  and said that                                                               
DLWD currently  has 13 investigators  who work on  prevailing and                                                               
minimum wage issues.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  NELSON opined  that it's  difficult to  justify a                                                               
$300,000 fiscal note for that amount of self-reporting.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER shared  that  the fiscal  note amount  was                                                               
surprising and that  there were discussions with  DLWD about what                                                               
their process  was in arriving  at the  amount.  She  pointed out                                                               
that, since  receiving the fiscal  note, research has  shown that                                                               
several states  with similar or  larger populations  have enacted                                                               
similar  laws with  either no  fiscal  notes or  notes with  very                                                               
small amounts, usually intended for implementation or education.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:19:10 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS commented  that there are already  staff in place                                                               
to enforce the provisions and that  he doesn't see the need for a                                                               
fiscal note.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:19:53 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOE  DUNHAM, Chief  Investigator, Wage  and Hour  Administration,                                                               
Division of Labor  Standards and Safety, Department  of Labor and                                                               
Workforce  Development, said  that  the logic  behind the  fiscal                                                               
note is that  the underlying message of HB 146  is "equal pay for                                                               
equal work."   He said that  if workers were to  start discussing                                                               
their wages  there could be many  calls coming in to  his office.                                                               
He said  that he would  like to add  three workers to  handle the                                                               
"onslaught"   of   calls   regarding   issues   of   termination,                                                               
retaliation, or  the handling  of back  wages.   He said  that he                                                               
could  understand  the  existence  of   a  zero  fiscal  note  if                                                               
implementation was  a simple  issue of putting  up a  poster, but                                                               
this  proposed  legislation  would encourage  workers  to  openly                                                               
discuss their salaries.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:21:16 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER   commented  that  if  DLWD   foresees  an                                                               
onslaught of  complaints in response  to HB 146, such  an opinion                                                               
further justifies the need for the proposed legislation.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. DUNHAM replied that he could see many moot investigations.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:22:12 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  SPOHNHOLZ asked  whether the  three-year limitation  to                                                               
file a civil claim would apply to all provisions of the bill.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER replied that it would.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:22:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE NELSON  asked whether  HB 146  would be  pulled if                                                               
the federal Paycheck Fairness Act were enacted.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER  noted the  common practice of  having laws                                                               
in state statute that mirror those on the federal level.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:23:30 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR SPOHNHOLZ  invited Mr. Wayne  to discuss the  subject of                                                               
federal versus state statutes.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:23:55 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DAN  WAYNE,  Attorney,  Legislative Legal  Services,  Legislative                                                               
Affairs Agency, said  that he doesn't know of a  federal law that                                                               
specifically requires  employers to post  a salary range  or that                                                               
protects the rights of employees to discuss their salaries.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:25:20 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SNYDER clarified  that  she  was referencing  the                                                               
Paycheck  Fairness  Act,  which  would   be  a  new  federal  law                                                               
addressing pay  privacy and prohibiting employers  from requiring                                                               
an applicant's  salary history.   She pointed out that  27 states                                                               
already have the law in  place, and that the proposed legislation                                                               
would be intended to complement the federal law.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  NELSON  stated  that  his  earlier  question  was                                                               
whether  there would  be  any  conflict between  HB  146 and  the                                                               
legislation proposed at the federal level, should they pass.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:26:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE MCCARTY  asked Mr. Dunham how  many investigations                                                               
he conducts  on a monthly basis  and by how much  he would expect                                                               
the number of investigations to increase as a result of HB 146.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MR.  DUNHAM  replied  that  displaying wages  on  a  job  posting                                                               
shouldn't cause any  increase in workload in  his department, nor                                                               
does he  anticipate an  increase in  the workload  resulting from                                                               
the provision about employers being  prohibited from asking about                                                               
previous wages.   He said encouraging employees  to discuss wages                                                               
could cause problems.   He said, "If I hire a  mechanic at $26 an                                                               
hour and then I  hire this next one at $30 an  hour, I'm going to                                                               
tell  him, 'Don't  talk about  your wages  because it's  going to                                                               
cause a  problem.'"   He said  that he  could see  the lower-paid                                                               
mechanic wanting  more money and  possibly contacting  DLWD about                                                               
the issue of equal pay for equal work.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:29:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   SNYDER  pointed   out  that   Mr.  Dunham   just                                                               
highlighted  how important  the  education roll-out  is, so  that                                                               
individual and  employers fully understand the  parameters of the                                                               
proposed   legislation.      She    noted   the   importance   of                                                               
distinguishing between  policy preferences and cost  estimates of                                                               
implementation and monitoring.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:30:33 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KAUFMAN referred  to page 2, lines  21 through 24,                                                               
which read as follows:                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     (c) Nothing in this section                                                                                                
     (1) creates an obligation for an employee or applicant                                                                     
      for employment 23 to disclose information about the                                                                       
         employee or applicant's compensation or the 24                                                                         
     compensation of another;                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE KAUFMAN commented that  some people might not want                                                               
others to  know their salary  range.   He then asked  whether the                                                               
proposed legislation includes protections  for employers who want                                                               
to compensate high performers.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SNYDER explained that  the "pay privacy" provision                                                               
is sometimes called a "salary history  ban" and is connected in a                                                               
positive  way to  "pay  posting."   She  said  that there  exists                                                               
evidence  that  when  employers  are  prohibited  from  requiring                                                               
salary histories from their  applicants, they naturally gravitate                                                               
toward posting the  salary range on the  job posting, eliminating                                                               
the  need to  ask  for  an applicant's  pay  history because  the                                                               
applicant  is prepared  for the  salary range.   She  also stated                                                               
that  nothing  in  the proposed  legislation  would  prohibit  an                                                               
employer from giving a bonus or  other reward for good work.  She                                                               
expressed  being  amenable  to   changing  the  language  of  the                                                               
proposed legislation to clarify that point.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:33:40 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR FIELDS announced that HB 146 was held over.