04/16/2025 01:00 PM House JUDICIARY

        HB  97-ORG. RETAIL THEFT/FUND;MKTPLACE SALES TAX                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
5:28:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR GRAY  announced that  the next order  of business  would be                                                               
HOUSE  BILL  NO. 97,  "An  Act  relating  to theft;  relating  to                                                               
organized retail theft; relating  to property crimes; relating to                                                               
aggravating  factors  at  sentencing;  establishing  a  statewide                                                               
marketplace   facilitator  sales   tax;   and  establishing   the                                                               
organized retail  theft fund in  the general fund."   [Before the                                                               
committee, adopted  as the working  document on 3/26/25,  was the                                                               
proposed committee substitute (CS) for HB 97, Version 34-                                                                       
LS0109\T, C. Radford, 3/25/25 ("Version T").]                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
5:29:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE moved Amendment 1  to Version T, labeled 34-                                                               
LS0109\T.3, C. Radford, 4/3/25, which read:                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4, line 11:                                                                                                           
          Delete "knowingly"                                                                                                    
          Insert "intentionally"                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR GRAY objected.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
5:29:56 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  VANCE  said Amendment  1  would  change the  word                                                               
"knowingly" to  "intentionally" to be  more specific on  the mens                                                               
rea.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR GRAY asked Mr. Skidmore  to speak to the difference between                                                               
knowingly and intentionally in terms of the payment of wages.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
5:31:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. SKIDMORE  said the difference  is being aware of  the conduct                                                               
versus having  a conscious  objective of the  conduct.   He added                                                               
that both terms  are defined in Alaska statutes.   In response to                                                               
a follow  up question  from Chair  gray, he  said if  Amendment 1                                                               
were  to pass,  the state  would have  to prove  that it  was the                                                               
employer's  conscious  objective  not  to pay  the  employee,  as                                                               
opposed to being aware and disregarding.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:33:53 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KOPP  opined  that  wage theft  doesn't  seem  to                                                               
address legal  justification.  He  shared examples  and suggested                                                               
adding language  to make  it clear  that there  could be  a valid                                                               
reason [to not pay one's employees the agreed upon wage].                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  GRAY  restated   Representative  Kopp's  question,  asking                                                               
whether there  is legal justification  not to pay  the employee's                                                               
agreed upon wage.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
5:36:36 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.   SKIDMORE  did   not  know   how  the   scenario  posed   by                                                               
Representative Kopp  would fit into the  requirements under Title                                                               
23 or  what the  legal justification  would be.   He  referred to                                                               
page  4, explaining  that wage  theft would  be committed  if the                                                               
employer  fails  to pay  an  employee  or independent  contractor                                                               
their wage, salary, or agreed upon compensation.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
5:41:06 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  EISCHEID  asked  Mr.   Skidmore  to  restate  the                                                               
standard of proof for both knowingly and intentionally.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. SKIDMORE  said the  burden of proof  does not  change because                                                               
the  prosecutor must  prove the  elements of  the crime  beyond a                                                               
reasonable  doubt.   Elements fall  between two  categories: mens                                                               
rea  and  actus rea.    He  shared an  example.    He added  that                                                               
Amendment  1  would   increase  the  mens  rea   to  a  conscious                                                               
objective, which  when including felony penalties,  is beneficial                                                               
to prosecutors.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:44:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  UNDERWOOD   asked  whether  both   knowingly  and                                                               
intentionally could be included.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR. SKIDMORE said using both terms would be problematic.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR GRAY maintained his objection.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
5:47:19 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE VANCE, in wrap up,  stated that "intentionally" is                                                               
justified because  this section of  law pertains to  felonies and                                                               
would provide the according distinction.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
5:48:27 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll  call vote  was taken.   Representatives  Underwood, Mina,                                                               
Eischeid,  Vance,  and  Kopp  voted  in  favor  of  Amendment  1.                                                               
Representative  Gray voted  against it.   Therefore,  Amendment 1                                                               
was adopted by a vote of 5-1.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
5:49:03 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The committee took a brief at-ease at 5:49 p.m.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
5:50:05 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR GRAY announced that HB 97 was held over.