HOUSE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE March 30, 1993 3:00 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Rep. Bill Hudson, Chairman Rep. Brian Porter Rep. Eldon Mulder Rep. Bill Williams Rep. Jerry Mackie Rep. Joe Sitton MEMBERS ABSENT Rep. Joe Green COMMITTEE CALENDAR *HB 236: "An Act relating to newspapers of general circulation." CSHB 236(L&C) PASSED OUT OF COMMITTEE *HB 249: "An Act relating to persons whose occupations involve electrical or mechanical equipment and systems; and providing for an effective date." SSHB 249 PASSED OUT OF COMMITTEE *HB 247: "An Act changing the frequency of certain state inspections of weights and measures and relating to the issuance of citations for weights and measures violations." PASSED OUT OF COMMITTEE HB 170: "An Act extending the termination date of the Board of Marine Pilots." PASSED OUT OF COMMITTEE *HB 237: "An Act relating to marine pilot licensing and tariffs." HEARD AND HELD OVER SB 64: "An Act relating to civil liability for workplace safety inspections; and providing for an effective date." NOT HEARD, HELD OVER *HB 241: "An Act relating to workers' compensation; and providing for an effective date." NOT HEARD, HELD OVER HB 185: "An Act establishing credits for purchasers of state royalty oil for expenditures made by those purchasers on qualifying capital investments to be applied against liquidated purchase arrearage's established in contracts, settlements, or final judgments; and providing for an effective date." NOT HEARD, APPOINTED TO SUBCOMMITTEE HB 221: "An Act relating to workers' compensation for volunteer ambulance attendants, police officers, and fire fighters; and providing for an effective date." NOT HEARD (* First public hearing.) Confirmations to Boards and Commissions: Ray Kimberlin - Alaska Workers' Compensation Board Nancy J. Ridgley - Alaska Workers' Compensation Board Darrell F. Smith - Alaska Workers' compensation Board William M. Bishop - Alcohol Beverage and Control Board Jane Perkins - Alcohol Beverage and Control Board James Carter - Alaska Public Utilities Commission Terral F. Wanzer - Real Estate Commission Ken Kincaid - Real Estate Appraisers WITNESS REGISTER BOB GOULD Alaska Journal of Commerce 880 "N" Street Anchorage, Alaska 99501 276-8880 Position Statement: Supported HB 236 JOHN MCKAY Anchorage Daily News 211 H St. Anchorage, Alaska 99501 276-5231 Position Statement: Opposed HB 236 REP. GARY DAVIS Alaska State Legislature State Capitol Juneau, Alaska 99801-1182 465-2693 Position Statement: Prime Sponsor of HB 249 C.W. MAHLEN, Commissioner Department of Labor 5950 Sunset St. Juneau, Alaska 99801 465-2700 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 CHRIS HERBY P.O. Box 7381 Ketchikan, Alaska 99901 225-9725 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 GARY TRIEWEILER P.O. Box 2905 Homer, Alaska 99603 235-6977 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 DOUG DONEGAN Trident Seafoods 5011 Jewell Lake Rd., #203 Anchorage, Alaska 99502 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 DENNY BOWDEN Department of Labor 3301 Eagle St. Anchorage, Alaska 99510 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 STANLEY BISHOP KISS Communications 700 W. 6th, #400 Anchorage, Alaska 99518 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 RALPH WINTERROWD Winterrowd Telecommunications Inc. 6901 East Tudor, Ste. #7 Anchorage, Alaska 99507 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 GERALD NEWTON 315 Dunbar Ave. Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 452-8575 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 DAVE ELBERT 183 Concord Fairbanks, Alaska 99712 457-1914 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 HUGH DOOGAN 359 Slater St. Fairbanks, Alaska 99701 456-1869 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 GEORGE CARNAHAN P.O. Box 8202 Kenai, Alaska 99611 776-5570 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 MARTIN HALL P.O. Box 3574 Soldotna, Alaska 99669 262-7813 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 MARK JOHNSON P.O. Box 7486 Nikiski, Alaska 99635 776-8593 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 WILL JAHRIG P.O. Box 51 Kenai, Alaska 99611 283-4262 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 AL DWYER 8711 Barney Circle Anchorage, Alaska 99502 269-4925 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 MARYLOU VILANDRE 803 Halibut Point Road Sitka, Alaska 99835 747-8086 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 JOHN SKANNES 204 Katlian St. Sitka, Alaska 99835 747-8610 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 PETE JURCZAK 1309 Edgecumbe Dr. Sitka, Alaska 99835 747-5891 Position Statement: Supported HB 249 WENDY MULDER, Special Assistant Department of Commerce and Economic Development P.O. Box 110800 Juneau, Alaska 99811-0800 465-2500 Position Statement: Read sponsor statement on HB 247 REP. JERRY SANDERS Alaska State Legislature State Capitol Juneau, Alaska 99801 465-4945 Position Statement: Prime Sponsor of HB 170 REP. BILL HUDSON Alaska State Legislature State Capitol Juneau, Alaska 99801-1182 465-3744 Position Statement: Prime sponsor of HB 237 PAUL FUHS, Commissioner Department of Commerce and Economic Development P.O. Box 110800 Juneau, Alaska 99811-0800 465-2500 Position Statement: Presented overview of HB 237 DON SCHROER Alaska Public Utilities Commission 1016 W. 6th, Suite 400 Anchorage, Alaska 99501-1963 276-6222 Position Statement: No position yet CARL LUCK, Director Division of Occupational Licensing Department of Commerce and Economic Development P.O. Box 110800 Juneau, Alaska 99811-0800 465-2500 Position Statement: Presented overview of HB 237 PETER LIE-NIELSEN Alaska Coastwise Pilots Association P.O. Box 22708 Juneau, Alaska 99802 789-3231 Position Statement: Opposed HB 237 BERNIE SMITH Alaska Steamship Association P.O. Box 1630-2 Kenai, Alaska 99611 776-8191 Position Statement: Testified on HB 237 MICHAEL SPENCE Alaska Coastwise Pilots Association P.O. Box 3040 Ketchikan, Alaska 99901 247-8382 Position Statement: Opposed HB 237 BILL SWAN Southeast Pilots Association Ketchikan, Alaska 99901 725-9696 Position Statement: Supported HB 237 PREVIOUS ACTION BILL: HB 236 SHORT TITLE: NEWSPAPER OF GENERAL CIRCULATION DEFINED BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S): LABOR & COMMERCE TITLE: "An Act relating to newspapers of general circulation." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 03/19/93 707 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/19/93 707 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: HB 249 SHORT TITLE: ELECTRICAL/MECHANICAL TRADESPERSONS BILL VERSION: SSHB 249 SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) G.DAVIS TITLE: "An Act relating to persons whose occupations involve electrical or mechanical equipment and systems; and providing for an effective date." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 03/22/93 733 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/22/93 733 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE,STATE AFFAIRS,JUDICIARY 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 03/30/93 853 (H) SPONSOR SUBSTITUTE INTRODUCED-REFERRALS 03/30/93 853 (H) L&C, STATE AFFAIRS, JUDICIARY BILL: HB 247 SHORT TITLE: WEIGHTS & MEASURES: INSPECTIONS/CITATIONS BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S): LABOR & COMMERCE TITLE: "An Act changing the frequency of certain state inspections of weights and measures and relating to the issuance of citations for weights and measure violations." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 03/22/93 732 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/22/93 732 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, JUDICIARY 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: HB 170 SHORT TITLE: EXTEND BOARD OF MARINE PILOTS BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) SANDERS,Grussendorf TITLE: "An Act extending the termination date of the Board of Marine Pilots." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 02/22/93 413 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 02/22/93 413 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, FINANCE 03/23/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 124 03/25/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 124 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: HB 237 SHORT TITLE: MARINE PILOT LICENSING AND TARIFFS BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S)HUDSON,Phillips,Brice,Sitton, Sanders TITLE: "An Act relating to marine pilot licensing and tariffs." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 03/19/93 707 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/19/93 707 (H) L&C, TRANSPORTATION, STA AFF, FINANCE 03/19/93 (H) COSPONSOR(S): BRICE, SITTON, SANDERS 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: SB 64 SHORT TITLE: IMMUNITY FOR SAFETY INSPECTIONS BILL VERSION: CSSB 64(JUD)(EFD FLD) SPONSOR(S): LABOR & COMMERCE TITLE: "An Act relating to civil liability for workplace safety inspections." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 01/22/93 137 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 01/22/93 137 (S) LABOR & COMMERCE, JUDICIARY 02/04/93 (S) L&C AT 01:30 PM BELTZ ROOM 211 02/04/93 (S) MINUTE(L&C) 02/10/93 313 (S) L&C RPT 3DP 2NR 02/10/93 313 (S) ZERO FISCAL NOTE (DCED) 02/19/93 (S) JUD AT 01:30 PM BELTZ ROOM 211 02/19/93 (S) MINUTE(JUD) 02/22/93 (S) JUD AT 01:30 PM BELTZ ROOM 211 02/22/93 (S) MINUTE(JUD) 02/24/93 461 (S) JUD RPT CS 2DP 1NR 1DNP 1AM SAME TITLE 02/24/93 461 (S) PREVIOUS ZERO FN APPLIES (DCED) 03/03/93 (S) RLS AT 10:45 AM FAHRENKAMP 203 03/03/93 (S) MINUTE(RLS) 03/05/93 614 (S) RULES RPT 3CAL 1DNP W/O AM 3/5/93 03/05/93 623 (S) READ THE SECOND TIME 03/05/93 623 (S) JUD CS ADOPTED UNAN CONSENT 03/05/93 625 (S) AM NO 1 FAILED Y7 N11 E2 03/05/93 626 (S) AM NO 2 FAILED Y8 N10 E2 03/05/93 627 (S) AM NO 3 FAILED Y7 N11 E2 03/05/93 629 (S) AM NO 4 FAILED Y8 N10 E2 03/05/93 630 (S) AM NO 5 FAILED Y8 N10 E2 03/05/93 630 (S) AM NO 6 FAILED Y7 N11 E2 03/05/93 631 (S) ADVANCED TO THIRD READING UNAN CONSENT 03/05/93 631 (S) PASSED Y11 N7 E2 03/05/93 632 (S) EFFECTIVE DATE FAILED Y11 N7 E2 03/05/93 632 (S) Duncan NOTICE OF RECON 03/08/93 659 (S) RECON TAKEN UP-IN THIRD READING 03/08/93 659 (S) PLACE AT BOTTOM OF CAL PASSED Y11 N8 E1 03/08/93 673 (S) RETURN TO SECOND FOR AM 1 UNAN CONSENT 03/08/93 674 (S) AM NO 7 FAILED Y8 N11 E1 03/08/93 674 (S) AUTOMATICALLY IN THIRD READING 03/08/93 674 (S) PASSED ON RECONSIDERATION Y11 N8 E1 03/08/93 675 (S) EFFECTIVE DATE FAILED Y12 N7 E1 03/08/93 677 (S) TRANSMITTED TO (H) 03/10/93 582 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/10/93 582 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, JUDICIARY 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: HB 241 SHORT TITLE: WORKERS COMP:REQD HEALTH BEN;INSPECTIONS BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) MULDER TITLE: "An Act relating to workers' compensation; and providing for an effective date." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 03/19/93 708 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/19/93 709 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, JUDICIARY 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: HB 185 SHORT TITLE: CREDITS AGAINST PURCHASE OF ROYALTY OIL BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S):REPRESENTATIVE(S)GREEN,Barnes,Sanders,James, Olberg,Kott TITLE: "An Act establishing credits for purchasers of state royalty oil for expenditures made by those purchasers on qualifying capital investments to be applied against liquidated purchase arrearages established in contracts, settlements, or final judgments; and providing for an effective date." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 02/25/93 457 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 02/25/93 457 (H) LABOR & COMMERCE, FINANCE 03/01/93 495 (H) COSPONSOR(S): KOTT 03/18/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 BILL: HB 221 SHORT TITLE: WORKERS COMP:VOLUNTEER FIRE FIGHTERS, ETC BILL VERSION: SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVE(S) HUDSON,Grussendorf TITLE: "An Act relating to workers' compensation for volunteer ambulance attendants, police officers, and fire fighters; and providing for an effective date." JRN-DATE JRN-PG ACTION 03/12/93 619 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME/REFERRAL(S) 03/12/93 619 (H) CRA, LABOR & COMMERCE, FINANCE 03/25/93 (H) CRA AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 124 03/30/93 (H) CRA AT 01:00 PM CAPITOL 124 03/30/93 (H) L&C AT 03:00 PM CAPITOL 17 ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 93-27, SIDE A Number 000 CHAIRMAN HUDSON called the meeting to order at 3:17 p.m. on March 30, 1993. Members present were Reps. Hudson, Porter, Williams, Mulder, Sitton and Mackie. Rep. Green was excused. HB 236 - NEWSPAPER OF GENERAL CIRCULATION DEFINED Number 010 BOB GOULD, principal owner of the ALASKA JOURNAL OF COMMERCE, testified that the purpose of HB 236 was to promote competition in the market place for legal advertisements. Most legal advertisements in Alaska appear in metropolitan dailies. In most other jurisdictions the same ads would appear in specialty papers and the readership would mostly be made up of bankers, attorneys and title companies. MR. GOULD pointed out that Alaska statutes simply state that the notices have to appear in a newspaper of general circulation without a definition of what "a paper of general circulation" means. Mr. Gould explained that the title company underwriter was the entity responsible for publishing the default notices in Alaskan papers and they are generally out-of-state firms not familiar with the size and scope of Alaska. MR. GOULD stated that if HB 236 were to pass, these firms would be able to publish in newspapers other than the big three in the state without fear of violating the statutes, as the definition would be specific. Number 270 CHAIRMAN HUDSON read the following amendment: To section 3, add a new sentence to read: "the notice may be given by using a combination of print and broadcasting media in communities with two or more daily newspapers the notice shall be published in the daily newspaper with the lowest advertising rates." Number 289 REP. MACKIE read the following amendment: On page 2, lines 9-10, delete: "have a total paid circulation of at least 2,500 bona fide subscribers" and insert: "has an average paid circulation or distribution of at least 1500 copies of each issue." Discussion ensued regarding this amendment. The amendment was moved and adopted. Number 365 REP. MULDER expressed his concern on line 9, section B, that the paper had to be in existence for at least two years. He was concerned that this would hurt new starts. Number 380 MR. GOULD explained that some arbitrary figure had routinely been used to ensure that the publication had some track record to count on. Mr. Gould further pointed out that the amount of revenue generated by legal notices in the larger newspapers was small compared to their other sources of income. Number 410 JOHN MCKAY, ALASKA DAILY NEWS, testified against HB 236, stating that it basically disqualified papers that currently published legal notices. This bill would eliminate smaller newspapers. MR. MCKAY believed that the bill is a merchandizing tool for the Journal of Commerce. Number 462 CHAIRMAN HUDSON inquired how HB 236 would hurt smaller newspapers. Number 470 MR. MCKAY pointed out that a number of the smaller communities have newspapers with a paid circulation or distribution of less than 2500, or even the 1500 the amendment called for. Number 495 MR. GOULD added that currently four newspapers in Alaska cover the bulk of the state's legal notices. Number 521 CHAIRMAN HUDSON stated that it was not the committee's intention to exclude anyone. REP. MULDER moved to amend the earlier amendment to lower the number from 1500 to 1000. No objections were heard; it was so ordered. Number 533 REP. MACKIE moved for passage of CSHB 236(L&C) with a fiscal note, and unanimous consent. No objections were noted; it was so ordered. Number 540 HB 249 - ELECTRICAL/MECHANICAL TRADESPERSONS REP. GARY DAVIS, PRIME SPONSOR of HB 249, read a sponsor statement. Rep. Davis stated that the purpose of HB 249 is to protect the safety of people and property in the state from the danger of improperly installed electrical wiring and equipment and installed or retrofitted mechanical systems. This will be accomplished by assuring the public that persons responsible for making electrical and mechanical installations in this state are qualified and that a sufficient number of persons are so qualified. Number 604 COMMISSIONER CHARLES MAHLEN, DEPARTMENT OF LABOR, testified in support of HB 249, reiterating the sponsor's statement. TAPE 93-27, SIDE B Number 000 CHRIS HERBY testified in support of HB 249 from Ketchikan. Mr. Herby stated that he practiced as an electrical administrator in another state that does not have these provisions and the quality of work performed was much lower than Alaska's. Number 041 GARY TRIEWEILER testified in support of HB 249 from Homer. Mr. Trieweiler echoed the statement given above. Number 063 DOUG DONEGAN testified in support of HB 249 from Anchorage. Mr. Donegan echoed the statements given above. Number 114 DENNY BOWDEN testified in support of HB 249 from Anchorage. Mr. Bowden echoed the statements given above. Number 115 STANLEY BISHOP testified in support of HB 249 from Anchorage. Mr. Bishop echoed the statements given above. Number 137 RALPH WINTERROWD testified in support of HB 249 from Anchorage. Mr. Winterrowd echoed the statements given above and added that he would like to see more prosecutions of persons who violate these statutes. GERALD NEWTON, representing the INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF ELECTRICAL INSPECTORS, testified from Fairbanks in support of HB 249. Number 188 DAVE ELBERT testified in support of HB 249 from Fairbanks and echoed the above statement. Number 202 HUGH DOOGAN testified in support of HB 249 from Fairbanks. Number 226 GEORGE CARNAHAN testified from Kenai that he would support the bill, except sections 6 and 9 in the sectional analysis. REP. MACKIE pointed out that the committee was presently working from a sponsor substitute and not the original bill Mr. Carnahan was addressing. Number 301 MARTIN HALL testified in support of HB 249 from Soldotna. Number 311 MARK JOHNSON testified in support of HB 249 from Soldotna with the exception of one item on page 9, line 21. Mr. Johnson stated that the bill should not exempt fire alarms from inspections. Number 340 WILL JAHRIG testified in support of HB 249 from Soldotna, but wanted clarification on the testing procedure and times between testing. Number 350 AL DWYER, DEPARTMENT OF LABOR, testified that the testing would be done weekly. Number 385 MARYLOU VILANDRE testified from Sitka in support of HB 249, but expressed her concern regarding contractors from out-of- state who are not physically present on the job when the work is done. Ms. Vilandre said she would like to see a requirement that ensures that this is not allowed. Number 408 JOHN SKANNES testified from Sitka and echoed Ms. Vilandre's comments. PETE JURCZAK testified from Sitka in support of HB 249. REP. MACKIE moved for passage of SSHB 249 with individual recommendations, fiscal note, and unanimous consent. No objection was heard; it was so ordered. HB 247 - WEIGHTS & MEASURES: INSPECTIONS/CITATIONS WENDY MULDER, SPECIAL ASSISTANT, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, read the following sponsor statement on HB 247: "Prior to 1986, weights and measures inspectors had the authority to issue citations for weights and measure violations. Changes were made to AS 45.75 in 1986 to authorize weigh station operators to issue citations for truck size and permit violations. When these changes were made, the weights and measures inspectors were inadvertently stripped of their authority to issue citations. During the last year, the Division of Measurement Standards promulgated regulations that provide for the registrations of all weighing and measuring devices with the division and the payment of an annual fee. To allow the division to adequately enforce AS 45.75 it is necessary for the weights and measures inspectors to have the authority to issue citations for those persons who choose to violate the law. Most, if not all, weights and measures jurisdictions in the United States and Canada possess this authority. This does not mean that a rash of new citations will be issued, but it does give the weights and measures official an effective enforcement tool. "Within current budget constraints, the division is unable to maintain semiannual inspections in all locations in Alaska. Amending AS 45.75.080 will allow the director to establish inspection priorities based on inspection history of various device types, inspecting most devices at least annually, and others more often if necessary." REP. SITTON moved for passage of HB 247 with individual recommendations, fiscal note, and asked unanimous consent. No objections were heard; it was so ordered. CONFIRMATIONS Number 500 CHAIRMAN HUDSON brought up the following names for confirmation: Ray Kimberlin - Alaska Workers' Compensation Board Nancy J. Ridgley - Alaska Workers' Compensation Board Darrell F. Smith - Alaska Workers' compensation Board William M. Bishop - Alcohol Beverage and Control Board Jane Perkins - Alcohol Beverage and Control Board James Carter - Alaska Public Utilities Commission Terral F. Wanzer - Real Estate Commission Ken Kincaid - Real Estate Appraisers REP. MACKIE moved for approval of the confirmations. No objections were noted; they were so ordered. Number 541 HB 170 - EXTEND BOARD OF MARINE PILOTS REP. JERRY SANDERS, PRIME SPONSOR of HB 170, stated that the Board of Marine Pilots was created under AS 08.62.040, and includes membership of two marine pilots licensed under Alaska statutes and regulations, two vessel agents or managers, two public members, and the commissioner of Commerce or his designee. The board ensures the maintenance of efficient and competent pilotage service on the inland and coastal water of and adjacent to the state to assure the protection of shipping, the safety of human life and property, and the protection of the marine environment. It establishes qualifications of and the required training for pilots, provides for the examination of pilots, and the issuance of original and renewal licenses to qualified persons. REP. SANDERS said continuance of the board is considered essential due to the continued emphasis on competition, the requirement to set tariffs, and the constant evolution of state statutes and regulations which require implementation in the interest of commerce and safety. REP. MACKIE moved for passage of HB 170 with individual recommendations. No objections were heard; it was so ordered. Number 567 HB 237 - MARINE PILOT LICENSING AND TARIFFS CHAIRMAN BILL HUDSON, PRIME SPONSOR of HB 237, read the sponsor statement. He explained that HB 237 was introduced to fine-tune Alaska's Marine Pilot Act of 1991, and to provide a mechanism to determine pilotage tariffs, now left to the several pilot organizations by statutory provision, and scheduled to be repealed on June 30, 1994. CHAIRMAN HUDSON further stated that while the 1991 Act improved marine pilotage in Alaska, its implementation has revealed that many problems still need to be addressed, specifically with regard to the powers of the Board of Marine Pilots and tariff setting. HB 237 seeks to remedy these problems by: 1) better defining the powers of the Board of Marine Pilots to make it more effective; and 2) charging the APUC with the authority to set tariffs. Number 619 COMMISSIONER PAUL FUHS, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, testified in support of the work put into HB 237 and emphasized the importance of HB 237. Commissioner Fuhs pointed out that 95 percent of Alaska's resources move over the water. COMMISSIONER FUHS stated that Alaska has four regions in the state, two of which have competing piloting organizations and two that don't. TAPE 93-28, SIDE A Number 001 COMMISSIONER FUHS explained that a lot of the issues the committee will deal with are safety and efficiency; some of the most contentious issues are purely money. Commissioner Fuhs explained that the department called for a meeting last month with the various aspects of the pilotage industry and pilot groups to get people talking and air their concerns. Number 020 COMMISSIONER FUHS reiterated the importance of moving some of the decision making to the Alaska Public Utilities Commission (APUC) and suggested that the APUC be charged with the responsibility of setting the number of pilots allowed to operate in the state. COMMISSIONER FUHS commented that he did not know of any other industry where the same words were used to mean the exact opposite, and he expressed his hope that the committee would look and listen carefully to all sides of the issues. Number 072 REP. WILLIAMS asked what the outcome was of the meeting Mr. Fuhs mentioned. MR. FUHS explained that they were still working on getting the parties together in some sort of agreeable fashion. REP. WILLIAMS stated that he was of the opinion that the people involved in the issues come together instead of looking to the legislature to solve everything. Number 115 CHAIRMAN HUDSON commented that he and his staff have met with all sides of every issue and have come to the conclusion that it would be impossible to please everyone on every issue. CHAIRMAN HUDSON pointed out that his major concerns were: - safety of the movement of ships in Alaskan waters; - qualifications of the pilots; _ making certain that the pilots are separated from the shipping companies, so that there can be no undue influence put on the pilots; and - uniform fees for taking a ship from point A to point B. COMMISSIONER FUHS added another concern that the costs of pilotage not be so high that it be a deterrent to commerce, and that the number of pilots be so great that pilots can't make a living. Number 169 DON SCHROER, CHAIRMAN, ALASKA PUBLIC UTILITIES COMMISSION (APUC), testified that the commission does not have a position on HB 237 yet. He said a public meeting would be scheduled in the near future to develop a commission position and fiscal note for HB 237. Mr. Schroer asked for a deferment until the commission has time to evaluate the costs involved in taking on this added responsibility. Number 199 CARL LUCK, DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF OCCUPATIONAL LICENSING, DEPARTMENT OF COMMERCE AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, testified that under current law there are provisions for competition within regions as well as across regions. He stated that there is an unlimited number of pilots; the board is balanced between the pilot industry and the public; the board sets maximum tariffs; and then the pilot organizations negotiate with industry. He further noted that the board disciplines pilots, approves pilot organizations, sets training programs, licenses pilots, upgrades pilots, tests pilots, and creates piloting regions. He said pilots are independent contractors, prohibited from being employees, and have to carry insurance. MR. LUCK stated that HB 237 would limit the number of pilots, and most states already do that. MR. LUCK added that he hoped the following issues would be addressed by this legislature: - safety on Alaskan waters; - licensed pilots for cross regions; - equitable tariffs set by unbiased entity; and - pilot dispatching. MR. LUCK detailed some of the requirements to become a licensed pilot in this state. CHAIRMAN HUDSON noted that HB 237 does not address the pilot dispatch issue. Number 601 REP. PORTER asked, If the Alaska Public Utilities Commission were to limit the number of pilots, would it pose a problem to the free movement of commerce? MR. LUCK explained that the pilotage act does not make the free movement of commerce a determining factor; safety is the only concern. REP. PORTER added that setting the maximum too low would curtail movement on the waters. Number 623 MR. LUCK stated that the formula used to set limits, both minimum and maximum, would have to provide for retirement, sickness, vacations, etc. Mr. Luck further stated that he believed this could be done with a considerable amount of input and time. TAPE 93-28, SIDE B Number 001 CHAIRMAN HUDSON stated that he had no problem with amending the bill to include a statement regarding the free movement of trade. MR. LUCK stated that currently the state regulates the pilots and not the industry, but he envisioned industry having to come to the table in the future with at least some quantative analysis of how this affects the bottom line. REP. WILLIAMS inquired about the numbers Mr. Luck cited on when and how often pilots work. MR. LUCK asked that the pilots answer for themselves. Number 060 PETER LIE-NIELSEN, ALASKA COASTWISE PILOTS, testified that his group was against setting a maximum number of pilots. Mr. Lie-Nielsen also noted that there are a large number of pilots over the age of 65 that will be retiring shortly. MR. LIE-NIELSEN added that in 1992 not one new pilot was licensed partly due to a strict licensing procedure. Mr. Lie-Nielsen stated that the U.S. Coast Guard relaxed its restrictions on pilotage, resulting in the Exxon Valdez disaster. MR. LIE-NIELSEN noted that there are numerous examples of vessels in compulsory waters moving without pilots because of the nonavailability of licensed pilots. Number 212 REP. SITTON inquired how much insurance and license fees were. Number 224 MR. LIE-NIELSEN stated that the insurance runs about $3,000.00 per year and the license fees are about $1,000.00 per year. Number 230 CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked Mr. Lie-Nielsen why he believed the state would end up with too few pilots under this proposed legislation. Number 244 MR. LIE-NIELSEN answered that vessels do move on the water without pilots illegally, and restricting the number of pilots does a disservice to the concept of safety on the water. Number 280 CHAIRMAN HUDSON reiterated that it was his belief that a formula could be devised that would take into account the concerns mentioned above and would satisfy the needs of the industry. Number 305 REP. WILLIAMS expressed concern with putting a cap on the number of pilots. MR. LIE-NIELSEN agreed that this was a concern and that safety should come first. Number 343 CHAIRMAN HUDSON interrupted to announce that he would hold SB 64 and HB 241 over for a future meeting. CHAIRMAN HUDSON appointed a subcommittee on HB 185 composed of Reps. Porter, Green and Sitton. Number 388 BERNIE SMITH, representing TESORO PETROLEUM AND ALASKA STEAMSHIPS, testified that HB 237 had some good points, but it needed more work, and he would like to see it held over the interim for further review. Number 425 MICHAEL SPENCE, ALASKA COASTWISE PILOTS ASSOCIATION, read a statement on behalf of his group opposing HB 237. Mr. Spence stated that his group was concerned about three elements of HB 237: 1) fixing tariffs; 2) fixing the number of pilots in a region; and 3) forbidding cross regional pilotage. Number 499 CHAIRMAN HUDSON asked Mr. Spence to be specific as to what parts of HB 237 Mr. Spence had problems with. Number 507 MR. SPENCE pointed out the following concerns: - HB 237 might create a shortage of pilots; - HB 237 prohibits cross region licensing; - giving authority to APUC would increase tariffs; and - HB 237 as written does not provide more safety. Number 569 MR. LUCK clarified the licensing fee structure as it stands now. Number 580 REP. MACKIE asked Mr. Spence where and how in this bill would his organization be adversely affected. Number 593 MR. SPENCE answered that it was his group's concern that the Board of Marine Pilots has been unfair in the past and that they couldn't make a fair and accurate assessment of what's needed. Number 610 REP. MACKIE asked that the persons limit their testimony to the legislation at hand and not air their feelings about alleged bias and "bad blood" from the past. Rep. Mackie said he was only interested in good public policy, not the in-fighting between the groups. TAPE 93-29, SIDE A Number 001 PHIL SWAN, SOUTHEAST ALASKA PILOTS ASSOCIATION, testified that his group supported HB 237. Mr. Swan believed that HB 237 would give the industry well-qualified pilots at a fair price and the state would benefit by retaining exclusive control over pilotage without any interference from industry. Number 078 REP. PORTER asked if HB 237 was the same as what's currently law on the west coast. MR. SWAN responded that HB 237 does bring Alaska law closer to what's being done on the West Coast. Number 122 REP. MACKIE asked if there was anything about HB 237 that was detrimental to Mr. Swan's group. MR. SWAN answered that his group had no concerns regarding the bill. CHAIRMAN HUDSON announced that he would hold HB 237 over and adjourned the meeting at 6:34 p.m.