HOUSE HEALTH, EDUCATION AND SOCIAL SERVICES STANDING COMMITTEE April 8, 1999 3:06 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT Representative Fred Dyson, Co-Chair Representative John Coghill, Co-Chair Representative Jim Whitaker Representative Joe Green Representative Carl Morgan Representative Tom Brice Representative Allen Kemplen MEMBERS ABSENT All members present COMMITTEE CALENDAR PRESENTATION BY DIVISION OF FAMILY AND YOUTH SERVICES ON GROUP FOSTER HOMES - CANCELED * HOUSE BILL NO. 175 "An Act requiring the Department of Health and Social Services to provide notice to a community council on receipt of an application for a license to operate a certain kind of foster group home." - HEARD AND HELD * HOUSE BILL NO. 149 "An Act relating to insurance coverage for treatment of mental illness and substance abuse; repealing provisions of ch. 8, SLA 1997, that terminates required mental health benefit coverage; and providing for an effective date." - HEARD AND HELD * HOUSE BILL NO. 142 "An Act relating to the education credit for the fisheries business tax and the fisheries resource landing tax; and providing for an effective date." - HEARD AND HELD (* First public hearing) PREVIOUS ACTION BILL: HB 175 SHORT TITLE: LICENSING OF FOSTER GROUP HOMES SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVES(S) GREEN, Dyson, Halcro Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action 3/31/99 628 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S) 3/31/99 628 (H) HES, CRA 4/06/99 661 (H) COSPONSOR(S): HALCRO 4/08/99 (H) HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106 BILL: HB 149 SHORT TITLE: INSURANCE: MENTAL HEALTH & SUBSTANCE ABUSE SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVES(S) DAVIS BY REQUEST Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action 3/19/99 516 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S) 3/19/99 516 (H) HES, L&C, FIN 4/08/99 (H) HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106 BILL: HB 142 SHORT TITLE: EDUCATION CREDIT FOR FISHERY TAXES SPONSOR(S): REPRESENTATIVES(S) DAVIS Jrn-Date Jrn-Page Action 3/19/99 514 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRAL(S) 3/19/99 514 (H) HES, FINANCE 4/08/99 (H) HES AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 106 WITNESS REGISTER JEFF LOGAN, Legislative Assistant to Representative Joe Green Alaska State Legislature Capitol Building, Room 214 Juneau, Alaska 99801 Telephone: (907) 465-3727 POSITION STATEMENT: Presented sponsor statement for HB 175. SONIA VASCONI 140 Bree Avenue Anchorage, Alaska 99515 Telephone: (907) 345-8830 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in favor of HB 175. GAIL IGO, Co-President Anchor Foster Care Association 1922 Logan Anchorage, Alaska 99508 Telephone: (907) 272-4948 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175. MARBETH JOHNS, Advocate Disability Law Center of Alaska 615 East 82nd, Number 101 Anchorage, Alaska 99518 Telephone: (907) 344-1002 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175. CHERYL SHROYER 220 Bree Avenue Anchorage, Alaska 99515 Telephone: (907) 345-0859 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 175. HEIDI POLLARD 220 Bree Avenue Anchorage, Alaska 99515 Telephone: (907) 345-3152 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 175. BOB BELL, Assemblyman Anchorage Assembly 2610 Curlew Circle Anchorage, Alaska 99515 Telephone: (907) 343-2430 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175. JEFF JESSEE 13030 Back Road Anchorage, Alaska 99515 Telephone: (907) 269-7960 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175. JAY BUSH, Administrator Customer Satisfaction and Quality Assurance Hope Community Resources 540 West International Airport Road Anchorage, Alaska 99518 Telephone: (907) 564-7434 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175. JOHN VOTE 311 Bree Avenue Anchorage, Alaska 99515 Telephone: (907) 348-0209 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175. KRISTAN JEZ, Development Director Hope Community Resources 540 West International Airport Road Anchorage, Alaska 99518 Telephone: (907) 564-7434 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175. RACHEL FARALAN Alternative Community Mental Health Center 11644 Eagle River Loop Road Spur Eagle River, Alaska 99577 Telephone: (907) 694-7644 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175. KARIN ST. CLAIR 5904 Buckner Drive Anchorage, Alaska 99504 Telephone: (907) 338-8716 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175. PELTON GOUDEY 1922 Logan Street Anchorage, Alaska 99508 Telephone: (907) 272-4948 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on HB 175. RITA BARRAS 4261 Chelsea Way Anchorage, Alaska 99504 Telephone: (907) 333-6220 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175. STEPHANI SOCK 9763 Newhaven Loop Anchorage, Alaska 99507 Telephone: (907) 349-0380 POSITION STATEMENT: Testified against HB 175. RUSS WEBB, Deputy Commissioner Department of Health and Social Services P.O. Box 110650 Juneau, Alaska 99811 Telephone: (907) 465-3030 POSITION STATEMENT: Provided information on HB 175. THERESA TANOURY, Administrator Family Services Division of Family and Youth Services Department of Health and Social Services P.O. Box 110650 Juneau, Alaska 99811 Telephone: (907) 465-3191 POSITION STATEMENT: Provided information on HB 175. ACTION NARRATIVE TAPE 99-31, SIDE A Number 0001 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON called the House Health, Education and Social Services Standing Committee meeting to order at 3:06 p.m. Members present at the call to order were Representatives Dyson, Coghill, Green, Morgan, Brice and Kemplen. Representative Whitaker joined the meeting at 3:13 p.m. HB 175 - LICENSING OF FOSTER GROUP HOMES Number 0052 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the first order of business as House Bill No. 175, "An Act requiring the Department of Health and Social Services to provide notice to a community council on receipt of an application for a license to operate a certain kind of foster group home." JEFF LOGAN, Legislative Assistant to Representative Joe Green, came forward to present the sponsor statement. He said HB 175 establishes a notification requirement as AS 47.35.018, so that community councils will have information about new facilities going in their area, and it establishes a definition for a foster group home. The need for HB 175 became apparent to Representative Green, the sponsor, and his constituents after a group foster home was established in his district with no notification, high barriers to information for citizens, and long delays in response times by the Division of Family and Youth Services (DFYS). While it may be true that some local governments may choose to require certain types of notification through the zoning process, other local governments may choose not to. After some consideration, Representative Green decided that all Alaskans, not just those in municipalities or boroughs with tight zoning restrictions, should have the benefits of notification. MR. LOGAN stated that it is important to note that HB 175 does not do anything to empower a community council to slow down, stop or prohibit a residential care facility. There might be testimony today that this will be the eventual result, but they believe that informing citizens of what their government is doing in their neighborhood is good public policy and a legitimate function of this legislative body. The sponsor fully understands that the state has a responsibility for the children being cared for in these facilities. He also understands that Alaskans have a right to know what their government is doing and believes HB 175 is a good balance between the two. Number 0305 SONIA VASCONI came forward to testify. She read the following testimony: Good afternoon Mr. Chairman and members of the committee. I'd like to thank you for providing me with the opportunity to testify in favor of HB 175, which will allow communities all throughout the state to be notified of the establishment of foster group homes in their neighborhoods. My name is Sonia Vasconi. I come before you as a parent, as a neighbor and as a concerned citizen. Let me start this testimony by giving you some basic background regarding foster group homes as I see it. The idea behind the establishment of foster group homes was well intended. Keeping large group of siblings together was logical and thoughtful. However, what foster group homes have become resembles little of what they were intended to be. Today, a single foster group home parent can care for up to eight or more unrelated children in a home. These children can potentially present severe mental dysfunctions such as sexual predatory behaviors, arsonist tendencies and aggressive behaviors. Some or perhaps all of them have "wrap around services" which provide these children with psychological and social services at home or at other facilities. These facts and the increased traffic from social workers, relatives, friends and the police have a tremendous impact in neighborhoods surrounding foster group homes. This situation creates frustration among those of us who try to do the right thing. We abide by the laws, faithfully pay our taxes and try to raise our children the best we can by, among other things, living in the safest neighborhood we can possibly afford, sometimes with sacrifices. Suddenly, we find ourselves dealing with safety issues we didn't previously have, and nobody took the time to inform us about. And when we tried to inform ourselves we found that the system is arrogant and answers are vague and misleading. We are expected to embrace these programs in our neighborhoods when we don't even know what they are all about. Additionally, foster parents find themselves in a bind as well. Sometimes, they, themselves, don't know enough about the children they are supposed to are for. And when safety issues arise they are limited by what they can do or say. This adds more confusion to the whole situation. Ignorance creates suspicion. Let's put the issues on the table at our community councils. That's what they were created for. House Bill 175 is the least a community should be entitled to have; the right to be notified. This bill encourages communication and creates a balance between the needs of foster group homes and the communities that they so depend on for the success of these programs. Thanks again Mr. Chairman and members of this committee for introducing legislation that assists both foster parent and the communities in addressing the needs of foster children. I respectfully encourage you to support and help this bill be enacted into law. If you have any questions, I'll be glad to answer. Number 0545 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if it would make a difference about the concern about danger if the children were all infants for instance. MS. VASCONI said it wasn't even if they were teenagers; it is the kinds of problems that they have. People cannot avoid having these children in their communities. She believes open communication would be better than suddenly realizing next door is a foster group home with severely emotionally disturbed children living there. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON agreed that communication is important, but his question was, if all the children in that home were infants, would she still be afraid. MS. VASCONI answered no. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if there was an age group which starts to be a safety issue in the neighborhood. MS. VASCONI responded that it depends on the issues of the children. In this case, they are teenagers labeled severely emotionally disturbed; that worries her. Number 0760 GAIL IGO, Co-President, Anchor Foster Care Association, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She informed the committee that she is concerned about the confidentiality and information that would be shared with the community council for those foster parents who have four or more children. Foster parents are members of the public record, and anyone can go to DFYS and find out whatever they need to know. She is concerned about the tenor of this, and said it begins to feel like a police state. She tries to teach respect to her foster children. In order to teach respect, they need to show respect. She doesn't believe that HB 175 is respecting the rights of the children. Number 0827 REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked Ms. Igo if the kind of children generally in foster care are awaiting adjudicatory hearings through the DFYS juvenile justice system. MS. IGO answered that she didn't have any statistics on that. There is full range of children as well as problems. REPRESENTATIVE BRICE commented that group homes provide services to a wide variety of children. MS. IGO agreed and said different foster homes provide different services to different children. Number 0922 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked Ms. Igo to show him where in the bill it implied that it would show no respect to the children. MS. IGO responded that if she were running a group home she would have to tell the community council. These children do not need attention brought to them. Foster parents are integrating the children back into society; to have their homes the focus of public attention is difficult and is not showing the children respect. Children who are placed in a group home are selected because they are a lower risk for reoffending or causing trouble in the community. They also need to protect the children's confidentiality. Number 0981 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said he appreciated what she is saying, but asked if she really believes where they have foster group homes that the neighborhood doesn't become aware of them. "You're saying there should be no discussion with the neighbors who have children of their own about what's going to happen in this foster group home, I think works against the very principle that you're trying to establish, in that they are trying to be rehabilitated into the community, the people in this particular case I know, would welcome them with open arms, to be part of the neighborhood. What they object to is to have it put upon them without any notification at all. Had DFYS come to these people and said, 'We are considering buying house X over here because we want to establish a group home for children, what can we do, how can you help us, will you help us?' I think there would have been no problem whatsoever." The neighborhood would have welcomed them; they would have helped them adjust. The problem is that they first weren't told, and then when they finally began to find out, then they were not given information. He had two different meetings with DFYS and several letters trying to get information about what was going on, and he still got no information. They don't want to know the background of each child; what they want to know is what is going to happen. MS. IGO responded that her neighbors know she is a foster parent; she did not give them any details. They don't have a large number of children usually. They did approach the community council and told them they were experienced foster parents. She and her husband moved to Alaska from Vermont and have over 20 years of experience fostering children. Number 1125 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN appreciated her comment and noted that would have gone a long way. In her case she and her husband went to the neighbors and told them what their plan was. In this case, it was a single man and the neighbors questioned if this was the best approach to have four children being supervised by a single person who is frequently out of the house. He doesn't believe that is an invasion of the privacy of the children; it is a protection for them. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON respectfully reminded Representative Green that he is debating the issue and maybe with the wrong person. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN said he was trying to find out why Ms. Igo asked that question. His point is information exchange. He said he was agreeing with her now, not debating with her. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked what does she have to do to protect the confidentiality of the children at her home. MS. IGO said she cannot even say that she is a foster parent. They went to the community council and announced that they were foster parents moving here from Vermont. She is not allowed to give any information about any particular child or the reasons the child is with them. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked for confirmation if she had said she couldn't even say she is a foster parent. MS. IGO answered that is correct. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON questioned that; they will pursue that later. Number 1238 MARBETH JOHNS, Advocate, Disability Law Center of Alaska, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She told the committee the reasons they are interested in HB 175 are because many of the children in foster care have disabilities. They are concerned that notice to community councils suggest that some communities may try to exclude some children with disabilities. In AS 47.35.105 there already is a process for complaints if a community member believes a foster home has violated their condition of license. The alternatives to Alaska's system of foster group homes are out-of- state placement or institutional placement, which are both expensive. They find very little support for this bill and urged the committee to find ways to increase the availability of therapeutic foster care, not decrease it as this bill could do. Number 1294 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked in addition to decreasing availability of homes, are they concerned about the children being stigmatized in the neighborhood. MS. JOHNS answered yes they are. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked her to speak about her concern. MS. JOHNS explained that a regular family can move into a neighborhood without having to give notice. If individuals with disabilities have to give notice, that does stigmatize them and points them out to everybody in the neighborhood. It is treating them differently from everybody else. REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if, from a legal view, she is aware of any other class or group that have to post notice of moving into a community. MS. JOHNS answered sexual assaulters. Number 1366 CHERYL SHROYER, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She stated her support of HB 175, and she encourages resident involvement in neighborhood and community-wide planning. The community council is the forum that provides opportunities for all the residents to be thoughtful and active participants. They can discuss community issues that affect the neighborhood like speeding in front of the park, snowmobiles in the street and a foster group home. A foster group home creates traffic and safety problems, and difficulty communicating with DFYS. She would hope that notification to the community council regarding application for a license for a foster group home would help educate the community, increase public knowledge, and ensure that all persons and community groups have an opportunity for a fair voice in decisions affecting their neighborhood. Number 1430 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if Ms. Shroyer lives in the neighborhood where the problem arose. MS. SHROYER answered that is correct. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if her family had been harassed or had property damage or anything from the children in the foster home. MS. SHROYER answered no. Number 1448 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if there was a mechanism in place to remedy situations with conflict between a group home and the neighborhood, would that make Ms. Shroyer more comfortable about a group foster home being located in her neighborhood. MS. SHROYER answered of course. The idea of an ombudsman is perfect. Their problem is that the neighbors never know what is going on or why. They see police cars going by, they hear rumors and that could all be ended if there were someone as Representative Kemplen described. Number 1544 HEIDI POLLARD, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She testified on behalf of Ev Irvin and herself. She supports HB 175 because it is the basic communication a community should hear. Additionally, she would like to support an amendment to specify how many children are in the care of a foster group home, and what level of care is in that home. Neighbors should be aware of the impact in their neighborhood. She lives on the same street as the foster group home and is aware of how the traffic situation and the constant police visits have impacted the neighborhood. MS. POLLARD participated in a neighborhood group who researched foster group homes. They have been at it for over a year, and they have learned who to ask, how to ask, how to beg for information and find out who to call. They have had bad luck at getting anything out of DFYS and the Department of Health and Social Services (DHSS). They have called or had meetings with DFYS staff: Gwen McAlpine, Steve McComb, Karl Brimmer, Russ Webb, Leonard Abel, Daryl Johnson and Jane Steele; Department of Health and Development Disabilities Foster Care Review panel, the Anchorage Police Department, probationary officers and planning and health departments, the assembly people, Jeff Jessee, the mental health association director, the Oceanview/Old Seward Community Council and Representatives Joe Green and Pete Kelly. One year of phone calls and meetings has resulted in HB 175. MS. POLLARD supports HB 175 because getting this kind of information should not be this difficult, and these meetings would not have taken place without the intervention of the Oceanview/Old Seward Community Council and Representative Green. It has been like pulling teeth to get DFYS and DHSS to listen to their concerns. She encouraged the committee to support HB 175. Number 1697 BOB BELL, Assemblyman, Anchorage Assembly, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He has been working with the neighborhood for quite some time. It seems to him that they should be able to find some kind of balance. The discussion here is about group foster homes, not just foster homes. It is important to try to maintain a neighborhood identity and environment. Maybe in some cases a group home doesn't fit into that environment very well. In all his discussions, no one has said they need less opportunity for foster homes. The programs are necessary, and no one is trying to restrict it; but the neighbors shouldn't be impacted too much either. MR. BELL suggested the idea of a citizen's committee with staff support from DFYS, that would look at the applications for group foster homes to see if they fit in the community. If they end up in a community that doesn't want them there, that has a negative impact on the foster home, as well as the community. He believes that HB 175 starts in the direction of finding a balance. He doesn't think there is any intent for the community council to interrogate the foster parents or children. It is more a "let us know what you're doing there, and let's see if we can find some way to fit into our community in the best way possible." Number 1788 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if Mr. Bell believes that every neighborhood had the responsibility to share in the burden of dealing with community issues. MR. BELL responded absolutely. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked Mr. Bell if he would support a feedback mechanism being established in the neighborhoods. MR. BELL replied that he wasn't sure where he was going with that. It strikes him that HB 175 sort of accomplishes that because once the community council is notified that there is an application, they would start providing feedback. He asked Representative Kemplen if he was talking about before or after the fact. Number 1868 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN answered both. He continued that the bill doesn't have a system to develop a set of rules for a stronger sense of partnership between the neighborhood and the group foster home, or other social agency. When there are instances when someone steps over the line, that person will be dealt with in a swift fashion. By changing the legislation to require that set of rules to be developed between the agency and the neighborhood represents that feedback mechanism. MR. BELL assumed that notification to the community council would infer that the DFYS and the foster parents who were planning to bring a group foster home into the neighborhood would be doing that maybe on a less formal basis. After the fact, if it turns out that the foster home is causing problems beyond what would normally be anticipated, he would assume that DFYS would have the mechanism to deal with that. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Bell if they thought about dealing with this on a local zoning basis. Number 1998 MR. BELL replied that they were having a meeting next week with the municipal attorney to look at that. They have two concerns with that, one the state doesn't have to comply with local zoning requirements and two, it might be a bit more draconian than they want. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Bell why they haven't dealt with this issue in municipal code as opposed to bringing it to the legislature. MR. BELL reiterated that the state isn't obligated to abide by municipal code. The municipality can't overrule the state. It also gets into the U.S. Federal Fair Housing Act and the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) and gets complicated. They are looking at that to make sure there is a fair balance. Number 2069 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Bell how quickly he thought they would get through that process locally. MR. BELL anticipated several months. Number 2099 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN confirmed that Mr. Bell has been working with them on the issue and did advise them last year that rezoning probably wouldn't be effective. MR. BELL agreed he did, and he got back a letter from an attorney who expressed a lot of reservations of what they could do legally with zoning considering the Fair Housing Act and ADA. The only place he thought there was an opportunity to deal with it on zoning would be on public safety issues. Number 2149 MIKE KEECH, President, Foster Care Providers Association, testified from Anchorage via teleconference. He noted some of the issues that HB 175 raises for him on a personal level and as a representative of the Foster Care Providers Association. If he can afford to live in a neighborhood and has to go to a community council, that seems in direct violation of the Fair Housing Act. He should not be segregated because he is a foster family. A group home is a family, it is not a business. He asked if he had biological children with problems, would he also be required to let the community council know he was moving into a neighborhood. MR. KEECH went to two meetings at Oceanview, but he went to get involved in trying to understand where foster families come from. They are a ministry to children for the state; they desire to help the children, but where they live should be deemed by what they can afford and where they choose to live, not out a community council saying "We don't want you in our neighborhood." He asked if this would be grandfathered, and would he be forced to move because his neighborhood decides they don't want foster families. MR. KEECH added that confidentiality would also be an issue not only for the children, but for his family. What they choose to do as a family, as long as they are controlling the foster children the same as their own, should not be an issue, and should not need the community council's approval. Number 2232 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON indicated he didn't think there was anything in the bill that gives a community council any kind of approval process at all. MR. KEECH mentioned that the situation in Oceanview has forced that gentleman to put his house up for sale, and he will more than likely take a loss on it, because of the pressures put on him because of all of this. He doesn't want to see that happen to other foster parents. The city desperately needs foster parents. Number 2283 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if Mr. Keech heard the conversation with Mr. Bell about balance and feedback mechanism. MR. KEECH answered he had. He noted most of his neighbors know he does foster care, and he understands the traffic issue. Most of the children running the streets are not his children. Most foster families keep their children in a controlled environment. He has training to deal with foster children, and most families do. He sees the checks and balances, but most communities don't get involved. In fact, Oceanview didn't get involved until they saw something that they didn't like. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked Mr. Keech where the accountability mechanism is in a neighborhood with a foster home. TAPE 99-31, SIDE B Number 2349 MR. KEECH answered he didn't know. He asked how someone is held accountable when their biological child does something. In the case of children the foster parents can't control, they call DFYS and say this child needs to move for whatever reason; they need more care than what is provided. If his neighbors report that his foster child is doing something outside the realm, he will deal with like any parent would. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked if the Foster Care Providers Association have any policies that address the issue of accountability. It seems to him there needs to be a mechanism established when there is a violation of community norms, action will be taken. He asked if they had thought about establishing some self-policing rules for group foster homes. MR. KEECH answered they hadn't at this point. The association is just now getting back on its feet. It has been inactive for about three years. The purpose is to establish more foster care associations in the local areas, have strong voice with the legislature, and to give support to each other. Accountability hasn't been looked simply because it is too new of an organization. Number 2216 REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if Mr. Keech owns his own home or does an agency have title to it. MR. KEECH answered he owns his home. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked about training Mr. Keech has received as a foster parent. Number 2175 MR. KEECH answered he has had Mandt training, which is a way to control a child physically without harming them; training for fetal alcohol and drug addiction, emotional problems and sexual molestation. He has had recurring training on how to deal with all those problems, and there is information available on the Internet. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if Mr. Keech thought foster parents would be able to handle the variety of children without that training. MR. KEECH said he didn't feel they would, especially initially, but as time goes on, foster parents do learn more. Number 2111 JEFF JESSEE testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He is a resident of the Oceanview community council area and was a participant on the work group the community council formed to look into the issue of this particular group home. He believes this bill is an example of "hard cases make bad law." He understands the concerns for safety, their frustration in terms of getting adequate, timely answers from DHSS, but he can't understand how this bill is going to solve the problem; he believes it will make the problem worse. Much of the information the neighbors really want is confidential, and they won't be able to get it. MR. JESSEE agreed there needs to be some mechanism to answer concerns. One of the recommendations of the community group, which many agreed with, was an independent review group. The Foster Care Review Board might have been that kind of organization; it recently was defunded. He encouraged them to look at those kinds of options rather than this bill. Number 1943 JAY BUSH, Administrator, Customer Satisfaction and Quality Assurance, Hope Community Resources, testified via teleconference from Anchorage and is against HB 175. He noted it seemed to be a restriction on the rights of individuals who experience disabilities for fair housing and rights protected under the ADA. He appreciates the concerns he has heard in support of the bill. He agrees that foster children should have a safe, caring environment that meets their needs, as well as protects them, and provides for their furthering education and acquiring life skills. MR. BUSH is concerned any time another hoop to jump through is created which is not a hoop anyone else moving into a neighborhood would be forced to jump through. If he had children with special needs and moved into a neighborhood, he wouldn't have to go to the community council to seek their permission. He believes that this bill infers that permission has to be granted. It is incumbent upon any foster parent to reach out to the neighborhood because children are raised by the neighborhood. They are not raised only by the single family. It really does take a village to raise a child. It is important to have good supportive neighbors because everyone is involved in the parenting of a child. MR. BUSH doesn't see this bill as building community; he sees it building walls and barriers and providing for more gated-controlled communities in America. The needs for foster children in Alaska are great, and bills are needed to support more good foster parents and more good opportunities for children who can't be supported in their natural family. Number 1826 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN disagreed with Mr. Bush's conclusions. He doesn't think there is anything in the bill that impairs the ability to establish a group home in the neighborhood; notification certainly isn't a restriction. People are far more willing to accept things when they are informed instead of finding out after the fact. The neighbors are only asking that they be informed. MR. BUSH said his concern about the bill is that it doesn't require a natural family who may have four or more children with special needs to jump through the same hoop. If they are making a special class of people who have to go through one more hoop to live in a neighborhood, he is concerned and it smacks of civil rights. If they were taking out the clause that says "disability" and putting in "person of color," they would not even be having this discussion. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN said he is quite familiar with these type of issues at the neighborhood level. He has seen agencies come in and work with the community council and be accepted by the neighborhood. The notion of "after-the-fact" is a key concern of neighborhoods. He asked Mr. Bush why he feels group foster homes can't be up-front with neighborhoods. Number 1602 MR. BUSH said he is not saying foster group homes should not be up- front with the neighborhood. He is concerned that the legislation requires notification to a body, which may or may not be able to make a comment or restrict moving into a neighborhood. People should reach out to their neighbors and become a society of people who sit on their porches and say "hello" to people as they walk by; but it shouldn't be legislated. He believes the legislation sets a tone that may not be intended. Number 1532 JOHN VOTE testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He is the foster group home that resulted in HB 175. He responded to Representative Green's remarks about his Oceanview neighbors wanting to welcome him with open arms. "Within a short period of time after I moved into this neighborhood, they did, I don't know how, but they were made aware of that I was here, and they were also given a bunch of false information as far as what type of kids I was working with. When they were asked to come down and meet me, ... one of the comments from one of the neighbors which actually testified, I believe, was 'When hell freezes over.' You'll find that also in the newspaper comments because that comment was even made to--well actually it was overheard by--Lisa Demer from the Daily News because she was standing there when the comment was made. I feel that this bill comes out of bigotry. Do we pass laws because of bigotry? That is my feeling because I'm the one that's had to put up with this for one year." Number 1431 MR. VOTE continued that as a foster parent, he is restricted by regulations as far as what information he can relate to others. One would be telling people he is moving in, and he has foster children. In some ways he is not supposed to tell people he is a foster parent. The fact that he is a foster parent isn't a secret but how it is said or where, could end up letting people know that the children are foster children, and that is against regulation. A group home means there are more than three children in care. This bill seems to be directed at homes that have more than three children. He doesn't see why more than three children is the issue. He believes that this bill could lead to restriction of free movement. Most DFYS group homes are for sibling groups. As soon as there are more than three children, it becomes a group home. These are mostly specific group homes meaning that they are living with grandparents or a friend who has agreed to take these children. If this bill were to pass, then these people would now have to report to the community council that they were a group home for their relatives MR. VOTE noted that he has put his home up for sale due to the near-constant harassment that he has felt since he has been there. He has not harassed his neighbors to his knowledge. His close neighbors have never had any problems; they have been supportive. The fact that his neighbors know that he is a group home, they start developing rumors, jumping to conclusions, and that causes them not be able to live there and feel comfortable. They are being watched constantly; he can't even have a meal in his home without a neighbor driving by, stopping and watching them. It creates harassment when people find out, and he doesn't see how this bill will help; it will target other people who are going to do this. Number 1248 REPRESENTATIVE GREEN wondered since Mr. Vote's adjacent neighbors were congenial, where is the harassment. MR. VOTE replied that the harassment comes from the people on the street, most of whom testified today. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if Mr. Vote thought it was harassment when several state cars drove by the neighbors' houses. MR. VOTE asked if they were stopping and looking in their windows at them. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked if people were looking in Mr. Vote's windows. MR. VOTE answered yes they are and taking down license plate numbers. He believes his neighbors called Representative Green when one of his children was brought home by a worker who had to use her limousine to drive him home. "That made it all the way to the Governor, I think." REPRESENTATIVE GREEN commented that what he had learned about some of the children was in the newspaper. He mentioned since Mr. Vote's house is up for sale, there will be a lot more people stopping to look in the house. MR. VOTE commented that they won't be his neighbors. Number 1141 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Vote if he had a job besides being a foster parent. MR. VOTE acknowledged he did up until the time he had six children. His children do have special needs and as a result, he has a tremendous number of appointments and commitments that he responds to. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Vote the age group of his children. MR. VOTE said they are between sixth grade and ninth grade; he has had children as young as nine and as old as 16. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Mr. Vote if he pays anyone to help him with the children. Number 1074 MR. VOTE answered that he hires respite people to give him a break or cover situations he can't. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if any of the children in Mr. Vote's care had been arrested during the time he has been in the neighborhood. MR. VOTE answered one had been arrested. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if it was a crime in the neighborhood. Number 1042 MR. VOTE answered it wasn't a crime toward the neighborhood. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked Mr. Vote if he thought any community norms on accountability would work for him as a foster parent. MR. VOTE asked if it were for things like noise levels. Number 0975 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN answered noise level, or a foster parent letting their children play out on the street at 1 a.m. in a boisterous fashion. MR. VOTE replied that would be great. He questioned that it would be necessary because he is not aware of foster parents letting their children cause problems. However, they are held very accountable; they are bound by licensing regulations. If the neighborhood has a problem with either the children or the foster parents, all they have to do is call DFYS with their concern or report of harm. It is immediately acted upon. Number 0878 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN commented that the people who testified earlier in favor of this legislation indicated that accountability is not there, and the department is not able to address their concerns in a timely manner. He asked Mr. Vote if he agreed that it is better for neighbors to work with neighbors to produce solutions rather than going to government as a mediator. MR. VOTE replied certainly but in this instance, the department does have authority and power over the foster parents. The department can require and enforce change. As far as the comments from people who testified in support of HB 175, his interpretation was that they were not able to get their questions answered, not that they had particular issues. To his knowledge they have had no problem with his home, except that they have concerns about the amount of traffic, which he has detailed. REPRESENTATIVE GREEN asked Mr. Vote if he has undergone training for foster parents. MR. VOTE answered in the four years that he has been a foster parent, he has 43 hours of documented training for the past 12 months and about the same amount of undocumented training to total about 80 hours of actual training. He is only required to turn in ten hours; he seeks out much more than that because it is helpful. Number 0553 KRISTAN JEZ, Development Director, Hope Community Resources, testified, via teleconference from Anchorage, in opposition to HB 175. She believes HB 175 invades the privacy and confidentiality of the children they are trying to help and protect. "Foster parents are licensed care givers and that should be the important issues, not whether or not the community is aware of them. Children deserve a chance, a safe home and a community to live in. It appears that this bill would automatically single out these children and their foster homes. Foster homes shouldn't be treated any differently than you or I and our families." There shouldn't be segregation between them and their community members. Once they are in a community, it should be up to them and their community around them, to become involved with each other. Foster care homes are a fact of life; with open-mindedness, they should welcome diversity in their communities. Number 0469 RACHEL FARALAN, Alternative Community Mental Health Center, testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She commented that the nation has worked hard on the fair treatment of children getting away from orphanages, institutions and going out-of-state. She said she believes this bill is a step backward. Foster children are not criminals, and being foster children does not make them unsafe people. She cited examples of crimes biological children have made upon their biological parents. MS. FARALAN reiterated the crisis in Alaska of needing more foster homes, and sometimes they do need to create group homes to accommodate the children. Her solution is if people don't want group foster homes in their neighborhood, they should sign up to be foster parents and take one or two children into their homes. She agrees with neighbors supporting each other. She agreed that Mr. Vote has been harassed. She has been in his home and watched his neighbors drive up, stop and peer into his windows, and "we waved at them" and they continued to stare. That is harassment; no one does that to her in her neighborhood. It is true that HB 175 doesn't say people have to get permission to move into a neighborhood, but it infers it. She believes once someone does move into a neighborhood, they will get harassed and have to move out, so it is segregation. She stated she does not support this bill; it is a step backward. Number 0220 KARIN ST. CLAIR testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She is a foster parent, doesn't have a group home, but she would if her house were big enough. Her mother was a foster parent, and she has been involved in foster care her entire life. She stated, "I agree that this is harassment. We need to be here for our children as a community." She said she felt that Oceanview is not there for the children. If they were, they would take some of these children into their homes, and then there wouldn't be any need for group homes. There is a great need for homes in the entire state. These children need love, and they cannot get that in orphanages and institutions. The group homes are families; not businesses. They are there to love those children. MS. ST. CLAIR added the neighbors like to know exactly what kind of children are in these homes, but these children have a right to privacy. The foster parents are not allowed to tell why the children are in their homes and what has happened to them. She is against HB 175 and agrees with the previous testifier about people getting involved and taking these children into their homes. TAPE 99-32, SIDE A Number 0009 PELTON GOUDEY testified via teleconference from Anchorage. He believes that there needs to be a solution to the problem, but that HB 175 is not necessarily the solution. He concurred with the statement "It takes a village to raise a child." This means society is responsible as a group for the children. The children are the most valuable resource. They need to be loved shown respect no matter what. He described some of the awful problems of two children that he cared for. Since his working with them and having a supportive community, now they are productive members of society. He agreed that communities do have a right to have community norms, but he doesn't think a foster home would go out of its way to violate those norms. He tries to be sensitive in his community and teach the children he works with to understand the norms. Being a good neighbor is very important to him. He indicated that the tenor of HB 175 is negative. He would like to see them work in the direction of finding solutions. Coming back to accountability to the community support, he also believes communities need to be accountable to the children. Number 0272 RITA BARRAS testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She stated her opposition to HB 175. She made the following statement: "I have been a foster parent since 1982, and I do have a group home, and I have taken all kinds of children. I am in the same neighborhood I have been in since I started and I have not had any problems with my neighbors. ... My children do not cause any problems in the neighborhood and I have a real problem with this having to disclose information about my foster children, which I have not ever had to do. ... I hope that this does not come to pass. My foster children are not labeled foster children. I have several here today. They tell everybody that they are 'godchildren,' that they are my godchildren that they were sent to me by God. I take care of them and I am real opposed to putting labels on people because I have been labeled myself since birth. So that is where I'm coming from. If the people would take the time to walk where we walk, and to experience some of the things we're experiencing, perhaps maybe to apply to become a foster parent and try to help some of these children instead of trying to find reasons to get them out of their community." Number 0408 STEPHANI SOCK testified via teleconference from Anchorage. She informed the committee that she runs a group home and believes this bill is an issue of segregation. She asked if she were a single mother with children with disabilities or problems, would she be under scrutiny from a neighborhood council and not allowed to purchase a home because they didn't like the fact that her children had problems, or were afraid they might be a problem to the neighborhood. She believes they are invading the privacy of her family and taking away a home atmosphere by doing this. She has been threatened and harassed by angry parents. She believes the safety of her family and those staying with her will be jeopardized by announcing their presence in a neighborhood. She wondered if other people would be willing to be required to put their names before a council and be pointed out so all the neighbors knew who they were. MS. SOCK addressed the issue of the neighbor children being safe. She asked, "Do I know if my children are safe from their children? I don't think so. I don't think that we're always self-assured by how anybody's children are going to behave in the neighborhood. We have to sometimes have a little bit of trust. We are a family setting and we're here to set an example to these children that come in who have had no example." MS. SOCK noted that foster parents are more protective of their children, and they do not let their children run around the neighborhood. They keep a close eye on them since they are constantly under a magnifying glass because of what they do. She believes her children are better behaved than a lot of the children in the neighborhood; she has never had any problems with her children. She has had many hours of training; she worked eight years in mental health even before she became a foster parent. She summarized that this bill is wrong, and they need to look for other ways to deal with this problem. HB 149-INSURANCE: MENTAL HEALTH & SUBSTANCE ABUSE Number 0679 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the next order of business as House Bill No. 149, "An Act relating to insurance coverage for treatment of mental illness and substance abuse; repealing provisions of ch. 8, SLA 1997, that terminates required mental health benefit coverage; and providing for an effective date." He indicated that HB 149 would be held over for further hearing. HB 142 - EDUCATION CREDIT FOR FISHERY TAXES Number 0682 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the next order of business as House Bill No. 142, "An Act relating to the education credit for the fisheries business tax and the fisheries resource landing tax; and providing for an effective date." He indicated that HB 142 would be held over for further hearing. The committee took an at ease 4:53 - 4:54 p.m. HB 175 - LICENSING OF FOSTER GROUP HOMES CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON announced the committee will return to the hearing on HB 175. Number 0746 RUSS WEBB, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Health and Social Services (DHSS), Acting Director, Division of Family and Youth Services (DFYS), came forward to testify. He apologized for missing the earlier testimony, so he is not clear about all of the issues that were raised. He referred to the difficulty in getting information from the department. It has been about a year since the department began meeting with the community council and neighborhood. The DHSS answered some 60 questions, and doubtless they have not given everybody all the answers that they want. He said he is accountable for that, but they have made a good faith effort. MR. WEBB continued in terms of their licensing procedures, he has heard people say they want the department to meet its mandate to provide safe, appropriate placements for children in family and community settings with well-trained foster parents who provide supervision and nurturing care, monitoring and correction for children that everyone would want for their own children. Many folks have pointed out that DHSS is in a bit of a box in trying to meet that mandate and responsibility; that is simply because they don't have enough foster parents. Clearly recruitment, retention, training and reimbursement support are essential; there is a need to develop a full continuum of care in foster care is critical. Having kids in community-based settings is important. They are a long way from where they want to be. MR. WEBB indicated foster care is in the developmental stage, and they are trying to develop a system of foster care levels. They are trying to set in place licensing and training requirements, and ratios of children in homes, particularly the ones with high needs. He believes they will have to rewrite their foster care regulations to fully implement that system. His opinion is many of the issues that are addressed in the last year can be dealt with in that process without legislation. Number 0990 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if it is true foster parents can't tell people that they are foster parents. MR. WEBB answered he didn't believe it is impossible for people to admit they are foster parents, and frankly they want them to do that; but it is true that they must be very careful to protect the rights of the children in their care, protect the confidentiality of those children and to not compromise the ability of those children to be in the community. There are restrictions about what they can share, but it is a matter of public record who is licensed as a foster parent. Number 1052 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if the foster parent can tell anyone the classification of the foster home and the types of children they are licensed for and trained to provide services for. MR. WEBB said yes they can. They can certainly explain that they are licensed and what the licensing requirements are. They are not licensed for a specific type of child; they are licensed for age groups and can talk about age groups. REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked what the ages and numbers of the children in foster care are currently. MR. WEBB answered that they certainly have that information, but he doesn't have it off the top of his head. He can make that information available. He did tell them that about sixty percent of the children in care are under 12 years old. REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked Mr. Webb to answer some questions on the demographics of the children. He also asked how this legislation would impact those ages and the classifications of children. MR. WEBB responded by saying there are approximately 2,000 children in custody in out-of-home care who are there by virtue of being abused or neglected. The majority of those children are in either relative or foster care. He estimated there are 44 delinquent children who are in foster care, and 75 or fewer in foster care largely as a result of emotional problems. Number 1281 THERESA TANOURY, Administrator, Family Services, Division of Family and Youth Services, Department of Health and Social Services, informed the committee that there are eight foster group homes in Anchorage so there are not a lot of them. However, there are homes that go beyond the licensing regulations of three per home. There are approximately 30 foster group homes statewide, and the majority of those are in the northern region. Number 1306 MR. WEBB said the bill redefines a foster group home by saying that is a home where there are more than four children, which potentially could be a good number of homes. The bill would place some burden on the DHSS when someone applies to be a foster group home, but he didn't think it would be a great burden. He mentioned that foster parents already discussed the chilling effect that this might have on someone's willingness to become a foster parent; particularly if they felt they might be subject to disapproval or scrutiny. REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked how many children a foster parent can have before they become a foster group home. Number 1380 MS. TANOURY replied that a foster group home is no more than eight. A foster home by regulation is three. There are variances if it is a sibling group or emergency, short-term ones. Unfortunately, that happens quite often due to the shortage of foster homes. Number 1411 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN wondered if some foster parents are in it for the money or treat it as a business. MR. WEBB responded that he would be happy to provide the rates they pay foster parents but on review of those rates, it would be imminently clear that foster care as a business is not a money- making venture. Foster care is reimbursement for care of the children; it is not an income to the parent. He thought it would be very difficult for someone to make a living as a foster parent. MR. WEBB stated that nationally, foster care is in a transition period. Years ago most foster homes had one parent who didn't work outside the home; that is not necessarily the case today, and that presents some problems. They are trying to develop a system of care for children that allow them to be present in the community, hopefully in a family based setting, but with people who are trained to provide the type of care they require. Maybe later, they will begin to development professional foster parents. Number 1531 REPRESENTATIVE KEMPLEN asked for some background information explaining the system Mr. Webb is trying to put into place. He also asked Mr. Webb to address a mechanism to deal with the concerns of neighbors when community-based services will go into their neighborhoods. Number 1663 MS. TANOURY answered that the application for a foster parent license is public record as is a completed complaint, but there are pieces of the foster care application that are not public record. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked what DHSS can tell a neighbor who calls and asks what is going on at a certain address. MS. TANOURY explained they would take the information down as a complaint and go investigate it. Number 1693 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Ms. Tanoury if a neighbor calls and asks if there is a foster group home or foster home there and how many children it is licensed for, can the department answer that MS. TANOURY answered yes. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked if they could tell the age group of the children. MS. TANOURY answered yes. Number 1710 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON asked Ms. Tanoury if she thought that worked well in this situation. The neighbors seemed frustrated; and he wondered if this was a breakdown of one time only. Number 1720 MR. WEBB answered that question. He explained that they did have several meetings with the folks in the community, but he doesn't know what occurred in a specific phone conversation. He does know that information has certainly been provided to the folks in the community. They could not answer questions like "What are the children's problems; do they have records of delinquency; are they sex offenders?" Those type of questions are confidential. That proved to be frustrating for people who have high levels of fear of the danger an unknown group of kids may pose in the neighborhood. CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON confirmed that confidentiality laws preclude them from releasing that information. Number 1766 MR. WEBB responded that's correct. REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked Mr. Webb if HB 175 will address that concern. MR. WEBB answered no. Number 1779 REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if the DHSS requires any private home owner to notify a third party for any purpose outside of sex offenders. MR. WEBB answered he cannot think of a circumstance that the DHSS requires that. Number 1817 CO-CHAIRMAN DYSON recessed the meeting at 5:18 p.m. until Saturday morning. [HB 175 was held over.]