Legislature(2013 - 2014)BUTROVICH 205
02/27/2014 09:00 AM Senate STATE AFFAIRS
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| SJR18 | |
| SB98 | |
| SB182 | |
| SB98 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | SB 98 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | SB 141 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | SJR 18 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| = | SB 182 | ||
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
SENATE STATE AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE
February 27, 2014
9:03 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Senator Fred Dyson, Chair
Senator Cathy Giessel, Vice Chair
Senator John Coghill
Senator Bill Wielechowski
MEMBERS ABSENT
Senator Bert Stedman
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 18
Requesting the United States Congress to call a convention of
the states to propose amendments to the Constitution of the
United States that impose fiscal restraints on the federal
government, limit the power and jurisdiction of the federal
government, and limit the terms of office of federal government
officials; and urging the legislatures of the other 49 states to
request the United States Congress to call a convention of the
states.
- HEARD & HELD
SENATE BILL NO. 98
"An Act relating to Department of Public Safety regulations
allowing village public safety officers to carry firearms."
- HEARD & HELD
SENATE BILL NO. 182
"An Act relating to salary differences in collective bargaining
agreements subject to the Public Employment Relations Act that
are based on a difference in the cost of living outside the
state and the cost of living in the state; and providing for an
effective date."
- HEARD & HELD
SENATE BILL NO. 141
"An Act relating to vehicle registration fees for members of the
Alaska National Guard."
- SCHEDULED BUT NOT HEARD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: SB 182
SHORT TITLE: PUBLIC EMPLOYEE SALARY DIFFERENTIALS
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) DYSON
02/19/14 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/19/14 (S) STA
02/25/14 (S) STA AT 9:00 AM BUTROVICH 205
02/25/14 (S) Heard & Held
02/25/14 (S) MINUTE(STA)
BILL: SB 98
SHORT TITLE: VPSO FIREARMS
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) OLSON
04/05/13 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
04/05/13 (S) CRA, STA
02/11/14 (S) CRA AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205
02/11/14 (S) Heard & Held
02/11/14 (S) MINUTE(CRA)
02/13/14 (S) CRA AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205
02/13/14 (S) Moved SB 98 Out of Committee
02/13/14 (S) MINUTE(CRA)
02/14/14 (S) CRA RPT 4DP
02/14/14 (S) DP: MICCICHE, EGAN, BISHOP, GIESSEL
02/14/14 (S) FIN REFERRAL ADDED AFTER STA
02/27/14 (S) STA AT 9:00 AM BUTROVICH 205
BILL: SJR 18
SHORT TITLE: FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) DYSON
02/05/14 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/05/14 (S) STA
02/27/14 (S) STA AT 9:00 AM BUTROVICH 205
WITNESS REGISTER
TYLER BELK, Staff
Senator Fred Dyson
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided an overview of SJR 18.
ROY CARLSON, representing himself
Wasilla, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Supports SJR 18.
DAVID EICHLER, State Director
The Convention of State Project
North Pole, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Supports SJR 18.
DAVID SCOTT, Staff
Senator Olson
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Provided an overview of SB 98.
TERRY VRABEC, Deputy Commissioner
Alaska Department of Public Safety
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Addressed departmental questions pertaining
to SB 98.
COLONEL JAMES COCKRELL, Director
Division of Alaska State Troopers
Alaska Department of Public Safety
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Addressed departmental questions pertaining
to SB 98.
CAPTAIN STEVEN ARLOW, Commander
Village Public Safety Officers (VPSO) Program
Division of Alaska State Troopers
Alaska Department of Public Safety
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Addressed departmental questions pertaining
to SB 98.
BEN GOLDRICH, Regional Representative
Marine Engineers' Beneficial Association
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
RON BRESSETTE, Regional Representative
The International Organization of Masters, Mates & Pilots Union
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
RICK DEISING, Regional Director
Inlandboatmen's Union of the Pacific
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
CHRIS OLSEN, Chief Engineer
Motor Vessel LeConte
Alaska Marine Highway System
Wasilla, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
PATRICK PHILLIPS, Crew Member
Motor Vessel Fairweather
Alaska Marine Highway System
Alaska Department of Transportation & Public Facilities
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
JARED BARLOW, Ordinary Seaman
Motor Vessel Kennicott
Alaska Marine Highway System
Alaska Department of Transportation & Public Facilities
Klawock, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
TERESA GILBERT, Crew Member
Motor Vessel Kennicott
Alaska Marine Highway System
Alaska Department of Transportation & Public Facilities
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposes SB 182.
NICKI NEAL, Director
Division of Personnel and Labor Relations
Alaska Department of Administration
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Addressed departmental questions regarding
SB 182.
KATE SHEEHAN, Deputy Director
Labor Relations
Division of Personnel and Labor Relations
Alaska Department of Administration
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Addressed departmental questions regarding
SB 182.
ACTION NARRATIVE
9:03:19 AM
CHAIR FRED DYSON called the Senate State Affairs Standing
Committee meeting to order at 9:03 a.m. Present at the call to
order were Senators Coghill, Giessel, and Chair Dyson.
CHAIR DYSON reviewed the committee meeting agenda. He stated his
intention was to have Senator Wielechowski's bill on waiving
registration fees for National Guard members before the
committee. He said SJR 18 will be before the committee and noted
that he sponsored the resolution for calling a convention of the
states by proposing a constitutional convention to the U.S.
Congress. He set forth that his intent was to pass out SB 182
and noted that at least 45 minutes has been allotted for
testimony. He summarized that [SB 98] will also be before the
committee on arming of Village Public Safety Officers (VPSO).
SJR 18-FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION
9:04:56 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that SJR 18 is before the committee.
9:05:05 AM
TYLER BELK, Staff, Senator Dyson, Alaska State Legislature,
Juneau, Alaska, read an overview as follows:
For the past seven years, the U.S. federal government
has operated outside of the constraints of what our
founding fathers had envisioned. Inherent
overspending, over extended use of regulation and
enforcement jurisdiction, and unreasonably long
service terms of federal government officials are
fused several ways in which our national government is
moving outside of its designed blueprint. Aiming to
mitigate a federal government that exceeds its
enumerated powers, our founding fathers added a key
provision of the Constitution that would allow for the
states to rein in and control any move to expand
federal government beyond its intended means. Article
V grants states the power to call for a Convention of
the States to amend the Constitution in a controlled
and topic-specific manner. This ability to call for a
convention is a method to rein in and alleviate the
aforementioned problems. A Convention of States is not
a Constitutional Convention. The scope and subject
matter of a Convention of States is controlled and
limited by what the applications call for. SJR 18 is
the first step in a long process for a convention.
Through the Article V process, two thirds or 34 of the
50 states must call for a convention based on a
similar application. Congress then must call for a
convention once those applications are received.
Delegates, who are chosen in a manner decided on by
the states, will design and debate amendments aimed at
the topic. In this case, imposing fiscal constraints
on the federal government, limiting the power and
jurisdiction of the federal government, and limiting
the terms of office officials will be the topic. If
the convention validly proposes one or more
amendments, Article V requires Congress to select one
of two modes of ratification. The Congress may decide
that amendments be submitted to the states, then the
state legislatures, or they will demand that the
states call for special amendment conventions within
the states, similar to how we did with the 21st
Amendment to repeal prohibition. SJR 18 is a portion
of step 1 of the Article V convention process; it is
Alaska's formal application calling for a Convention
of the States. Essentially, this resolution is Alaska
moving into cue for an Article V convention.
CHAIR DYSON asked if anyone in the room would like to testify.
9:08:01 AM
ROY CARLSON, representing himself, Wasilla, Alaska, noted that
he is a retired U.S. Army Lieutenant Colonel and Vietnam
veteran. He read a statement as follows:
I do not intend my words to be partisan in any way.
What I am saying has been going on for many years
through different party administrations. The
resolution before you is truly non-partisan. During
the Constitutional Convention, it was argued that the
amendment process did not address the possibility of
an out of control federal government, they recognized
that Congress would not pass an amendment limiting
their own power, so they added another way to amend
the Constitution and put that power in the hands of
state legislatures, that of course is your committee
and your colleagues in the Alaska Legislature. You
have a necessary and awesome responsibility. As a
solider, I have seen tyranny, I have seen it in the
eyes of the children who are not carefree and laugh
when they are at play. You see it in the faces of
their parents who are afraid for themselves and their
children, they are afraid to talk to you for fear of
reprisal by their government or terrorist groups.
Also, I have talked to a number of immigrants from the
former Soviet Union, Cuba, and other countries with
tyrannical governments and with a unified voice they
say, "Wake up, don't you understand what is happening
to you," they see it because they have been through
it. The federal government is out of control and we
know from history that a mere change of administration
is not going to change that and so I ask you to please
pass SJR 18.
CHAIR DYSON thanked Mr. Carlson for his service to the nation.
9:10:24 AM
DAVID EICHLER, State Director, The Convention of State Project,
North Pole, Alaska, stated his support for SJR 18.
9:10:59 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that SJR 18 will be held in committee.
SB 98-VPSO FIREARMS
9:11:20 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that SB 98, version A was before the
committee.
9:11:30 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that the committee will stand at ease.
9:12:03 AM
CHAIR DYSON called the committee back to order.
9:12:17 AM
DAVID SCOTT, Staff, Senator Olson, Alaska State Legislature,
Juneau, Alaska, said SB 98 is a one page bill and is easy to
understand. He said SB 98 prohibits the Department of Public
Safety (DPS) from not allowing VPSOs to carry firearms. He noted
that since SB 98 and the companion in the other body were
introduced during the last Session, DPS has undergone a process
to write the regulations for allowing the arming of VPSOs.
MR. SCOTT set forth that SB 98's intent is to clearly establish
the Legislature's intent that VPSOs would be allowed to carry
firearms. He said VPSOs would have to meet all satisfactory
training standards. He asserted that SB 98's passage would make
the State's support for arming VPSOs clear and unambiguous. He
called attention to VPSOs killed in the line of duty in
Manokotak and South Naknek. He pointed out that VPSOs often work
without backup and in remote locations. He informed the
committee that VPSO calls to the Alaska State Troopers (AST) for
assistance can mean hours or even days due to weather. He set
forth that Senator Olson, SB 98's sponsor, believes that it is
not reasonable to ask VPSOs to walk unarmed into situations that
pose obvious dangers to their lives and the lives of other
Alaskans. He said it is Senator Olson's hope that arming VSPO
first responders in rural Alaska will have a deterrent effect
that makes the officers and communities safer. He pointed out
that SB 98 will not require VPSOs to be armed. He said the
wishes of individual communities, nonprofits, and the Northwest
Arctic Borough will be respected. He asserted that everyone
should have a thorough understanding of the issues if VPSOs will
be armed in the front lines of public safety, search and rescue,
firefighting, and medical assistance.
9:15:47 AM
He addressed arms training and evaluations. He said Senator
Olson's office has spoken with DPS and specifically Captain
Arlow, who is the head of the VPSO programs and training for
AST. He said the firearms training that VPSOs will receive will
be absolutely identical to the firearms training that AST and
municipal police officers receive. He pointed out that VPSOs
will receive training from the same instructors at the Sitka
Training Academy (STA). He revealed that training will meet the
Alaska Police Standards Council and the Alaska Law Enforcement
training requirement. The training would cover the entirety of
the use of force continuum and it emphasizes avoiding the use of
deadly force. He noted that training terms used in the law
enforcement are "verbal judo" and "de-escalation training;" it
is a technique used to try to defuse situations to avoid the use
of firearms. He said VPSO training would also include intensive
scenario based exercises with the emphasis on judgment and
avoiding the use of deadly force.
He addressed VPSO psychological evaluations and noted that DPS
officials anticipate that the regional nonprofits will agree to
a requirement for full psychological evaluations for carrying
firearms. The VPSO psychological evaluations will be identical
to those administered to AST and municipal police. He noted that
the requirement for the psychological evaluations can be added
to DPS' contracts with the nonprofits and Northwest Arctic
Borough. He revealed that the cost for each evaluation will be
approximately $400 per person. He said additional VPSO
screenings will include medical examinations and full criminal
checks from statewide and FBI resources.
9:18:08 AM
MR. SCOTT disclosed that there have been concerns through the
committee process that VPSO firearms training will not be
thorough and comprehensive. He added that there had been
concerns regarding the psychological evaluation levels for VPSOs
to carry firearms. He asserted that DPS has provided every
assurance that the 600 total hours that current VPSOs train
combined with additional arms training will produce safe and
conscientious officers. He summarized that Senator Olson would
characterize SB 98's fiscal note as modest.
9:19:06 AM
SENATOR GIESSEL addressed the drafted amendment provided to the
committee regarding VPSO regulations, 13 AAC 96.040(b). She
pointed out paragraph (6) regarding the submission of a written
report if a VPSO has to draw his firearm and noted permissive
language that says "may permit" a VPSO to carry a firearm. She
asked if the submitted draft was done by DPS.
MR. SCOTT answered correct. He specified that the draft
regulations that Senator Olson's office asked for.
SENATOR GIESSEL addressed 13 AAC 96.080 regarding "Basic
standards for village public safety officers." She asked to
clarify that 13 AAC 96.080 are adopted regulations that from
what Mr. Scott described will be revisited and probably beefed-
up a bit.
MR. SCOTT replied that DPS can answer Senator Giessel's
question.
CHAIR DYSON stated that in general, government employees and
public safety officers have sovereign immunity that protects
them from lawsuits. He asked if VPSOs would have similar
protection.
9:20:55 AM
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI joined the committee meeting.
MR. SCOTT addressed the fiscal note and pointed out that
additional liability insurance is included for $500 per VPSO.
CHAIR DYSON asked if the added liability insurance is covered by
the state or regional corporations.
MR. SCOTT replied that to his knowledge the regional
corporations or non-profits that administer the VPSO program
with cover the liability insurance. He deferred to DPS to verify
his assessment.
CHAIR DYSON invited officials from DPS to address the committee.
9:22:34 AM
TERRY VRABEC, Deputy Commissioner, Alaska Department of Public
Safety, Juneau, Alaska.
9:22:43 AM
COLONEL JAMES COCKRELL, Director, Division of Alaska State
Troopers, Alaska Department of Public Safety, Anchorage, Alaska.
MR. VRABEC addressed liability concerns and noted that the added
$500 is for the non-profits' individual VPSOs. He said there is
liability in everything and DPS will take VPSO training very
seriously.
COLONEL COCKRELL asserted that DPS had adequate safeguards in
place to provide the firearms training necessary for VPSOs. He
noted that he had met with various VPSOs plus the nonprofits and
revealed that there seems to be universal support for allowing
the option to arm VPSOs. He said villages are seeing an increase
in assaults, including the VPSOs. He asserted that arming VPSOs
gives communities an option to decide if they want to have armed
VPSOs. He pointed out that arming VPSOs will be up to the
nonprofits and individual communities. He set forth that DPS
supports SB 98 and will ensure that there are protections in
place to assure VPSO and community safety.
9:25:19 AM
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI noted his support for the concept of the
bill. He explained that his only issue with SB 98 is its
training aspect. He asked if VPSOs are considered state or
nonprofit employees.
MR. VRABEC answered that VPSOs are not state employees. He
pointed that the VPSOs go to STA, but the VPSOs are employees of
their respective nonprofit organization.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if VPSOs are indemnified by the state
or native nonprofits for any liability if VPSOs use deadly
force.
MR. VRABEC answered that liability insurance is included in the
fiscal note. He specified that the additional liability
insurance costs are coming up because there obviously is
potential liability that would be borne by the respective
nonprofit corporation. He stated that anytime DPS does any type
of training or programs with a VPSO, police officer, or AST, DPS
ensures that training meets the highest standards that also
protects DPS respectively with some of the liability.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if a VPSO can potentially be
criminally prosecuted if the use of force was not justified
under Alaska law and could there be civil responsibility if the
use was not justified.
MR. VRABEC replied that he cannot speak as an attorney, but
anytime any officer takes any action, everyone will be held
accountable and actions must be justified. He remarked that
Senator Wielechowski's inquiry was potentially possible.
9:27:31 AM
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if VPSOs will be treated differently
from ASTs in terms of criminal prosecution and civil liability.
He inquired if native nonprofits would be liable for the actions
of their VPSO employees.
MR. VRABEC replied that he would not be able to answer Senator
Wielechowski's question. He commented that any use of force
action or the use of deadly force by any department or VPSO is
internally investigated by DPS. He asserted that DPS does a very
good investigative job.
COLONEL COCKRELL added that if DPS had a situation where a VPSO
used deadly force in a village, whether it was justified or
unjustified, AST would be the lead investigative agency and the
only investigative agency. He said a deadly force incident would
be thoroughly investigated and as is done in AST cases,
regardless if DPS felt it was justified or not, it still gets
reviewed by the Department of Law-Office of Special Prosecutions
to determine justification.
SENATOR COGHILL inquired if DPS' expectations on the use of
deadly force would be included in the VSPO training. He asked if
the VPSO trainees and the corporations doing the hiring would be
made aware of the deadly force incident process and possible
liability.
9:30:25 AM
CAPTAIN STEVEN ARLOW, Commander, Village Public Safety Officers
Program, Division of Alaska State Troopers, Alaska Department of
Public Safety, Anchorage, Alaska; answered that firearms
training for VPSOs will be new grounds as far as educating the
nonprofits on the firearm component. He explained that the
current firearms training at the academy covers the use of force
and the associated law issue. He explained that the use of force
is currently investigated through the Alaska Bureau of
Investigations where an incident is treated like a crime scene
until all of the information and evidence is collected. He said
after information and evidence is gathered, the incident is
written up and then reviewed by the Office of Special
Prosecutions. He detailed that the Office of Special
Prosecutions determines independently whether there was a
criminal act involved and justifiability. He opined that the
Special Prosecutions' determination would most likely be shared
with the nonprofits since the nonprofit is the VPSO employer. He
added that if there was any civil litigation to follow, the
nonprofits would have the information provided for use in a
civil case as well. He set forth that VPSOs will be briefed on
things to anticipate with the responsibilities of carrying a
firearm, just like any AST or law enforcement trainee.
9:32:44 AM
CHAIR DYSON addressed Senator Coghill's question and asserted
that the intent was to clarify that the regional corporations
and the nonprofits will understand that some liability will be
incurred if deadly force is used. He set forth that the
committee encourages DPS to make very clear to the corporations
that liability will be incurred.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI noted that Captain Arlow did a presentation
in House Finance on the reasons that VPSOs leave the program. He
recalled that approximately 30 percent leave because of
violation of rules or laws.
CAPTAIN ARLOW responded that about half had issues with either
policy violations or personal judgment calls where VPSOs
violated either the law itself or some policy. He noted that
most of the nonprofits have a strict zero tolerance policy for
the use of alcohol in the dry villages, violating the alcohol
policy is grounds for termination. He specified that VPSO
terminations are 25 to 30 percent for policy violations and 20
to 25 percent for criminal activities.
9:34:37 AM
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI pointed out a concern regarding the
creation of a private police force to enforce the laws of
Alaska. He added that arming VPSOs is essentially giving AST
responsibilities to a private police force. He asserted that
VPSOs do not have the training and background checks. He
referred to the 30 percent VPSO turnover rate because of rule or
law violations. He asked if private police forces were used
anywhere else in the U.S.
MR. VRABEC replied that VPSOs are very specialized and their
academy training is over 600 hours. He pointed out that VPSO
training is more than just law enforcement. He said VPSO
training also includes fire and rescue, medical, and
firefighting. He asserted that nonprofit organizations love
having their VPSOs.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI announced that he wanted to be clear that
he has absolutely no disrespect on his part towards VPSOs. He
stated that his intent is to see the best possible trained
officers that the state can get into the villages. He asked what
the pay was for VPSO versus AST.
9:36:34 AM
MR. VRABEC replied that he does not have exact numbers, but
conceded that there is a difference and AST officers are paid
more. He pointed out that AST is a different job at a different
capacity. He noted that the Legislature recently raised VPSO
salaries. He stated that the VPSO position is a great job and
some do very well with it. He reiterated that VPSO training is
extensive and the 600-plus hour academy is well over the Alaska
Police Standards minimum of 400-plus hours. He added that
firearms will increase the VPSO training hours.
SENATOR COGHILL said part of the question that Senator
Wielechowski was getting to is the corporations are doing the
hiring and that is a private entity, but corporations are
community based entities as well, something that is unique to
Alaska. He queried what would happen if a community does not
support a corporation and noted that a corporation is different
from a municipality under Alaska Statutes-Title 29. He noted
that the State partners with the corporations and questioned
whether the VPSO program is a private police force.
9:39:32 AM
MR. VRABEC answered that VPSOs are considered peace officers in
the state and do have law enforcement authority. He set forth
that VPSOs are employees of the nonprofits. He said in addition
to training, DPS assists with the backgrounds and screening of
VPSO candidates. He concurred that the VPSO program is very
unique to Alaska with the state's rural areas.
CHAIR DYSON remarked that most of the villages he had worked
with in Western Alaska had problems with bears in local dumps.
He asked what is done about VPSOs having to protect people or
run bears out of the dump. He asked if VPSOs are allowed to have
a shot gun.
CAPTAIN ARLOW answered yes. He noted that current VPSO training
includes proper shotgun use for the problems Chair Dyson
described. He revealed that VPSOs already have the authority to
use a shotgun as well as using a firearm in emergency
situations. He said allowing VPSOs to carry a firearm is
actually introducing another tool to do the job. He said the
VPSO liability already exists for batons or other instruments
needed for VPSOs to protect themselves.
CHAIR DYSON asked if anyone in the committee room or online that
wants to speak against SB 98.
9:41:52 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that the committee will stand at ease.
9:41:59 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that SB 98 will be held in committee. He
noted that Senator Wielechowski has an amendment to introduce at
the next hearing. He noted that the bill will probably move out
of committee and apologized to the people that wanted to
testify. He said the bill will probably not require added
testimony and asked supporters to provide written testimony.
9:43:00 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that the committee will stand at ease.
SB 182-PUBLIC EMPLOYEE SALARY DIFFERENTIALS
9:43:13 AM
CHAIR DYSON stated that the committee with take up SB 182. He
noted that the Administration provided testimony at the previous
hearing. He set forth that his intention is to get through 35 or
40 minutes of public testimony and asked the union
representatives to come forward and testify.
9:44:14 AM
BEN GOLDRICH, Union Representative, Marine Engineers' Beneficial
Association (MEBA), Juneau, Alaska.
9:44:23 AM
RON BRESSETTE, Regional Representative, International
Organization of Masters, Mates & Pilots Union (MM&P), Juneau,
Alaska, said he represents the licensed deck officers onboard
the Alaska Marine Highway System (AMHS).
9:44:35 AM
RICK DEISING, Regional Director, Inlandboatmen's Union of the
Pacific-Alaska Region (IBU), Juneau, Alaska, said he is a 32
year retiree from AMHS.
MR. GOLDRICH set forth that the members of the three unions are
the Senators' constituents. He asserted that SB 182 will result
in roughly a 10 percent pay cut for MEBA members across the
board and penalizes MEBA members for being Alaskan citizens. He
said Cost of Living Differentials (COLD) has been part of the
AMHS wage for 30 years and enables members to live throughout
the state. He stated that COLD was intended as an incentive for
mariners to move to Alaska and it has been a success.
9:46:12 AM
He continued that the overwhelming majority of MEBA members live
in Alaska. He asserted that SB 182 targets only those members
living in the state. He pointed out to the committee that SB 182
puts MEBA members in a strange place in addressing COLD when
MEBA is actively in negotiations with the State. He remarked
that early on in negotiations the Administration voiced their
concern for COLD and MEBA has been negotiating in good faith
throughout in an effort to come to a mutually agreeable
conclusion. He asserted that SB 182 passage is asking MEBA to
negotiate out of a hole. He noted that the all of the union
bargaining units are concerned with SB 182 due to the current
vacancy rates that range from 7 to 20 percent. He set forth that
the intent is to bring young mariners into the state, live in
Alaska, and work their careers in AMHS. He asserted that
removing COLD from union member's wages is going to prevent the
unions from bringing young talent into Alaska in addition to
losing those with years of experience. He said at a time when
wage really is all there is now, a 10 percent pay cut is just a
killer and it is a big hit for AMHS moral.
9:48:35 AM
SENATOR GIESSEL noted that a chief engineer's wage is $40.62 per
hour in Alaska, plus $677.96 for non-watch pay. She asked what
non-watch pay is.
MR. GOLDRICH replied that non-watch pay is a payment that the
chief engineers receive in lieu of overtime. He detailed that a
chief engineer generally works a 12 hour day, but a day could be
18 hours long. Non-watch pay was intended to be based on 11
hours of overtime pay, but members work for beyond the 11 hours
every month.
SENATOR GIESSEL asked if the $677.96 is per pay period.
MR. GOLDRICH replied that the $677.96 is a flat amount that the
chief engineers receive per pay period regardless of how many
hours they work.
MR. BRESSETTE noted that Mr. Goldrich addressed concerns for all
three unions.
9:51:07 AM
MR. DEISING set forth that IBU represents the unlicensed AMHS
employees. He said SB 182 will harm all Alaskans that work in
the state. He detailed that IBU has 640 members in AMHS and 5
percent are from out of state. He asserted that a 10 percent pay
cut is going to harm the lifestyle of every IBU member, harm
Alaska communities, and will not entice new employees to work
for AMHS. He pointed out that IBU members are well trained,
first responders that wear multiple hats on ships.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI addressed the 40 year old contract language
which basically says the base rate is based on a Seattle rate,
but COLD is provided for employees that live in Alaska.
MR. BRESSETTE answered yes.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI continued that if COLD is taken away, every
Alaskan member will receive a pay cut, while the people who live
outside of Alaska keep their wage the same.
MR. BRESSETTE answered yes.
9:54:11 AM
SENATOR COGHILL noted that the contract with COLD was set in
1977. He asked what the 1977 differential is versus present day.
MR. GOLDRICH answered that the differential was set between
Seattle and Anchorage. He said currently the State contends that
the cost of living in Seattle and Anchorage is roughly the same.
He remarked that the State's cost of living assertion is
probably true if an individual lives in downtown Seattle where
housing prices are sky high. He asserted that it is vastly more
expensive to live in Alaska than the Lower 48. He pointed out
that MEBA members do not receive step-increases, but receive a
negotiated wage that Alaska members base their living on with
COLD.
9:56:00 AM
SENATOR COGHILL asked if it would be more advantageous to
negotiate a wage with COLD due to Alaska's dynamic geographical
issues.
MR. GOLDRICH answered that COLD is a better fit for AMHS and
noted that the State does not offer geographical differential in
negotiations. He said starting from 10 percent less with a
geographical differential would only benefit day-boat members.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI set forth that the three unions are in
negotiations with the Administration. He asked if there is
anything to stop the Administration from coming to the
bargaining table and renegotiate the SB 182 provision.
9:57:50 AM
MR. GOLDRICH replied absolutely not.
MR. DEISING added that COLD has been a topic with the
Administration. He asserted that union members are very
passionate about keeping the benefits they have and serving
Alaskans to the best of their ability.
MR. GOLDRICH addressed the Administration's concerns into
nonresidents receiving COLD and noted that over the past 12
years only 1 member has lost in arbitration. He said it is the
State's responsibility to take members to task who are
nonresidents. He asserted that only Alaskan members are
receiving COLD.
10:00:40 AM
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI noted the unusual language in the agreement
that dates back a long time. He remarked that the Legislature
always talks about Alaska hire and encouraging people to live in
Alaska, COLD is actually a pretty clever way to do that.
MR. GOLDRICH responded that COLD works.
SENATOR GIESSEL stated that the Legislature encourages Alaska
hire. She referred to the information provided to her and noted
that there are substantial benefits to living in Alaska outside
of COLD. She pointed out that after 5 years of service, an AMHS-
Alaska resident annually receives 420 vacation hours with 180
sick-leave hours and an AMHS-nonresident receives 160 vacation
hours with 96 sick-leave hours. She asserted that AMHS employees
receive significant benefit as Alaska residents in addition to
COLD.
MR. BRESSETTE replied that in the MM&P contract, there is no
difference between Alaska residents and out of state residents
as far as vacation accumulation or sick leave accumulation. He
pointed out that everyone gets the same thing for sick-leave
accumulation and vacation hours is based on hire-date.
10:02:51 AM
SENATOR GIESSEL replied that she will follow up with the State
and noted that her information differs from what Mr. Bressette
had noted.
CHAIR DYSON addressed Senator Wielechowski and noted that parts
of the negotiation are prescribed due to the 1977 law. He noted
that the Administration has addressed a geographical
differential in recent negotiations.
MR. GOLDRICH answered that if the State is going to offer up
geographical differential pay, the unions are looking forward to
hearing their proposal in negotiations.
CHAIR DYSON stated that he may be mistaken and noted his
understanding that the Administration is aware of a potential
pay cut. He said he is hopeful that the Administration will
maintain pay and benefit levels that will keep union members
happy.
He announced that the committee is going to run out of time and
noted that two or three pages of testifiers have signed up. He
announced his plan to provide time for testifiers who are online
and in person. He asked that the testifiers not repeat what had
already been said unless it is very necessary.
10:05:13 AM
CHRIS OLSEN, Chief Engineer, Motor Vessel (MV) LeConte, Alaska
Marine Highway, Wasilla, Alaska, noted that MV LeConte is home
ported in Juneau and he is a member of MEBA. He stated that he
is testifying against SB 182. He asserted that SB 182 penalizes
him for being an Alaska resident. He said he has been an AMHS
crew member for 18 years and noted that he relocated to Alaska
in 1986. He said there is no comparison between the maritime
unions' COLD and the geographical difference for the other
regular state Alaska unions; the two are completely different
and unrelated to each other. He asserted that SB 182 is specific
to the maritime union's COLD payment. He asserted that the 1977
contract agreement rewards employees who choose to live in
Alaska and keeps wages within Alaska while supporting
communities. He noted that he does not agree with the study that
claims that the cost of living in Seattle is equal to Anchorage
and added that he pays for commuting to Juneau on a biweekly
basis.
10:08:29 AM
PATRICK PHILLIPS, Crew Member, Motor Vessel Fairweather, Alaska
Marine Highway System, Alaska Department of Transportation &
Public Facilities, Juneau, Alaska, said he moved to Alaska 20
years ago. He asserted that SB 182 punishes him and changes the
deal he originally agreed to. He asserted that the passage of SB
182 will be a hardship to him.
10:10:10 AM
JARED BARLOW, Ordinary Seaman, Motor Vessel Kennicott, Alaska
Marine Highway System, Alaska Department of Transportation &
Public Facilities, Klawock, Alaska, stated that he is an IBU
member. He said he is speaking against SB 182 and asserts that
the bill's passage will hurt him. He remarked that there is a
cost living difference between Alaska and Seattle.
10:13:21 AM
TERESA GILBERT, Chief Steward, Motor Vessel Kennicott, Alaska
Marine Highway System, Alaska Department of Transportation &
Public Facilities, Juneau, Alaska, stated that she is buying a
home in Juneau and sets her budget according to her wages. She
said a cut in pay will be detrimental to her finances. She noted
that she has worked 30 years for AMHS and intends to retire in
Juneau.
CHAIR DYSON replied that the committee wants Ms. Gilbert to stay
in Juneau. He asked if the union representatives had any closing
comments.
MR. GOLDRICH answered no.
CHAIR DYSON noted that he has about nine pages of testifiers and
explained that it is very difficult to get through the entire
list. He encouraged written testimony to be submitted and noted
that SB 182 will be heard in other committees in addition to
having to go through the House as well. He asked representatives
from the Administration to address the committee.
10:16:12 AM
NICKI NEAL, Director, Division of Personnel and Labor Relations,
Alaska Department of Administration, Juneau, Alaska.
10:16:28 AM
KATE SHEEHAN, Deputy Director, Labor Relations, Division of
Personnel and Labor Relations, Department of Administration,
Juneau, Alaska.
CHAIR DYSON asked to clarify that not having COLD will result in
AMHS employees taking up to an $18,000 decrease per year. He
remarked that Alaska residents will be discriminated against
because they would not get something even though they have a
higher cost of living and the accusation that there will be no
geographical differential that many other state employees
receive.
MS. SHEEHAN addressed the bargaining piece and stated that the
DOA's bill interruption is that there would no longer be COLD
negotiations. She pointed out that there have been discussions
on COLD and geographical differential. She noted that the 2008
McDowell Study used a national study to show that there is no
COLD between Seattle and Anchorage. She said the Administration
is in the process of having geographical differential
conversations with the three unions and referenced new
geographical differential rates implemented with other state
unions.
10:18:22 AM
CHAIR DYSON asked to clarify that the Administration's use of
the word "COLD" means the term of art that is in the statute. He
inquired that the bill's passage will allow the Administration
to make adjustments based on where people's jobs are, or where
people live as the standards used by the State for other
employees.
MS. SHEEHAN answered that geographical differential is more
difficult with the marine units because they can live wherever
they choose to live. She added that AMHS employees generally
work weekly on-off based schedules and can choose to live in a
place other than their change port. She pointed out that AMHS
has three day-boats in Metlakatla, Juneau, and Cordova; that is
clearer to address. She pointed out that the geographical
differential was for the different intrastate cost of living and
COLD was for interstate.
CHAIR DYSON pointed out that testimony implied that passing the
bill just means an $8,000 to $18,000 wage cut. He asked to
verify that it is the State's intent to negotiate an adjustment
to keep AMHS' compensations competitive.
MS. NEAL answered that there will be options gained through
collective bargaining and those have already been discussed with
the unions regarding changes to the geographic rates within
Alaska. She pointed out that there were discussions on
protection for current employees on wage reduction.
10:20:52 AM
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI read the language from the current MM&P
Collective Bargaining Agreement with the State as follows:
Section 17.02, this is something you negotiated and
you agreed to, it says, "It is agreed that the cost of
living differential between Alaska and Seattle, which
is referred to in AS 23.40.210, shall be a mandatory
subject for collective bargaining, and shall not be
changed, modified, adjusted, re-determined, or altered
in any way by the state of Alaska unilaterally and no
change shall be made without the consent and agreement
of the union."
He asked Ms. Neal to verify that the section he read was the
section that the Administration negotiated.
MS. NEAL answered yes, at one point in time many years ago.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if Section 17.02 is currently valid.
MS. NEAL answered yes.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asserted that the Department is violating
Section 17.02.
MS. NEAL replied that she disagreed.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked for an explanation as to how the
Administration is not involved in an unfair labor practice.
MS. NEAL answered that the bill is irrespective of the
negotiations currently being held with the unions.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI responded that the bill says COLD shall be
changed without the consent and agreement of the union. He asked
if the Administration has the unions' consent and agreement to
change COLD. He pointed out that he heard unanimous testimony
that the Administration did not have consent and agreement from
the unions.
MS. SHEEHAN replied that the Administration is currently
bargaining with the unions on COLD and the process is
irrespective of the bill. She said the Administration is
bargaining the COLD and geographical differentials. She remarked
that the whole contract with the unions is open for negotiations
and the Administration is not violating the current contract and
is not involved in unfair labor practices.
10:22:55 AM
SENATOR COGHILL inquired if the Administration is presently
bound statutorily to COLD.
MS. SHEEHAN answered yes.
SENATOR COGHILL asked that the bill's passage would only apply
to prospective bargaining agreements.
MS. SHEEHAN answered yes.
SENATOR COGHILL asked if Senator Dyson invited the
Administration to you comment on the bill.
MS. SHEEHAN answered yes.
SENATOR COGHILL opined that he did not believe that the
Administration was acting in bad faith by commenting on a bill
that would change prospective bargaining. He stated that the
unfortunate part is the unions and the Administration is in the
middle of bargaining.
CHAIR DYSON added that he understands Senator Wielechowski's
point is not that these people discuss it, but indeed that it is
a part of negotiation in contrast to the law. He asked if anyone
in the committee room is a labor attorney.
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI [raised his hand.]
CHAIR DYSON asserted that his previous statement was an
important question. He said he will hold SB 182 over. He asked
that someone from the Administration have a labor attorney at
the next meeting in order to address the issues raised by
Senator Wielechowski. He noted that he is sympathetic to the
bill, but added that he has the question about having SB 182
pass in the midst of negotiations. He apologized and asked that
individuals who did not get a chance to testify to submit
written testimony. He announced that SB 182 is set aside.
10:24:56 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that the committee will stand at ease.
10:25:05 AM
SENATOR COGHILL asked if the next order of business is SB 98.
10:25:19 AM
CHAIR DYSON announced that the committee will stand at ease.
10:25:38 AM
CHAIR DYSON said Senator Olson would like to speak to Senator
Wielechowski's amendment and cannot attend the committee
meeting. He announced that SB 98 will be held in committee.
He said he appreciated everyone's presence at the committee
meeting, particularly members of the marine unions.
10:26:09 AM
There being no further business to come before the committee,
Chair Dyson adjourned the Senate State Affairs Standing
Committee hearing at 10:26 a.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| SB 98.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 - TCC support.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document Coons.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document Kamai.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document Letter Robert Claus.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document McCarthy Letter.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document Wasserman.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document Letters.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Informational Meeting Summary 9 26 2013.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Information Hearing Supporting Documents 2.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 DPS Draft Revised VPSO Regs.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Hiring Regs 13 AAC 96 080.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document ADN Article.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document ADN Editor Letter.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 98 Supporting Document Alaska Dispatch.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 98 |
| SB 141 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 141 |
| SB141- Legislation - National Guard License Registration.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 141 |
| SB 141 - Supporting - AK National Guard Benefits Summary.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 141 |
| SB 141 - Supporting - Legislative Research Report.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 141 |
| SB 182 - Sponsor Statement.pdf |
SSTA 2/25/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| SB 182 - Legislation.pdf |
SSTA 2/25/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| SB 182 - Section Analysis.pdf |
SSTA 2/25/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| SB182-DOT-AMHS-MVO-2-25-14.pdf |
SSTA 2/25/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| Alaska GDS 2008 Final.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| SB 182 - Support Documents - Talking Points.pdf |
SSTA 2/25/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| SB 182 - Support Document - 2011 CBA.pdf |
SSTA 2/25/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/4/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SB 182 |
| SJR 18 - Legislation.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |
| SJR 18 - Sponsor Statement.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |
| SJR 18 - Supporting Documents - Details of the Case for Convention of the States.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |
| SJR 18 - Supporting Documents - List of States with Current COS Movement Resolutions.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |
| SJR 18 - Supporting Documents - State Application and Convention Process Step by Step.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |
| SJR 18 - Supporting Documents - Timeline of State Article V Applications.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |
| SJR 18 - Supporting Documents - What Types of Amendements Possible Under Proposed Topic.pdf |
SSTA 2/27/2014 9:00:00 AM SSTA 3/11/2014 9:00:00 AM |
SJR 18 |