Legislature(2007 - 2008)BELTZ 211
03/29/2007 09:00 AM Senate STATE AFFAIRS
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Confirmation Hearing, Apoc: Elizabeth Hickerson | |
| SB100 | |
| SB101 | |
| SB135|| HB171 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| *+ | SB 135 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| = | SB 100 | ||
| = | SB 101 | ||
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
SENATE STATE AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE
March 29, 2007
9:04 a.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Senator Lesil McGuire, Chair
Senator Gary Stevens, Vice Chair
Senator Hollis French
Senator Lyda Green
Senator Con Bunde
MEMBERS ABSENT
All members present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
CONFIRMATION HEARING: Alaska Public Offices Commission
Elizabeth Johnston Hickerson--Anchorage
CONFIRMATION ADVANCED
SENATE BILL NO. 100
"An Act relating to substance abuse and mental health disorder
prevention and treatment programs; and relating to long-term
secure treatment programs for persons with substance abuse or
co-occurring substance abuse and mental health disorders."
MOVED CSSB 100(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE
SENATE BILL NO. 101
"An Act relating to private professional conservators and
private and public guardians."
MOVED CSSB 101(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE
SENATE BILL NO. 135
"An Act relating to the terms of legislators, the date and time
for convening regular legislative sessions, certain procedures
of the legislature, the date for organizing the Legislative
Budget and Audit Committee, and deadlines for certain matters or
reports to be filed or delivered to the legislature or a
legislative committee; prohibiting bonuses for legislative
employees; and providing for an effective date."
HEARD AND HELD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: SB 100
SHORT TITLE: SUBSTANCE ABUSE/MENTAL HEALTH PROGRAMS
SPONSOR(S): SENATOR(S) ELLIS
02/28/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/07 (S) HES, STA, FIN
03/19/07 (S) HES AT 1:30 PM BUTROVICH 205
03/19/07 (S) Moved SB 100 Out of Committee
03/19/07 (S) MINUTE(HES)
03/21/07 (S) HES RPT 4DP 1NR
03/21/07 (S) DP: DAVIS, ELTON, THOMAS, DYSON
03/21/07 (S) NR: COWDERY
03/27/07 (S) STA AT 9:00 AM BELTZ 211
03/27/07 (S) Heard & Held
03/27/07 (S) MINUTE(STA)
BILL: SB 101
SHORT TITLE: GUARDIANSHIP AND CONSERVATORS
SPONSOR(S): LABOR & COMMERCE
02/28/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/07 (S) L&C, STA, FIN
03/08/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
03/08/07 (S) Heard & Held
03/08/07 (S) MINUTE(L&C)
03/13/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
03/13/07 (S) Moved CSSB 101(L&C) Out of Committee
03/13/07 (S) MINUTE(L&C)
03/14/07 (S) L&C RPT CS 3DP 1NR SAME TITLE
03/14/07 (S) DP: ELLIS, BUNDE, DAVIS
03/14/07 (S) NR: STEVENS
03/27/07 (S) STA AT 9:00 AM BELTZ 211
03/27/07 (S) Heard & Held
03/27/07 (S) MINUTE(STA)
BILL: SB 135
SHORT TITLE: ACCOMMODATE 90-DAY SESSION
SPONSOR(S): STATE AFFAIRS
03/23/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/23/07 (S) STA, FIN
03/29/07 (S) STA AT 9:00 AM BELTZ 211
WITNESS REGISTER
ELIZABETH JOHNSTON HICKERSON, Designee
Alaska Public Offices Commission
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: She presented herself as designee.
SENATOR JOHNNY ELLIS
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Presented SB 100 as sponsor.
BILL HOGAN, Deputy Commissioner
Department of Health and Social Services (DHSS)
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Spoke in favor of SB 100.
KATE HERRING, Staff
to Senator Johnny Ellis
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions regarding SB 100.
JOSH FINK, Director
Office of Public Advocacy
Department of Administration
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions regarding SB 101.
RYNNIEVA MOSS, Staff
to Representative Jack Coghill
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on SB 135 and HB 171.
JOHN BOUCHER
Office of Management and Budget
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on SB 135 and HB 171.
TAMARA COOK, Director
Legislative Legal and Research Services
Legislative Affairs Agency
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on SB 135 and HB 171.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CHAIR LESIL MCGUIRE called the Senate State Affairs Committee
meeting to order at 9:04:02 AM. Senators Green, Stevens, French,
Bunde, and McGuire were present at the call to order.
^Confirmation Hearing, APOC: Elizabeth Hickerson
CHAIR MCGUIRE announced the consideration of the confirmation of
Elizabeth Johnston Hickerson for a seat on the Alaska Public
Offices Commission (APOC).
ELIZABETH JOHNSTON HICKERSON, Designee, Alaska Public Offices
Commission, said she is interested in the position because it is
important to make sure people follow the rules, especially while
representing constituents. It is somebody's responsibility to
make the hard calls, and she is willing to do it. She said she
is honest, fair and reasonable. The law should be followed by
all people regardless of their politics, she stated.
SENATOR BUNDE said once a person runs for office, he or she is
presumed guilty. The public judges legislators unfairly and
harshly, but since Ms. Hickerson has a sense of humor, she might
apply the laws with common sense and a sense of humor.
9:07:49 AM
SENATOR STEVENS asked about her membership in the Alaska Bar
Association and Alaska Rules of Professional Conduct and if that
experience will assist her in this role.
MS. HICKERSON said she served on the disciplinary committee for
the third judicial district for about 20 years, reviewing
complaints against attorneys. Sometimes the committee gives
advice to bar council on paper and other times it has
administrative hearings to cross examine witnesses and to reach
a decision. That experience has helped her understand due
process, she said. She is trained as an attorney, but
determining conduct is different from a criminal trial. She said
she has attempted to understand people and their behavior. Her
position has given her experience sitting in judgment. With the
Alaska Rules of Professional Conduct she is revising rules that
apply to attorney behavior with clients and the public. It has
been an ongoing process, and she has sat with attorneys going
over rules and how they would be applied. It has her thinking
about ethical behavior and how it should be applied, she said.
9:11:03 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said people have similar opinions of politicians
and lawyers, but most are good people. The legislature is trying
to redefine its rules to align with public expectations. She
said APOC has been very helpful in guiding legislators through
the form requirements. It is important to frame the rules to
ensure the public trust and let the members know how they can do
the job better.
MS. HICKERSON said she hopes APOC will continue to be helpful.
Politicians are under scrutiny, but that is the public's right.
She said she worked for the Senate and there are very honorable
people serving the public, and it is unfortunate that the good
work is overlooked by the indiscretion of others.
9:13:16 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said she appreciates Mr. Hickerson's desire to
serve and she moved to recommend that her name be forwarded to a
joint session for consideration for the Alaska Public Offices
Commission. Hearing no objection, it was so ordered.
The committee took an at-ease from 9:13:52 AM to 9:15 AM.
SB 100-SUBSTANCE ABUSE/MENTAL HEALTH PROGRAMS
CHAIR MCGUIRE announced the consideration of SB 100.
9:15:21 AM
JOHNNY ELLIS, Alaska State Legislature, Sponsor of SB 100, said
Senator Bunde had earlier asked the daily cost for patients in
the non-secure "detox" facility, and that is yet to come. The
number of calls regarding "high flyers" in Anchorage is
forthcoming as well. The question of whether a person must hit
rock bottom before treatment can be effective is answered in
studies that he has provided to the committee. He said the bill
goes to finance committee next, and the main rub will be the
costs of the pilot project. The bill will need broad support in
the body, he surmised.
9:17:14 AM
SENATOR STEVENS noted that he received a letter saying that
Senator Ellis should be the first one committed.
SENATOR ELLIS said that person corresponds frequently with the
legislature and has feelings about conspiracies. He said
everyone is entitled to their opinions. There is a
misunderstanding; the bill will use an existing statute, and
judges, not politicians, will commit people. It is for the most
extreme cases and he has taken time to educate people.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said she has had constituents in favor of
involuntary commitment. One has had tremendous difficulty
getting a family member committed, she stated.
SENATOR ELLIS said it is often family members that ask for help
getting someone committed, and the statute should be stronger.
He said the American Civil Liberties Union would likely oppose
the legislation if the bill changed the balance of power. "If
people perceive that someone is out to get them or that the
system is totally corrupt and people are after them…I've heard
from two individuals that have concerns that this bill might
pass and someone might try to involuntarily commit them. I've
gone to great pains to explain to people it is extreme
circumstances that we're talking about."
9:20:23 AM
SENATOR FRENCH noted a handout with a cost and health comparison
of babies born to untreated and treated substance-abusing women.
For the one-week treatment for substance abuse, the average
savings to the system was over $30,000 per birth [because the
babies were born larger and healthier and their stay in the
hospital was shortened]. Looking at it from a purely economic
standpoint-without even considering the long-term consequences
of being a small baby--the system is money ahead, he stated.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the part of the bill she likes is putting
pregnant women at the top of the treatment list. She thought
that was already the mandate and didn't know the state wasn't
following it. It is two lives being impacted. It is not 100
percent, but the hope is the mother can be treated and the baby
benefits, she said.
SENATOR ELLIS said federal grants require priority for pregnant
women, but the state doesn't for its grants. The bill would make
it clear in state statute. One discussion got caught up in an
abortion debate, he said, and "I hope we've transcended that."
9:23:16 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said whether a person is pro-life or pro-choice,
it is in everybody's best interest.
SENATOR BUNDE clarified that giving pregnant women priority
treatment doesn't mean they will be sent involuntarily.
SENATOR ELLIS said there is a committee substitute (CS).
SENATOR GREEN moved to adopt the CS for SB 100, labeled 25-
LS0151\N, as the working document. Hearing no objection, Version
N was before the committee.
BILL HOGAN, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Health and Social
Services (DHSS), said he was once with the Division of
Behavioral Health. The change made by the CS is simple and
mandates that DHSS coordinates with existing community resources
to ensure an adequate number of trained crisis responders and
medical and legal support.
9:25:45 AM
MR. HOGAN said there are many aspects of the bill that DHSS
feels strongly about, including identifying people with co-
occurring disorders. Up to 70 percent of people receiving
services have co-occurring disorders. The department is working
on an integrated behavioral health service delivery system, and
SB 100 supports those efforts. He said he likes the focus on
evidence-based practice and the use of research to determine the
most effective services. Some federal block-grant money has been
used on evidence-based practices lately, and this will reaffirm
that focus. He said he likes focusing on outcomes. Just being
sober is not good enough; "we really want folks to be productive
and contributing members of society." He supports the pilot
project for involuntary commitment. He has worked with a lot of
individuals forced into treatment, and it is not necessary that
they have hit rock bottom to be successful. Forcing treatment
really helps people achieve sobriety and maintain it, he stated.
9:28:29 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said it will particularly help people whose family
members and friends are involved due to their love for them.
SENATOR STEVENS assumed the fiscal note includes the needed
personnel. But the CS speaks to existing community resources. He
asked, "What are we buying for $2 million?"
KATE HERRING, Staff to Senator Ellis, said the first version
discussed the pilot program coordinating with community
resources, and the program should fund its own staff, but the
department was concerned that it would need to extend community
service patrols and policing. "We basically inserted the word
'existing.'" The intent is to clarify no expansion.
9:30:45 AM
SENATOR FRENCH said the bill doesn't change the legal standards
for involuntary commitment. The difference is being committed to
a treatment program instead of a mental institution.
MS. HERRING said yes. She understands that the involuntary
commitment statute was underutilized because there was no where
to put people who were incapacitated by their addiction.
SENATOR ELLIS said he has been impressed with the Department
while working on this legislation, and they are willing to try
something new. The legislature has been frustrated with money
put into treatment programs that sound good, but it takes
longitudinal studies and statistical reporting beyond simply
intuition or hope to know the results. So evidence-based
programming is the way the country is going, because policy
makers are sick and tired of investing in programs that don't
work. The legislature was shocked to find that the D.A.R.E.
program is not a good investment. "We all stood there, had our
photos taken with the kids and the canine units and the police."
It seemed to be a good program, but studies showed it didn't
work. He said we are not giving up on young people but trying to
put money in things that truly work. He understands that one
would want a program to have an 80 or 90 percent success rate.
Maybe 45 percent is the best to expect, he said. "But we don't
know unless we require that these programs that we invest our
public dollars in are evidence-based." That way there will be no
flying in the dark on good intentions, he concluded.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the big decision will be made on the fifth
floor. She said she doesn't know how much money they have.
9:34:15 AM
SENATOR ELLIS said he is committed to work with all senators to
get the bill through. This is a partnership, and he is calling
everyone to the table to help whittle down the legislative
fiscal note. The status quo has gone on too long with a
ridiculous waste of money, he said.
9:35:33 AM
SENATOR BUNDE said the bill is sound, but he is disappointed
that the Mental Health Trust won't support it. It is a general
fund responsibility. Mandated treatment does not work in the
state, he said. Looking at $2 million for only 20 people a year
is not a gamble he is willing to take. It might speed the bill
up to take out the financial implication, he stated. He moved
Amendment 1 to remove Section 8, the pilot program.
SENATOR FRENCH objected because it guts the bill and leaves
nothing but a wish list. The real test of the bill is if the
state can save money and save lives by intensive treatment for
people with co-occurring disorders. Senator Bunde doesn't think
the programs work, but there is a study by Johns Hopkins that a
period as short as one week can save the system $30,000 by
focusing on pregnant women. There is evidence that is does work.
9:38:22 AM
SENATOR ELLIS encouraged the committee to not adopt the
amendment. If the bill moves, "we would have the opportunity to
work with all the parties, and discussions are ongoing." The
Mental Health Trust is supportive, and he is telling them to put
money in. The bill will have to satisfy the body and the finance
committee. There are other sources of money as well, he stated.
If the pilot project is left in the bill, the finance committee
is where people can come to the table. If that doesn't work, it
won't pass. Please give him the chance to work on it, he asked.
SENATOR BUNDE said the care for pregnant women doesn't involve
involuntary commitment, so there is value in the bill without
Section 8. Section 8 is just a gamble; there is no evidence
until $11 million is spent, he stated.
9:40:06 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said she shares some of his concerns but she will
let the idea go to the finance committee. Innovation may be
needed to get the repeat folks that cost so much money. It is a
big bite for the state, especially when trying to figure our
fiscal stability. Section 8 is a big part of the bill, she said.
A roll call vote was taken on Amendment 1. Senator Bunde voted
in favor, and Senators French, Green, Stevens, and McGuire voted
against. Amendment 1 failed on a vote of 1 to 4.
SENATOR FRENCH moved the CS for SB 100, labeled 25-LS0151\N,
Mischel, from committee with individual recommendations and
accompanying fiscal notes.
SENATOR BUNDE objected. He said there were some good ideas in
the bill but the price tag is far too high.
A roll call vote was taken. Senators French, Green, Stevens, and
McGuire voted in favor of moving the CS and Senator Bunde voted
against. Therefore CSSB 100(STA) moved from committee on a vote
of 4 to 1.
9:42:26 AM
SB 101-GUARDIANSHIP AND CONSERVATORS
CHAIR MCGUIRE announced the consideration of SB 101. [The
committee was working off of the committee substitute (CS) to SB
101, labeled 25-LS0559\K.]She suggested an amendment for page 4,
lines 14-16. Past testimony indicated that that is a remnant of
the old licensing structure.
JOSH FINK, Office of Public Advocacy, Department of
Administration said it does appear to be a remnant.
CHAIR MCGUIRE moved Amendment 1 "to remove Section 4, lines 14-
16, and whatever cleanup language is needed by the drafter to
make that flow well." Hearing no objection, Amendment 1 was
adopted.
9:44:19 AM
MR. FINK said the bill is in good shape.
SENATOR STEVENS moved the CS to SB 101, labeled 25-LS0559\K, as
amended, from committee with individual recommendations and
attached fiscal note(s). There being no objection, CSSB 101(STA)
moved from committee.
SB 135-ACCOMMODATE 90-DAY SESSION
[Comparison to HB 171 is included in the discussion.]
CHAIR MCGUIRE announced the consideration of SB 135. She noted
that there is a comparison with the companion bill, HB 171, in
the committee packet. She also said there were three amendments
passed in the House State Affairs committee this morning.
SENATOR STEVENS noted that only two amendments passed.
9:47:13 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE referred to the side-by-side comparison of the
house and senate bills and said Section 3 is still in the house
bill, and it adds a section that the first regular legislative
session would start on the second Monday in January and the
second session on the second Monday in February. Representative
Johnson offered that language because with a late start date in
an election year, there is the potential for the governor to
call a lame duck session of people who are only technically
serving because the newly elected members have not yet been
sworn in. If the newly elected members aren't aligned with the
governor, such a situation could upset the public's will. She
said she has no opinion.
9:50:22 AM
SENATOR GREEN said that happened in the third special session
with non-re-elected members participating. "This makes it so
difficult." She asked if the bill changed the reporting date of
the governor. That may solve the problem, she said.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said it is commiserate.
RYNNIEVA MOSS, Staff to Representative Jack Coghill, said
Amendment 2 that passed in the house this morning addresses some
of the reporting dates. "I hope this matches your bill." She
referred to Page 6, line 18. It addresses the supplemental
appropriations and the budget amendments. The first year was
adjusted to allow 30 days to submit the supplemental budget, and
it is 5 days in the second year.
9:52:35 AM
JOHN BOUCHER, Office of Management and Budget (OMB), said he has
been working with the house regarding the deadlines, and there
is only one OMB suggestion that the house has not adopted. In
the odd-number years, OMB proposed to have the amended budget by
the 45th day, and the house has it on the 30th day. He
understands it would be half way through the 90-day session, but
"in terms of the calendars that are set up in the odd year,
which would begin in January, they provide adequate time for us
to prepare a budget."
CHAIR MCGUIRE said there have been lame duck sessions and the
earth didn't fall off the axis. The governor is still sworn in
on December 4, so he or she could still call a lame duck session
even with the house language. She asked Mr. Boucher if the
staggered dates would cause OMB any difficulty.
9:55:17 AM
MR. BOUCHER said the only real concern is moving the deadline
for the final budget up with a January start date, because the
revenue forecast for the current year won't be quite as robust.
There may be a slightly larger group of amendments the following
year, he surmised. But revenue forecasts can change dramatically
based on the price of oil, so the budget release is timed to be
as close to the end of the fiscal year as possible. It will be
best to give the Department of Revenue the advantage of having
the time to incorporate the tax information from the previous
year into the spring forecast.
SENATOR BUNDE asked the rationale for starting later instead of
the normal time. He has heard that airport problems are worse in
January, but he is not sure that is a reason to establish public
policy. With a 90-day session members may not be leaving Juneau
as often. There may be more special sessions, which may have
less impact to families if they happen in April or May, rather
than June. He asked the reason for beginning the session later.
9:58:05 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the Senate bill also calls for a February
start date, "but this is wide open; it's for us to decide."
SENATOR STEVENS said it would be nice to have a little more time
at home during the winter holidays.
SENATOR GREEN said it had more to do with deadlines for reports
and the governor's budget. It reduces pressure, especially
during an election year, and it will result in fewer substitutes
and amendments.
9:59:27 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the staggered start dates are confusing. If
it is a citizen legislature and members have jobs, it is nice to
have a predictable schedule. She said, "I don't share the
heightened degree of paranoia that something terrible is going
to happen, maybe because I lived through it this last year."
There were only 12 people that were not re-elected who were
making decisions [during that lame duck special session].
MS. MOSS said the February date is for the revenue forecast, and
the January amendment was added when Representative Gruenberg
noted that the constitution defines the term of a representative
as two years. Starting the session on the second Monday of
February, "the term of the outgoing representatives would end on
January 15, so technically you would have no members of the
house. Their term has expired." Currently that situation exists
for about eight days in the gubernatorial election years, and it
hasn't been a problem. "This would only occur once, because if
you had a session in February, they would be sworn-in in
February, and the two-year term would match."
10:02:11 AM
TAMARA COOK, Director, Legislative Legal and Research Services,
said Ms. Moss is correct. The constitution says that the term of
office for house members is two years and four for the senate,
so with a staggered start date on gubernatorial election years,
some members have a term that expires early. She said this might
not be a problem. As an administrative matter, the legislative
affairs agency has treated legislators as if they remain in
office until their successors are sworn in. It has not come
before the court, she said. If the term is moved radically
backward, then there is a bigger gap for one cycle. The
convening date can be changed by law. The problems are inherent
in the constitutional language, which says that the term is a
set period of years, but it also gives the legislature the
opportunity to change the beginning date. "I'm inclined to think
that a court would somehow…construe those two provisions
together to avoid a situation where we had a lot of empty seats
during a critical period."
10:04:40 AM
SENATOR FRENCH recalled testimony saying the revenue forecast
can be moved. "There is nothing fixed about the world economic
cycle or other reporting agencies that bring us the raw data for
preparing the revenue forecast. That date can be pushed around,"
he said. The real problem is the fiscal year is set at a certain
date. He surmised that the revenue folks would like to wait
until as close as possible to the beginning of the fiscal year
before they give the forecast. He said that makes sense, but it
is July 1. So why not move up the revenue forecast?
MR. BOUCHER said the forecast can be moved; it is a matter of
what information is available at the time. With a new tax
structure and other new components, "you want to have the best,
most latest information available, and I believe that those
would be provided for in the annual tax return." Forecasting
should begin shortly after those are filed.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said that is in April.
SENATOR FRENCH asked if he is referring to the PPT [profit-based
petroleum tax of 2006] law or just the general list of laws
passed each year.
MR. BOUCHER said in this case it is the PPT. Regarding this
spring forecast, the true-up payments are coming in around the
first of April, and that is critical information for this fiscal
year and next. This is unique, and once comfort is developed
with the PPT tax structure, it won't be so important.
10:07:32 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the state is so dependent on oil and gas
revenue, and the filing deadline is in April. That is when the
legislature gets the most accurate information.
SENATOR FRENCH said the PPT question will go away soon. He asked
if there are other April reports, because the PPT payments come
every month.
MR. BOUCHER said he believes that there is a true-up at the end
of the year.
SENATOR FRENCH said that on April 2 there will be the true-up
from the transition to the PPT, and it is a one-time event.
"We're looking for a billion dollars to enter the state bank
account on Monday," but it is a one-time event.
10:09:00 AM
SENATOR STEVENS asked if the law states that legislators remain
in office until the successors are in.
MS. MOSS said the only law is the constitution that defines a
term as two years.
SENATOR STEVENS suggested clarifying that a person is in office
until a successor is sworn in.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said that is a great idea and she asked for that
amendment from legal services.
MS. COOK said she presumes that would be limited to the period
at the end of a session. "You would not want a person to remain
in office until a successor is appointed by the governor in case
of vacancies that occur mid-term." If someone resigns, there is
a system for filling vacancies.
10:11:15 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said yes, and she asked for a draft for both bills
in that narrow context, because it will likely be the house bill
that moves forward.
SENATOR BUNDE said the ability of committees to take action
while not in regular session is not addressed in the bill.
MS. MOSS said in the House State Affairs Committee this morning
there was an amendment that a person could vote telephonically
and move a bill out of committee, but it failed. The committees
can now meet in the interim but cannot move a bill. The bill
would sit in limbo because it needs to be read across the floor
before going to the next committee.
MS. COOK said both standing and special committees are allowed
under the uniform rules to meet and hold hearings on bills.
There is nothing prohibiting a committee from reporting a bill
from committee, but there is no mechanism to deliver the report
to the Chief Clerk or Senate Secretary. If the matter remains
unaddressed in the bill, then there is the problem that the
uniform rules require the physical presence at the site where a
committee is held for a vote to report a bill from committee. A
member attending by teleconference cannot vote, and that may be
a greater problem in the interim when members are scattered.
10:14:46 AM
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the legislature would have to call itself
back in for technical sessions.
SENATOR STEVENS asked why Amendment 3 by Representative
Gruenberg did not pass because it addresses those issues.
MS. MOSS said the members want eye-to-eye contact with other
members. A legislator may call in from home and have someone
passing notes and providing information or influence that other
members would not have access to or have knowledge of.
10:17:03 AM
SENATOR STEVENS said he understands that, but he asked about the
issue of reporting the bill from committee.
MS. MOSS said there was no concern about that, it was just about
having the same information and access to people. "The only
thing this amendment really does is it allows a telephonic vote
to move the bill out of committee."
SENATOR BUNDE said this is interesting that in the internet age,
eye contact is needed. Members have wanted to participate from a
hospital and haven't been allowed to. "How many times on the
floor would a fellow legislator or a staff member give you a
note?" The members in the front might not be privy to that, he
stated. If the 90-day session is to save money, requiring
flights and per diem of far-flung members needs more discussion.
10:19:36 AM
SENATOR FRENCH asked about the requirement of reading a bill
across the floor before moving it to the next committee, and if
that is in the constitution or in the uniform rules.
MS. MOSS said it is in the uniform rules.
MS. COOK said the constitution requires three readings, but it
is silent with regard to moving the bill to the next committee.
The bill is not in second reading until it appears on the floor
having been calendared. It is public policy because the
legislature can control its own internal procedure, including
the referral of bills to committees and the accepting of
reports. If a committee report travels from one committee to the
next without going to the floor, there is no opportunity for a
member to object to that report. That will be lost, she stated.
SENATOR FRENCH said he has never seen that happen in his short
experience. He asked, "Are we recreating the wheel?" The voters
said they wanted a 90-day session. What does it mean to do an
enormous amount of interim work? Did the voters not want the
members in Juneau for very long, did they want them not
legislating for very long, or did they want to save money? He
said there will be pressure to get the work done in 90 days.
10:22:02 AM
SENATOR STEVENS said the public said a 90-day session, and we
have to find a way to cut a quarter out of the time spent. He
said there must be a way to allow committees to operate [in the
interim], or else the legislature is setting itself up for
failure. Serious consideration needs to be given to allow bills
to move between committees.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said the committee may want to incorporate that
into the bill.
SENATOR BUNDE said lobbyists would love the provision that a
bill dies if it doesn't move out of its originating house the
first year because "it will give them another pressure point to
really focus on." The voters may want less legislation. If that
can't be done, perhaps the number of bills should be limited.
10:24:38 AM
MS. MOSS said that provision of a bill dying in the first
session died quickly. There has been discussion on limiting the
number of bills a legislator could file.
SENATOR STEVENS said there is a lot of opposition to limiting
the number of bills, but the next step is requiring bills to be
introduced prior to session. That would reduce the number of
bills, he said. Perhaps only committee bills could be introduced
after the beginning of session.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said there is a version of that after the 24-hour
rule goes into effect.
MS MOSS said that is in the second session only, and that
deadline may be about the 45th day.
10:26:26 AM
MS. COOK said she thinks the personal bill deadline is the 35th
day after convening the second session.
CHAIR MCGUIRE said there is some precedence for it.
SENATOR BUNDE said Senator Steven's idea would increase the
influence of the committee chair. He expects there could be a
lot of slippage.
CHAIR MCGUIRE announced she would hold SB 135 for further
consideration.
There being no further business to come before the committee,
Chair McGuire adjourned the meeting at 10:28:12 AM.
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