Legislature(2001 - 2002)

02/27/2001 03:40 PM STA

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
                     ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                   
                  SENATE STATE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE                                                                              
                         February 27, 2001                                                                                      
                             3:40 p.m.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Senator Gene Therriault, Chair                                                                                                  
Senator Randy Phillips, Vice Chair                                                                                              
Senator Rick Halford                                                                                                            
Senator Drue Pearce                                                                                                             
Senator Bettye Davis                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All Members Present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                              
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                              
SENATE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 14                                                                                                  
Urging President  Bush, the United  States Department of  State, and                                                            
the  United States  Congress  to intervene  and negotiate  with  the                                                            
government  of Canada  to  reconsider  the imposition  of  a fee  to                                                            
transport firearms through Canada.                                                                                              
     MOVED CS SJR 14 (STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 103                                                                                                             
"An Act relating to election campaigns and legislative ethics; and                                                              
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
     MOVED CS SB 103 (STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 102                                                                                                             
"An Act relating to the information required in an application for,                                                             
and to display of social security numbers on, certain licenses and                                                              
instructional permits; and providing for an effective date."                                                                    
     MOVED SB 102 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                              
SJR 14 - No previous action recorded.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SB 103 - See State Affairs minutes dated 2/22/01.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SB 102 - No previous action recorded.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                              
Joe Balash, staff to Senator Therriault                                                                                         
Alaska State Capitol, Room 121                                                                                                  
Juneau, AK 9980-1182                                                                                                            
POSITION STATEMENT: Explained provisions of SJR 14 and changes to                                                             
SB 103                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Senator Robin Taylor                                                                                                            
Alaska State Capitol, Room 30                                                                                                   
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of SJR 4                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Rod Arno                                                                                                                        
Alaska Outdoor Council                                                                                                          
P.O. Box 73902                                                                                                                  
Fairbanks, AK 99707                                                                                                             
POSITION STATEMENT: Supports SJR 14                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Susie Barnett, Administrator                                                                                                    
Select Committee on Legislative Ethics                                                                                          
P.O. Box 101468                                                                                                                 
Anchorage, AK 99510-1468                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on CS SB 103                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Brooke Miles, Assistant Director                                                                                                
Alaska Public Offices Commission                                                                                                
2221 E. Northern Lights, Room 128                                                                                               
Anchorage, AK 99508-4149                                                                                                        
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions on SB 103                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Holly Morris, staff to Senator Therriault                                                                                       
Alaska State Capitol, Room 121                                                                                                  
Juneau, AK  99801-1182                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT: Introduced SB 02                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Chuck Hosack, Deputy Director                                                                                                   
Division of Motor Vehicles                                                                                                      
3300B Fairbanks                                                                                                                 
Anchorage, AK 99503                                                                                                             
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified on SB 102                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Del Smith, Deputy Director                                                                                                      
Department of Public Safety                                                                                                     
P.O. Box 111200                                                                                                                 
Juneau, AK 99811-1200                                                                                                           
POSITION STATEMENT:  Commented on SB 102                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
TAPE 01-9, SIDE A                                                                                                             
Number 001                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT  called  the  Senate  State  Affairs  Committee                                                            
meeting to order  at 3:40 p.m. Present were Senators  Davis, Pearce,                                                            
Phillips and Chairman Therriault.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
The first order of business was SJR 14 with a proposed CS.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
JOE  BALASH, Senate  State  Affairs  staff,  introduced  SJR 14  for                                                            
sponsor, Senator Taylor, who was in another meeting.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
The joint resolution  is in response  to the new fees Alaskans  will                                                            
be charged for  transporting firearms through Canada.  "The Canadian                                                            
government  recently  adopted  new  regulations  requiring  visitors                                                            
without a valid Canadian  firearms license to declare their firearms                                                            
at a Canadian customs station  before entering the country. Visitors                                                            
would also have to fill  out a Non-Resident Firearm Declaration form                                                            
and pay a confirmation fee of $50.00 (Canadian).                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SJR  14  calls  upon  President  George  W.  Bush,  the  U.S.  State                                                            
Department, and  Congress to negotiate with the Canadian  government                                                            
to revoke the regulations.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT said  there was a prepared CS for the resolution                                                            
but, prior to  adoption, he wanted to remove the word  Canadian from                                                            
page 1 line 12  because it is redundant. He then asked  for a motion                                                            
to adopt the F version as a working document.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  made a motion  to adopt F  version of CS SJR  14 for                                                            
discussion purposes.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
There were no objections.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  asked whether the  new fees imposed by the  Canadian                                                            
government  were in  response to fees  imposed on  Canadians  by the                                                            
U.S. government.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT  said he  didn't believe  so  but that  Senator                                                            
Taylor was now present and he could address the question.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  TAYLOR said he  wasn't aware  of any  U.S. fees or  charges                                                            
recently  imposed  on  Canadians.  He  believes  that  the  new  fee                                                            
regulation stems from Canadian  concerns about firearms and handguns                                                            
in particular.  He  assured members  that this  resolution does  not                                                            
suggest that the Canadian regulation is retaliatory.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Number 348                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  said that  Canadian firearms  laws were phased  in                                                            
over a 3-4 year period and this is part of the final phase.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
He went  on to say that  Alaska state law  requires anyone  flying a                                                            
plane  to  carry  a  firearm  for  survival  purposes  so  this  new                                                            
regulation causes difficulties  for Alaskans flying through Canadian                                                            
airspace when transiting from one part of the state to another.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  TAYLOR   agreed  saying  that  for  Alaskans   flying  from                                                            
Southeast  into Canada  for  a fishing  trip, customs  clearance  is                                                            
received telephonically  from Prince Rupert and then U.S. customs is                                                            
cleared upon return.  Now, when that plane enters  Canadian airspace                                                            
it's illegal because of the emergency firearm carried.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
He thanked the committee for hearing the resolution.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  asked for questions  and apologized  to Senator                                                            
Taylor  for starting the  meeting prior  to his  arrival.  Next,  he                                                            
called Rod Arno.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
ROD ARNO, lobbyist  for the Alaska Outdoor Council  (AOC), testified                                                            
that he  and AOC support  SJR 14. AOC is  a state affiliate  for the                                                            
National Rifle Association.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  said that Yukon legislators would  be visiting the                                                            
"15th  and  16th"   and  this  would  provide  an  opportunity   for                                                        
discussion.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  asked whether there were any  changes to the CS                                                            
before  the committee  and noted  that Senator  Phillips had  worked                                                            
with Senator  Taylor  on changing  the tone of  the wording  without                                                            
changing the intent.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  offered an amendment  to the bill on page  2, line                                                            
14.  After  "Minister of  Foreign  Affairs,  Canada;"  he  suggested                                                            
inserting "MPs Yukon and B.C.".                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT said  that amendment #1 would add to the section                                                            
of the bill  telling to whom  copies of the  bill would be  sent. He                                                            
asked  for  objections  and  there  were  none.  The  amendment  was                                                            
adopted.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Number 743                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
He noted that there was a zero fiscal note.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS made a  motion to move CS SJR 14 (STA) and the zero                                                            
fiscal  note to  the  next committee  of  referral  with  individual                                                            
recommendations.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
There were no objections.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Number 798                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
         SB 103-ELECTION CAMPAIGNS AND LEGISLATIVE ETHICS                                                                   
                                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT said there was a CS prepared for SB 103.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  moved to  adopt the State  Affairs substitute  of SB
103 as a working document. There were no objections.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
JOE BALASH,  staff for Senator Therriault,  explained the  following                                                            
changes to SB 103.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Section 1 is unchanged  incorporating existing practices of counting                                                            
multiple groups  as a single group for purposes of  the contribution                                                            
limits.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Section  2 allows thank  you advertisements  to  be included  in the                                                            
list of  allowable expenditures  and then makes  changes on  page 3,                                                            
line  20.  This  language   allows  the  removal  of   the  previous                                                            
requirement  for  a  public  office  expense   term  (POET)  reserve                                                            
account.  A  House  candidate  may transfer  $10,000  and  a  Senate                                                            
candidate  may transfer  $20,000 to  their POET  account doing  away                                                            
with  the   reserve  account  altogether.   Alaska  Public   Offices                                                            
Commission (APOC) had no objection to making this change.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Section  3 increases  the amount of  personal property  that  may be                                                            
kept after  an election  and makes  the necessary  changes  allowing                                                            
candidates  to continue to use their  bulk mailing permits.  It also                                                            
allows  use of campaign  photographs,  seasonal  greeting cards  and                                                            
campaign signs after an election.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Section  4,  page  5, makes  a  technical  change  so  this  section                                                            
correlates with a section that appears later in the bill.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Section  5 clarifies  the definition  of contribution.  In  previous                                                            
testimony,  there  was  concern  expressed  about  the use  of  mass                                                            
mailings by political  parties to promote a slate  of candidates for                                                            
election. To address this  concern, the number of mailings per party                                                            
is limited to  two or fewer before each election.  Thus, a party may                                                            
not  run a  bulk mailing  on  behalf  of a  candidate  to skirt  the                                                            
individual  contribution  limits placed  on the  candidate and  take                                                            
advantage of the larger limits placed on parties.                                                                               
Page  6, line  4,  changes  the language  so  an individual  who  is                                                            
required to  register as a lobbyist  may not provide an issue  based                                                            
poll that would benefit a particular candidate.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  asked whether this  addressed a concern  expressed                                                            
by APOC during the February 22, 2001 meeting.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. BALASH said it addresses part of their concern.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Section 6 deals  with legislative ethics statutes.  Page 7, line 13,                                                            
makes allowances  for the  use of state  resources. Subsections  (F)                                                            
through (J) deal  with preparation and mailing of  seasonal greeting                                                            
cards, using  state resources to transport  personal computers  used                                                            
on  state  business,  using  photographs,   reasonable  use  of  the                                                            
Internet  by a  legislator  or staff  except for  election  campaign                                                            
purposes, and  allowing a legislator  to solicit, accept  or receive                                                            
gifts   on   behalf   of    recognized,   nonpolitical    charitable                                                            
organizations  in a state facility.  This last subsection  addresses                                                            
the annual  Betty  Fahrenkamp golf  tournament held  in the  capitol                                                            
building and  makes it clear that  the legislature has no  objection                                                            
to this use of the capitol and state resources.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Page 8 clarifies  the concern expressed by Susie Barnett  during the                                                            
previous hearing,  and makes an allowance  that prevents  the use or                                                            
authorized  use  of state  resources  for  political  purposes.  The                                                            
technical issue she raised  was addressed by removing the provision.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Page 8,  line 28, (G) deals  with use of  governmental resources  by                                                            
legislators  or staff to support or  oppose a proposed amendment  to                                                            
the  state  or  federal  constitution.  The  previous  version  also                                                            
allowed  them  to   support  or  oppose  citizen's  initiatives   or                                                            
referendums and has been removed in this draft.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Section  7 repeals  the section  of statute  dealing  with the  POET                                                            
reserve account.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Section 8 is a transitional provision.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT asked  whether members had any questions for Mr.                                                            
Balash.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PHILLIPS asked  about  the provisions  on page  3, line  20                                                            
dealing  with  transfer  of  unused   campaign  funds  by  state  or                                                            
municipal candidates.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR. BALASH said that these  funds must be dealt with within a 90-day                                                            
period after the  election. Campaign expenses and  debts may be paid                                                            
then funds  are transferred to a Public  Office Expense Term  (POET)                                                            
account. Current  law allows $5,000 to be put into  the POET account                                                            
and up to $5,000  per year of the term into a POET  reserve account.                                                            
This amounts  to $10,000  for House members  and $20,000 for  Senate                                                            
members.  The  amended language  does  away  with the  POET  reserve                                                            
account and limits  fund transfers to $10,000 for  a House candidate                                                            
and $20,000 for a Senate candidate.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Number 1278                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT said  the dollar  amount  hasn't changed,  it's                                                            
just that the reserve account has been eliminated.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
To deal with  the language in Section  8, amendment #1 was  proposed                                                            
by Chairman  Therriault. On page 9,  lines 8-11 following  "reserve"                                                            
delete  all wording  and insert  "shall  transfer those  funds  to a                                                            
public  office expense  term  account  before January,  2002."  This                                                            
makes it  clear that  if a successful  candidate  has established  a                                                            
reserve account, any funds  held in that account must be removed and                                                            
placed in a POET account by January 1, 2002.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Number 1480                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT moved  amendment #1 and there were no objections                                                            
so it was adopted.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR. BALASH  reviewed amendment  #2 and explained  that the  language                                                            
deals  with the use  of governmental  resources  by legislators  and                                                            
their employees. On page  8, line 31, following "however," insert "a                                                            
legislator  or  legislative   employee  may  not  use  governmental                                                             
resources  to solicit contributions  for  a proposed constitutional                                                             
amendment." Lines  1 and 2 on page 9 are removed.  Previous language                                                            
didn't mention legislators, just their employees.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  asked for confirmation  that government  resources                                                            
means,  "company  time, government  time,  resources  and  supplying                                                            
money plus time."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT  said  that  that's  correct;  while  in  their                                                            
offices,  legislators and  staff may  not solicit  contributions  to                                                            
promote or oppose a constitutional amendment.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PHILLIPS said, "Using  government  resources which  also is                                                            
inclusive of government time, right?"                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  HALFORD asked  whether that  was of the  legislator  or the                                                            
staff.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS said both.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT said  that the legislator  comes and goes  from                                                            
the office while the legislative staff works regular hours.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS said he understands that but that (indisc).                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR   HALFORD  agrees   on  employees   but  isn't  sure   about                                                            
legislators.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  said it is simply  a prohibition on  soliciting                                                            
funds but a  legislator could still  work with their staff.  "If you                                                            
were  the legislator  that proposed  the  constitutional  amendment,                                                            
you'd be the one that has  the files on how the language was shaped.                                                            
You could deal  with your staff on  gathering information  to answer                                                            
questions,  get information  out, promote the  issue you got  on the                                                            
ballot but  you wouldn't be able to  sit at your legislative  office                                                            
and solicit funds to promote the question."                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
He then  moved  to adopt  the modified  language  for amendment  #2.                                                            
There were no objections.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR THERRIAULT  said he  didn't intend  to move amendment  #3 at                                                            
this time. He asked for other amendments.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  asked whether  Brooke Miles  would be available  for                                                            
questions  because  she  had  a  question  that  might  lead  to  an                                                            
amendment.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  said that Brooke  Miles and Susie Barnett  were                                                            
on line.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  referred to page 2, line 30 through  page 3, line 8,                                                            
that speaks to ways to  distribute unused campaign contributions for                                                            
candidates  for various offices.  She asked  whether the  candidates                                                            
referred  to on line 1, 3,  5 and 7 meant  "that is what the  person                                                            
was a candidate  for when he or she was elected to  the position for                                                            
which  they were  raising the  money, or  is it what  they become  a                                                            
candidate for?"                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
MS.  MILES  said  the   commission's  interpretation   is  what  the                                                            
candidate ran  for. Thus, a candidate  for governor, with  a $50,000                                                            
surplus, could retain those monies in an account.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  asked if her interpretation was correct.  If she ran                                                            
for  senator and  had $10,000  left  at the  end of  her  successful                                                            
campaign, she could transfer that to another senate race.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MS. MILES said  she could transfer that amount to  a future campaign                                                            
account  because she  had run as  a senator.  However, that  doesn't                                                            
mean that  account has to  be used for another  senate campaign,  it                                                            
could be used for a different office.                                                                                           
SENATOR PEARCE  confirmed that  the $10,000  limit was for  a senate                                                            
candidate.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS. MILES said that was correct.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  confirmed with Susie Barnett  that the language                                                            
she objected to in the previous hearing was now acceptable.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SUSIE BARNETT, Legislative  Ethics Administrator, said that deleting                                                            
the subsection  on Internet use concerning  campaign use  solved the                                                            
problem and kept the common  sense approach to Internet use outlined                                                            
earlier  in the  bill.  She complemented  the  Chair  in saying  the                                                            
prohibition from  soliciting a constitutional amendment  is now very                                                            
clear.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PHILLIPS was  concerned with  page 4, line  13, because  it                                                            
doubled  the amount  of personal  property  that  could be  retained                                                            
after an election. He thinks  the current $2,500 figure is adequate.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
He proposed  amendment #3 keeping  the figure for retained  personal                                                            
property, exclusive of a computer and printer, at $2,500.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE objected to the amendment.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT said the figure was exclusive of computers.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR HALFORD asked whether  computers included printers and phone                                                            
systems.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. MILES said  that computer peripherals  would be included  in the                                                            
system but not a phone system.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT asked  for additional discussion on amendment 3.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR DAVIS asked Senator Phillips to speak to his amendment.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  said he realized that he was speaking  for himself                                                            
but he doesn't need more than $2,500.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PEARCE  pointed out that it was $2,500 in  personal property                                                            
and not cash.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  said he  doesn't need more  than that amount  left                                                            
over after a campaign.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR DAVIS said she just wanted to hear his rationale.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS  said his rationale is that $2,500  is adequate for                                                            
himself whether it is for  anyone else at the table or not. His last                                                            
election cost just $12,000.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT called  for a  roll call on  amendment #3.  The                                                            
amendment  failed  1 to  4  with Senator  Phillips  voting  yea  and                                                            
Senators Davis, Halford,  Pearce and Chairman Therriault voting nay.                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PEARCE  made a  motion  to move  CS SB  103  (STA) and  the                                                            
accompanying   fiscal   note   from   committee    with   individual                                                            
recommendations.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Number 1999                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  said the next order of business  was SB 102 and                                                            
he was the prime sponsor. His staff introduced the bill.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
HOLLY  MORRIS,  staff to  Senator  Therriault,  said  that  although                                                            
federal  law requires  that an  applicant supply  a social  security                                                            
number on a driver's license  application, SB 102 removes the social                                                            
security  number from  the face  of those  licenses.  The bill  also                                                            
places into statute  a policy currently followed by  the Division of                                                            
Motor Vehicles  (DMV) allowing individuals  with no social  security                                                            
number the opportunity  to obtain a license. They  must sign a sworn                                                            
affidavit  stating that they  do not have  a social security  number                                                            
when they submit  their application.  Previously, an applicant  with                                                            
no social security number was denied a driver's license.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS said there  is an exception from obtaining a social                                                            
security number  for personal or religious  convictions.  He's aware                                                            
of this because  he's worked with several people in  his district in                                                            
this situation.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN  THERRIAULT  asked  whether  they  were  able to  obtain  a                                                            
driver's license.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS said they were.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  said that that's  what was said in the  sponsor                                                            
statement.  It's been policy  for DMV to issue  licenses if  a sworn                                                            
affidavit is submitted in lieu of a social security number.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  DAVIS asked  whether removing  the social  security  number                                                            
from the face  of a driver's license would preclude  businesses from                                                            
asking for the social security card for identification purposes.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT said  no, but that isn't the issue at hand. This                                                            
bill simply removes the  social security number from the face of the                                                            
license. Identity  theft is becoming  more a problem and  the social                                                            
security  number is  a key  to this  theft. Making  the number  less                                                            
accessible should help deal with this growing problem.                                                                          
Number 262                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CHUCK HOSAK, Division  of Motor Vehicles Deputy Director,  said that                                                            
Section  1 of  the  bill puts  current  administrative  policy  into                                                            
statute.  Federal law  requires  that a  social security  number  be                                                            
listed  on a  driver's  license  application.  Six months  ago  they                                                            
received  a new  federal interpretation  of  the  child support  law                                                            
stating that a sworn affidavit  in place of a social security number                                                            
was acceptable.  This process was instituted in practice  in January                                                            
so  forms are  currently  available  to  those  individuals  without                                                            
social security  numbers and who were previously unable  to obtain a                                                            
driver's license.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Section 2 deals  with display of the  social security number  on the                                                            
license.  Up to  now,  display of  the  number on  a non-commercial                                                             
license  has been  optional. Individuals  simply  needed to  request                                                            
that this information be  suppressed and it wouldn't be printed on a                                                            
non-commercial  license.  Since  this  capability  is  currently  an                                                            
option, there won't be  any difficulty for DMV to routinely suppress                                                            
the printing  of the  social security  number if  this bill  passes.                                                            
Since the  changes this  bill would institute  are already  options,                                                            
the bill has a zero fiscal note.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN   THERRIAULT   explained   that   Section  3   deals   with                                                            
applicability.  Drivers  need not  apply for  a new  license  before                                                            
their current license is due for renewal.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  PHILLIPS  asked  whether  an individual  could  have  their                                                            
social security  number removed from  their license immediately  and                                                            
not wait for the renewal date.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR.  HOSAK said  they could  come  in and  get a  duplicate  license                                                            
without the social  security number printed. They  would be expected                                                            
to pay a duplicate license fee of $10.00.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
DEL SMITH,  Department of  Public Safety  Deputy Commissioner,  said                                                            
that  he has  testified  on  this  matter previously  and  that  law                                                            
enforcement  personnel across  the state  aren't enthusiastic  about                                                            
the removal  of the social security  number from driver's  licenses.                                                            
He does  realize, however,  that the numbers  are readily  available                                                            
from the DMV database  if the need arises. Although  an individual's                                                            
identification  number  that is  listed on  the license  is used  to                                                            
access personal  information, the social security  number is used to                                                            
help  pare  out  duplicate   names.  They  are  pleased   that  this                                                            
information will still  be available for law enforcement purposes so                                                            
the overall effect should be slight.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT  said there was no proposed CS  and the bill had                                                            
a zero fiscal note. He asked whether there were any amendments to                                                               
the wording and there were none.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
He asked for a motion.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR PHILLIPS made a motion to move SB 102 with its zero fiscal                                                              
note to the next committee of referral. There were no objections.                                                               
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIRMAN THERRIAULT adjourned the meeting at 4:30 p.m.                                                                          

Document Name Date/Time Subjects