Legislature(1993 - 1994)

03/23/1994 09:08 AM STA

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
                SENATE STATE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE                                 
                         March 23, 1994                                        
                           9:08 a.m.                                           
  MEMBERS PRESENT                                                              
 Senator Loren Leman, Chair                                                    
 Senator Jim Duncan                                                            
 Senator Johnny Ellis                                                          
  MEMBERS ABSENT                                                               
 Senator Mike Miller, Vice Chair                                               
 Senator Robin Taylor                                                          
  COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                           
 CS FOR SENATE BILL NO. 255(HES)                                               
 "An Act establishing a comprehensive policy relating to human                 
 resource development in the state."                                           
 CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 49(FIN) am                                              
 "An Act relating to absentee voting, to electronic transmission of            
 absentee ballot applications, to delivery of ballots to absentee              
 ballot applicants by electronic transmission, and enacting a                  
 definition of the term `state election' for purposes of absentee              
 voting; and providing for an effective date."                                 
 SENATE BILL NO. 302                                                           
 "An Act relating to the establishment, modification, and                      
 enforcement of support orders and the determination of parentage in           
 situations involving more than one state; amending Alaska Rule of             
 Administration 9; amending Alaska Rule of Civil Procedure 82; and             
 providing for an effective date."                                             
 HOUSE BILL NO. 421                                                            
 "An Act authorizing grants for temporary housing assistance during            
 emergencies and disasters."                                                   
 CS FOR HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 43(FIN)                                     
 Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the State of Alaska             
 relating to the rights of crime victims.                                      
  PREVIOUS SENATE COMMITTEE ACTION                                             
 SB 255 - See Community & Regional Affairs minutes dated                       
          1/25/94, 2/1/94, 2/3/94, 2/8/94 & 3/16/94.                           
 HB 49 - No previous senate committee action.                                  
 SB 302 - See State Affairs minutes dated 3/21/94 and 3/23/94.                 
 HB 421 - No previous senate committee action.                                 
 HJR 43 - See Judiciary minutes dated 11/16/93 and State Affairs               
          minutes dated 3/9/94 and 3/21/94.                                    
  WITNESS REGISTER                                                             
 Senator Randy Phillips, Chairperson                                           
 Senate Community & Regional Affairs Committee                                 
 State Capitol, Juneau, AK 99801-1182¶465-4949                                 
  POSITION STATEMENT:  prime sponsor of SB 255                                 
 Debra Call, Chairperson                                                       
 Alaska Job Training Council                                                   
 12342 W. Prince of Peace, Eagle River, AK 99577¶696-5786                      
  POSITION STATEMENT:  in favor of SB 255                                      
 Representative Terry Martin                                                   
 State Capitol, Juneau, AK 99801-1182¶465-3783                                 
  POSITION STATEMENT:  prime sponsor of HB 49                                  
 Tom Anderson, Aide                                                            
 Representative Martin                                                         
 State Capitol, Juneau, AK 99801-1182¶465-3783                                 
  POSITION STATEMENT:  prime sponsor of HB 49                                  
 Joe Swanson, Director                                                         
 Division of Elections                                                         
 P.O. Box 110017, Juneau, AK 99811-0017¶465-4611                               
  POSITION STATEMENT:  in favor of HB 49                                       
 Kenneth Kirk                                                                  
 900 W. 5th, Suite 730, Anchorage, AK 99501¶279-1659                           
  POSITION STATEMENT:  in favor of SB 302                                      
 Laraine L. Derr, Deputy Commissioner                                          
 Department of Revenue                                                         
 P.O. Box 110400, Juneau, AK 99811-0400¶465-4880                               
  POSITION STATEMENT:  in favor of SB 302                                      
 Donna Page, Senior Hearing Officer                                            
 Department of Revenue                                                         
 P.O. Box 110400, Juneau, AK 99811-0400¶465-2330                               
  POSITION STATEMENT:  in favor of SB 302                                      
  ACTION NARRATIVE                                                             
 TAPE 94-19, SIDE A                                                            
 Number 001                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN calls the Senate State Affairs Committee to order at           
 9:08 a.m.  The chairman notes that the committee does not yet have            
 a quorum, but will take testimony.                                            
 Number 011                                                                    
 DEVELOPMT) as the first order of business before the Senate State             
 Affairs Committee.  The chairman calls the prime sponsor of SB 255            
 as the first witness.                                                         
 Number 022                                                                    
 SENATOR RANDY PHILLIPS, prime sponsor of SB 255, says the bill will           
 establish a state policy on human resource development for state              
 government agencies, and require public officials responsible for             
 education and training programs to coordinate their programs.  He             
 is introducing this legislation because he is one of the members of           
 the Alaska Job Training Council.  Ms. Call can better explain what            
 SB 255 attempts to do.  There are several zero fiscal notes.                  
 Number 040                                                                    
 SENATOR RANDY PHILLIPS says on page 3, lines 5-7 an amendment was             
 added that would require a legislative audit every four years.                
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN asks if there are any questions for Senator                    
 Phillips.  Hearing none, the chairman asks Ms. Call if she would              
 like to testify.                                                              
 Number 050                                                                    
 DEBRA CALL, Chairperson, Alaska Job Training Council says she does            
 not have any testimony to add, but is available to answer                     
 questions.  Ms. Call states the council oversees the Alaska Job               
 Training Partnership Act (AJTPA), and also advises the governor on            
 human resource policy in the state.  Ms. Call says she currently              
 works as the employment and training program director for Peak                
 Alaska Ventures, which is wholly owned in the Cook Inlet Region.              
 Peak Alaska Ventures is also 50% of the Peak Oil Field Service                
 Company.  Peak currently employs over 500 people.                             
 MS. CALL says she supports SB 255 because she thinks the State of             
 Alaska needs to have a human resource development policy.  She                
 currently works with many of the entities addressed by the bill.              
 She has found that each entity has its' own rules and guidelines              
 governing human resource development, and so sees a need for                  
 Number 096                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN thanks Ms. Call for her testimony.  The chairman               
 asks about the phrase used several times throughout SB 255,                   
 "...productive work force, and have an opportunity to earn a living           
 wage."  He asks also about the term "employment opportunities".               
 His question is, should we not also encourage people to enter into            
 their own business opportunity, and not just refer to people                  
 becoming employees, but also becoming small business owners.                  
 Number 120                                                                    
 MS. CALL responds that the Alaska Job Training Council focuses                
 about 90% of it's energy on job training to work with established             
 industries.  She believes there is funding available through the              
 Department of Community & Regional Affairs and other entities to              
 give people the opportunity to start their own businesses.  She is            
 aware that it was not included in SB 255 because they wanted to               
 focus on training to help those people who really did not have the            
 entrepreneurial spirit.                                                       
 Number 142                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN says he understands why the bill is written the way            
 it is, but as a follow up question, asks Ms. Call if she thinks it            
 would do disservice to the intent of the bill to include verbiage             
 addressing entrepreneurial activity.                                          
 Number 151                                                                    
 MS. CALL replies she does not see a problem with adding language              
 addressing entrepreneurial activity.  However she does know that              
 some programs are just focused on training and education.  It is              
 something that could be added, but she hesitates because many of              
 the entities do not have the background to provide that type of               
 Number 163                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN thanks Ms. Call, and says the committee will                   
 probably add wording addressing entrepreneurial activity.  The                
 chairman appreciates what Ms. Call is trying to accomplish, and               
 totally supports that, but also wants to acknowledge that there may           
 be situations where it would be preferable for someone to have                
 their own business.                                                           
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN asks if anyone else wishes to testify on SB 255.               
 Hearing none, he announces the committee will hold SB 255 to work             
 on language addressing entrepreneurial activity, and bring the bill           
 back up for consideration on Monday.                                          
 Number 175                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN brings up HB  49 (ABSENTEE VOTING & USE OF FAX) as             
 the next order of business before the Senate State Affairs                    
 Committee.  The chairman invites the prime sponsor to join the                
 committee at the table to testify.                                            
 Number 180                                                                    
 REPRESENTATIVE TERRY MARTIN, prime sponsor of HB 49, states the               
 idea of the bill is to catch up with modern times.  Alaska is the             
 largest state in the union, and probably has more travel problems,            
 for numerous reasons.  Representative Martin thinks those problems            
 disenfranchise some people from the right to vote, and having                 
 modern means at their disposal to use in voting would help solve              
 the problem.  Using fax machines to vote was allowed by emergency             
 regulation during the Persian Gulf Crisis and War.  Representative            
 Martin states he was told 54 people voted by fax machine at that              
 time.  Voting by fax can work; it can remain confidential.                    
 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN says the U.S. Justice Department has analyzed           
 the confidentiality laws in many states, and says the minor chance            
 of losing confidentiality in voting is minimal compared to the loss           
 of the right to vote.  Many states are getting involved in voting             
 by electronic means.                                                          
 HB 49 goes a lot further than what was originally intended.  In the           
 House Finance Committee, Representative Brown proposed some good              
 amendments, which were added.  The original intent was to start off           
 on a smaller scale, but the majority of people wanted to go for the           
 program completely.  At this point, HB 49 would allow anyone to               
 vote electronically by the time of the general election.                      
 REPRESENTATIVE MARTIN thinks HB 49 is a good bill.  He introduces             
 Mr. Swanson from the Division of Elections to fill in the details             
 of the process.  Representative Martin informs the committee he               
 needs to go to another meeting, and that his aide, Mr. Anderson,              
 will speak for the bill.                                                      
 Number 239                                                                    
 TOM ANDERSON, Aide to Representative Martin, states HB 49 will                
 allow the faxing of a request for an absentee ballot application,             
 for the Division of Elections to fax the application to the                   
 requestor, for the requestor to fax the filled out application back           
 to the Division of Elections, for the ballot to be faxed to the               
 requestor, and then for the voter (requestor) to fax the ballot               
 back to the Division of Elections.                                            
 MR. ANDERSON says there are two provisions the requestor must                 
 fulfill to vote via fax: one, they must sign a secrecy waiver,                
 which basically states they are giving up their right to secrecy              
 and one person will see their ballot, and secondly, the absentee              
 voter must take an oath.  The faxed absentee ballot application               
 must be received four days before the election, compared to seven             
 days before the election for a mailed request.                                
 HB 49 does not allow for electronic voter registration.  HB 49                
 defines "state election", so that it is clear the electronic                  
 transmission of absentee ballots will not be used in state-run REAA           
 (Regional Education Attendance Area) elections, coastal resource              
 area board elections, or local option elections.                              
 Finally, persons eligible to vote absentee by electronic ballot               
 would be anyone within the state who is not in their respective               
 election districts, anyone in another part of the U.S., and anyone            
 outside the U.S.  So basically, anyone who is outside their                   
 election district could vote by electronic transmission if they               
 follow the guidelines and parameters set up in HB 49.  If passed,             
 persons could begin voting by electronic transmission in the 1994             
 general election.                                                             
 Number 278                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN thanks Mr. Anderson and notes the existence of a               
 memorandum from Legislative Counsel Jack Chenoweth regarding a                
 proposed technical amendment.  According to the memo, an amendment            
 made on the floor of the House of Representatives was not reflected           
 in the title, and this technical amendment would simply change the            
 title to reflect the change made on the house floor.  The only                
 change between the version passed in the house and the Senate State           
 Affairs committee substitute adds Mr. Chenoweth's proposed                    
 technical amendment.                                                          
 Number 299                                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS makes a motion to adopt SCS CSHB 49(STA) in lieu of             
 CSHB 49(FIN) AM.                                                              
 Number 300                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN, hearing no objection, notes SCS CSHB 49(STA) has              
 been adopted in lieu of CSHB 49(FIN) AM.  The chairman asks Mr.               
 Swanson if he has any testimony he would like to add.                         
 Number 303                                                                    
 JOE SWANSON, Director, Division of Elections says the division                
 supports HB 49.  The division feels strongly that the state has               
 entered modern times and voting by electronic transmission should             
 be allowed.  He feels this would give some people an advantage in             
 voting that they may not have had before.  There were some early              
 concerns regarding confidentiality, but the division feels it can             
 preserve as much of the confidentiality process as possible through           
 MR. SWANSON states there was also some discussion of potentiality             
 for fraud.  However, the division did not see any opening in HB 49            
 allowing the potential for fraud in the voting process.                       
 Number 316                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN says his main concern would be ballot security and             
 the potential for fraud.  If the division can be sure of ballot               
 security, he thinks HB 49 is a good idea.                                     
 Number 320                                                                    
 MR. SWANSON replies the intent is to have two people in the                   
 Division of Elections Anchorage office assigned to this program.              
 All absentee voting by fax would be done through one office.  An              
 individual in the Division of Elections would receive the fax, make           
 sure everything on the ballot was clear, remove the name, and put             
 the ballot in the ballot box.  The faxed document would be put in             
 an envelope, sealed, and kept for records for seven years.                    
 Number 330                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN asks how the division will ensure that the person              
 who voted by fax isn't going to vote again.                                   
 Number 333                                                                    
 MR. SWANSON responds all absentee voting is done by number, by                
 individual.  When a faxed ballot comes in, that ballot is checked             
 in the division's computer and voter registration system.  It would           
 be virtually impossible for someone to vote twice and the division            
 not catch it.                                                                 
 Number 344                                                                    
 SENATOR DUNCAN asks if people will be able to register to vote by             
 Number 350                                                                    
 MR. SWANSON replies there is nothing currently in statute                     
 prohibiting the Division of Elections to allow persons to vote by             
 fax.  If someone faxed the division a registration form, the                  
 division would accept it if it was properly filled out and                    
 notarized.  There is nothing in regulation or statute addressing              
 registration by electronic transmission.                                      
 Number 357                                                                    
 SENATOR DUNCAN asks Mr. Swanson if the motor-voter bill will                  
 address electronic registration.                                              
 MR. SWANSON says the motor-voter bill does not address electronic             
 voter registration.  However, electronic registration is not                  
 Number 376                                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS asks if there is any requirement under HB 49 for                
 confirmation of receipt of the fax by the Division of Elections.              
 MR. SWANSON says the intent was to put provision in regulation to             
 send notices of receipt.  He agrees whole-heartedly with Senator              
 Ellis that receipt of faxes received should be made.                          
 Number 388                                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS asks Mr. Swanson what he thinks about addressing                
 receipt of faxes in the legislation.                                          
 MR. SWANSON responds he would have no problem with that.                      
 Number 393                                                                    
 MR. ANDERSON states, in response to Senator Duncan's question on              
 registering to vote by electronic transmission, that at the top of            
 page three of the bill is a provision that he may want deleted.               
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN asks Mr. Anderson what the discussion in the house             
 was regarding the provision on page three disallowing registering             
 to vote by electronic transmission.                                           
 MR. ANDERSON says no one raised the issue, that he can recall.  He            
 certainly is not opposed to deleting that provision.                          
 Number 402                                                                    
 SENATOR DUNCAN asks if, in Mr. Swanson's opinion, that provision              
 prohibits registering to vote by electronic transmission.                     
 Number 405                                                                    
 MR. SWANSON responds that provision only prohibits registration by            
 electronic transmission at the same time a person applies for a               
 ballot by electronic transmission.                                            
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN thinks that is probably a valid concern for the time           
 being, just to help maintain security of the election process.                
 MR. SWANSON again states that the provision on page three                     
 addressing electronic transmission of registration does not                   
 prohibit electronic transmission of registration.                           
 Number 409                                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS comments that many other nations, including a number            
 of European nations allow same-day registration and voting, and do            
 not have problems with fraud.  He is not proposing that, but does             
 not want people to have the impression that it would be an                    
 impossible or unreasonable thing to do.                                       
 Number 425                                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS asks if all steps must be done by fax, or if someone            
 could, for example, request the absentee ballot in person, but vote           
 by fax.                                                                       
 MR. SWANSON responds a person does not have to do all steps in the            
 process by fax, but could mix and match any of the steps.                     
 SENATOR ELLIS asks if there are other states that currently do what           
 HB 49 proposes to do.                                                         
 Number 432                                                                    
 MR. ANDERSON replies seven other states allow some form of fax.  HB
 49 is modeled on the Montana law.  They allow faxing for the                  
 complete process.  He believes one other state allows faxing for              
 the entire process also.  He does not believe any other state other           
 than Montana allows the faxing of the marked ballot itself.                   
 Number 436                                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS remarks that there have been several high-profile               
 election fraud cases in the country recently, and a number of those           
 involved absentee ballots.                                                    
 SENATOR ELLIS asks if the bill was originally intended to address             
 the needs of overseas military personnel.                                     
 MR. ANDERSON says HB 49 was not drafted to address the particular             
 needs of overseas military personnel.  Representative Martin                  
 received some calls from Peace Corps volunteers and some other                
 individuals, military included, but it was not designed primarily             
 to answer the needs of military personnel.  The intent was to                 
 implement the program in segments, starting first with people                 
 outside the United States.  But Representative Brown had the                  
 foresight to suggest opening it up to everyone outside their own              
 SENATOR ELLIS agrees that everyone should have equal access to                
 voting by fax, rather than just overseas Peace Corps volunteers and           
 military personnel.  He asks if Representative Martin agrees that             
 the program should be open to everyone.                                       
 MR. ANDERSON confirms that Representative Martin agrees 100% that             
 the program be available to everyone who might need to utilize it.            
 Representative Martin assumed it might be too difficult to                    
 implement on a large scale, but was happy to change the bill.                 
 Number 456                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN asks if there is further committee discussion.                 
 Hearing none, he announces HB 49 will be held in order to work on             
 it.  He expects the committee will move the bill on Monday.                   
 Number 460                                                                    
 ACT) as the next order of business before the Senate State Affairs            
 Committee.  Joining the committee from the Department of Revenue is           
 Ms. Derr, Mr. Mallonee, and Ms. Page.                                         
 Number 469                                                                    
 LARAINE DERR, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Revenue, says the            
 department has provided the committee members with a comparison               
 between ERISA and UIFSA.                                                      
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN thanks Ms. Derr for the comparison and says he has             
 looked through it.  The chairman asks Mr. Kirk to testify.                    
 Number 489                                                                    
 KENNETH KIRK, testifying from Anchorage, states he is speaking for            
 himself, though he does work with and act as legal counsel for                
 Family Support Group.  He also emphasizes that he is in favor of SB
 302 and UIFSA, though it may not sound like it because he intends             
 to air some very specific criticisms of SB 302.                               
 UIFSA is needed because the present URISA system has a real                   
 potential to ruin people's lives.  Mr. Kirk says he has seen                  
 situations where there are two different orders from two different            
 states, both of which are valid and enforceable, which are                    
 completely inconsistent with one another.                                     
 MR. KIRK states he faxed a copy of a letter, which was originally             
 sent to William Grant Cowell (sp?), about the original draft of the           
 legislation before it was put into SB 302, to the Senate State                
 Affairs Committee on March 22, 1994.  Mr. Kirk does not know if he            
 sent it in time for it to be included in the bill packets, but he             
 hopes the committee had time to look at it, because most of the               
 criticisms he has are contained in that letter.                               
 Number 503                                                                    
 MR. KIRK states he will review his biggest concerns.  First, it               
 does not appear anyone has taken the time to harmonize SB 302 with            
 AS 25.27, which is the CSED (Child Support Enforcement Division)              
 statute.  He thinks there are potential problems related to                   
 conflict between the provisions of SB 302 and AS 25.27.  He                   
 suggests legislative counsel review AS 25.27 for purposes of making           
 AS 25.27 more consistent with UIFSA.                                          
 His second concern relates to specific things he thinks should be             
 changed in SB 302, without causing any harm to the overall intent             
 of the bill.  On page 4, line 24, the language gives the state                
 jurisdiction over the non-resident.  That language is not                     
 constitutional, pursuant to a case called Burnham (sp?) v. Superior           
 Court.  It is also bad public policy, is unfair, and should be                
 eliminated.  For instance, someone who has never had any connection           
 with Alaska, but their ex-spouse moved here with the kids, flies up           
 to Alaska periodically to see the children or to accompany them out           
 of state.  When the out-of-state parent flies up to see the                   
 children, they can then be handed a complaint and summons in a                
 child support case, and will then be subject to Alaska's laws on              
 child support, rather than the laws of the place in which that                
 person actually resides.  So Mr. Kirk sees a problem with that, as            
 a public policy matter.                                                       
 MR. KIRK also sees a problem on page 10, line 9, subsection (b)               
 regarding tribunals.  Mr. Kirk states there are several powers                
 contained in SB 302 which are not proper for administrative                   
 agencies of the state to have, including citing a person for                  
 criminal contempt, and the issuance of bench warrants.  Mr. Kirk              
 would hope that if SB 302 is passed, CSED will recognize that they            
 do not really have that authority, and they will not try to issue             
 bench warrants and hold people in criminal contempt.  It would be             
 much easier to simply delete that provision from SB 302, rather               
 than go to court over it.  Since the bill states CSED can use any             
 other remedies already in law, that provision could be left out.              
 MR. KIRK's next concern is with Section 25.25.312 on page 13,                 
 starting on line 16, NONDISCLOSURE OF INFORMATION IN EXCEPTIONAL              
 CIRCUMSTANCES.  Mr. Kirk states this is inconsistent with                     
 25.27.275, which states the agency shall relate the information               
 about the location of a child if the obligor is current in child              
 support and there is a visitation or joint custody order in effect.           
 His second concern with Section 25.25.312 is that it is ex parte,             
 which means the obligor does not even get a chance to present their           
 side of the story.  The custodial parent can simply tell the                  
 enforcement officer that the non-custodial parent is dangerous, or            
 scares them, or something like that, and without any contest, all             
 of a sudden there is what appears to be a permanent order in place.           
 There is no provision set up for appeal at a formal hearing, so the           
 non-custodial parent might not even get to contest that order.                
 Finally, there are no real standards for it, it is a very broad               
 statement.  CSED does not have any expertise with regard to issues            
 relating to the health, safety, or liberty of the child, or of                
 domestic violence.  That should be left with the courts, not with             
 CSED.  Or at the least, there should be better standards and an               
 appeals process.                                                              
 MR. KIRK states he also has a concern with the next section of the            
 bill, Section 25.25.313, COSTS AND FEES.  What this provision would           
 essentially do is require the obligee, when they lose an appeal, to           
 pay the entire attorney's fee bill for the other side.  But if the            
 obligee wins, all the obligee is entitled to is, at most, about               
 one-quarter to one-third of attorney's fees.  So SB 302 would                 
 basically set up unequal standards for the custodial parent to the            
 obligee.  The mind-set between too many of these laws is that the             
 obligee is the "bad guy".  All the obligee has ever done wrong,               
 necessarily, is that some judge decided at some time that the                 
 obligee's children would be better off spending most of their time            
 with the other parent.  There may not even be that, if there has              
 never actually been a court case, such as if the child was born out           
 of wedlock or the marriage was terminated through dissolution.                
 That whole section, 25.25.313, should be dropped.                             
 Number 565                                                                    
 MR. KIRK states Section 25.25.608, which precludes any further                
 contest of the order with respect to a matter that could have been            
 asserted at the time of registration, should be "softened" up a bit           
 in default cases.  In both court cases and administrative cases, if           
 a person has a good-faith reason for not responding, you will often           
 be allowed to re-open a case.  Situations like this are common in             
 Alaska.  A person gets served the day before going out on a crab              
 processor for six months, and in the meantime defaults on an order.           
 This section would appear to completely preclude a person from any            
 opportunity to re-open the matter later for redetermination.                  
 Number 574                                                                    
 MR. KIRK states he will be in Juneau March 24th and 25th for a                
 Correctional Industries Commission meeting and would be glad to               
 meet with legislators or staff to help work on SB 302 any time the            
 commission is not taking care of business, if anyone wishes to do             
 so.  He acknowledges the complexity of SB 302, and is not always              
 sure himself how the bill will play out in practice, but recognizes           
 that some people may be less sure of it than he, and so would like            
 to make himself available to work on it.  He can be reached at the            
 above phone number.                                                           
 MR. KIRK thanks the committee members for their time.                         
 Number 580                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN asks if the Department of Revenue could meet with              
 Mr. Kirk to discuss his concerns.                                             
 TAPE 94-19, SIDE B                                                            
 Number 583                                                                    
 MS. DERR says the department has not talked to Mr. Kirk before, and           
 would like to review his suggestions before commenting on them.               
 The department can meet with Mr. Kirk while he is in Juneau.                  
 DONNA PAGE, Senior Hearing Officer, Department of Revenue says the            
 department has considered some of the concerns mentioned by Mr.               
 Kirk and can explain them to him.                                             
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN gives Ms. Page a copy of the letter faxed to the               
 committee by Mr. Kirk.  The chairman asks if anyone else wishes to            
 testify today on SB 302.  Hearing none, he announces the committee            
 will hold SB 302 over to work on.                                             
 Number 568                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN LEMAN adjourns the Senate State Affairs Committee meeting            
 at 9:54 a.m.                                                                  

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