Legislature(2025 - 2026)BUTROVICH 205

01/23/2026 03:30 PM Senate RESOURCES

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Audio Topic
03:30:32 PM Start
03:31:31 PM SB75
03:39:01 PM Presentation(s): Megaproject Risks, Alaska Lng, Pegasus Global
04:20:24 PM Presentation(s): Key Issues and Recommendations, Alaska Lng & Phase 1, Gaffneycline
05:02:09 PM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Agenda Change --
+ Presentation: Pegasus: Review of 2019 Memo to the TELECONFERENCED
State of Alaska
Jeremy Clark, Pegasus Global Holdings Inc.
Joe Miller, Pegasus Global Holdings Inc.
Presentation: GaffneyCline: Key Issues and
Recommendations
Nicholas Fulford, Senior Director, Liquid Natural
Gas and Energy Transition, GaffneyCline Energy
Advisory
+= SB 75 TIMBER MANAGEMENT LEASES TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
Uniform Rule 23 Waived
**Streamed live on AKL.tv**
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
              SENATE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                             
                        JANUARY 23, 2026                                                                                      
                           3:30 P.M.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Senator Cathy Giessel, Chair                                                                                                    
Senator Bill Wielechowski, Vice Chair                                                                                           
Senator Matt Claman                                                                                                             
Senator Scott Kawasaki                                                                                                          
Senator Robert Myers                                                                                                            
Senator George Rauscher                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Senator Forrest Dunbar                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
OTHER LEGISLATORS PRESENT                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Senator Bert Stedman                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 75 "An Act relating to timber on state lands;                                                                   
relating to timber management leases; and providing for an                                                                      
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD & HELD                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
PRESENTATION(S): MEGAPROJECT RISKS~ ALASKA LNG~ PEGASUS GLOBAL                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PRESENTATION(S): KEY ISSUES AND RECOMMENDATIONS~ ALASKA LNG &                                                                   
PHASE 1, GAFFNEYCLINE                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB  75                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: TIMBER MANAGEMENT LEASES                                                                                           
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
01/27/25       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        

01/27/25 (S) RES, FIN 02/07/25 (S) RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205 02/07/25 (S) Heard & Held 02/07/25 (S) MINUTE(RES) 05/02/25 (S) RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205 05/02/25 (S) Scheduled but Not Heard

01/21/26 (S) RES WAIVED PUBLIC HEARING NOTICE,RULE 23

01/23/26 (S) RES AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205 WITNESS REGISTER SENATOR JESSE BJORKMAN, District D Alaska State Legislature Juneau, Alaska POSITION STATEMENT: Presented SB 75, sponsored by the Senate Rules Committee by request of the governor. JEREMY CLARK, Chief Operating Officer Pegasus-Global Holdings, Inc. Seattle, Washington POSITION STATEMENT: Delivered the presentation: Megaproject Risks, Alaska LNG, Pegasus Global. JOE MILLER, President Pegasus-Global Holdings, Inc. Seattle, Washington POSITION STATEMENT: Assisted with the presentation: Megaproject Risks, Alaska LNG, Pegasus Global. NICHOLAS FULFORD Senior Director LNG and Energy Transition GaffneyCline Energy Advisory Houston, Texas POSITION STATEMENT: Provided the Presentation: Key Issues and Recommendations, Alaska LNG & Phase 1, GaffneyCline ACTION NARRATIVE 3:30:32 PM CHAIR GIESSEL called the Senate Resources Standing Committee meeting to order at 3:30 p.m. Present at the call to order were Senators Myers, Kawasaki, Rauscher, Wielechowski, Claman and Chair Giessel. SB 75-TIMBER MANAGEMENT LEASES 3:31:31 PM CHAIR GIESSEL announced the consideration of SENATE BILL NO. 75 "An Act relating to timber on state lands; relating to timber management leases; and providing for an effective date." 3:32:50 PM SENATOR JESSE BJORKMAN, District D, Alaska State Legislature, Juneau, Alaska, provided an overview of SB 75. He emphasized that the state, the Department of Natural Resources, the legislature, and the people of Alaska needed a clear and shared vision for the management of public lands. He stated that Alaskans value public lands and rely on them for hunting, fishing, recreation, hiking, and camping, and that maintaining access to these lands was essential to the state's way of life. He argued that misunderstandings had arisen during a proposed State Forest rollout on the Kenai Peninsula, partly due to insufficient communication about what state forests are and are not. He explained that state forests are not meant to lock up land like state parks but instead allow the state to hold land in public trust while maintaining public access, supporting timber harvest, reducing wildfire fuel loads, and improving access for fire suppression. 3:33:46 PM SENATOR BJORKMAN encouraged the Department of Natural Resources (DNR) and the committee to clarify the long-term vision for how public lands should support Alaska's economy and land management goals. He noted that recent wildfires on the Kenai Peninsula mostly on federal land but also on some state landdemonstrated the need for active forest management, including thinning operations, road access, and other practices that could help prevent large, uncontrollable fires. He discussed the need for clearer and more consistent expectations for public access across different types of public lands, including trust lands managed by entities such as the University of Alaska and the Alaska Mental Health Trust. Although these lands are technically not considered general public lands, he argued that they are government-owned, and that the public should have guaranteed access to them. 3:37:06 PM SENATOR BJORKMAN referred to Gravina Island as an example of how different land ownership typesfederal land in the Tongass National Forest, the Southeast State Forest, and university trust lands resulted in significantly different management. He said SB 224 could support active forest management that reduces wildfire risk, protects forests from pests such as spruce bark beetles, improves wildlife habitat, and promotes healthier forests. He stressed, however, that any legislation should include safeguards to ensure continued public access and prevent destructive logging practices. He concluded by expressing appreciation that SB 224 would receive further consideration rather than being rushed through the legislative process. 3:38:56 PM CHAIR GIESSEL held SB 75 in committee. ^PRESENTATION(S): MEGAPROJECT RISKS, Alaska LNG, PEGASUS GLOBAL PRESENTATION(S): MEGAPROJECT RISKS, Alaska LNG, PEGASUS GLOBAL 3:39:01 PM CHAIR GIESSEL announced the presentation: Megaproject Risks, Alaska LNG, by Pegasus Global Holdings. She said the presentation was based on a 2019 report prepared by Pegasus reviewing the construction of the Trans Alaska Pipeline System (TAPS). Commissioned by Senator Stedman, the report discussed project mistakes, cost overruns, and lessons learned to help inform the committee as it considered a natural gas pipeline project. 3:40:32 PM JEREMY CLARK, Chief Operating Officer, Pegasus-Global Holdings, Inc., Seattle, Washington, explained that Pegasus provided expertise on planning and delivering complex construction projects worldwide. Drawing on its experience with mega projects, Pegasus advised clients on avoiding common problems, improving efficiency, managing risk, and reducing disputes. He said the presentation would highlight key points from the company's 2019 report, including common planning and execution challenges, as well as lessons learned from the Trans Alaska Pipeline System (TAPS) and related strategic reconfiguration projects. 3:41:36 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 2: [Original punctuation provided.] Pegasus's 2019 Report Overview • Engaged by the State to provide advice concerning the risks associated with megaprojects, including specifically the proposed Alaska LNG project. • Reviewed the Trans-Alaska Pipeline System (TAPS) and Strategic Reconfiguration project execution and issues encountered. • Identified issues commonly realized on megaprojects. • Discussed impact of cost overruns. • Provided examples of contract tools to mitigate risks. 3:42:40 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 3: [Original punctuation provided.] Megaprojects Defined • Typically have costs in excess of $1 billion USD. • Comparably high benefits and correspondingly high risk. • Multi-year construction, often longer than a decade from feasibility planning through execution. • Many diverse stakeholders that can have substantial impacts on the project (strategically, environmentally, economically). • Unique aspects/scopes (i.e. not a bigger version of a smaller project). • Conventional project management processes and priorities often not sufficient. 3:43:06 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 4. He explained that mega projects inherently faced greater execution challenges than typical projects due to their scale and complexity. He observed that the Alaska LNG project illustrated this dynamic: it was effectively initiated in 2014 with the passage of Alaska Senate Bill 138 and the creation of the Alaska Gasline Development Corporation (AGDC). Twelve years later, the project was only approaching a final investment decision (FID) for its first phase: [Original punctuation provided.] Megaproject Challenges • Inherent risk exposure due to long planning/execution horizons and complex interfaces. • Technology/components that are often not standard (including FOAK). • Decision-making and planning involves multiple parties with conflicting interests. • Unplanned events (black swans) are often not accounted for, but megaprojects have high exposure and high resulting impacts. • Over optimism on costs, benefits, and risk treatment. MR. CLARK concluded that such long timelines increased project risk in two primary ways: they made it more difficult to accurately plan and estimate future conditions, and they heightened exposure to rare, high-impact disruptions. He further noted that when risks materialize on mega projects, their scale and complexity often amplified secondary or ripple effects across multiple aspects of the project. 3:44:08 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 5. He emphasized that project execution issues, particularly design and construction, often received heightened attention as projects moved into the execution phase, however, all risk categories must be considered and addressed: [Original punctuation provided.] LNG Project Risks Risk Category Risk Factors Economics • High project costs • Changing market conditions Design • Defective design • Design changes • Delay in approvals HSE • Force majeure (earthquake, pandemic) • Adverse weather • Site safety • Permit compliance • Accidents (human, vehicle) Security & Social • Sabotage/protest • Labor strike Supply Chain • Invalid materials/poor quality • Supplier monopoly • Delays in material/equipment supply Financial • Supplier/contractor bankruptcy • Inflation and interest rates • Tax burdens Construction • Unforeseen site conditions • Low productivity • Equipment failure • Quality/rework • Missed execution windows 3:44:48 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 6: [Original punctuation provided.] Cascading Project Risks Examples Realized Risk Immediate Impact Ripple Effects Weld failure Hydrotest stop Rework > schedule slip > in-service delay Slope failure Safety hazard Reroute with new design > new permits > resequencing > schedule slip Equipment/ Resequencing Schedule slip > material delay contractor claims > in-service delay Environmental Stop work order Regulatory reset > violation stakeholder backlash > schedule slip Low Less work Schedule slip > productivity completed than contractor claims planned Contractor Work stops Secure site > bankruptcy source replacement contractor > schedule slip> claims from original contractor 3:45:59 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked who would ultimately bear the risk in the event that costs rise, or the market softens. 3:46:27 PM MR. CLARK asked that the question be repeated. 3:46:32 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked, in this [AKLNG] project, who bears the downside risk, if costs rise or markets soften. 3:46:47 PM MR. CLARK restated the question for clarity and answered that there was not yet enough information to fully determine that. He said all stakeholders involved in the project would have some degree of exposure with the various contracts and agreements defining who ultimately has that exposure. 3:47:11 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI said the legislature was told that the project costs would remain confidential and asked Mr. Clark for his perspective on that. He emphasized the legislature's obligation to protect the rate payers and the state of Alaska and the treasury. He asked whether Mr. Clark had thoughts or ideas on how the legislature can protect the state and the rate payers when the costs are confidential and unknown to lawmakers. 3:47:44 PM MR. CLARK acknowledged the unique situation and said he did not recall a project where the costs were kept confidential. He deferred to Mr. Miller. 3:47:58 PM JOE MILLER, President, Pegasus-Global Holdings, Inc., Seattle, Washington, concurred. 3:48:14 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 7: [Original punctuation provided.] The "Iron Law" of Megaprojects "Over budget, over time, under benefits, over and over again." Bent Flyvbjerg 92% of megaprojects come in over budget, over schedule, or both! MR. Clark said mega projects often exceeded budgets and schedules but still delivered their intended benefits. The Vogtle nuclear project in Georgia illustrated this pattern: although costs rose from about $14 billion to over $36 billion and completion was delayed by seven years due to challenges such as COVID-19 and a partner bankruptcy, the plant ultimately began producing over 2,000 megawatts of electricity, enough to power more than two million homes for the next 6080 years. 3:49:28 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 8. He explained that project cost overruns were typically shared among the project owner, main contractors, and end users. Construction contracts determined how overruns were allocated between the owner and contractors, while tolling agreements governed how costs were distributed between the owner and end users. He described how risk was managed for the Trans Mountain Expansion Project in Canada using capped and uncapped pipeline segments. He said contractual agreements served as the primary mechanism for dividing cost responsibility, though their effectiveness varied depending on their design and quality: [Original punctuation provided.] Who pays for Project Cost Overruns? Owner Construction Contracts Tolling Agreements Contractors User [derived from Venn diagram, slide 8] 3:50:48 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 9: [Original punctuation provided.] [Engineer, Procure, Construct/ Engineer, Procure, Construction Management] EPC/EPCM Contracting Approaches [Slide 9 is a table comparing the elements and outcomes of various contracting approaches to Mega Projects.] 3:51:51 PM CHAIR GIESSEL asked for definitions of acronyms on slide 9. 3:51:58 PM MR. CLARK said "EPC" stood for Engineer, Procure and Construct and EPCM was for Engineer, Procure and Construction Management. He said these were the typical contracts for vendors engaged to deliver mega projects. 3:52:20 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked whether it was common for lenders to bear the exposure of cost overruns. 3:52:32 PM MR. CLARK said it was not unheard of, but that there was usually a balance. He said the agreements usually contained some nuance. 3:52:56 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 10 and explained that an effective contracting approach supported the strategic vision of project owners while promoting alignment among project partners and allowing flexibility to address project complexities and uncertainties. Risk allocation was clearly defined and assigned to the parties best positioned to manage and mitigate those risks, while risk management remained active throughout project planning and execution with broad partner participation. He said integrated project delivery methods were often applied to large, complex, or first-of-a-kind projects because they encouraged collaboration, streamlined decision-making, and reduced construction risk. He said this approach emphasized early stakeholder engagement, shared governance, collaborative practices, shared financial incentives, and open communication within a no-blame culture: [Original punctuation provided.] Construction Contracting Considerations • Size and complexity of megaprojects can require multiple delivery methods and contracting approaches. • Risk should generally be assigned to the party best able to manage/mitigate it. • For a contractor to assume a risk, additional costs and/or contingencies are expected. • Cost-plus and time and materials contracting approaches run the risk of the contractor low- balling the bid to win the award, leading to extensive change orders. • Firm price/lump sum contracting approaches run the risk of the contractor adding excess contingency and still has the risk of disputes if major issues are encountered. • Alliance/collaborative contracting can benefit complex, highly uncertain projects by balancing risk allocation and supporting alignment on project objectives. 3:54:13 PM SENATOR MYERS expressed concern that assigning risk to the party best able to manage it could create perverse incentives. He suggested that risk should instead be assigned to the party most likely to cause it to prevent actions that benefit one party while imposing risk on others. 3:54:45 PM MR. CLARK explained that risk was commonly allocated to the party best positioned to manage it because they had the greatest awareness of the risk and its impact. He said collaborative agreements often supported this approach by aligning parties on objectives and risk perspectives, sometimes through shared risk registers used by owners and contractors. This allowed all parties to maintain a common understanding of risks while assigning mitigation responsibilities to those best able to manage them. 3:55:47 PM SENATOR CLAMAN expressed concern that the confidentiality surrounding the Alaska LNG project made it difficult for legislators to understand how risks were allocated among the parties involved, including the state. 3:56:23 PM MR. CLARK concurred. He said there was a lot of information and data that would typically be available, if not publicly, at least to the key stakeholders that had not been shared to this point. 3:56:44 PM SENATOR CLAMAN noted that lending institutions financing a large project would receive full access to confidential information about risk allocation due to confidentiality agreements, while public sector representatives would not have access to that same information. 3:57:19 PM MR. CLARK explained that while some contract details are typically kept confidential due to proprietary or competitive concerns, it would be unusual for a large amount of information to be withheld from the public or the legislature. 3:57:48 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI noted concern about legislating municipal tax reductions without knowing the financial details. He questioned whether rate concessions would support project viability or simply boost investor profits and asked what information legislators would need to make that assessment. 3:58:24 PM MR. CLARK said all parties would have access to the same economic model used by Glenfarne, ensuring a shared understanding of variables and assumptions. Sensitivity analyses would then be conducted to assess how factors such as property taxes affected project economics. He said access to this information was essential for evaluating the project on behalf of Alaskans. 3:59:06 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI questioned whether, in the absence of necessary information, the legislature should simply trust project stakeholders and approve requested tax cuts. 3:59:26 PM MR. CLARK said it would be difficult to advise that in this situation. 3:59:34 PM CHAIR GIESSEL raised questions about the involvement of 8 Star Alaska, LLC, which held a 25 percent stake in the project, asking who they were, whether they had access to confidential information, and whether they represented the state, suggesting these issues could be addressed in the upcoming presentation. 4:00:37 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 11. He explained that LNG and similar infrastructure projects progressed through structured pre- execution phases, each improving project definition and estimate accuracy before a final investment decision. These stagesFEL-0 through FEL-3/FEEDused milestone reviews to determine readiness to advance. Early phases identified opportunities and refined solutions with broad cost accuracy, while later phases developed detailed technical scope, execution strategies, and risk plans. By the final FEL-3/FEED phase, projects were fully defined with detailed engineering and a Class 3 estimate, achieving significantly improved cost and schedule accuracy to support execution: [Original punctuation provided.] LNG Project Pre-Execution Phases FEL-0 (+/- 50 percent) • Defines need/opportunity (business case) • Preliminary assessment of solutions and major challenges • Initial stakeholder engagement • Rough-order-of-magnitude cost and schedule estimates FEL-1 (+/- 30-40 percent) • Evaluates options to address need/opportunity • High-level technical assessment of feasibility • Refined estimates • Selects preferred solution for further development FEL-2 (+/- 20-25 percent) • Project scope defined • Preliminary designs developed • Detailed risk assessment and mitigation strategies developed • Initial execution strategies for procurement, construction, commissioning • Updated cost and schedule estimates FEL-3 & FEED (+/- 10-15 percent) • Advanced designs • Procurement strategies, including bid packages, developed • Detailed construction execution plans developed • Validation of risk mitigation strategies, updated risk profiles • Final cost and schedule baseline for FID & execution Increasing level of project definition and estimate accuracy 4:03:04 PM CHAIR GIESSEL asked whether reaching a final investment decision (FID) meant that the project should already have achieved a high level of detail and definition. 4:03:24 PM MR. CLARK affirmed that it was common industry practice that a final investment decision (FID) was typically made at the stage of a Class 3 estimate, with established standards defining the level of detail and inputs required to reach that level of project definition. 4:03:46 PM CHAIR GIESSEL asked for the definition of "FEL". 4:03:52 PM MR. CLARK said FEL was front end loading. He said it was an industry term referring to the early pre-execution planning and development phases. 4:04:07 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked what happened when FID was reached before key regulatory or legislative processes were complete and whether that was common. 4:04:21 PM MR. CLARK said that making a final investment decision with key project aspects still undefined introduced additional uncertainty, which could significantly impact the project either positively or negatively once those factors became clear. 4:04:58 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked what project terms would become locked in at FID. 4:05:09 PM MR. CLARK said at the time of a final investment decision (FID), projects typically had a well-developed scope supported by engineering and studies, but the level of completeness could vary. Some projects engaged contractors and partners early under planning-phase agreements that transitioned into execution, resulting in different approaches and degrees of readiness at FID. 4:06:08 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 12. He said a Class 3 estimate typically had an accuracy range of about plus or minus 1015 percent, though in the pipeline industry it could range from roughly minus 10 to minus 20 percent on the low end and plus 10 to plus 30 percent on the high end, based on [Association for the Advancement of Cost Engineering] (AACE) standards and an 80 percent confidence level. He said accuracy was influenced by factors such as project characteristics, quality of planning, stakeholder pressures, and broader systemic risks, including market, economic, and geopolitical uncertainties over long project timelines: [Original punctuation provided.] Factors Influencing Project Definition & Estimate Accuracy • Project site in remote locations with unique logistical and environmental issues. • Feasibility studies often focus on technical issues and less on business or project delivery issues. • Stakeholder pressure for a predetermined value (biased estimate). • Systemic risks, including: • Uniqueness of project vs. reference data available • Project execution complexity • Quality of estimate data/experience of estimate team • Market and economic conditions • Accuracy of geotechnical data • Geo-political, environmental, and regulatory circumstances 4:07:28 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 13: [Original punctuation provided.] Risks of Delayed FID • Escalating project costs • Market opportunity loss • Supply chain disruptions • Regulatory/permitting challenges • Erosion of stakeholder confidence • Project team attrition 4:08:50 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 14. He pointed out that the Trans Alaska Pipeline System (TAPS), built in the 1970s, faced many of the same challenges seen in today's Alaska LNG projectespecially difficult ground conditions and reduced productivity in extreme cold. Although initially estimated at just over $4 billion, the final cost doubled to about $8 billion (roughly $40 billion today): [Original punctuation provided.] Trans-Alaska Pipeline System GAO Report Findings Challenges and Cost Overruns Site-specific Challenges: • More groundwater than anticipated. • Underground construction required deeper/wider trenches than planned. • Wide variations in soil conditions. • Permafrost more difficult to move and drill than planned. • Less backfill material sites available, requiring additional hauling. • Tolerances for valve support structures far more critical than planned; temperature changes and settlement required realignment. • Productivity impacts in cold weather. Construction Cost Overruns: • Feasibility estimate contained no allowance for escalation (also experienced 4-year delay to start of construction). • Insufficient contingency (10 percent) compared to status of engineering and project risks. • Underestimated amount of elevated pipe. • Additional infrastructure required, but not in initial scope. • Underestimated support structure (camps, airstrips). • Underestimated scope for environmental requirements (vapor recovery, ballast water treatment system). MR. CLARK emphasized the importance of: • Accurate and validated cost estimating (including third-party reviews) • Strong risk assessment processes • Adequate contingency planning He said modern best practice now uses quantitative risk analysisstatistical modeling and simulationsto better predict cost and schedule outcomes and improve confidence in project estimates. 4:10:38 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 15: [Original punctuation provided.] Trans-Alaska Pipeline System GAO Report Findings Lessons Learned • Initial and subsequent cost estimates should be viewed with skepticism. • As much site-specific data as is feasible should be obtained. • Technical and geological uncertainties should be thoroughly investigated. • Government approval should be contingent on detailed planning for management control, including cost controls. • Future project expenditures should have an ongoing government audit to protect the public's interest. 4:11:35 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 16, summarizing the findings of a Federal Energy Regulatory Commission (FERC) prudence review of the 2004 strategic reconfiguration project that involved installation of new pumps and upgraded technology to improve operations. He said the initial estimate for this project was $249 million compared to actual cost of around $786 million: [Original punctuation provided.] Strategic Reconfiguration Project (2004) Prudence Review Findings • Project engineer lacked Alaska experience, failed to effectively manage the project. • Poorly defined scope at sanction, leading to poor cost/schedule estimates. • Reduction of project contingency to an unrealistic level to improve project economics. • No meaningful oversight by project owner. • Failure to rely on internal project risk assessments. • Assumed control of project at Supplement 1 decision point, despite insufficient resources to do so. 4:12:10 PM MR. CLARK moved to and narrated slide 17. He said that a recent update from Glenfarne highlights that Phase One is advancing, with a target pipeline completion date of 2028. He said key elements are already in place, including conditional construction contracts, pipe supply agreements, and gas supply agreements. However, updated total project cost figures have not yet been disclosed.: [Original punctuation provided.] Brief Background on the Alaska LNG Project Public Cost Estimates $45 to $65B > $38.7B > $44B > $10.8B (Phase 1) • 2014: SB 138 establishes the framework for commercialization and development of North Slope natural gas. • 2014-2016: Preliminary agreements reached with North Slope producers, AGDC and partners advance preliminary design and permitting. • 2016-2017: Change in administration shifts emphasis towards more state control, private partners scale back involvement. • 2018-2019: AGDC files applications with FERC. • 2020-2022: Global LNG market downturn slows progress; continued permitting and environmental reviews. • 2023-Present: Renewed interest in the project; Glenfarne acquires majority ownership of 8 Star Alaska, leads FEED development efforts towards a FID. MR. CLARK noted that historically, cost estimates have varied significantly. Early projections ranged from $45 billion to $65 billion, reflecting high uncertainty. More recent estimates place Phase One at just under $11 billion. The use of cost rangesrather than single-point estimateshas become standard practice for early-stage megaprojects, as it better captures uncertainty and potential risk outcomes. 4:13:47 PM CHAIR GIESSEL noted that Phase One does not include an LNG export facility, which would account for the more economic cost. 4:14:07 PM MR. CLARK concurred and noted that he was not sure earlier cost estimates envisioned Phase One and Phase 2. He said it would make a fair comparison of estimates difficult. 4:14:25 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI noted that Phase One was described as solely providing gas for Alaskans. He asked whether, if Phase One costs increased significantly, higher tariffs would shift the burden of cost overruns onto Alaska consumers or whether Glenfarne, equity owners, and lenders would bear the cost. 4:15:03 PM MR. CLARK assumed that costs would be passed through the tariffs. 4:15:17 PM MR. MILLER said the Regulatory Commission of Alaska (RCA) would have significant input at that point. 4:15:27 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked whether there was a recommendation for legislation or whether the RCA would allow a pass-through for consumers to pick up [the additional costs]. 4:15:46 PM MR. CLARK said recommending legislation was beyond the scope of his experience. He deferred to Mr. Miller. 4:15:56 PM MR. MILLER noted that in some states, statutes require companies to justify overruns above a target price by demonstrating the expenses were prudent and reasonable. 4:16:31 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 18. He suggested that as the Alaska LNG project approached a final investment decision (FID), additional legislative oversight and information were needed, particularly regarding project readiness, Phase Two planning, and unresolved uncertainties such as scope, including the Point Thomson lateral pipeline, front-end engineering and design (FEED) completion status, and the timing of the FID: [Original punctuation provided.] Open Questions on the Alaska LNG Project • Status of preliminary planning (e.g. geotechnical, constructability, and environmental studies). • Scope of the FEED Study efforts. • Strategic approach to Phase I/Phase II. • Robustness/quality of current estimate supporting FID. • Status of program management plans. • Status of the project's risk management program. • Availability of contractors/laborers to support the project needs. • Oversight of Glenfarne. 4:17:38 PM MR. CLARK moved to slide 19. He said Pegasus recommended enhanced state oversight as the project advanced, particularly if the state retained a minority ownership stake. Specific recommendations include targeted independent assessments to inform the FID and execution strategy, as well as ongoing independent monitoring or an advisory committee to track project performance during execution: [Original punctuation provided.] Recommendations • Detailed review of the FEED Study (including updated cost estimate). • Readiness reviews prior to FID and prior to execution. • Perform a contract risk review for the EPC/EPCM contract. • Independent project monitor/advisory committee during execution. 4:18:41 PM SENATOR MYERS raised concern that reviewing the FEED study may be difficult if it remains confidential to Glenfarne. He questioned how such a review could be conducted. 4:19:15 PM CHAIR GIESSEL concurred. She expressed appreciation for the recommendations and the presentation. ^PRESENTATION(S): KEY ISSUES AND RECOMMENDATIONS, ALASKA LNG & PHASE 1, GAFFNEYCLINE PRESENTATION(S): KEY ISSUES AND RECOMMENDATIONS, ALASKA LNG & PHASE 1, GAFFNEYCLINE 4:20:24 PM CHAIR GIESSEL announced the presentation: Key Issues and Recommendations, Alaska LNG & Phase 1, GaffneyCline. She suggested that a review of a recent letter addressing conflicts of interest and confidentiality be addressed prior to beginning the presentation. 4:21:31 PM NICHOLAS FULFORD, Senior Director, LNG and Energy Transition, GaffneyCline Energy Advisory, Houston, Texas, explained that the presentation and analysis were conducted with strict independence, objectivity, and reliability, emphasizing that these principles are central to GaffneyCline's longstanding reputation. He noted that, since GaffneyCline's acquisition by Baker Hughes in 2008, formal safeguards have been in place to restrict access to client data and ensure project work is isolated to dedicated team members. MR. FULFORD emphasized that although Baker Hughes entered into an agreement with Glenfarne shortly before their initial Alaska LNG presentation, none of the GaffneyCline personnel involved in the report had any involvement in or awareness of those discussions, and no related communications had occurred. He affirmed that their work was completed without influence from other Baker Hughes business units, and that no information was shared across the corporate group except where legally or contractually required. 4:23:44 PM MR. FULFORD underscored GaffneyCline's commitment to transparency given the legislature's reliance on their analysis and invited questions about their processes and the safeguards ensuring independence. 4:24:11 PM CHAIR GIESSEL questioned whether GaffneyCline could truly operate independently given its ownership by Baker Hughes, which is affiliated with Glenfarne. She noted difficulty seeing clear separation between the entities and raised doubts about whether the advice provided by GaffneyCline was fully in Alaska's interest rather than influenced by the parent company. 4:25:50 PM MR. FULFORD acknowledged that when GaffneyCline and Baker Hughes had overlapping involvement, clients often sought reassurance about data privacy and separation. He explained that additional internal safeguardssuch as stricter controls on data handling and storagecould be implemented when necessary. Considering the relationship between Baker Hughes and Glenfarne, he emphasized that protections beyond those already outlined could be put in place. 4:26:59 PM CHAIR GIESSEL requested written clarification of the proposed separations and asked how Mr. Fulford would handle a potential conflict of interest. Specifically, she questioned whether, in a situation where advice benefiting the State of Alaska might harm Baker Hughes or Glenfarne, GaffneyCline would prioritize the state's interests or those of Baker Hughes and Glenfarne. 4:27:52 PM MR. FULFORD explained that, like their role as expert witnesses in international arbitrations and courts, their duty had been to provide objective, independent advice. He emphasized that this commitment to independence was a core company value, noting that they had at times worked against major clients but remained guided by principles of objectivity and impartiality. 4:28:57 PM CHAIR GIESSEL noted that GaffneyCline was a wholly owned subsidiary of Baker-Hughes. MR. FULFORD affirmed that GaffneyCline had been a subsidiary of Baker Hughes since 2008. CHAIR GIESSEL asserted that Mr. Fulford had fiduciary responsibility to Baker Hughes as an employee of GaffneyCline. 4:29:23 PM MR. FULFORD said that interpreting fiduciary duty in that context was complex. He explained that GaffneyCline was fundamentally evaluated on the quality of its independent advisory work. He stated that his fiduciary responsibility had been to preserve the integrity and value of that independent advice, as it was essential to GaffneyCline's success and that of its parent organization. 4:30:06 PM CHAIR GIESSEL emphasized the unique and complicated situation, involving a mega project with confidential documentation, fiscals, and contracts, while GaffneyCline, as a wholly owned subsidiary of Baker Hughes, was expected to advise the State of Alaska on securing the best deal. She noted that courts had recognized a unity of interest between a parent company and its subsidiary and questioned how the state of Alaska could maintain confidence in GaffneyCline's independence given the overlap with confidential project involvement. 4:31:19 PM MR. FULFORD expressed appreciation for the concerns raised and the open discussion. He said the topic had extended beyond his area of expertise. He noted that his legal colleagues had supported the opinions shared and deferred to them for further guidance. 4:31:51 PM CHAIR GIESSEL expressed appreciation that GaffneyCline had initiated the discussion by sending a letter and acknowledged that both GaffneyCline and Baker Hughes had recognized the concern raised as valid. She allowed the presentation to continue but emphasized that the issue remained unresolved and that she wanted greater legal clarity. 4:32:41 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI recalled using GaffneyCline in 2007 during [Accelerating Clean Energy Savings] (ACES) and found its analysis very helpful. He noted that GaffneyCline also represented oil companies at the time and asked whether there were other sovereign clients where potential conflicts of interest with Baker Hughes might exist. 4:33:10 PM MR. FULFORD noted that Baker Hughes equipment was present in roughly 8090 percent of LNG plants globally, meaning there was often some level of overlap when advising investors, lenders, or sovereign states. He noted that this overlap had become more visible in this case due to active discussions between Glennfarne and the Alaska legislature. He emphasized that similar interactions, particularly involving the Baker Hughes division that supplies LNG plant equipment, occurred in most LNG projects worldwide, and that this instance stood out mainly because of press coverage. 4:34:28 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI concurred with the concerns expressed by Chair Giessel and would have preferred a [consulting] party entirely unaffiliated with Baker Hughes, though he was unsure if that was possible. He acknowledged that GaffneyCline had worked with the State of Alaska for around 20 years and expressed interest in hearing the testimony while reiterating his concerns. 4:35:05 PM MR. FULFORD moved to and narrated slide 3. He noted property tax issues and requests for mitigation or concessions and said the presentation would address how such matters had been handled in Texas, Louisiana, and Maryland. He said the presentation would highlight LNG-related developments on the Canadian coast, including projects such as LNG Canada. He also proposed reviewing the outcomes of Senate Bill 138, passed in 2014. He noted that his colleague, Andrew Duncan from GaffneyCline, would contribute insights into FID readiness: [Original punctuation provided.] Agenda Topics to be covered • Lessons from other LNG projects • Property Tax comparison with Lower 48 • LNG Canada and other Canadian projects • Comparison with previous project framework agreements • Path to FID ?Progression of cost estimate classifications 4:36:43 PM MR. FULFORD moved to slide 5 and explained that Louisiana had addressed property tax issues through a broad statute offering relief for large industrial developments. He noted that the statute allowed up to 80 percent property tax reduction for as long as 10 years, with considerations sometimes tied to job creation. He noted that LNG projects typically generated relatively few jobs. He explained that Louisiana's property tax system differed from Alaska's due to its ongoing valuation approach, and that standard tax rates resumed after the concession period. He described how major LNG projects had benefited from these incentives. He emphasized that such concessions could amount to hundreds of millions of dollars and had been a central feature of LNG development in Louisiana. Finally, he noted that while the statutory relief was capped at 80 percent, some projects had negotiated additional concessions, in some cases reducing property taxes to near zero for a decade: [Original punctuation provided.] Property Tax Incentives (Louisiana) • Nominal property tax rate is 100 mills • LNG property tax reductions are achieved through the Louisiana Industrial Tax Exemption Program (ITEP) • Up to 80 percent reduction in property tax for 10 years • Louisiana State audit estimates exemptions valued at $21 Bn Project Sponsor Value Sabine Pass Cheniere $4.9 Bn Cameron LNG Sempra $3.7 Bn Calcasieu Pass Venture Global $2.9 Bn Plaquemines LNG Venture Global $834 M Magnolia LNG Glenfarne $501 M Note: Operating LNG projects, except for Magnolia LNG which is planned. Source Sierra Club, GaffneyCline Analysis 4:40:38 PM SENATOR KAWASAKI said he was trying to make an apples-to-apples comparison, noting that there was currently a 20-mill rate on oil and gas property taxes across Alaska, and asked what the equivalent rate was in Louisiana, specifically whether that figure reflected the rate with or without incentives. 4:40:57 PM MR. FULFORD explained that one way to view it was comparing a 100-mill rate with a slower decline to a 200-mill rate that declined with depreciation, noting that the key difference lay in discount rates and the time value of money. He said upfront, near-term costs had a disproportionately large impact, especially for private investors, due to how those financial factors were evaluated. He concluded that while the mill rates mattered, the more significant factor was the property tax profile over time. 4:41:53 PM SENATOR KAWASAKI said he believed property taxes increased during construction, peaked at a certain point, and then declined, using a home as an example. He asked whether that was accurate and sought to compare his own experience as a property taxpayer [to the consideration of property taxes for AK LNG development] on an apples-to-apples basis. 4:42:22 PM MR. FULFORD said it was an excellent question and explained that HB 4, passed around 2014, had reduced the property tax burden by delaying it until first gas. He added that under the current arrangement, property taxes would become payable once the project began producing LNG. 4:42:56 PM SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI said he supported building a gas line but was reluctant to ask communities to reduce property taxes without access to the project's financial details. He questioned whether such reductions would constitute necessary investment, inflate investor profits, or be required to meet a hurdle rate, and emphasized that his fundamental concern was how to make an informed decision without seeing the underlying numbers. 4:43:28 PM MR. FULFORD noted that legislative and regulatory processes ideally required significant disclosures about costs and project profiles. He mentioned that while confidentiality limits some details, some disclosures were appropriate for public interest. He explained that projects often use an open-book economic model, allowing stakeholders to analyze the project with their own assumptions while keeping proprietary data private, providing a common basis for discussion given the large sums involved. 4:45:22 PM CHAIR GIESSEL asked whether Mr. Fulford recommended [the legislature] request an open book economic model from Glenfarne. 4:45:33 PM MR. FULFORD said he thought it would be an appropriate request and noted that an open book economic model was used for the previous version of the AK LNG project in 2014. 4:46:01 PM CHAIR GIESSEL noted that the third bullet on slide 5 showed a property tax reduction limited to 10 years and found it interesting because she had heard suggestions that reductions could last indefinitely. She asked whether the 10-year period was typical. 4:46:29 PM MR. FULFORD explained that the 10-year limit was set by Louisiana law for major capital projects and noted that tax relief in the first 10 years was far more significant for developers than in later periods. He added that LNG projects often balance mitigating near-term costs, which strongly affect project economics, with longer-term benefits that governments or stakeholders can leverage to create value. 4:47:32 PM MR. FULFORD moved to slide 6. He explained that property tax [reductions] were distributed among local entities, with school districts contributing the largest share. He noted that after reforms in 2022, school district taxes were excluded from concessions, effectively reducing available tax relief. He highlighted examples like Corpus Christi LNG, where large relief amounts reflected its much bigger scale, and added that project size significantly influenced these figures. He also noted a general cost rule of thumb for Gulf Coast LNG projects and explained that smaller projects, like Texas LNG, showed lower tax concession amounts due to both their size and the newer tax framework: [Original punctuation provided.] Property Tax Incentives (Texas) Taxing Entity Rate • County 0.300.45 percent • City (if applicable) 0.400.60 percent • Port authority 0.100.25 percent • School district~1.00 percent (No longer available for tax concession) Taxable property value typically 75 percent of capital cost of terminal • Pre- December 31st 2022 • up to 10 years • Up to 100 percent relief • 2023 and after • Relief limited to County, City and Port relief Project Sponsor Value Golden Pass LNG QatarEnergy / $235 M ExxonMobil Port Arthur LNG Sempra $694 M (PALNG) Infrastructure Corpus Christi LNG Cheniere Energy $1.23 Bn (incl. Stage 3) Freeport LNG Freeport LNG $447 M (Train 4) Development Rio Grande LNG NextDecade $373 M Texas LNG Glenfarne $34 M [Slide 6 noted that the Golden Pass, Port Arthur, Corpus Christi and Freeport LNG projects included school district tax reductions; the Rio Grande and Texas project had no School District Tax reductions.] 4:50:08 PM MR. FULFORD moved to slide 7. He explained that Maryland, specifically the Cove Point LNG facility, served as a useful example for Alaska. He described how the facility transitioned from a regulated import terminal to an export terminal and adopted a PILT (payment in lieu of taxes) arrangement in 2013 to address concerns about tax revenue volatility while supporting investment. He noted that after reverting to standard property taxes, the county experienced valuation disputes and revenue instability, which led to school budget shortfalls. As a result, Maryland reinstated the PILT in 2024, concluding it provided more stability, though its relative cost compared to property taxes depended on differing state and county valuations: [Original punctuation provided.] Property Tax Incentives (Maryland) • LNG liquefaction terminals in Maryland are explicitly eligible for negotiated PILT agreements under state law. • This statute was written with Cove Point specifically in mind, reflecting its unique scale, infrastructure, and economic importance. • Allows the county to substitute a negotiated annual payment for standard real and personal property taxes • Rationale for PILT: • Depreciation risk to county revenues • Potential delays or cancellation of an anchor economic project • PILT was restructured in 2024, when the county approved an amended PILT agreement • fixed payment of $60 million per year • Runs for 15 years (tax years 20232038, expiring June 30, 2039) • Estimated difference: PILT $11m higher than nominal property tax (State evaluation) or $32m less (based on consultant's valuation) 4:53:19 PM SENATOR CLAMAN asked how much information Maryland had with respect to economics, the balance sheets, etc. of that project when they were making these decisions. 4:53:35 PM MR. FULFORD said he did not have the specific information for Maryland but believed it could be determined with further analysis. He explained that a key difference between Alaska LNG and LNG Canada was that LNG Canada's pipeline was privately funded and operated under negotiated agreements, including tariffs. In contrast, he noted that Alaska's pipeline would initially serve public ratepayers, making transparency and disclosure more important due to the need for public interest determinations, and emphasized that this gave the project a fundamentally different purpose. 4:55:23 PM SENATOR MYERS observed the consideration of long-term change in property tax policy, referencing a 10-year framework like Louisiana's approach and noting a suggestion to make any property tax reduction permanent. He expressed concern about using payments in lieu of taxes (PILT) as a workaround, emphasizing that constitutional limits prevent the state from contracting away its taxing authority. As a result, even if the current legislature and administration reached an agreement, future governments would still have the power to modify it. He concluded that, despite interest from Glenfarne and others in achieving long-term certainty, the existing constitutional language made it effectively impossible to guarantee such permanence. 4:56:52 PM MR. FULFORD said this issue had also arisen during [the development of] Senate Bill 138 [in 2014], which aimed to create fiscal stability for the AK LNG project. He noted that constitutional limits on taxation had already been examined by the Department of Law in that context. He explained that similar concerns would apply again, especially since lenders prioritize fiscal stability and closely evaluate the legal and regulatory framework. While Alaska was seen as well governed compared to other regions, he said lenders might still seek additional certainty. 4:58:41 PM SENATOR CLAMAN said he believed Glenfarne had a detailed financial model and asked whether it would be possible to request a version of that model without confidential data. He suggested the legislature could input its own numbers to better understand how the model was structured and how the overall proposal was put together. 4:59:31 PM MR. FULFORD said that for large global projects, the level of information shared between developers and governments varies, but some disclosure is usually necessary. He noted that governments often need insight into costs and project economics to make decisions. He added that in other jurisdictions, open- book economic models are used to support this kind of dialogue. 5:00:50 PM CHAIR GIESSEL thanked Mr. Fulford and directed the committee and the public to the Senate Resources Committee website for pertinent reports and documents 5:02:09 PM There being no further business to come before the committee, Chair Giessel adjourned the Senate Resources Standing Committee meeting at 5:02 p.m.