Legislature(1993 - 1994)
02/24/1993 03:45 PM Senate RES
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
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+ teleconferenced
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SENATE RESOURCES COMMITTEE
February 24, 1993
3:45 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Senator Mike Miller, Chairman
Senator Loren Leman, Vice Chairman
Senator Steve Frank
Senator Drue Pearce
Senator Dave Donley
Senator Al Adams
Senator Fred Zharoff
MEMBERS ABSENT
All Present
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
SENATE BILL NO. 77
"An Act relating to the powers of the Board of Game and to
intensive game management to achieve higher sustained yield
for human harvest."
SENATE BILL NO. 107
"An Act relating to the wildlife conservation tag and to
entry onto state game and wildlife sanctuaries, state game
refuges, state range areas, and fish and game critical
habitat areas; and providing for an effective date."
SENATE BILL NO. 90
"An Act clarifying powers and duties of state officials in
relation to a disaster emergency caused by a catastrophic
oil discharge or the release of a hazardous substance."
PREVIOUS SENATE COMMITTEE ACTION
SB 77 - See Resources minutes dated 2/10/93.
SB 107 - No previous action to record.
SB 90 - See Oil & Gas minutes dated 2/16/93.
WITNESS REGISTER
Russell Heath, Director
Alaska Environmental Lobby
P.O. Box 22151
Juneau, Alaska 99802
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed CSSB 77.
Mike Dubowski
5751 Old Valdez Tr.
Salcha, Alaska 99714
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported CSSB 77 and SB 107.
John George
Alaska Outdoor Council
9515 Moraine Way
Juneau, Alaska 99801
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported CSSB 77 and SB 107.
Dave Kelleyhouse, Director
Division of Wildlife Conservation
Department of Fish and Game
P.O. Box 25526
Juneau, Alaska 99802-5526
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on CSSB 77.
Ron Somerville, Deputy Commissioner
Department of Fish and Game
P.O. Box 25526
Juneau, Alaska 99802-5526
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on CSSB 77.
Teresa Sager-Stancliff, Staff
Senator Mike Miller
State Capitol
Juneau, Alaska 99811-1182
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on SB 107
Wayne Regelin, Deputy Director
Division of Wildlife Conservation
Department of Fish and Game
P.O. Box 25526
Juneau, Alaska 99802-5526
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 107.
Mary Forbes
Alaska Environmental Lobby
P.O. Box 22151
Juneau, Alaska 99802
POSITION STATEMENT:
Tom Garret
Alaska Visitors Association
234 gold Street
Juneau, alaska 99801
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 107 with some
recommendations.
Jeff Morrison, Legislative Liaison
Department of Military and Veterans Affairs
P.O. Box 110900
Juneau, Alaska 99811-0900
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 107.
ACTION NARRATIVE
TAPE 93-9 , SIDE A
Number 001
SENATOR MILLER called the Resources Committee meeting to
order at 3:45 p.m. and announced SB 77 INTENSIVE MANAGEMENT
OF GAME RESOURCES to be up for consideration.
SENATOR SHARP explained his proposed CS to SB 77. He said
it accommodated most of the ADF&G amendments to the title.
Number 111
SENATOR ADAMS moved to adopt the CS to SB 77 and asked for
unanimous consent. There were no objections and it was so
ordered.
Number 120
RUSSELL HEATH, Alaska Environmental Lobby, opposed CSSB 77,
because they believe that game should be managed for the
health of the ecosystem and not specifically for human
consumption. A healthy ecosystem will sustain all types of
users over the long term.
Number 134
MIKE DUBOWSKI supported intensive management for human use,
because from a personal standpoint he depends on the
resources, specifically mouse. He thought a lot of the
areas he now uses would be closed, which means he would have
to hunt in others areas, which,in turn, would make them
overcrowded.
Number 185
JOHN GEORGE, Alaska Outdoor Council, supported intensive
management of the game resources on the limited amount of
land we have left where the public can actually hunt and
fish.
Number 197
DAVE KELLEYHOUSE, Alaska Department of Fish and Game, said
most of their recommendations had been accommodated in the
CS. He has some problems with removal of (a)(11)c on page
2, because that referred to conducting intensive management
where human consumption would be expected to increase
significantly. MR. KELLEYHOUSE said their official position
remains neutral until he reviews the CS.
SENATOR SHARP said the underlying purpose behind this bill
is to create legislative intent for intensive management
with the least amount of wiggle room possible.
Number 314
SENATOR PEARCE asked if they say "shall" to the Board rather
than "may," does the Governor, then, have the authority to
overturn a decision by the Board of Game?
MR. KELLYHOUSE said they had looked at the word "shall"
versus "may" and it says the Board of Game "shall" adopt
regulations it considers advisable. In all instances when
there is a disagreement between the Board and the
Commissioner, the Governor is the ultimate arbiter of that
impasse.
Number 388
SENATOR FRANK moved to pass CSSB 77 from Committee with
individual recommendations. SENATOR ADAMS objected and
there was a roll call vote: SENATOR ADAMS: no; SENATOR
PEARCE: yes; SENATOR FRANK: yes; SENATOR LEMAN: yes; SENATOR
MILLER: yes; and SENATOR ZHAROFF: no; and CSSB 77 was
discharged from Committee with a vote of 4 yeas and 2 nays.
Number 418
SENATOR MILLER announced SB 107 WILDLIFE CONSERVATION TAG
AND FEE to be up for consideration.
TERESA SAGER-STANCLIFF, Staff for Senator Miller, said SB
107 would establish a wildlife conservation tag program.
The tag would allow the purchaser to enter onto certain
wildlife or game sanctuaries. It would give the
Commissioner the authority to set a fee and to establish,
through regulation, state refuges, range areas, and critical
habitat areas where a wildlife conservation tag would be
required for entry.
Number 451
SENATOR ADAMS asked to see a map of the areas concerned and
asked if his district was in it. He commented that in
Anchorage and Fairbanks people are rich and can afford the
tag, but if you're in rural Alaska, it is different.
Number 462
WAYNE REGELIN, Deputy Director, Division of Wildlife
Conservation, supported SB 107. It is a way to allow users
of wildlife who don't hunt or fish to contribute to the
resource. He said there are 32 of these areas in the state,
none of them are farther north than Fairbanks. The only
three the legislation speaks to are McNeil River, Round
Island, and Pack Creek. They intend to charge about the
same price as a hunting license. They don't want to change
the use of the land, but to gain revenues.
MR. REGELIN offered one amendment to clarify the intent. It
says revenues received would be used for non-game programs
and watchable wildlife programs.
Number 528
SENATOR ADAMS asked him to explain the concerns surrounding
the Stan Price area. MR. REGELIN explained that the Forest
Service has requested that they submit two other amendments
for the Stan Price/Pack Creek area where the state owns the
tide land area and the federal government owns the uplands
area. They are trying to work out some agreement to
accommodate the situation.
SENATOR ADAMS asked him if the people who ride snow machines
have to buy a permit to cross the lands with exemptions for
private property and public easements? MR. RICKLAND
answered if they were snow machining they would have to.
The cost of that tag would be the same as a hunting license
which is $25. He said they may lower it after public
comment.
Number 530
SENATOR ZHAROFF said that $15 may not be lot of money to
him, but it means a lot to someone out there who is
unemployed.
SENATOR ZHAROFF asked how this dealt with subsistence users.
MR. REGELIN said the areas they would plan to do this in are
not where subsistence is an issue.
SENATOR ZHAROFF asked if there was a difference in
residential and nonresidential rates. MR. REGELIN said at
this time, no. SENATOR ZHAROFF commented that now we do have
residential and nonresidential rates for hunting and
fishing. MR. REGELIN said a different statute authorizes
that. SENATOR ZHAROFF asked where the revenues are
deposited. SENATOR MILLER said he understands that they
will go into the general fund. MR. REGELIN said that was
correct and they hoped to set up something similar to the
duck stamp program.
SENATOR ZHAROFF asked what were the penalties if you didn't
have a stamp or whatever they decided upon. MR. REGELIN
said that penalties had not been addressed.
TAPE 93-10, SIDE B
Number 580
SENATOR ZHAROFF said if you are going to pattern this after
their other fish and game violation laws, there should be
major penalties. MR. REGELIN thought there should be some
sort of penalty if a regulation is broken.
SENATOR ZHAROFF said he didn't favor this legislation. He
said there a very few places we offer people the luxury to
see some of the wildlife in Alaska. He didn't think we
should be trying to balance the budget of the department
with the users. He didn't think it required any management
other than what is already provided through statute.
MR. REGELIN said that the department is moving to put more
effort into a watchable wildlife program. They are spending
quite a lot of money on it and it is all coming from the
general fund. They are looking for ways to reduce that
general fund expenditure.
Number 535
MIKE DUBOWSKI supported SB 107. He suggested requiring all
visitors to the state pay a fee.
Number 517
MARY FORBES, Alaska Environmental Lobby, supported SB 107.
They believe nonconsumptive users of state land should pay a
share of management costs. She suggested using language
that specifically says what the funds should be used for and
she wanted the program to be expanded to include more state
lands.
SENATOR ZHAROFF asked her if she didn't think charging a fee
would be a deterrent to using them. MS. FORBES said she
didn't think so, and she compared it to back pack programs
she participated in where you have to pay a fee.
Number 478
TOM GARRET, Alaska Visitors Association, supported SB 107.
However, he had recommendations that would make it work
better for both the department and the industry. He said
that tourism does affect management and used the recent wolf
issue as an example. The constitution says these resources
are the common property of all Alaskans and should be
managed to the highest and best use without regard for the
amount of money collected by the department. They do
support raising money to pay for non game wildlife
activities, as long as they are voluntary. A broadly based
market driven program of wildlife stamps or tags would be
the most effective way to generate revenue. The tagging
program now seems to be more of a program for entry fees.
They do not support across the board mandatory wildlife
viewing fees.
MR. GARRETT said the Destination Alaska Study Team reviewed
hundreds of different taxing options and determined the only
options that would tax all visitors to Alaska equally was a
state wide sales tax.
They believe there should be two separate bills; one that
establishes mandatory entrance fees for specific areas and
another one that sets up the voluntary wildlife tag program
that is marketed to people who may never even go to the
places. He thought the revenue potential for the program
had been greatly underestimated and offered to help them
develop it. He said the fees should be implemented no
sooner than 1994 as the season of 1993 has already been half
sold.
He thought the entrance fee should be spelled out in the
legislation instead of leaving it up to the Commissioner.
He said he was shocked to hear the proposed $25 fee. A trip
to Pack Creek costs $245 round trip. If you had to pay a
$25 fee on top of that, that's 10% of the purchase price.
He also said where there is joint ownership or management,
there should be only one fee.
Number 391
JOHN GEORGE, Alaska Outdoor Council, supported the concept
of user fees for nonconsumptive users of wildlife resources.
They favored a volunteer program and using a patch or decal.
SENATOR MILLER said he would hold SB 107 for further work
and announced SB 90 DECLARATION OF DISASTER EMERGENCIES to
be up for consideration.
JEFF MORRISON, Legislative Liaison, Department of Military
and Veterans Affairs, supported SB 107 because it clarifies
some ambiguities in Titles 26 and 46. Title 46 says an oil
spill is automatically a disaster if it's of sufficient
magnitude and Title 26 gives the Governor authority to
declare a disaster when a recommendation is made.
SENATOR PEARCE said under the Master Contingency Plan for
Prince William Sound the departments can come in and force a
closure of the terminal if they think there is an imminent
problem, but they don't take over the management.
MR. MORRISON said that the lines of authority would be much
cleaner if this bill were passed. He said that there are
oil spills all the time that are not disasters. When
something is major, it should be the Governor's
responsibility to declare it.
Number 220
SENATOR PEARCE moved to pass SB 90 with individual
recommendations and with any attendant fiscal notes from
Committee. There were no objections and it was so ordered.
SENATOR MILLER adjourned the meeting at 5:00 p.m.
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