Legislature(1993 - 1994)

04/30/1994 11:40 AM RES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
                   SENATE RESOURCES COMMITTEE                                  
                         April 30, 1994                                        
                           11:40 A.M.                                          
                                                                               
 MEMBERS PRESENT                                                               
                                                                               
 Senator Mike Miller, Chairman                                                 
 Senator Loren Leman, Vice Chairman                                            
 Senator Steve Frank                                                           
 Senator Drue Pearce                                                           
 Senator Al Adams                                                              
 Senator Fred Zharoff                                                          
                                                                               
  MEMBERS ABSENT                                                               
                                                                               
 Senator Dave Donley                                                           
                                                                               
  COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                           
 CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 443(RES) am(efd fld)                                    
 "An Act relating to the confidentiality of certain records relating           
 to fish and wildlife."                                                        
                                                                               
 SCHEDULED, BUT NOT HEARD THIS DATE.                                           
 SENATE BILL NO. 375                                                           
 "An Act relating to general grant land entitlements."                         
                                                                               
 CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 398(CRA)                                                
 "An Act relating to conveyance of certain land to municipalities."            
                                                                               
 CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 266(L&C)                                                
 "An Act relating to guide-outfitter and master guide-outfitter                
 licenses; extending the termination date of the Big Game Commercial           
 Services Board; and providing for an effective date."                         
                                                                               
 CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 239(RES) am                                             
 "An Act relating to raffles and auctions of certain permits to take           
 big game; and providing for an effective date."                               
                                                                               
 HOUSE BILL NO. 232                                                            
 "An Act relating to a bow hunting tag and bow hunting safety; and             
 providing for an effective date."                                             
                                                                               
 CS FOR HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 55(RES)                                     
 Relating to the importance to the economy of Southeast Alaska of              
 continued timber harvests on the Tongass National Forest.                     
                                                                               
 CS FOR HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 56(RES)                                     
 Relating to an exemption for federal land in Alaska from the                  
 federal PACFISH management strategy.                                          
                                                                               
 CS FOR HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 59(FSH)                                     
 Relating to reduction of wanton waste in North Pacific Ocean and              
 Bering Sea fisheries.                                                         
                                                                               
 HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 61                                                 
 Relating to the Western Alaska Community Development Quota Program            
 and the North Pacific Fishery Management Council Comprehensive                
 Rationalization Program.                                                      
                                                                               
 HOUSE BILL NO. 462                                                            
 "An Act repealing certain provisions of the laws, other than those            
 in the Alaska Land Act, relating to recording requirements, labor             
 and improvement requirements, and size requirements for mining                
 claims and providing for the suspension or waiver of state annual             
 mining labor requirements when the federal government has suspended           
 or waived federal annual mining labor requirements administratively           
 or by statute; and providing for an effective date."                          
                                                                               
 HOUSE BILL NO. 446                                                            
 "An Act relating to community agreements for environmental                    
 conservation purposes; and providing for an effective date."                  
                                                                               
  PREVIOUS ACTION                                                              
                                                                               
 SB 375 - See Community & Regional Affairs minutes dated                       
          4/19/94 & 4/21/94.                                                   
                                                                               
 HB 398 - See Community & Regional Affairs minutes                             
          dated 3/15/94.  See Resources minutes dated 4/18/94.                 
                                                                               
 HB 266 - No previous action to record.                                        
                                                                               
 HB 239 - No previous action to record.                                        
                                                                               
 HB 232 - See Resources minutes dated 2/22/94, 2/23/94,  and                   
          3/9/94.                                                              
                                                                               
 HJR 55 - No previous action to record.                                        
                                                                               
 HJR 56 - No previous action to record.                                        
                                                                               
 HJR 59 - No previous action to record.                                        
                                                                               
 HJR 61 - No previous action to record.                                        
                                                                               
 HB 462 - See Resources minutes dated 4/13/94.                                 
                                                                               
 HB 446 - See Community & Regional Affairs minutes                             
          dated 4/7/94.                                                        
                                                                               
  WITNESS REGISTER                                                             
                                                                               
 Martha Stewart, Legislative Aide                                              
 c/o Senator Al Adams                                                          
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Commented in SB 375.                                   
                                                                               
 Jerry Gallagher, Director                                                     
 Division of Mining                                                            
 Department of Natural Resources                                               
 P.O. Box 107016                                                               
 Anchorage, Ak. 99510-1724                                                     
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Commented on SB 375, HB 398,                           
                                                                               
 Representative Harley Olberg                                                  
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Sponsor of HB 398.                                     
                                                                               
 Representative Gail Phillips                                                  
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Sponsor of HB 266.                                     
                                                                               
 Paul Johnson, Chairman                                                        
 Big Game Commercial Services Board                                            
 Juneau, Ak. 99801                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Supported HB 266.                                      
                                                                               
 Representative Con Bunde                                                      
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Sponsor of HB 239.                                     
                                                                               
 Dave Kelleyhouse, Director                                                    
 Division of Wildlife Conservation                                             
 P.O. Box 25526                                                                
 Juneau, Ak. 99802-5526                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Commented on HB 239.                                   
                                                                               
 John George                                                                   
 Alaska Outdoor Council                                                        
 9515 Marine Way                                                               
 Juneau, Ak. 99801                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Supported CSHB 239.                                    
                                                                               
 Representative Bill Williams                                                  
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Sponsor of HJR 55.                                     
                                                                               
 Katya Kirsch                                                                  
 Alaska Environmental Lobby                                                    
 P.O. Box 22151                                                                
 Juneau, Ak. 99802                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Opposed HJR 55 and HJR 56.                             
                                                                               
 Chuck Achborger, Director                                                     
 Juneau Chamber of Commerce                                                    
 124 West 5                                                                    
 Juneau, Ak. 99801                                                             
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Supported HJR 55 and HJR 56.                           
                                                                               
 Troy Reinhart, Executive Director                                             
 Alaska Forest Association                                                     
 Ketchikan, Ak. 99901                                                          
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Supported HJR 55 and HJR 56.                           
                                                                               
 Cheryl Sutton, Legislative Aide                                               
 Representative Carl Moses                                                     
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Commented on HJR 59 and HJR 61.                        
                                                                               
 Representative Gene Therriault                                                
 State Capitol                                                                 
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1182                                                        
  POSITION STATEMENT:   Sponsor of HB 462.                                     
                                                                               
 Mead Treadwell, Deputy Commissioner                                           
 Department of Environmental Conservation                                      
 410 Willoughby Ave., Suite 105                                                
 Juneau, Ak. 99801-1795                                                        
                                                                               
    ACTION NARRATIVE                                                           
                                                                               
  TAPE 94-40, SIDE A                                                           
                                                                               
 Number 001                                                                    
 CHAIRMAN MILLER called the Resources Committee meeting to order at            
 11:40 a.m. and announced that  HB 443  (FISH & WILDLIFE CONFIDENTIAL     L    
 RECORDS) was transmitted to the Senate, but hadn't been transmitted           
 to the committee, so they could not take it up.                               
 SENATOR MILLER said the first item they would take up today would             
 be  SB 375  (GENERAL GRANT LAND ENTITLEMENTS).                                
                                                                               
 MARTHA STEWART, Legislative Aide to Senator Al Adams, said this               
 bill would allow municipalities to select up to 10% of the general            
 grant land within their municipal boundaries.  A CS incorporating             
 changes suggested by the DNR was in their packets.                            
                                                                               
 She explained that certain members of the oil industry were                   
 concerned over the possibility of selecting "unitized land."  The             
 Oil and Gas Commission designates units which is a method of                  
 controlling the order of drilling activities.  A proposed amendment           
 would take those lands out of the possibility for selection for the           
 municipal entitlements.                                                       
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to adopt the CSSB 375 (RES).  There were no               
 objections and it was so ordered.                                             
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE  moved Senator Adam's amendment regarding "unitized            
 land."  There were no objections and it was so ordered.                       
                                                                               
 JERRY GALLAGHER, Department of Natural Resources, said there was a            
 $0 fiscal note and that local governments can select vacant and               
 unappropriated land.  The purpose of that limited selection is so             
 that municipal governments can select lands for schools, municipal            
 expansion and needs.  State Park and State Forest designated lands            
 could not be selected, he said.                                               
                                                                               
 SENATOR FRANK noted that Haines entitlements would go up by 5 times           
 and his district would triple.                                                
                                                                               
 MR. GALLAGHER elaborated for Senator Pearce that the smaller areas            
 with a higher population have a higher proportion of land, like               
 Juneau.                                                                       
                                                                               
 Number 254                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to discharge CSSB 375 (RES) from committee with           
 individual recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so           
 ordered.                                                                      
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HB 398  (LAND CONVEYED TO & FROM                    
 MUNICIPALITIES) to be up for consideration.                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE HARLEY OLBERG, Sponsor, said HB 398 allows                     
 municipalities to acquire their adjoining tide lands from the state           
 of Alaska subject to four conditions.  He said an existing problem            
 in the City of Skagway is addressed, also.                                    
                                                                               
 He had a proposed amendment that would enable the State of Alaska             
 to retain title to Anderson Bay by giving the Commissioner of DNR             
 the right to decline a conveyance if the state's interests clearly            
 outweigh the municipalities interests.                                        
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE asked if this could be used to stop aquaculture.               
 REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG said it has to be a development project for             
 the municipality to acquire their tide and submerged lands.                   
                                                                               
 MR. GALLAGHER noted that there wasn't a definition for development            
 in statute, although language on page 4, line 8 discusses what the            
 land can be used for.                                                         
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF asked what was the affect of repealing subsection             
 11.  REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG said that section was included at the              
 request of Skagway where their high school and a large piece of               
 their town is on filled tide lands.                                           
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said he was concerned with lines 13-15 on page 4               
 where it says, "the land is required for the accomplishment of a              
 public or private development approved by the city."  He thought              
 someone's interpretation of development could mean a park, and he             
 wasn't interested in creating parks.                                          
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE said she would like to hold the bill to tighten up             
 the meaning of development.                                                   
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER moved to adopt another amendment by inserting                  
 language "unless the Commissioner finds that the public interest in           
 retaining state ownership clearly outweighs the municipalities                
 interest in obtaining land."  There were no objections and it was             
 so ordered.                                                                   
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said he intended to hold this bill until Monday and            
 announced a recess for 2 minutes.                                             
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HB 266  (ELIGIBILITY FOR GUIDE-OUTFITTER            
 LICENSE) to be up for consideration.                                          
                                                                               
 SENATOR GAIL PHILLIPS, Sponsor, said this bill does affect the                
 guide-outfitter/master guide-outfitter licenses.  It seeks to                 
 extend the Big Game Commercial Services Board's statutory authority           
 to June 30, 1997, broaden the statute in one section to enable                
 compliance with a court decision in Cobb v. State, and reenact and            
 define the master/guide license.                                              
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF asked how a person became a registered guide.                 
                                                                               
 PAUL JOHNSON, Chairman, Master Guide Commercial Service Board, said           
 there are 2 different ways.  One system goes through a class A                
 guide which tries to assist those in rural areas.  The other way is           
 to become an assistant guide for 3 years.                                     
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF said one of the complaints he hears a lot is that             
 the master guides don't live in the state.  MR. JOHNSON said there            
 are legal constraints, but they have pursued having a different fee           
 for out of state guides.  There aren't really that many.  He said             
 the Board was trying to work with local people to protect them if             
 the federal government takes over, because of the subsistence                 
 issue.                                                                        
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said it his intent to work on the bill over the                
 weekend and bring it back on Monday.                                          
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HB 239  (RAFFLE OR AUCTION OF BIG GAME              
 PERMITS) to be up for consideration.                                          
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE CON BUNDE, Sponsor, said HB 239 is a revenue                   
 generating bill that will allow raffles and auctions of certain               
 permits to take big game.  He said he supported the CS.                       
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE, Director, Division of Wildlife Conservation,            
 explained that the bison raffle has not generated enough money to             
 keep the safeguard program going.  They would receive 50% of the              
 proceeds.  Other organizations would receive 10% with 90% going to            
 the Fish and Game fund.                                                       
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF asked how they get around the dedicated fund issue.           
 REPRESENTATIVE BUNDE said this would be like the sale of the duck             
 stamp prints.                                                                 
                                                                               
 MR. KELLEYHOUSE said he didn't think there would be a problem with            
 the money going into the Fish and Game fund.                                  
                                                                               
 JOHN GEORGE, Alaska Outdoor Council, supported the proposed CS to             
 HB 239.                                                                       
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE moved to adopt the CS to HB 239.  There were no                
 objections and it was so ordered.                                             
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE moved to pass CSHB 239 (RES) from committee with               
 individual recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so           
 ordered.                                                                      
 Number 577                                                                    
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HB 232  (BOW HUNTING STAMP & BOW HUNTING            
 SAFETY) to be up for consideration.  He said they had adopted the             
 Resources SCS.                                                                
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to discharge SCSHB 232(RES) from committee with           
 individual recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so           
 ordered.                                                                      
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HJR 55  (TONGASS NATIONAL FOREST TIMBER             
 HARVESTS) to be up for consideration.                                         
                                                                               
  TAPE 94-40, SIDE B                                                           
  Number 580                                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE WILLIAMS, Sponsor, said HJR 55 asks Congress to                
 review the economic impact of Southeast Alaska on the Forest                  
 Products Industry, brought about by ANILCA and the Tongass Reform             
 Act of 1990.  There has been a timber shortage since 1990 resulting           
 in the loss of more than 600 forest products industry jobs in                 
 southeast Alaska.  The lack of an assured supply of timber                    
 available for harvest posses a great threat to the economic well              
 being of the region, Representative Williams said.                            
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF said he didn't have trouble with the timber                   
 industry portion of the bill.  But he and other legislators have              
 been receiving a number of messages from other resource users in              
 the state who are concerned.                                                  
                                                                               
 Number 540                                                                    
                                                                               
 KATYA KIRSCH, Alaska Environmental Lobby, opposed HJR 55, because             
 the Congressional report it requests is already required and                  
 petitions the Forest Service to manage the Tongass National Forest            
 in a way that will force Southeast Alaska to face the same                    
 environmental and economic collapse seen in the Pacific Northwest.            
                                                                               
 She said the legislature has all the user groups in their                     
 constituencies, not just timber.  It's poor policy to accommodate             
 a single interest, especially when it can negatively impact other             
 people and industries in the state.                                           
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN said he understands her to be saying that if they are           
 optimizing opportunity for the timber industry, they are of                   
 necessity not optimizing opportunity for other interests.  That is            
 not his conclusion.  He thinks they can optimize an opportunity for           
 timber and other industries within the confines of the existing               
 management plans.                                                             
                                                                               
 MS. KIRSCH commented that current harvest levels have been below              
 that stated in law.  Problems like subsistence, viable populations,           
 and the fact that there just isn't enough timber in certain units             
 have been cropping up.  The intent of the language in this                    
 resolution is to increase what has already been happening when that           
 is already unsustainable - as far as all of the user groups being             
 able to continue their uses.                                                  
                                                                               
 CHUCK ACHBORGER, Director, Juneau Chamber of Commerce, supported              
 HJR 55.  It is extremely important for Southeast Alaska to have a             
 viable timber base for a viable economy.  The Tongass Land                    
 Management Plan was put together with a consensus of all interests.           
 Timber ended up with 10% of the Tongass to work with.  Ever since             
 then, they have been fighting to maintain that 10%.                           
                                                                               
 TROY REINHART, Executive Director, Alaska Forest Association,                 
 supported HJR 55.  It does not ask for anything that isn't in                 
 current law.                                                                  
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN asked him if he found the Tongass Timber Reform Act             
 of 1990 workable.  MR. REINHART said it was workable and they will            
 continue to make it workable.                                                 
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF said looking at the citations and resolutions that            
 have come in from the different municipalities and interest groups            
 he represents, he thought their comfort level would be increased              
 greatly if they adopt amendments asking that the other resources be           
 protected in all of these deliberations.                                      
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF moved to adopt amendment #1.  SENATOR MILLER                  
 objected for the purpose of discussion.  SENATOR ZHAROFF explained            
 it would replace the first "WHEREAS."  The amendment defers to the            
 goal of sustainable yield of the various resources.                           
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE WILLIAMS said the various acts in place now, like              
 the Forest Practices Act, are working.  He, therefore, objected.              
 SENATOR ZHAROFF suggested he work with the sponsor over the weekend           
 and move the bill out Monday.                                                 
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said that would be fine and he asked Representative            
 Williams if he objected to amendment #2.  REPRESENTATIVE WILLIAMS             
 said that he objected to that one also.                                       
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HJR 56  (EXEMPT ALASKA FROM "PACFISH" REGS)    S)   
 to be up for consideration.                                                   
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE WILLIAMS, Sponsor, said that salmon stocks are                 
 healthy.  Alaska does not share the habitat degradation problems              
 faced by the other northwest states.  Salmon stocks in Alaska are             
 protected by existing federal and state laws and regulations,                 
 including the Tongass Land Management Plan, the Tongass Timber                
 Reform Act, the Alaska Coastal Zone Management Program, and the               
 Alaska State Forest Practices Act. Implementation of PacFish in               
 Alaska is inappropriate and unnecessary, he said.                             
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF asked what "beribboned" meant.  There was                     
 discussion that it meant the same thing as braided.                           
                                                                               
 KATYA KIRSCH, Alaska Environmental Lobby, said many of their                  
 members fish commercially for salmon.  They strongly oppose this              
 resolution banning the best science to date that will insure a                
 future for the salmon resource.                                               
                                                                               
 MS. KIRSCH said that Senator Stevens obtained a one year exemption            
 from Pacfish for Alaska requiring the Forest Service to do a report           
 on the applicability of the strategy to the state.  HJR 56 asks               
 Congress to make a permanent exemption before that report even                
 comes out.  She said the Pacfish strategy for healthy streams is              
 simply to place the burden of proof on land users that their                  
 activity will not adversely affect salmon.  Salmon provides jobs              
 for Alaskans and they are also a part of our culture.                         
 CHUCK ACHBORGER, Juneau Chamber of Commerce, supported HJR 56.  He            
 said the reason most of the healthy streams are in Alaska is                  
 because the timber industry and the state have the Forest Practices           
 Act which does protect our streams.                                           
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF commented that there are other user groups that               
 have concerns as well.  He mentioned the resolutions from city                
 counsels that have expressed interest in having their uses                    
 considered equally.                                                           
                                                                               
 TROY REINHART, Alaska Forest Association, supported HJR 56.  He               
 said if you look at the Pacific Northwest for which Pacfish was put           
 in place, there is no doubt that they have problems, but they are             
 generally not habitat problems.  The problems are dams and                    
 irrigation and development in the lower sections of the river and             
 estuaries.                                                                    
                                                                               
 Number 120                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF moved to delete "beribboned" for which there is no            
 official definition.                                                          
                                                                               
 SENATOR FRANK objected.  He thought it might clarify the                      
 description of the topography and, therefore, the logic for having            
 different rules apply.                                                        
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said that "beribboned" would be amendment #1 (a).              
 SENATOR FRANK removed his objection and the amendment was adopted.            
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF moved amendment #2.  He said we really need to be             
 careful in getting involved in the problems that are unique to the            
 problems of the Northwest.  There were no objections and it was               
 adopted.                                                                      
                                                                               
  TAPE 94-41, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 001                                                                   
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF said he thought this legislation would send up a              
 red flag to permanently exclude all land in Alaska, meaning that we           
 don't want anyone else interfering.                                           
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said there were no objections and amendment #2 was             
 adopted.                                                                      
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS moved to pass HJR 56 from committee with individual             
 recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so ordered.             
 Number 60                                                                     
 SENATOR MILLER announced HJR 55 to be back before the committee.              
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF moved amendment #1.  There were no objections and             
 it was so ordered.                                                            
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF moved amendment # 2.  There were no objections and            
 it was so ordered.                                                            
                                                                               
 SENATOR ZHAROFF moved to pass CS to HJR 55 (RES) am from committee.           
 There were no objections and it was so ordered.                               
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HJR 59  (WANTON WASTE OF FISH                       
 N.PACIFIC/BERING SEA) to be up for consideration.                             
                                                                               
 CHERYL SUTTON, Legislative Aide to Representative Carl Moses, read            
 a sponsor statement.                                                          
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS moved to pass HJR 59 from committee with individual             
 recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so ordered.             
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HJR 61  (COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT FISHING              
 QUOTAS) to be up for consideration.                                           
                                                                               
 CHERYL SUTTON testified that HJR 61 first establishes some factual            
 information relative to Western Alaska Community Development Quota            
 Groups and then addresses the North Pacific Fisheries Management              
 Council's comprehensive rationalization plan for ground fish and              
 crab.  Comprehensive rationalization means collectively all present           
 and potential users of resources will be included in some plan that           
 will be formalized by the federal government.                                 
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to discharge HJR 61 from committee.  There were           
 no objections and it was so ordered.                                          
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HB 462  (MINING REQUIREMENTS:                       
 RECORDING/LABOR/SIZE) to be up for consideration.                             
                                                                               
 REPRESENTATIVE GENE THERRIAULT, Sponsor, explained the CS.                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE moved to adopt the CS to HB 462.  There were no                
 objections and it was so ordered.                                             
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to discharge CSHB 462 from committee with                 
 individual recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so           
 ordered.                                                                      
 Number 225                                                                    
 SENATOR MILLER announced  HB 446  (ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION                 
 AGREEMENTS) to be up for consideration.                                       
                                                                               
 MEAD TREADWELL, Deputy Commissioner, Department of Environmental              
 Conservation, said this bill was proposed by the Governor to put in           
 the agency's charter that it is specifically able and has the                 
 authority to enter into agreements with communities to                        
 comprehensively address environmental problems.                               
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to adopt the CS to HB 446.  SENATOR PEARCE                
 objected for discussion purposes.                                             
                                                                               
 ANNETTE KRIETZER, Staff to Senator Loren Leman, said the amendments           
 that are proposed are in keeping with the direction of SB 215, SB
 33, and HB 238.                                                               
                                                                               
 SENATOR PEARCE commented that saying every time the Department                
 works with a community on its conservation needs they have to go              
 through this extra hoop, is adding a bureaucracy to a process that            
 is already cumbersome.                                                        
                                                                               
 MR. TREADWELL agreed and said he had never seen this amendment.               
 The Commissioner asked to have the bill go through without                    
 amendments, if possible.  The language is a change to the charter             
 to put very high in the introductory language that the Department             
 should work with communities.                                                 
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER said he viewed the language as an amendment, not a             
 committee substitute.                                                         
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS asked how the Alaskan communities were going to met             
 the unfunded needs that are required by federal regulations.                  
                                                                               
 MR. TREADWELL said they face that problem every day.  He said they            
 try to work with communities, not in an adversarial role.   They              
 have recently told the federal government, on another source of               
 unfunded mandates, that we are willing to lose the $2 million in              
 federal funding you are willing to give us, because the first time            
 we implement these regulations, it's going to cost our communities            
 far more than $2 million.                                                     
                                                                               
 SENATOR FRANK asked about problems with the private sector.  Why              
 limit this to just communities.                                               
                                                                               
 MR. TREADWELL explained that there is sometimes a problem in making           
 an agreement between an agency and a private entity that is not               
 specifically through a contract or through an open bidding process.           
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS asked if they would consider "private local                     
 corporations."                                                                
                                                                               
 MR. TREADWELL suggested adding to the original bill saying, "where            
 appropriate portions of the community agreement related to                    
 emergency response will be entered into jointly with the State                
 Emergency Response Commission."  This would take that part of an              
 agreement that would deal with local response issues and take it to           
 the CERC which involves other agencies.                                       
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to withdraw the motion to adopt the CS to HB
 446.  There were no objections and it was so ordered.                         
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to adopt Mr. Treadwell's conceptual amendment.            
 There were no objections and it was adopted.                                  
                                                                               
 SENATOR FRANK moved on line 7 after "corporation" to insert "other            
 local corporations."  There were no objections and it was so                  
 ordered.                                                                      
                                                                               
 SENATOR ADAMS moved SCSHB 446(RES) from committee with individual             
 recommendations.  There were no objections and it was so ordered.             
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to adopt the letter of intent.  MR. TREADWELL             
 commented that it would be a setback to adopt the letter of intent,           
 because they have many agreements in place already.                           
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN suggested deleting the words, "implementing HB 446              
 and before."  MR. TREADWELL said implementing some of the contracts           
 would begin in the next year, but it wasn't imminent.                         
                                                                               
 SENATOR LEMAN moved to withdraw his motion to adopt the letter of             
 intent saying he would offer an amended version on the floor.                 
 Number 518                                                                    
                                                                               
 SENATOR MILLER adjourned the meeting at 2:23 p.m.                             
                                                                               

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