03/13/2007 01:30 PM Senate LABOR & COMMERCE
| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| SB101 | |
| SB97 | |
| SB18 | |
| SB99 | |
| HB108 | |
| Adjourn |
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| *+ | SB 99 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | SB 18 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | HB 108 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | SB 97 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| += | SB 101 | TELECONFERENCED | |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
SENATE LABOR AND COMMERCE STANDING COMMITTEE
March 13, 2007
1:30 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Senator Johnny Ellis, Chair
Senator Gary Stevens, Vice Chair
Senator Bettye Davis
Senator Con Bunde
MEMBERS ABSENT
Senator Lyman Hoffman
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
SENATE BILL NO. 101
"An Act relating to private professional conservators and
private and public guardians."
MOVED CSSB 101(L&C) OUT OF COMMITTEE
SENATE BILL NO. 97
"An Act relating to identification seals for certain articles
created or crafted in the state by Alaska Native persons;
relating to the Alaska State Council on the Arts; and making
certain identification seal violations unfair trade practices."
MOVED SB 97 OUT OF COMMITTEE
SENATE BILL NO. 18
"An Act relating to property foreclosures and executions; and
amending Rule 65, Alaska Rules of Civil Procedure."
HEARD AND HELD
SENATE BILL NO. 99
"An Act relating to the composition of the Alaska Police
Standards Council; and providing for an effective date."
HEARD AND HELD
CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 108(L&C)
"An Act extending the termination date for the Board of Marine
Pilots; and providing for an effective date."
HEARD AND HELD
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: SB 101
SHORT TITLE: GUARDIANSHIP AND CONSERVATORS
SPONSOR(s): LABOR & COMMERCE
02/28/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/07 (S) L&C, STA, FIN
03/08/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
03/08/07 (S) Heard & Held
03/08/07 (S) MINUTE(L&C)
03/13/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
BILL: SB 97
SHORT TITLE: ALASKA NATIVE ART IDENTIFICATION SEALS
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) STEVENS
02/26/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/26/07 (S) L&C, FIN
03/08/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
03/08/07 (S) Heard & Held
03/08/07 (S) MINUTE(L&C)
03/13/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
BILL: SB 18
SHORT TITLE: PROPERTY FORECLOSURES AND EXECUTIONS
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) BUNDE
01/16/07 (S) PREFILE RELEASED 1/5/07
01/16/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/16/07 (S) L&C, JUD, FIN
03/13/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
BILL: SB 99
SHORT TITLE: POLICE STANDARDS COUNCIL MEMBERSHIP
SPONSOR(s): SENATOR(s) FRENCH
02/28/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/07 (S) L&C, STA, FIN
03/13/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
BILL: HB 108
SHORT TITLE: BOARD OF MARINE PILOTS
SPONSOR(s): LABOR & COMMERCE
01/25/07 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
01/25/07 (H) L&C, FIN
02/14/07 (H) L&C AT 3:00 PM CAPITOL 17
02/14/07 (H) Moved CSHB 108(L&C) Out of Committee
02/14/07 (H) MINUTE(L&C)
02/15/07 (H) L&C RPT CS(L&C) 7DP
02/15/07 (H) DP: GARDNER, BUCH, GATTO, RAMRAS,
LEDOUX, NEUMAN, OLSON
02/21/07 (H) FIN AT 1:30 PM HOUSE FINANCE 519
02/21/07 (H) Moved CSHB 108(L&C) Out of Committee
02/21/07 (H) MINUTE(FIN)
02/22/07 (H) FIN RPT CS(L&C) 9DP
02/22/07 (H) DP: GARA, CRAWFORD, HAWKER, JOULE,
THOMAS, NELSON, STOLTZE, MEYER,
CHENAULT
02/26/07 (H) TRANSMITTED TO (S)
02/26/07 (H) VERSION: CSHB 108(L&C)
02/28/07 (S) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
02/28/07 (S) L&C, FIN
03/13/07 (S) L&C AT 1:30 PM BELTZ 211
WITNESS REGISTER
DANA OWEN
Staff to Senator Ellis
Alaska State Capitol
Juneau, AK 99801-1182
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on SB 101(L&C) for the sponsor.
JOSH FINK, Director
Office of Public Advocacy
Department of Administration (DOA)
Anchorage AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported CSSB 101(L&C).
RICK URION, Director
Division of Corporations, Business and Occupational Licensing
Department of Commerce, Community & Economic Development
Juneau AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported CSSB 101(L&C).
TIM LAMKIN
Staff to Senator Stevens
Alaska State Capitol
Juneau, AK 99801-1182
POSITION STATEMENT: Commented on SB 97 for the sponsor.
SAUNDERS MCNEIL
No affiliation indicated
Anchorage AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 97.
SENATOR CON BUNDE
Alaska State Capitol
Juneau, AK 99801-1182
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of SB 18.
STEPHAN ROUTH, Attorney
Routh Crabtree
Anchorage AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 18.
BRYAN BUTCHER, Director
Governmental Affairs and Public Relations
Alaska Housing Finance Corp.
Department of Revenue (DOR)
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 18.
BRYAN MERRELL
First American Title Insurance Co.
Seattle WA
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 18.
SENATOR HOLLIS FRENCH
Alaska State Capitol
Juneau, AK 99801-1182
POSITION STATEMENT: Sponsor of SB 99.
JOHN CYR, Executive Director
Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA)
Anchorage AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 99.
SERGEANT TARA TIPPET, Patrol Division
Fairbanks Police Department
Fairbanks AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 99.
ROB COX, President
Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA)
Anchorage AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 99.
BRIAN DALLAS, Officer
Juneau Police Department
Juneau AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported SB 99.
WALT MONEGAN, Commissioner
Department of Public Safety (DPS)
Juneau AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SB 99.
TERRY VRABEC, Director
Alaska Police Standards Council
Juneau AK
POSITION STATEMENT:
JOHN LUCKING, Chief of Police
City of Soldotna
Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SB 99.
JEFF MARTIN, Senior Police Officer
Anchorage Police Department
Anchorage AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SB 99.
CHUCK KOPP, Chairman
Alaska Police Standards Council
& Chief of Police for the City of Kenai
Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Opposed SB 99.
AL CLOUGH, Chairman
Board of Marine Pilots
& Deputy Commissioner
Department of Commerce, Community & Economic Development (DCCED)
Juneau AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 108.
PAT DAVIDSON
Legislative Auditor
Alaska State Capitol
Juneau, AK 99801-1182
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 108.
PAUL FUHS
Southwest Pilots Association
Juneau AK
POSITION STATEMENT: Supported HB 108.
ACTION NARRATIVE
CHAIR JOHNNY ELLIS called the Senate Labor and Commerce Standing
Committee meeting to order at 1:30:55 PM. Present at the call to
order were Senators Bunde, Stevens, Davis and Ellis.
SB 101-GUARDIANSHIP AND CONSERVATORS
CHAIR ELLIS announced SB 101 to be up for consideration. He
asked his staff to explain the CS, version M.
DANA OWEN, staff to Senator Ellis, explained that the CS had two
significant changes. First, the requirements for bonding and
licensing were removed for guardians and conservatorships in
four different sections and references to them were removed from
two other places.
He pointed out that the other significant change occurs on page
2, line 6, of the original bill. In the CS it occurs on page 2,
line 7, where language is added to the list of things that are
prohibited in order to get a license; it also applies to
conservatorships. Language now reads: "any other crime the
department determines would affect the individual's ability to
provide the services of a guardian competently and safely for
the protected person".
Several smaller changes clarify language. On page 1, line 10,
"a" was dropped. On page 5, line 13, a new Section (7) was
added: "(b) The office of public advocacy shall notify the
department of the licensee's compliance with (a) of this
section." Clarifying language was added to (3) on the same page.
"Documents necessary to establish financial solvency" was
clarified to mean the financial solvency of the licensee.
CHAIR ELLIS asked Mr. Fink to explain the rationale behind the
changes in the proposed CS.
1:35:58 PM
JOSH FINK, Office of Public Advocacy (OPA), Department of
Administration (DOA), explained that currently when a guardian
or conservator is appointed, rules allow for the court to impose
a bond. It would look at the size of the estate and the
responsibilities of the guardian and a few other factors. So,
the department felt that since proof of insurance or bonding
isn't required for most professions it licenses, including
doctors and lawyers, and since the court is the gatekeeper on
appointments and establishes the amount of a bond, it wanted the
bonding and insurance requirements to be removed for
consistency. He said the court could still require bonds for
individual cases.
The criminal background check on page 2 was clarified so that to
receive a license, one couldn't have a crime of dishonesty
within 10 years. This language had been removed from the
original CS.
The other significant change came from the director of the
Division of Corporations, Business and Occupational Licensing
who had some concern about the division's obligation and
expertise in reviewing the guardianship reports. Mr. Fink said
he volunteered OPA to do that activity because in-house
expertise already provides those services to about 1,000 people
and could quickly review the reports and flag anything that was
alarming back to the division. It would also be notified that
registered guardians and conservators were in compliance or if a
report had not been received.
1:39:19 PM
RICK URION, Director, Division of Corporations, Business and
Occupational Licensing, Department of Commerce, Community &
Economic Development (DCCED), supported the CS.
1:39:45 PM
SENATOR STEVENS moved to adopt the CS to SB 101(L&C), version M.
There were no objections and it was so ordered.
1:40:13 PM
An AARP representative spoke from the audience in support of
CSSB 101(L&C).
1:40:39 PM
SENATOR STEVENS moved to report CSSB 101(L&C) from committee
with individual recommendations and accompanying fiscal notes.
There were no objections and it was so ordered.
SB 97-ALASKA NATIVE ART IDENTIFICATION SEALS
CHAIR ELLIS announced SB 97 to be up for consideration. He said
he had heard of good support for the legislation and no known
opposition.
TIM LAMKIN, staff to Senator Stevens, sponsor of SB 97, said he
had nothing further to add other than that several hundreds of
people are lined up to testify in favor of this bill.
SAUNDERS MCNEIL, no affiliation indicated, thanked the committee
for considering the bill.
SENATOR BUNDE noted the lack of fiscal note and said he
therefore assumed the program would be self-supporting.
MR. LAMKIN said that was correct.
1:43:08 PM
SENATOR DAVIS moved to report SB 97 from committee with
individual recommendations and attached fiscal notes. There were
no objections and it was so ordered.
SB 18-PROPERTY FORECLOSURES AND EXECUTIONS
CHAIR ELLIS announced SB 18 to be up for consideration.
SENATOR BUNDE, sponsor of SB 18, said that Alaska statutes on
real property and its non-judicial foreclosure process are
antiquated and sometimes ambiguous and are often prone to
litigation. SB 18 proposes to clarify the present statutory
language, simplify it and modernized it.
He said currently the process for such a foreclosure is to go to
the courthouse steps auction. Some people in the trade, known as
bottom feeders, will buy a mortgage for $1 more than is owed to
the bank with the idea of churning the property very quickly -
not caring for the property or using it as a home. This bill
would allow others who might actually wish to own the home and
establish a residence there to bid up the price on the property.
Passage of SB 18 would streamline and simplify the foreclosure
language and provide for a more open, accessible and fair
auction process that would benefit borrowers, lenders, title
insurers, individuals and even neighborhoods, as well as reduce
unnecessary litigation.
1:46:13 PM
STEPHAN ROUTH, Rough Crabtree, Anchorage, said he has practiced
law for 25 years focusing on real estate matters. This bill was
drafted to address issues he has seen over the years and with
the knowledge he has gained about practices in 11 other states
that are non-judicial foreclosure states like Alaska. The intent
was to incorporate best practices into Alaska law and modernize
it.
One change calls for a three-month time period between doing one
act and another and that was changed to 90 days to account for a
smaller number of days in February. The posting language was
clarified to cover situations where there is no structure by
stating you can take reasonable steps to post if you can't get
to a building. This was a "litigation-breeder."
Third, SB 18 modernizes the market for the foreclosure auction
by advertising foreclosures on the Internet. Now a foreclosure
auction takes place at the court house steps. However, because
it is done by judicial district, it requires advertising in a
newspaper and a courthouse in the district, but not necessarily
closest to the property. He emphasized that the newspaper piece
is not taken away, but reasoned that the foreclosure notice
section is probably the least-read part of any newspaper people
use the Internet all the time.
MR. ROUTH further explained that in his experience having two
bidders is better than one because he has found that the second
bidder is usually someone who wants to move into the property
and will also get the price up. You get two bidders by getting
information out where it can be seen. This bill gets it out on
the Internet and makes it lawful to accept an offer from
someplace other than the courthouse steps.
CHAIR ELLIS said this is the first hearing and he would have the
bill back before the committee in the near future.
1:52:12 PM
BRYAN BUTCHER, Director, Governmental Affairs and Public
Relations, Alaska Housing Finance Corporation (AHFC), supported
SB 18, but said a few technical issues have come to his
attention in talking to the Attorney General's Office.
MR. BUTCHER said there were three issues. The first is on page 1
regarding the extra cost of advertising. According to the AG's
office the publishing of the notice of sale of foreclosure on an
Internet website would bring an additional cost that is unknown
at this time. It would be borne by the borrower or possibly the
lender if the property cannot be sold for the balance of the
loan and the cost of foreclosure. Also, there may only be one
Internet website currently that would meet the qualifications of
the proposed bill.
The second change is on page 2 - the right to cure a default
arisen by failure to make payments. Under current law, a default
on a loan that has arisen by failure to make payments may be
cured at any time before the sale. The new language shortens the
time period to cure by five days, which would reduce the
borrowers' time to cure.
The third point is a terminology change on page 6 to be
consistent with the beginning of the bill where the reference is
to "deed of trust or trustor of the deed of trust". In section 9
it changes to use of the term "grantor in the trust deed" or
"grantor". For consistency purposes the AG's office pointed out
these terms should be changed to reflect what is used in the
beginning portion of the bill.
He concluded saying the changes have more to do with the
consumer than the corporation and he also noted a zero fiscal
note from the corporation.
1:55:04 PM
BRYAN MERRELL, First American Title Insurance Co., said he
practiced law in Alaska, but was transferred by his company to
Seattle. He continues to oversee his company's underwriting and
claims for the State of Alaska and he still visits frequently.
He supported SB 18 saying he had been involved with Mr. Routh
since its inception. He explained that First American and other
title insurance companies are involved in foreclosure cases
because they are named as the original trustee under the deed of
trust and in many cases continue to perform that function
through the foreclosure process.
Second he said they issue a product called "the trustee sale
guarantee" which is a title report to the foreclosing trustee
and the lender beneficiary under the deed of trust that recites
what parties are to be provided - what notice is required and
what the status of title of the property is at the time of the
foreclosure process beginning.
MR. MERRELL concluded that he supported SB 18 because it
clarifies foreclosure problems that have arisen because some
Alaska Supreme Court rulings have made the current statute so
unclear that it is, in fact, a litigation breeding ground that
needs to be cleaned up.
1:57:33 PM
SENATOR BUNDE summed up that he would incorporate the concerns
in a CS for another hearing.
SB 99-POLICE STANDARDS COUNCIL MEMBERSHIP
1:58:42 PM
CHAIR ELLIS announced SB 99 to be up for consideration.
SENATOR FRENCH, sponsor of SB 99, read the sponsor statement. It
adds three certified police officers with at least five years of
experience working with the police to the Alaska Police
Standards Council (APSC). He said the idea is to allow those who
are charged with the daily enforcement of the law to have input
into their training standards as participating members of the
state's board which certifies police officers.
At present, the APSC is the only board in state government that
does not have any representation by the group most affected by
its decisions. Although the APSC has seats assigned to the
chiefs of police, the commissioners of public safety and
corrections and to members of the public, it has no line
officers on the board. By contrast, he said, according to a
survey done by Legislative Research staff of 10 western states,
only two have no line officers on their police standards boards.
SENATOR FRENCH stated that he has no quarrel with the APSC and
believes it has done a fine job, but he thought it could benefit
from the presence of line officers who could bring their
particular experience and perspective to the board.
SENATOR BUNDE asked if a specific problem generated the
legislation.
SENATOR FRENCH replied no; he just thought it would provide more
balance and harmony with both the police and the board - between
those who are regulating and those who are being regulated.
SENATOR STEVENS asked what the composition of the council is
now.
SENATOR FRENCH listed the members referencing page 1 of the
bill. It's made up of 4 chief administrative officers or chiefs
of police, a commissioner of public safety or a designee, a
commissioner of corrections or designee, one correctional
administrative officer who is employed at the level of deputy
director or higher and 4 members of the public at large with at
least 2 from a community of 2,500 or less.
2:02:08 PM
JOHN CYR, Executive Director, Public Safety Employees
Association (PSEA), added some background to the issue. He said
about 35 years ago the Alaska Police Standards Council (APSC)
was created. Since 1972, however, the state has changed
significantly; the population has grown and problems confronting
officers have changed. Officers have to be versatile, organized
and extremely well-trained. He said, "Giving those who work
closest to crime a voice in the decision-making body that had
direct effect on the training officers receive and the standards
by which they work should be encouraged and welcomed."
He supported SB 99 because it adds three rank and file officers
to the Alaska Police Standards Council - however, it keeps the
composition of the Council at 11 members and keeps operating
expenses within its budget. It adds three police officers by
reducing the number of chief administrative officers or chiefs
of police from four to three and it reduces the public members
from four to two. It allows three representatives of police who
are working law enforcement officers with five years of
experience to serve. He emphasized that their years of
experience are critical in the training of officers.
SENATOR BUNDE asked if a particular incident prompted the
legislation.
MR. CYR replied no; but rather they want more direct input into
promulgating regulations and especially the training component.
SENATOR BUNDE commented that it's not broken, but we're going to
fix it anyway.
MR. CYR responded in his mind he wants folks to do a better job
in the field. Their decisions are critical and they should have
some say in their regulation as a matter of fairness.
2:08:10 PM
SENATOR BUNDE asked if the Council sets the standards for
training.
MR. CYR replied to a large degree, yes.
SENATOR STEVENS asked if the Council has anything to do with the
Academy and does it establish promotion standards.
MR. CYR replied that their packets list training, standards and
curriculum and compared them to teaching standards. It has
nothing to do with promotion.
SENATOR STEVENS asked if there is a connection between the
Council and the State Academy.
MR. CYR replied that the Council sets the Academy's standards.
2:10:46 PM
SERGEANT TARA TIPPET, Patrol Division, Fairbanks Police
Department, gave her credentials and reasons she thought her
extensive police experience would add much to the Council. She
is a certified police instructor and she has personally attended
over 4,000 hours of police training. She also became a national
certified and through delivering law enforcement training, she
has trained over 1,700 multi-disciplinary students within 700
hours of training.
She said that SB 99 corrects a basic fairness issue. The APSC is
the only board in Alaska that doesn't include members of those
who are licensed by it. She said that many states include rank
and file members on their council committees. Those members
participate in the process of developing standards, training and
curriculum for public safety officers.
She recapped that officers selected to serve on APSC will have
at least five years of police experience giving them a depth and
breadth of knowledge regarding policing issues. These officers
will broaden the base involvement at the APSC and can provide a
from-the-ground-up flow of communication and input that will be
invaluable. "Every police officer in the State of Alaska has a
stake in the decisions that are made by APSC and could
potentially affect their careers."
SERGEANT TIPPET reasoned that APSC currently has seven people
who are in top administrative positions in law enforcement and
corrections for civilians. Participation by representatives from
these groups is very important and rather than increase the
number of Council members, SB 99 proposes a change to the number
of people in two groups, chief administrative officers or chiefs
of police and civilians. For that reason these groups are still
adequately represented, but there is no additional fiscal note
and it will still fall within budget.
There are far more police officers in the State of Alaska than
there are chief administrators or chief of police. Yet their
representation on APSC will be equal. He reasoned:
There are far more civilians than police officers in
the State of Alaska; their positions will only be
reduced by one and although their interests are very
important and the public certainly has the right to be
represented, the police have a much closer vested
interest in the decisions that are made by APSC.
2:15:29 PM
SENATOR BUNDE asked if she were on the Council, could she
envision a problem with passing judgment on someone who has her
back the next time they go out on a call.
SERGEANT TIPPET responded, "Sir, I have no desire to retain bad
thoughts. There is no room for dishonest or disreputable police
officers on any police force anywhere in the United States and
certainly not here where I'm serving in the State of Alaska. I
certainly have personally no issue with performing such a role."
SENATOR STEVENS asked if this is a volunteer or paid position.
SERGEANT TIPPET replied because this has not been enacted, she
didn't know how it would happen. She saw value in serving on a
voluntary basis in that position and would petition her chief
for some happy medium for having time away to be able to
participate in such an important role.
CHAIR ELLIS directed the question to Senator French.
SENATOR FRENCH replied that he understands it to be a volunteer
position.
2:17:40 PM
ROB COX, President, Public Safety Employees Association (PSEA),
said he has been employed as an Alaska State Trooper for 16
years - 14 of those years as a DPS and APSC certified instructor
and instructor trainer. He believed that APSC has done a good
job in determining training criteria, but some gaps will exist
when there is no avenue for participation by those subject to
the criteria that are set by APSC. As a trainer and an officer
who works a patrol shift, he believes that he and officers like
him offer practical perspectives to the APSC regarding how
training courses impact the performance of police duties in the
field. He explained:
It can be very difficult to understanding the
practicality and impact of training policy, course
content from a policy-making position without input
from and a discussion with the so-called boots on the
ground. Additionally, when training is determined and
implemented with mutual discussion, inclusion and
inclusive acceptance then the acceptance at the field
level increases. Specific valuable input that would be
provided by having well-respected and experienced
police officers on the APSC include: 1)
appropriateness of course length; 2) practical
certification requirements; 3) logical course syllabi;
4) appropriate APSC instructor requirements; 5)
ongoing APSC instructor improvement courses; 6)
pertinence of course content based upon up-to-date
road experience; and 7) effective legislative actions
on practical law enforcement and how this impacts
training and training criteria - to name a few.
The vast majority, I believe, of the police officers
in the State of Alaska are highly motivated,
qualified, and professional individuals who desire to
reach their full occupational potential in terms of
understanding and fulfilling their enforcement
duties....
SENATOR STEVENS asked how he saw this being funded in terms of
working out volunteering for pay and asked if members could be
compensated with time?
MR. COX replied this would be a voluntary position. Those
officers who would potentially sit on APSC under SB 99 would not
necessarily be APSC members. The governor's function of
appointing the officers is still preserved.
SENATOR STEVENS was concerned about additional costs to the
Kodiak Police Department. He asked if a member is from another
community, who pays for him to get to a meeting that isn't held
there and how often did he think the meetings would occur.
MR. COX replied that he didn't know the details, but that the
number of members was not increased and a number of those who
sit on the council now are from various police departments
around the state. So he guessed there already was some provision
for travel compensation.
2:23:44 PM
SENATOR BUNDE asked how many officers are in the PSEA.
MR. COX replied that he didn't know - more are outside of the
union than in it.
SENATOR BUNDE speculated there would be ample opportunity for
both union and non-union members to be on the council and
informed them that members of boards and commissions receive a
per-diem.
2:24:46 PM
BRIAN DALLAS, Juneau Police Department, read his statement that
supported previous testimony and SB 99. He said that adding
officers to APSC would bring the high standards of their front-
line knowledge and experience to the APSC training program.
2:27:58 PM
WALT MONEGAN, Commissioner, Department of Public Safety (DPS),
said he was a police chief and member of the Anchorage Police
Department for almost 33 years. In that time he sat on board of
APSC. He was also an APSC instructor for about 12 years. He
commended everyone who spoke so far; they are high caliber
individuals.
He said when training comes to APSC's attention comes from the
departments. It wouldn't know what a TASER was until someone
brought it to their attention. The course on TASER training
would be put together by the subject matter experts - in this
case the instructors of any various departments' staff and then
presented through their chain of command up to the chief and the
chief would eventually see that it was brought up to APSC for
certification. He agreed with having input from the people who
are actually out on the streets, but it is already done that
way. APSC does not formulate these policies or training
guidelines just out of the blue. "So, the input is there."
COMMISSIONER MONEGAN said they do not want bad officers in any
department, but what is missing, in his mind, is a dialogue
between the PSEA or any union and the APSC Board, itself. This
has not been an agenda item that APSC has entertained or looked
at.
He said that communication is the lifeblood of all relationships
and that includes APSC and the members that it certifies or
decertifies. Finding out about this issue is counterintuitive to
a good cooperative working relationship. He suggested giving
them an opportunity to discuss this within the Council first
before rushing off and changing something that they didn't know
was broken before this.
2:32:21 PM
SENATOR BUNDE said he was concerned with cutting the number of
public members from four to two.
COMMISSIONER MONEGAN replied he was also concerned that the
public needs to see what they do as a police agency. By cutting
the public membership from four to two, this bill would
compromise that transparency. He said that people sometimes
think that civilian review boards might be the right answer, but
everything he has ever read and heard is that they are not.
Initially they start out great guns, but eventually they blend
and become part of the department because they work so closely
together. He explained:
We need to keep that objectivity and APSC provides
that right now - because of the distance and the
experience and the civilian participation. Something -
that we make decisions based on fact not on emotion.
I'm not saying it couldn't be done otherwise, but my
experience has shown that in times at APD, in my
tenure there, I did come across very emotional
responses to actions and decisions I have made.
2:34:25 PM
SENATOR STEVENS asked how frequent the meetings are and what the
locations were.
COMMISSIONER MONEGAN replied they try to meet twice a year on a
rotation basis between Juneau or Fairbanks and Anchorage - for
transportation purposes. Meetings are an open forum with a lot
of discussion. They usually last one day, but can stretch out
longer. He said there is always a lot of discussion from all
sides.
2:35:41 PM
TERRY VRABEC, Director, Alaska Police Standards Council, said he
served as a police line officer, supervisor and as a chief of
police. He said the Council has concerns with the line officers
replacing higher ranking chief executive officers. They feel
that the wealth of knowledge and experience is very important in
dealing with very sensitive issues on the Council.
Another concern he heard expressed was having multiple union
representation spots on the Council. He explained when a
potential decertification case comes to the Council, if its
chief of police is on it, he does not participate in the vote.
The concern is that if several union representatives were on the
Council and they had a member before it, they would not be able
to vote on the issue at hand. A lot of potential decertification
issues involve officers that may be with an organized unit. He
added that an appeals process is available with a hearing
officer picked by the governor's office.
MR. VRABEC clarified that the Council covers the costs for the
members' travel to meetings. The only out-of-pocket cost is for
officer time and usually the departments are supportive of that.
He expressed the desire to work with the various bargaining
units and wanted to put this issue on the next agenda for public
discussion before it comes before the legislature again.
SENATOR BUNDE asked if a union member would have to declare a
conflict on a decision that would affect a fellow union member.
MR. VRABEC replied yes.
SENATOR BUNDE said he wanted clarification from Legislative
Legal on that.
2:39:34 PM
JOHN LUCKING, Chief of Police, City of Soldotna, said he has
climbed up through the ranks and holds high regard for all of
the individuals who are testifying and he thought the Council's
good work and composition as it now stands has served well in
weeding out some of the bad and maintaining the best. After
reviewing SB 99 he was immediately concerned about the proposed
changes to the composition of the Council and how that might
affect accountability and discipline in law enforcement within
the state. He said:
The Council's mission is about standards, training and
accountability and the removal of two public seats and
a chief seat and replacement with union officers
would, to me, bring an imbalance to this council. To
maintain integrity and public trust I believe that a
chief with, you know, with many years of experience
has a need for broader vision, has direct
accountability to the public through being an at-will
employee. And citizens that have volunteered to serve
on this board with no vested interests are just much
more capable and create a cleaner composition - when
it comes to discipline - than would a police officer
who is a union member of a union, who by its very
nature, who is obligated to stand up for and defend
and represent the interests of their members at every
level of discipline. So, I think it would be difficult
in compromising, in some instances, in that regard."
MR. LUCKING gave an example where he decertified someone and the
city attorney negotiated a deal afterwards and he had no power
to change that decision. In short, he thought the unions would
support the issues that would make their service on the Council
very difficult. He saw it as a removal of public trust.
2:43:33 PM
JEFF MARTIN, Senior Police Officer, Anchorage Police Department,
said he is a member of the APEA and that he had been with the
department since 1990. Over that time he has been awarded with
Canine Officer of the Year in 1997 and Police Officer of the
Year in 1998, along with numerous police commendations.
His testimony is from a unique perspective because in 1999 his
police certificate was forwarded to the Alaska Police Standard
Council for decertification. He argued that a majority of
members should remain higher ranking administrators because of
their education, training, life-experience and leadership
abilities better prepare them to deal with complex issues that
the APSC is faced with.
MR. MARTIN said he also looked at it as a checks and balance
issue. "Somebody has to police the police when the time calls."
2:46:15 PM
CHUCK KOPP, Chairman, Alaska Police Standards Council, and Chief
of Police for the City of Kenai, focused on some of the comments
about the abilities of the chief administrative officers on the
Council to understand the experiences of the troops on the
ground. His response is that the chiefs on the Council right now
are all life-time career Alaskan law enforcement officers that
have resume's rich in experience and diversity in all patrol,
investigative and administrative functions. He has found that
the network in the minds of the people that serve on the Council
is very diverse in the sense of the need to understand how an
officer's actions affect a community.
He said that everyone understands that perspectives change with
more responsibility. This issue has never been brought to his
attention as a problem as Council chair. He spoke with Mr. Cyr
last week who told him he did not have a specific issue in mind
and he asked if it's not broke, what is to fix.
He encouraged letting them have a public dialogue at the APSC
meeting coming up in April that coincides with Alaska Peace
Officers Association Crime Conference, the largest conference of
training for officers in Alaska. The Council could provide a
resolution of support or not and the reasoning behind it. The
Alaska Association of Chiefs of Police meeting immediately
follows and those agencies probably represent the folks that are
most impacted by a structural change to the Council and are in
the best position to come forward with a resolution that he
would hope the Legislature would want to hear.
MR. KOPP said he thought the integrity of the Council would
suffer in the eyes of the public if the two public positions
were replaced with three officers nominated by organized labor.
He has spoken to all of the Council members and they are a
strong group; not one of them is afraid to look at this issue.
The reasons for composing it this way were very wise and he said
this change is very significant.
2:52:30 PM
CHAIR ELLIS said he would hold SB 99 for further consideration.
HB 108-BOARD OF MARINE PILOTS
CHAIR ELLIS announced CSHB 108(L&C) to be up for consideration.
AL CLOUGH, Chair of the Board of Marine Pilots, said he is also
Deputy Commissioner for the Department of Commerce, Community &
Economic Development (DCCED). He said the board fully supported
this bill as written.
CHAIR ELLIS asked if the Legislative Auditor recommended
extending the board.
MR. CLOUGH answered yes.
PAT DAVIDSON, Legislative Auditor, said she recommended that it
have only a six-year extension because she identified operation
issues she thought the board needed to deal with. One of those
is making better progress on rate-setting issues.
2:55:31 PM
PAUL FUHS, Southwest Pilots Association, said he would answer
question they might have. He gave a brief overview saying the
board maintains its balance of two pilots, two agents and two
public members. It sets training, points of pick up and also
sets a tariff that can be challenged. It is a required state
activity to have a pilot so they can't go on strike and stop
commerce. He supported the bill.
CHAIR ELLIS said he would hold HB 108 for a meeting in the near
future. There being no further business to come before the
committee, he adjourned the meeting at 2:57:36 PM.
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