Legislature(2011 - 2012)SENATE FINANCE 532

04/04/2012 09:00 AM FINANCE


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+= SB 192 OIL AND GAS PRODUCTION TAX RATES TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= SB 100 PERS TERMINATION COSTS TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSSB 100(FIN) Out of Committee
+= SB 203 ENERGY ASSISTANCE PROGRAM & VOUCHERS TELECONFERENCED
<Bill Hearing Postponed>
+= SCR 24 COMMISSION ON 100TH ANNIV. OF LEGISLATURE TELECONFERENCED
Moved SCR 24 Out of Committee
+= HB 129 DECEASED VETERAN DEATH CERTIFICATE TELECONFERENCED
Moved SCS CSHB 129(STA) Out of Committee
                 SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                                                                       
                       April 4, 2012                                                                                            
                         9:05 a.m.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:05:57 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CALL TO ORDER                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman called the Senate Finance Committee                                                                            
meeting to order at 9:05 a.m.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Senator Lyman Hoffman, Co-Chair                                                                                                 
Senator Bert Stedman, Co-Chair                                                                                                  
Senator Lesil McGuire, Vice-Chair                                                                                               
Senator Johnny Ellis                                                                                                            
Senator Dennis Egan                                                                                                             
Senator Donny Olson                                                                                                             
Senator Joe Thomas                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
None                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
ALSO PRESENT                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Senator Joe Paskvan; Tim Lamkin, Staff, Senator Gary                                                                            
Stevens; Ted Madsen, Staff, Representative Max Gruenberg;                                                                       
Janak Mayer, Manager, Upstream & Gas, PFC Energy;                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SUMMARY                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SCR 24    COMMISSION ON 100TH ANNIV. OF LEGISLATURE                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
          SCR 24 was REPORTED out of committee with a "do                                                                       
          pass" recommendation and with a new fiscal impact                                                                     
          note from Legislative Council.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SB 100    PERS TERMINATION COSTS                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
          CSSB 100(FIN) was REPORTED out of committee with                                                                      
          a "do pass" recommendation and with a new fiscal                                                                      
          impact note from the Department of                                                                                    
          Administration.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
SB 192    OIL AND GAS PRODUCTION TAX RATES                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
          SB 192 was HEARD and HELD in committee for                                                                            
          further consideration.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
SB 203    ENERGY ASSISTANCE PROGRAM & VOUCHERS                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
          SB 203 was was SCHEDULED but not HEARD.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
CSHB 129(FIN) DECEASED VETERAN DEATH CERTIFICATE                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
          SCS CSHB 129(STA) was REPORTED out of committee                                                                       
          with a "do pass" recommendation and with a                                                                            
          previously published fiscal impact note:                                                                              
          FN2(DHSS).                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 100                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     "An  Act  relating  to employer  contributions  to  the                                                                    
     Public   Employees'   Retirement  System   of   Alaska;                                                                    
     relating to  requirements that employers  who terminate                                                                    
     some  or all  participation  in  the Public  Employees'                                                                    
     Retirement System of Alaska  pay termination costs; and                                                                    
     making the changes retroactive."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:07:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Hoffman  MOVED  to ADOPT  the  proposed  committee                                                                    
substitute  for  SB  100,  Work  Draft  27-LS0272\E  (Wayne,                                                                    
4/3/12.)                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:07:48 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman OBJECTED for the purpose of discussion.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:07:55 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR JOE  PASKVAN, explained that  the CS  was introduced                                                                    
in  response to  concerns  raised by  committee members.  He                                                                    
related that the most important  change was found in Section                                                                    
1,  of  the   CS  that  related  to   AS  39.35.255a,  which                                                                    
established  a "floor"  for base  salaries, as  of June  30,                                                                    
2008. He  noted that  the provision  was left  unchanged. He                                                                    
reported that  Section 2 and  Section 5 allowed  a municipal                                                                    
employer  to  exclude up  to  20  percent of  its  employees                                                                    
[participation  in the  retirement plan]  without triggering                                                                    
termination  costs.  He  shared that  the  Alaska  Municipal                                                                    
League  felt  the changes  in  the  CS were  a  "reasonable"                                                                    
compromise. He  concluded that the  intent of the CS  was to                                                                    
include  the   "20  percent   rule",  [20   percent  partial                                                                    
termination rule] and maintain the salary base.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:10:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Stedman  REMOVED  his OBJECTION.  There  being  NO                                                                    
FURTHER OBJECTION, Work Draft 27-LS0272\E was ADOPTED.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Paskvan summarized  SB 100.  He explained  that the                                                                    
legislature  passed a  law [SB  125 enacted  in 2008]  which                                                                    
attempted  to   pay  off  the  unfunded   liability  in  the                                                                    
retirement  system  [Public   Employees'  Retirement  System                                                                    
(PERS)]  over   time.  The   law  required   that  municipal                                                                    
employers  paid  a  22  percent  contribution  rate  on  the                                                                    
greater  amount of  either a  combined defined  contribution                                                                    
and defined  benefit salary base or  total payroll beginning                                                                    
on June 30, 2008. The  established floor addressed a concern                                                                    
that  employers might  convert PERS  positions to  contacted                                                                    
positions in order  to reduce their PERS  costs and transfer                                                                    
an unfair burden of the  unfunded liability to the employees                                                                    
who  remained   in  the  system.  The   legislation  allowed                                                                    
municipalities  to   transfer  up  to  20   percent  of  its                                                                    
employees  to  a  different  plan  without  the  statutorily                                                                    
induced consequences  of paying  the costs of  a termination                                                                    
study and the potential assessment  of double the 22 percent                                                                    
for the terminated employees.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Egan wondered  if the  provisions in  the CS  would                                                                    
still  alleviate  the  concerns of  small  communities  like                                                                    
Anderson.  Senator Paskvan  could not  remember the  details                                                                    
but thought the CS would provide relief.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman noted that the  fiscal note (FN 2 ADM) from                                                                    
the  Department of  Administration  in the  amount of  $86.6                                                                    
thousand  in FY  3013,  reimbursed the  department for  cost                                                                    
related  to  the  retroactivity  clause  in  Section  9  and                                                                    
Section 10 of the legislation.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Hoffman  MOVED  to report  CSSB  100(FIN)  out  of                                                                    
committee   with   individual    recommendations   and   the                                                                    
accompanying fiscal  note. There being NO  OBJECTION, it was                                                                    
so ordered.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:15:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CSSB  100(FIN) was  REPORTED  out of  committee  with a  "do                                                                    
pass" recommendation and with a  new fiscal impact note from                                                                    
the Department of Administration.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATE CONCURRENT RESOLUTION NO. 24                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     Establishing   the   Alaska   Legislative   Celebration                                                                    
     Commission to organize events  to commemorate the 100th                                                                    
     anniversary of  the first convening of  the legislative                                                                    
     branch of government in Alaska.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:16:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
TIM LAMKIN, STAFF, SENATOR GARY  STEVENS, explained that the                                                                    
resolution established a small  commission comprised of four                                                                    
legislators and three public members  to plan and coordinate                                                                    
the   100th   anniversary   commemoration   of   the   state                                                                    
legislature. The  first territorial legislature  convened on                                                                    
March 3, 1913.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman  discussed the fiscal  note (FN 1  LEG). He                                                                    
reported that the fiscal note  appropriated $103 thousand in                                                                    
general funds  to cover  travel and per  diem costs  for the                                                                    
commission members.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Hoffman  MOVED to  report SCR  24 out  of committee                                                                    
with individual recommendations  and the accompanying fiscal                                                                    
note. There being NO OBJECTION, it was so ordered.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SCR  24 was  REPORTED  out  of committee  with  a "do  pass"                                                                    
recommendation  and  with  a new  fiscal  impact  note  from                                                                    
Legislative Council.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 129(FIN)                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     "An Act relating to providing a death certificate for                                                                      
     a deceased veteran without charge."                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:18:25 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
TED MADSEN,  STAFF, REPRESENTATIVE MAX  GRUENBERG, explained                                                                    
that the  bill provided four  copies of a  death certificate                                                                    
for  a  deceased veteran  for  the  purposes of  eligibility                                                                    
benefits.  The  eligible   individual  was  responsible  for                                                                    
acquiring  the  certificates  from the  Division  of  Public                                                                    
Heath, (Department of Health and Social Services).                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman  pointed out that the  Department of Health                                                                    
and Social Services fiscal note  (FN 1 DHS) appropriated $75                                                                    
thousand  in  general  funds to  replace  the  reduction  in                                                                    
program receipts for the Bureau of Vital Statistics.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Hoffman  MOVED to report  SCS CSHB 129(STA)  out of                                                                    
committee   with   individual    recommendations   and   the                                                                    
accompanying fiscal  note. There being NO  OBJECTION, it was                                                                    
so ordered.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:19:53 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SCS CSHB 129(STA)  was REPORTED out of committee  with a "do                                                                    
pass" recommendation and with  a previously published fiscal                                                                    
impact note: FN2 (DHSS)                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:20:08 AM                                                                                                                    
AT EASE                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:25:33 AM                                                                                                                    
RECONVENED                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 192                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     "An Act relating to the oil and gas production tax;                                                                        
     and providing for an effective date."                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:26:56 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JANAK MAYER, MANAGER, UPSTREAM &  GAS, PFC ENERGY, commented                                                                    
that  the presentation,  "Discussion  Slides: Alaska  Senate                                                                    
Finance  Committee",   (April  4   2012)  (copy   on  file),                                                                    
contained   corrections   to    numbers   from   yesterday's                                                                    
discussion  on  revenue  comparisons,  ("Discussion  Slides:                                                                    
Alaska Senate  Finance Committee",  (April 3 2012)  (copy on                                                                    
file),  in an  effort to  uphold  the accuracy  of SB  192's                                                                    
model  data. He  explained that  the model  did not  include                                                                    
property  tax data  which reduced  the  operating costs.  He                                                                    
discovered that  property taxes  were included  in operating                                                                    
costs  in the  Department  of Revenue's  (DOR)  data in  its                                                                    
"Revenue  Sources  Book."   The  difference  had  relatively                                                                    
little  impact  on  the ACES  (Alaska  Clear  and  Equitable                                                                    
Share)  data.  He  noted  a  reduction  of  $50  million  in                                                                    
operating  costs.  He  discovered   that  the  inclusion  of                                                                    
property taxes had a large impact  on the SB 192 data, which                                                                    
reduced the  level of revenue  by $200 million  at $110/bbl.                                                                    
(per barrel) price of oil in FY 2013.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
He  turned to  Slide 2,  "FY 2013  Revenue Comparison."  The                                                                    
slide depicted two graphs that  compared ACES, CSSB 192, and                                                                    
HB 110  (HB 110-Production Tax  on Oil and  Gas) provisions.                                                                    
The graphs illustrated revenues  generated to the state from                                                                    
production tax and cash to  oil companies. He noted that the                                                                    
HB  110 data  illustrated significantly  reduced revenue  at                                                                    
prices of  $60/bbl. up to  $200/bbl. The provisions  in CSSB                                                                    
192 provided the  state with more revenue  and mimicked ACES                                                                    
up  to  $100/bbl.  then  diverged from  ACES  and  showed  a                                                                    
revenue  reduction with  significant reduction  at $130/bbl.                                                                    
up to  $200/bbl., which  placed revenue for  the state  at a                                                                    
middle point  between HB110  and ACES.  He cited  the second                                                                    
graph;  cash to  companies  that depicted  an exact  inverse                                                                    
when compared to  state revenues. [The provisions  of HB 110                                                                    
provided more cash  to companies, the least  from ACES, with                                                                    
CSSB 192 in between.]                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:31:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
He  identified Slide  3, "FY  2013 Revenue  Comparison" that                                                                    
portrayed two  graphs comparing the  "total state  take" and                                                                    
"total government take."                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
He explained  slide 4 titled, "FY  2013 Revenue Comparison."                                                                    
The chart  depicted production tax, total  state take, total                                                                    
government take,  cash to companies, and  FY 2013 percentage                                                                    
of  government take  at  various prices  per  barrel of  oil                                                                    
under  HB 110  ,  CSSB 192,  and ACES.  He  relayed that  at                                                                    
$110/bbl.  the production  taxes were  $4.782 billion  under                                                                    
ACES,  $4.263  billion under  CSSB  192,  and 3.075  billion                                                                    
under  HB 110.  He noted  that  HB 110  authorized that  all                                                                    
capital credits may  be claimed under a  single year instead                                                                    
of  spread  over  two  years.  He  stated  that  the  figure                                                                    
represented the  claimed capital  credit allowance  under HB                                                                    
110. In  the future production  tax revenue would  amount to                                                                    
an additional $100  million to $200 million  less than under                                                                    
ACES.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair   Hoffman  remarked   that   the  industry   sought                                                                    
increased revenue  at high  oil prices.  He referred  to the                                                                    
"cash  to companies"  column in  the  chart on  slide 4  and                                                                    
noted  that at  $110/bbl. industry  received $4,582  billion                                                                    
under ACES and $4,890 billion  under CSSB 192. He added that                                                                    
at $200/bbl.  companies received  $7,440 billion  under ACES                                                                    
and  $9,170  billion  under  CSSB 192.  He  stated  that  at                                                                    
$150/bbl.  to  $160/bbl.  price  of  oil  CSSB  192  granted                                                                    
industry approximately $1 billion  more over ACES. Mr. Mayer                                                                    
agreed  and stated  that was  how CSSB  192 was  designed to                                                                    
work.  Progressivity  was  significantly reduced  from  ACES                                                                    
levels beginning at $125/bbl.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Hoffman   observed  that  CSSB   192  accomplished                                                                    
reducing  the disparity  between industry  and the  state of                                                                    
Alaska revenues as oil prices rise.  Mr. Mayer agreed.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:36:17 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator  McGuire  commented that  she  liked  what CSSB  192                                                                    
accomplished for  the legacy fields,  shown on the  chart on                                                                    
slide  4. She  felt that  a balance  was struck  between the                                                                    
previous  version  of  SB  192 and  HB  110.  She  expressed                                                                    
concern that the  incentives in CSSB 192  did not accomplish                                                                    
enough   to   stimulate   new  production.   She   requested                                                                    
projections  to  the  model  increasing  base  rates  to  15                                                                    
percent  and 20  percent for  incentivizing new  production.                                                                    
Mr.  Mayer responded  that there  were a  number of  ways to                                                                    
further   incentivize  new   production.  He   reminded  the                                                                    
committee  that the  incentives for  new production  in CSSB                                                                    
192 offered a maximum of  5 percent on the progressive gross                                                                    
tax.  He suggested  that  rescinding the  5  percent tax  or                                                                    
extending  the  7  year  limit   were  alternative  ways  to                                                                    
increase  the  new  production incentives.  He  warned  that                                                                    
changing the  base rate on  the profit based  production tax                                                                    
was  much   more  difficult  to   accomplish.  Administering                                                                    
different base rates for separate  streams of production was                                                                    
complex and problematic. He offered  that the only other way                                                                    
to  provide more  incentives through  a change  in the  base                                                                    
rate was to  lower the base rate for all  production and try                                                                    
to retain a  desired level of government  take through taxes                                                                    
on the gross.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator McGuire referred to Slide  6, "Total Government Take                                                                    
Comparison   Including  New   Production  Incentives"   that                                                                    
charted the percentages of government  take in FY 2013 under                                                                    
ACES, HB 110,  and CSSB 192. She wanted  the government take                                                                    
on new production  further reduced to 61 to  63 percent. She                                                                    
requested   additional  hypothetical   data  modeling   that                                                                    
outcome.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman  noted that  the committee  viewed previous                                                                    
data  that modeled  a  tax  structure without  progressivity                                                                    
which,  significantly reduced  government  take  to the  low                                                                    
sixty percent levels.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:40:31 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Ellis thought  that the  committee's goal  for CSSB                                                                    
was  "cost neutrality  at $100/bbl."  He was  uncertain that                                                                    
the projections on the slide  reflected the goal. He queried                                                                    
whether  that  was  still the  objective.  Co-Chair  Stedman                                                                    
answered, "yes." He  stated that the goal  was to accomplish                                                                    
revenue  neutrality  at  $100/bbl. He  reiterated  that  the                                                                    
model  was  adjusted  for property  taxes  and  shifted  the                                                                    
states  position downward.  He noted  a $300  million dollar                                                                    
difference as a result and wanted to rectify the gap.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Ellis  wondered  what options  existed  to  achieve                                                                    
neutrality. Co-Chair Stedman  advised that the progressivity                                                                    
calculation  could  be  raised.   Senator  Ellis  asked  for                                                                    
confirmation  that with  further adjustments  in the  model,                                                                    
the  state remained  revenue neutral  at $100/bbl.  Co-Chair                                                                    
Stedman agreed and  added that as the model  was refined the                                                                    
committee would revisit the position.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Senator Ellis  stated that he  appreciated the  attention to                                                                    
detail  in the  process. He  worried that  the floor  of the                                                                    
legislation  did  not fit  the  situation  and requested  an                                                                    
improvement  over the  Resources  Committee  version of  the                                                                    
bill.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:43:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman  related that  he requested  adjustments to                                                                    
the model  relating to the floor.  The adjustments necessary                                                                    
was  the difference  between the  legacy fields  and smaller                                                                    
fields. He  referenced the  chart on  slide 4,  the section,                                                                    
"Total State  Take" at $40/bbl.  The total state  take under                                                                    
ACES was $1.414  billion and $1.711 billion  under CSSB 192.                                                                    
He determined  "that was the  effect of the floor",  and was                                                                    
difficult to  adjust. A prolonged price  of $40/bbl. created                                                                    
more problems than just the  floor. He cited the total state                                                                    
take at  $100/bbl. under ACES  was $7.629 billion  and under                                                                    
CSSB 192,  $7.310 billion. He  remarked that  the difference                                                                    
between the figures was the  revenue neutral gap that needed                                                                    
adjustment.  He added  that the  data for  the model  needed                                                                    
further  scrutiny to  determine what  credits, impacts,  and                                                                    
oil fields were included in the figures to ensure accuracy.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Mr.  Mayer  turned  to  Slide 5  titled,  "FY  2013  Revenue                                                                    
Comparison  -  Adjusted  for   $400mm  Credits  Not  Claimed                                                                    
Against Current  Production." He explained that  the numbers                                                                    
were adjusted down  by $400 million from the  chart on slide                                                                    
4,  to  clarify the  impact  of  the additional  credits  on                                                                    
production tax and total state take.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
He identified the slide on  page 6 titled, "Total Government                                                                    
Take  Comparison Including  New  Production Incentives."  He                                                                    
reported   that  the   graph  and   chart  illustrated   the                                                                    
difference  between the  percentage of  government take  for                                                                    
ACES, HB 110,  and CSSB 192 for new  production and existing                                                                    
production.  He  offered that  the  percentages  for HB  110                                                                    
represented entirely  new production. The definition  of new                                                                    
production  for  CSSB  192  was  a  work  in  progress.  The                                                                    
intention  was   to  significantly  expand   the  definition                                                                    
compared to  the designation of  new production found  in HB                                                                    
110.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:48:49 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
In  response  to a  question  by  Co-Chair Stedman,  Senator                                                                    
McGuire  responded   that  she  was  convinced   by  further                                                                    
testimony that adjustments  to the base rate  solely for new                                                                    
production  was detrimental  to the  model and  withdrew her                                                                    
earlier request.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Stedman  wanted  flexibility   in  the  model.  He                                                                    
thought that if  a new type of oil  discovery needed further                                                                    
incentive  in the  future, adjustments  to progressivity  or                                                                    
other  type  of  modification   could  be  made  instead  of                                                                    
necessitating changes to the  structure that complicated the                                                                    
accounting process.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Senator McGuire felt that the  model enabled the analysis of                                                                    
various types  of incentives  and how  to achieve  that with                                                                    
progressivity.  She  requested  that  PFC model  a  10  year                                                                    
timeline  instead  of  7  year  timeline.  Co-Chair  Stedman                                                                    
believed that with the "time  value of money" the longer the                                                                    
timeline of  an oil  production curve  the least  impact was                                                                    
felt.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Stedman  remarked that  a solution that  dealt with                                                                    
incremental production  from the legacy fields  was the last                                                                    
big  component  in  CSSB 192  that  required  consideration.                                                                    
Various options were being examined  and would be introduced                                                                    
to  the committee  in  a timely  manner  for discussion  and                                                                    
input from the administration, and industry.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SB 192 was HEARD and HELD in committee for further                                                                              
consideration.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
9:53:05 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
The meeting was adjourned at 9:53 AM.                                                                                           

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
SB 192 April 4 Alaska Senate Finance .pdf SFIN 4/4/2012 9:00:00 AM
SB 192
SB 100 New BLANK CS 040412.pdf SFIN 4/4/2012 9:00:00 AM
SB 100