Legislature(2005 - 2006)CAPITOL 106

05/03/2005 08:00 AM STATE AFFAIRS


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
*+ HB 277 GAMBLE-SPERL UAS JOINT USE FACILITY TELECONFERENCED
Moved Out of Committee
+= HB 283 AK HOUSING FINANCE CORP BOARD COMP. TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 283(STA) Out of Committee
+ HB 189 COASTAL MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 189(STA) Out of Committee
+ SB 132 HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
+ HB 28 MUNICIPAL DIVIDEND PROGRAM TELECONFERENCED
Scheduled But Not Heard
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                    ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE                                                                                  
             HOUSE STATE AFFAIRS STANDING COMMITTEE                                                                           
                          May 3, 2005                                                                                           
                           8:04 a.m.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Representative Paul Seaton, Chair                                                                                               
Representative Carl Gatto, Vice Chair                                                                                           
Representative Jim Elkins                                                                                                       
Representative Bob Lynn                                                                                                         
Representative Jay Ramras                                                                                                       
Representative Berta Gardner                                                                                                    
Representative Max Gruenberg                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
All members present                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 277                                                                                                              
"An Act  naming the Charles Gamble  Jr. - Donald Sperl  Joint Use                                                               
Facility in Juneau."                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED HB 277 OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 283                                                                                                              
"An Act  relating to  the compensation for  board members  of the                                                               
Alaska  Housing   Finance  Corporation;  and  providing   for  an                                                               
effective date."                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 283(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 189                                                                                                              
"An  Act relating  to an  extension  for review  and approval  of                                                               
revisions  to the  Alaska coastal  management program;  providing                                                               
for an effective date by amending  the effective date of sec. 45,                                                               
ch. 24, SLA 2003; and providing for an effective date."                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     - MOVED CSHB 189(STA) OUT OF COMMITTEE                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
SENATE BILL NO. 132(efd fld)                                                                                                    
"An  Act  relating  to  complaints  filed  with,  investigations,                                                               
hearings, and orders  of, and the interest rate on  awards of the                                                               
State  Commission   for  Human  Rights;  and   making  conforming                                                               
amendments."                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     - HEARD AND HELD                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
HOUSE BILL NO. 28                                                                                                               
"An Act relating to the municipal dividend program; and                                                                         
providing for an effective date."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     - SCHEDULED BUT NOT HEARD                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 277                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: GAMBLE-SPERL UAS JOINT USE FACILITY                                                                                
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) KERTTULA                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
04/19/05       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/19/05       (H)       MLV, STA                                                                                               
04/30/05       (H)       WAIVE MLV REFERRAL DENIED                                                                              
05/02/05       (H)       MLV REFERRAL WAIVED                                                                                    
05/03/05       (H)       STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 283                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: AK HOUSING FINANCE CORP BOARD COMP.                                                                                
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) KOTT                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
04/21/05       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/21/05       (H)       STA, FIN                                                                                               
04/28/05       (H)       STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
04/28/05       (H)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
04/28/05       (H)       MINUTE(STA)                                                                                            
05/03/05       (H)       STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
BILL: HB 189                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: COASTAL MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS                                                                                        
SPONSOR(s): STATE AFFAIRS                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
03/01/05       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
03/01/05       (H)       CRA, STA, RES                                                                                          
04/28/05       (H)       CRA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 124                                                                             
04/28/05       (H)       Moved CSHB 189(CRA) Out of Committee                                                                   
04/28/05       (H)       MINUTE(CRA)                                                                                            
04/29/05       (H)       CRA RPT CS(CRA) NT 4NR 1AM                                                                             
04/29/05       (H)       NR: SALMON, LEDOUX, OLSON, THOMAS;                                                                     
04/29/05       (H)       AM: NEUMAN                                                                                             
04/29/05       (H)       FIN REFERRAL ADDED AFTER RES                                                                           
05/03/05       (H)       STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
BILL: SB 132                                                                                                                  
SHORT TITLE: HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION                                                                                            
SPONSOR(s): RULES BY REQUEST OF THE GOVERNOR                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
03/04/05       (S)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
03/04/05       (S)       STA, JUD                                                                                               
03/17/05       (S)       STA AT 3:30 PM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
03/17/05       (S)       Heard & Held                                                                                           
03/17/05       (S)       MINUTE(STA)                                                                                            
03/29/05       (S)       STA AT 3:30 PM BELTZ 211                                                                               
03/29/05       (S)       Moved SB 132 Out of Committee                                                                          
03/29/05       (S)       MINUTE(STA)                                                                                            
03/30/05       (S)       STA RPT  3NR 1AM                                                                                       
03/30/05       (S)       NR: THERRIAULT, WAGONER, HUGGINS                                                                       
03/30/05       (S)       AM: DAVIS                                                                                              
04/07/05       (S)       JUD AT 8:30 AM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
04/07/05       (S)       Scheduled But Not Heard                                                                                
04/08/05       (H)       JUD AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 120                                                                             
04/08/05       (S)       Scheduled But Not Heard                                                                                
04/14/05       (S)       JUD RPT  1DP 2NR 2AM                                                                                   
04/14/05       (S)       DP: SEEKINS                                                                                            
04/14/05       (S)       NR: THERRIAULT, HUGGINS                                                                                
04/14/05       (S)       AM: FRENCH, GUESS                                                                                      
04/14/05       (S)       JUD AT 8:00 AM BUTROVICH 205                                                                           
04/14/05       (S)       Moved SB 132 Out of Committee                                                                          
04/14/05       (S)       MINUTE(JUD)                                                                                            
04/21/05       (S)       TRANSMITTED TO (H)                                                                                     
04/21/05       (S)       VERSION: SB 132(EFD FLD)                                                                               
04/22/05       (H)       READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS                                                                        
04/22/05       (H)       STA, JUD                                                                                               
05/03/05       (H)       STA AT 8:00 AM CAPITOL 106                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
WITNESS REGISTER                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BETH KERTTULA                                                                                                    
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  As sponsor of HB 277, presented Senator Kim                                                                
Elton and Representative Bill Thomas.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KIM ELTON                                                                                                               
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified during the hearing on HB 277.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE BILL THOMAS                                                                                                      
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified during the hearing on HB 277.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
WALTER A. SOBELEFF, JR.                                                                                                         
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified on  behalf of himself  during the                                                               
hearing on HB 277.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CARLOS C. CADIENTE                                                                                                              
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified on  behalf of himself  during the                                                               
hearing on HB 277.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
KARYL D. "BUNNY" LINDEGAARD                                                                                                     
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified  on behalf of  the Class  of 1965                                                               
and herself during the hearing on HB 277.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
LORRAINE DAVIS                                                                                                                  
(Address not provided)                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT:  Her testimony  supporting HB 277 was read by                                                               
Karyl D. "Bunny" Lindegaard.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MIKE O'HARE, Staff                                                                                                              
to Representative Pete Kott                                                                                                     
Alaska State Legislature                                                                                                        
Juneau, Alaska                                                                                                                  
POSITION  STATEMENT:     Presented  the  HB  283   on  behalf  of                                                               
Representative Kott, sponsor.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
BRIAN BUTCHER, Director                                                                                                         
Government Relations and Public Affairs                                                                                         
Alaska Housing Finance Corporation (AHFC)                                                                                       
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Answered questions  during the hearing on HB
283.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
DANIEL  R.   FAUSKE,  Chief  Executive   Officer  (CEO)/Executive                                                               
Director                                                                                                                        
Alaska Housing Finance Corporation (AHFC)                                                                                       
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Answered questions  during the hearing on HB
283.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MORRIS NASSUK, Director                                                                                                         
Bering Strait Coastal Management Program                                                                                        
(Address not provided)                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT:   POSITION STATEMENT:   Testified  in support                                                               
of "the extension  for the OCRM approval program  changes" and in                                                               
opposition to "the  2011 sunset clause" during the  hearing on HB
189.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MARV SMITH, Community Development Coordinator                                                                                   
Lake & Peninsula Borough                                                                                                        
(Address not provided)                                                                                                          
POSITION  STATEMENT:    Testified   in  support  of  a  six-month                                                               
extension of time during the hearing on HB 189.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
JOHN OSCAR, Program Director                                                                                                    
Cenaliulriit Lake Coastal Resource Service Area District (CRSA)                                                                 
(Address not provided)                                                                                                          
POSITION STATEMENT:  Testified during the hearing on HB 189.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SCOTT NORDSTRAND, Deputy Attorney General (AG)                                                                                  
Civil Division                                                                                                                  
Office of the Attorney General                                                                                                  
Department of Law                                                                                                               
Anchorage, Alaska                                                                                                               
POSITION STATEMENT:  Introduced SB 132.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  PAUL  SEATON  called  the  House  State  Affairs  Standing                                                             
Committee  meeting  to  order at  8:04:09  AM.    Representatives                                                             
Seaton,  Gatto, Elkins,  Lynn, and  Gardner were  present at  the                                                               
call to order.   Representatives Ramras and  Gruenberg arrived as                                                               
the meeting was in progress.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB 277-GAMBLE-SPERL UAS JOINT USE FACILITY                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:04:40 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON announced  that  the first  order  of business  was                                                               
HOUSE  BILL NO.  277, "An  Act naming  the Charles  Gamble Jr.  -                                                               
Donald Sperl Joint Use Facility in Juneau."                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:04:42 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  BETH  KERTTULA,   Alaska  State  Legislature,  as                                                               
sponsor of HB 277, thanked  the committee for so promptly hearing                                                               
the bill and presented Senator  Kim Elton and Representative Bill                                                               
Thomas.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
8:05:06 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR KIM ELTON, Alaska State  Legislature, noted that 35 years                                                               
ago,  he would  have introduced  himself as  "U.S. 50203352"  - a                                                               
draftee of the U.S. Army who  served in Vietnam from 1969 through                                                               
1970.  He  introduced the parents, sister,  and brother-in-law of                                                               
the late  Donald Sperl.   He  said the  Sperl family  has brought                                                               
some  of  the memorabilia  of  Donald  Sperl  to share  with  the                                                               
committee.  He also introduced  the family and friends of Charles                                                               
Gamble.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON  said Charles and  Don lived their entire  lives in                                                               
Juneau,  Alaska, and  joined the  army and  ended up  in Vietnam.                                                               
Charles was  born November 16,  1948, and died October  28, 1969,                                                               
as a  result of a helicopter  crash in Vietnam.   Donald was born                                                               
January 12,  1948, and died May  8, 1968 from wounds  received in                                                               
the line of duty.  He noted that  both of the men would have been                                                               
his age if they were still alive.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
8:07:53 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR ELTON reported that the  joint use facility - both armory                                                               
and student recreation  - will be completed on  the University of                                                               
Alaska campus in July [2005].   He offered his understanding that                                                               
the facility will be  the only one in the nation  that is used as                                                               
both  a university  recreation  center  and as  an  armory.   The                                                               
facility  is  being built  with  federal,  state, and  university                                                               
funds.  He  stated that naming the facility  after Charles Gamble                                                               
and Donald  Sperl will  be an important  reminder [of  what these                                                               
men have sacrificed].  Senator  Elton shared that during his last                                                               
visit to  Washington, D.C., he  visited the Vietnam  War Memorial                                                               
and  found the  names of  both Mr.  Sperl and  Mr. Gamble  on the                                                               
wall.  He concluded, "It would  be very, very important, I think,                                                               
for  the community,  if we  could honor  them locally  instead of                                                               
just in our nation's capital."                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:09:08 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  BILL THOMAS,  Alaska State  Legislature, said  he                                                               
knows both families well, having  met them after he returned from                                                               
Vietnam.  He said, "It took me  18-20 years before I had the guts                                                               
to go see the  Sperl family."  He explained that  he grew up with                                                               
"Donny," meeting him on the  basketball court during high school.                                                               
He said  he went to  college with Donald Sperl.   He said  he was                                                               
drafted to  Vietnam on  December 7,  1966 as  U.S. 50202962.   He                                                               
related a story of running into  Donald and Charles on his way to                                                               
duty.   Both men were  serving as medics.   Representative Thomas                                                               
stated his support of HB 277.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
8:11:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  ELTON, in  response to  a  question from  Representative                                                               
Gardner, confirmed that Donald Sperl  and Charles Gamble were the                                                               
only two  men from  Juneau who  lost their  lives in  the Vietnam                                                               
War.   He  stated for  the  record that  the effort  to name  the                                                               
facility  began about  the same  time  an agreement  was made  to                                                               
build it,  about three years ago.   He revealed that  there is an                                                               
institutional  bias  within  the university  to  name  facilities                                                               
after university  folks, and  there is  an institutional  bias to                                                               
name armories after  those in the National Guard.   He emphasized                                                               
that  both  of  those  biases  are appropriate.    He  said  it's                                                               
important  for the  record to  reflect that  while these  are the                                                               
only two  ... young men  from Juneau  who died in  Vietnam, there                                                               
are people  from Juneau, and  around the state who  are presently                                                               
serving  in Iraq,  and if  any harm  should come  to them,  he is                                                               
certain that  Representatives Kerttula and Thomas  would join him                                                               
in welcoming additions to the names  on the building.  He said he                                                               
thinks  the naming  of the  facility  is especially  appropriate,                                                               
because it's a facility designed for  young men and women both at                                                               
the university and serving in the [National Guard].                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
8:13:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  ELTON, in  response  to a  question  from Chair  Seaton,                                                               
confirmed  that  the  borough assembly  passed  a  resolution  in                                                               
support of the naming of the facility.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:14:12 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  KERTTULA  noted  that  the  university  did  have                                                               
concerns because normally  the board of regents  and students are                                                               
involved.   However,  she noted  that Chancellor  Pugh has  asked                                                               
that  the rooms  within the  building remain  available to  name.                                                               
She  said she  thinks that  was  a gracious  compromise from  the                                                               
university.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:14:50 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON noted for the record  that he saw the chancellor nod                                                               
his head in agreement to that statement.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:15:06 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
WALTER A. SOBELEFF, JR., testifying  on behalf of himself, stated                                                               
that [the  Vietnam War] was  largely unpopular and  veterans from                                                               
that war  have "just gone by  the wayside."  He  said recognition                                                               
given to  Donald Sperl and  Charles Gamble  is long overdue.   He                                                               
noted that there  is a memorial to a dog  on Juneau's waterfront.                                                               
He spoke of the sacrifices of the men and of their families.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  assured  Mr.  Sobeleff that  he  would  find  wide                                                               
support for the bill.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:16:22 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CARLOS C.  CADIENTE, testifying  on behalf  of himself,  told the                                                               
committee that Charles Franklin Gamble  - also known as "Skoogie"                                                               
- was one of his best friends.   He said Charles was a full-blood                                                               
Alaska Native.   Mr. Cadiente  listed the  names of the  late Mr.                                                               
Gamble's parents and sisters.  He  noted that Donald Sperl was an                                                               
outstanding varsity  athlete.   He said  both Donald  and Charles                                                               
were  loved  by  all  their classmates  at  Juneau  Douglas  High                                                               
School, and  both had  the ability  to bridge  all people  in the                                                               
community together.  Mr. Cadiente  said he and his father debated                                                               
the  Vietnam War;  he  said  he believed  that  war  was not  the                                                               
answer.  He  said his father was devastated when  Charles died in                                                               
Vietnam.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR. CADIENTE  shared a  photograph of his  father next  to "panel                                                               
17-West  of   the  Vietnam  Memorial,  where   Charles'  name  is                                                               
inscribed.   He stated that it  would be a great  tribute to both                                                               
Donald and Charles, who made  the ultimate sacrifice, to name the                                                               
new building in their honor.   He noted that Charles' family also                                                               
approves of the  naming of the building after both  their son and                                                               
Donald Sperl.   He added,  "I ... think  that naming in  honor of                                                               
Charles and  Don would also be  a belated thank you  from all our                                                               
Alaskan communities  to all  those who  have served  in Vietnam."                                                               
Furthermore,  he  opined that  it  would  honor all  the  Alaskan                                                               
soldiers  who  are  currently  in  harm's  way.    He  urged  the                                                               
committee to support HB 277.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:18:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON said  he knows  it's difficult  to testify,  and he                                                               
emphasized  how   much  he  appreciates  the   efforts  of  those                                                               
testifying, as well as of [those who serve their country].                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:19:05 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
KARYL D.  "BUNNY" LINDEGAARD, testifying  on behalf of  the Class                                                               
of 1965 and herself, said  meetings are being held in preparation                                                               
for a 40-year  reunion this year.  She said,  "We will be missing                                                               
Donald Sperl."                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
LORRAINE  DAVIS  had  her  testimony read  by  Karyl  D.  "Bunny"                                                               
Lindegaard as follows:                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     I will  be out of  town tomorrow,  until May 12.   Just                                                                    
     wanted  to say,  "thank  you" for  this opportunity  to                                                                    
     express   support  naming   the   new  facility,   "The                                                                    
     Sperl/Gamble Armory."   What a tribute  to the families                                                                    
     and those  of us  who went to  JD-High with  these men.                                                                    
     Please feel  free to use  my name in support  of naming                                                                    
     this facility ....                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS. LINDEGAARD  continued with  her testimony.   She  said Donald                                                               
Sperl  and Charles  Gamble  were  young men  of  character.   She                                                               
listed Donald's qualities.  She said  that people will be able to                                                               
explained to  others the reason  the building is named  after the                                                               
two men.  She stated,  "They were men of responsibility, respect,                                                               
courtesy, and honesty,  and that those values  might be displayed                                                               
through their  names and  through their  families' names  on that                                                               
building, I thank  you for any thoughtful  consideration you will                                                               
give."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:22:14 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON closed public testimony.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:22:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LYNN moved to report  HB 277 out of committee with                                                               
individual  recommendations and  the  accompanying fiscal  notes.                                                               
There being  no objection, HB 277  was reported out of  the House                                                               
State Affairs Standing Committee.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
HB 283-AK HOUSING FINANCE CORP BOARD COMP.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:23:40 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON announced that the  next order of business was HOUSE                                                               
BILL  NO. 283,  "An Act  relating to  the compensation  for board                                                               
members of the Alaska Housing  Finance Corporation; and providing                                                               
for an effective date."                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
8:23:48 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MIKE  O'HARE, Staff  to Representative  Pete  Kott, Alaska  State                                                               
Legislature, presented  HB 283 on behalf  of Representative Kott,                                                               
sponsor.   He  said the  bill  would increase  the board  meeting                                                               
compensation  levels for  public board  members from  the current                                                               
level of $100 to  $400 per meeting.  The $100  amount has been in                                                               
place  since  the inception  of  the  corporation  in 1971.    He                                                               
explained  that the  Alaska  Housing  Finance Corporation  (AHFC)                                                               
Board is  asked to consider and  review topics having to  do with                                                               
bonding, the  mortgage industry,  public housing, and  many other                                                               
complex technical  financial matters.   The board members  do not                                                               
draw  a salary  from  AHFC.   They  are  tasked  to consider  and                                                               
approve  bond  programs  valued   between  $600  million  and  $1                                                               
billion.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR.  O'HARE  said that  with  such  responsibility, members  must                                                               
spend  a   considerable  amount  of  time   educating  themselves                                                               
regarding  the issues.   He  said the  proposed legislation  will                                                               
allow the  corporation to ensure  having the most  capable people                                                               
on the board.  He stated  that the per board meeting compensation                                                               
is  applicable only  to  the  four public  board  members of  the                                                               
seven-member board of  directors.  The fiscal note  is $14,400 in                                                               
corporate receipts per fiscal year.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
8:25:52 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
BRIAN   BUTCHER,  Director,   Government  Relations   and  Public                                                               
Affairs, Alaska  Housing Finance  Corporation (AHFC),  added that                                                               
AHFC is  a completely self-supporting  corporation that  does not                                                               
receive any state general funds  and pays a $103 million dividend                                                               
to the  state annually.   In  response to  a question  from Chair                                                               
Seaton regarding information pertaining  to compensation rates of                                                               
other boards  that he had  requested at  the prior hearing  of HB
283, Mr. Butcher affirmed that  he provided that information with                                                               
Chair Seaton's staff [included in the committee packet].                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:27:10 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  noted that the sponsor  statement reveals                                                               
that board  members spend a  lot of  their own time  studying and                                                               
preparing  for meetings.   She  asked for  confirmation that  the                                                               
bill proposes  to increase the  amount of reimbursement  for only                                                               
the members' meeting time.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:27:26 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BUTCHER  answered  that's   correct.    He  offered  further                                                               
details.  In response to  Representative Gatto, he said the board                                                               
usually  meets   in  Anchorage,   but  sometimes  in   Juneau  or                                                               
"different  places  where we  have  public  housing units."    In                                                               
response  to follow-up  questions from  Representative Gatto,  he                                                               
said a  board member's airfare and  hotel rate is covered  by the                                                               
corporation; the  stipend in question  is above and  beyond those                                                               
costs and  is considered compensation  pay for the  board meeting                                                               
time.  He  agreed with Representative Gatto that  the stipend is,                                                               
essentially,  like a  salary.   However, he  pointed out  that in                                                               
many  cases board  members have  to  take a  day off  work for  a                                                               
meeting.  He clarified that in  many cases it costs board members                                                               
to participate in meetings.   He reminded the committee that $400                                                               
is currently what Permanent Fund  Corporation and Alaska Railroad                                                               
Board  members receive.   He  said, comparatively,  AHFC receives                                                               
less than most in terms of compensation.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:29:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS offered his  belief that the Permanent Fund                                                               
Corporation trustees are paid annually,  and he asked if the AHFC                                                               
Board members are.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:30:13 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BUTCHER  answered no.   In response  to a  follow-up question                                                               
from Representative Ramras, he said  the aggregate fund that AHFC                                                               
manages is $5 billion.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:30:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS stated his support of the bill.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:31:33 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG asked  if any other boards  use the term                                                               
"or  portion  of  the  day"   [on  page  1,  line  6,]  regarding                                                               
compensation, and if the board would  be paid for meeting only 15                                                               
minutes.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:31:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BUTCHER, to  the  first question,  replied  that he  doesn't                                                               
know.   Regarding the second  question, he said  the compensation                                                               
is  applied "to  the date  of the  board meeting."   He  said the                                                               
meetings tend to last 3-5 hours.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
[VICE CHAIR GATTO was handed the gavel.]                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:32:26 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DANIEL  R.   FAUSKE,  Chief  Executive   Officer  (CEO)/Executive                                                               
Director,  Alaska Housing  Finance Corporation  (AHFC), said  the                                                               
length  of  meetings  are  five  to six  hours.    Sometimes  the                                                               
meetings carry  over to the  next day.  Sometimes  a subcommittee                                                               
will meet the  day before a regular meeting, so  that it can make                                                               
a  recommendation to  the board  the next  day.   He said  he has                                                               
never heard of  a meeting that has lasted only  15 minutes and it                                                               
would  not be  proper to  pay someone  $400 for  stopping by  the                                                               
office to sign a paper, for example.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
8:33:57 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR  GATTO asked  if  that  means  Mr. Fauske  would  act                                                               
negatively on any request.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:34:13 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. FAUSKE  responded that  he has a  good relationship  with the                                                               
board and  would deny someone if  he felt that the  intent of the                                                               
compensation was being abused.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:34:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  GATTO offered a  scenario whereby board  members meet                                                               
for dinner  and talk business, have  a meeting the next  day, and                                                               
meet for  breakfast the  next morning and  conduct business.   He                                                               
asked if that would be an unlikely scenario.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:35:11 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. FAUSKE said he cannot envision that happening.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:35:22 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ELKINS asked,  "So, you're telling me  on the days                                                               
they travel they get no per diem?"                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:35:31 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. FAUSKE answered  in the affirmative.  He said  the purpose of                                                               
the  bill  is to  increase  the  amount  of money  board  members                                                               
receive solely for the meetings they attend.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:36:21 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  ELKINS pointed  out that  a member  from Wrangell                                                               
[attending  a meeting  in  Anchorage] loses  three  days pay  for                                                               
attending a meeting.  He said  he doesn't think it's right not to                                                               
be reimbursed  for days  of travel.   He stated,  "I have  a hard                                                               
time supporting the  $400, but not supporting the  travel days is                                                               
harder for me than supporting the $400."                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:36:37 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER   noted  that  the  bill   refers  to  AS                                                               
39.20.180,  which  she  said is  legislation  that  provides  for                                                               
transportation  and  per  diem  expenses.   She  added,  "So,  my                                                               
understanding is  that members would  get transportation  and per                                                               
diem on  the days they're traveling  as well as the  days they're                                                               
actually meeting."                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:36:57 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  FAUSKE  offered the  following  correction  to his  previous                                                               
statements:  "They  do get paid that day for  travel.  If they're                                                               
traveling on  corporate business coming  here, they do  get their                                                               
pay for the day."                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
[CHAIR SEATON took back the gavel.]                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
8:37:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON  stated, "I  would like to  note on  another portion                                                               
that we are looking at the  same compensation rate for the Alaska                                                               
Retirement Board.   That's built into that  piece of legislation,                                                               
as well."                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
8:37:34 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG suggested  standardizing  the rate  for                                                               
all boards  and incorporating  into HB 283  a section  asking the                                                               
administration  or appropriate  entity to  review all  the boards                                                               
and submit  a report to the  legislature at the beginning  of the                                                               
next session.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
8:38:35 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON recommended  the committee make that  request of the                                                               
administration in a separate piece of legislation.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:38:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER noted  that the  fiscal note  states that                                                               
the  members would  receive the  $400  compensation per  meeting.                                                               
She  said  that  is  incorrect, because  members  would  actually                                                               
receive the reimbursement per day.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:39:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BUTCHER confirmed  that Representative  Gardner is  correct,                                                               
and he said he would change that.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
8:39:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER questioned  whether  that would  increase                                                               
the [amount of the fiscal note].                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
8:39:21 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON asked,  "Were the calculations based on  the way the                                                               
compensation was  ... actually done,  or [were]  the calculations                                                               
in the fiscal note based just on an anticipated meeting date?"                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:39:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BUTCHER  replied that  it was based  on what  the anticipated                                                               
cost to the corporation would  be should the proposed legislation                                                               
pass.                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON asked  if  that  was based  on  the  idea that  the                                                               
compensation would be only on the  day of the meeting, or whether                                                               
that included the travel days, as well.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. BUTCHER answered  that of the four public  members, one lives                                                               
in   Anchorage  and   two   others   frequently  participate   by                                                               
teleconference;   therefore,  multiple-day   meetings  are   "not                                                               
applicable in most cases."  He  said, "I don't know that it would                                                               
be a  big difference; maybe  a difference of a  thousand dollars,                                                               
or so, depending on how you looked at it."                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:40:17 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON said  he would not hold the bill  up, but would like                                                               
Mr. Butcher to  ensure that the issue is revised  before the bill                                                               
is heard  before the House Finance  Committee.  He said  he would                                                               
like the House  State Affairs Standing Committee to  focus on the                                                               
policy issue of  whether $400 is adequate for  someone serving on                                                               
the  board, rather  than looking  at  the absolute  terms of  the                                                               
fiscal note.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:41:23 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  said, "If we decide  that, for example,                                                               
...  $400 a  day is  more than  we should  be spending  for these                                                               
folks, we're not  going to be able  to roll this board  back.  By                                                               
doing this now,  we are setting a precedent for  what we're going                                                               
to be quite possibly doing with these other boards."                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
8:42:16 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON closed public testimony.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
8:42:26 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE LYNN  declared a  potential conflict  of interest;                                                               
he revealed  that he is  a licensed real estate  associate broker                                                               
who has done business  with AHFC in the past and  may do so again                                                               
in the future.                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:42:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON noted Representative  Lynn's conflict and stated, "I                                                               
make a ruling that it's not significant at this time."                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:42:57 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  moved Amendment 1, to  delete "or portion                                                           
of a  day".  She explained  that she is troubled  by that phrase.                                                           
She said she  read AS 18.56.030 and doesn't know  that "a day" is                                                               
defined anywhere.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
8:43:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  said  he  would  like  Representative  Gardner  to                                                               
clarify if  the intent of  the amendment is  to say that  a board                                                               
member has to work for a specific  amount of time for it to count                                                               
as a  day.   He indicated that  that is the  problem he  has with                                                               
Amendment 1.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
8:44:49 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  asked if a  breakfast meeting on  the day                                                               
of departure would be counted as a workday.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:45:01 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  reminded  Representative Gardner  that  since  the                                                               
travel  day is  compensated,  it doesn't  matter  whether or  not                                                               
there  is  a  breakfast  meeting.     He  said  the  $400  a  day                                                               
compensation rate is  not really high when  consideration is made                                                               
to the caliber of people being  asked to make decisions for AHFC.                                                               
He said, "So, I think we  may be getting into more technicalities                                                               
than we really want to."                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:45:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE ELKINS  said he has  a hang  up with any  board or                                                               
commission member being paid more than  a legislator.  He said he                                                               
thinks it  would be proper "that  their per diem rate  be tied to                                                               
ours."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:46:26 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON  clarified that  although the  money in  question is                                                               
called  a per  diem,  it really  is a  salary,  not just  expense                                                               
compensation.   He added, "So,  you'd have  to compare it  to our                                                               
salary, and I don't think we  want to compare very many people to                                                               
our   salaries,  otherwise   we  wouldn't   have  anybody   doing                                                               
anything."                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:47:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG asked  if  any other  statutes for  any                                                               
other boards use the phrase, "or portion of a day".                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
8:48:09 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BUTCHER responded that he doesn't  know.  He said the request                                                               
to  Legislative Legal  and Research  Services was  to change  the                                                               
amount from $100 to $400 and "this is how it was drafted."                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:48:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG  said  he  supports Amendment  1.    He                                                               
explained that if  the phrase "or portion of a  day" is used only                                                           
in HB 283  and not in other statutes pertaining  to other boards,                                                               
the   result  may   be  that   "this   statute"  is   interpreted                                                               
differently.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER restated  Amendment  1 for  clarification                                                               
purposes.   She  added, "And  I'd like  to say,  if 'day'  is not                                                               
defined, a 'portion of a day' is covered."                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  added, "I would  ask that that  be done                                                               
with the understanding that I'll be offering that motion."                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:50:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON, upon  a query from the  committee secretary, stated                                                               
that he had objected to Amendment 1.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
8:50:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
A roll call vote was  taken.  Representatives Gardner, Gruenberg,                                                               
Gatto,  Elkins,  and   Lynn  voted  in  favor   of  Amendment  1.                                                               
Representatives Ramras  and Seaton voted against  it.  Therefore,                                                               
Amendment 1 passed by a vote of 5-2.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  asked Representative  Gruenberg  if  he wanted  to                                                               
restate his request.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said, "I will  do that after we move the                                                               
bill; if you're going to move the bill."                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
8:51:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER interpreted:                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
     My reading  of this, because it  includes AS 39.20.180,                                                                    
     means that  they do  get per  diem rate  at essentially                                                                    
     the  same rate  as  the legislature,  according to  the                                                                    
     regulations, on the  travel date.  So,  what they would                                                                    
     now get  is $400 a day  for travel day, as  well as the                                                                    
     same  per  diem that  everybody  else  gets.   Is  that                                                                    
     correct?                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
8:51:40 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BUTCHER responded  that's correct.   He  said, "For  the day                                                               
they're in Anchorage, they receive  $40, or whatever the meal per                                                               
diem is for that day."                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:51:47 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GATTO   referred  to  the  language:     "may  be                                                               
reimbursed   by  the   corporation  for   actual  and   necessary                                                               
expenses".   He indicated  that the  language "sounds  like we're                                                               
telling them we're going to  reimburse their hotel cost - 'actual                                                               
and necessary  expense' -  and their food  cost."   He continued,                                                               
"But what  you told us was  that that's already covered  and this                                                               
is  more of  a  salary.   And yet,  the  language conflicts  with                                                               
that."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:52:54 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BUTCHER explained  that  the corporation  pays  for the  air                                                               
fare, hotel rate,  and meal allowance, all of  which are separate                                                               
from the $100  [or $400 if the bill is  adopted] compensation for                                                               
the board meeting.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:54:31 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   GARDNER    noted   that   the    language   that                                                               
Representative Gatto  is asking about already  exists in statute.                                                               
She said, "The only change we're making is the dollar amount."                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:54:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS  asked Mr. Butcher  to remind him  how much                                                               
the dividend is that AHFC "throws off annually."                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BUTCHER answered  that it's  been  $103 million  a year  for                                                               
about the last 8-10 years.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
8:55:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE RAMRAS responded:                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     So, a billion  dollars over the last 10  years has gone                                                                    
     to the general fund and  we're arguing about moving the                                                                    
     per diem  from $100 a  day to $400  a day for  a fiscal                                                                    
     note of $14,000 a year?   For over 10 years, that would                                                                    
     be  $140,000  dollars,  and [AHFC]  has  thrown  off  a                                                                    
     billion dollars  into the general  fund for the  use of                                                                    
     the state.  Is that right?                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
8:55:28 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BUTCHER  replied, "In  the last 10-15  years it's  been about                                                               
$1.5 billion."                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
8:55:41 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  RAMRAS remarked,  "We're  probably  not going  to                                                               
change the per diem for awhile  ..., so it could be $140,000 over                                                               
the next  10 years.   And we  may see another  billion or  two in                                                               
dividends over the next 10 years?"                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:55:48 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. BUTCHER responded that that's a possibility.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
8:55:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER said, "Point taken."                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER  moved to report  HB 283, as  amended, out                                                               
of   committee   with    individual   recommendations   and   the                                                               
accompanying fiscal note that will  also be amended.  There being                                                               
no objection  CSHB 283(STA) was  reported out of the  House State                                                               
Affairs Standing Committee.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
8:57:01 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG presented  a concept for a  letter to be                                                               
transmitted from the committee as follows:                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
     The   House  State   Affairs  Committee   requests  the                                                                    
     administration  ... to  provide a  written response  to                                                                    
     the  following  questions  concerning  all  boards  and                                                                    
     commissions, compensated and noncompensated ....                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     1)  Should   any  [other]  noncompensated   boards  and                                                                    
     commissions be compensated?                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     ...                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     2) Should  the compensation  rate or rates  be adjusted                                                                    
     or standardized and, if so, at what rates?                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
     3)  Should the  following  language be  added to  those                                                                    
     statutes that provide compensation  at a daily rate "or                                                                    
     a portion of a day"?                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     ... If  legislation is  warranted, the  committee would                                                                    
     welcome proposed legislation.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
8:58:41 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON  said unless the  committee has a burning  desire to                                                               
address the  letter with a  committee action, he would  prefer to                                                               
transmit the letter individually and "get the information back."                                                                
                                                                                                                                
8:58:49 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
HB 189-COASTAL MANAGEMENT PROGRAMS                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
8:58:56 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON announced that the  next order of business was HOUSE                                                               
BILL NO.  189, "An Act  relating to  an extension for  review and                                                               
approval of  revisions to the Alaska  coastal management program;                                                               
providing for  an effective date  by amending the  effective date                                                               
of sec.  45, ch.  24, SLA  2003; and  providing for  an effective                                                               
date."                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
8:59:10 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON explained  that HB  189 is  sponsored by  the House                                                               
State  Affairs Standing  Committee  and was  heard  first by  the                                                               
House Community  and Regional Affairs Standing  Committee, during                                                               
which  time  "there  was some  frustration"  which  resulted  in,                                                               
basically,  a   "one-line  bill."    Chair   Seaton  assured  the                                                               
committee members  that the House Community  and Regional Affairs                                                               
Standing  Committee  fully  anticipates   that  the  House  State                                                               
Affairs Standing  Committee will make significant  changes to the                                                               
bill.  He said, "This isn't a fight between two committees."                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:00:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GATTO moved  to  adopt  the committee  substitute                                                               
(CS) for  HB 189, Version  24-LS0703\G, as  a work draft.   There                                                               
being no objection, Version G was before the committee.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:00:49 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON reviewed that the  committee had conducted a lengthy                                                               
meeting  on the  coastal  zone management  program, during  which                                                               
there  was discussion  surrounding the  sunsetting of  House Bill                                                               
191 and  districts that  didn't get  plans in by  July 1.   There                                                               
were problems in revising the  state standards necessary in order                                                               
for "them  to build their new  plans around."  He  said there was                                                               
dissention between  the federal approving agencies  and the state                                                               
regarding "what  those plans  could be  - whether  it could  be a                                                               
minor modification  or would have to  be a major amendment."   He                                                               
said, "Those  things are still  working through the system."   To                                                               
date, there  is still no  federal final approval  of regulations,                                                               
and coastal  districts are in  limbo as  to how to  rewrite their                                                               
plans in a way that will be consistent.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  pointed  out that  some  districts  along  Western                                                               
Alaska are widespread  with a lot of communities to  cover.  Part                                                               
of the process for having a  coastal management program is to get                                                               
local input  and knowledge  in the plans;  so, "the  timeframe of                                                               
constructing  a plan  is very  difficult if  you're going  to get                                                               
meaningful public input."                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON said [Version Y]  has been constructed to change the                                                               
date at which the state plan  has to be recognized by the federal                                                               
government, so  that the action of  House Bill 191 does  not take                                                               
effect and  kill the program  on July 1.   He said it  would also                                                               
have the  effect of sunsetting the  program in 2011, so  that the                                                               
legislature will have  to review the program to extend  it.  Also                                                               
included in Version  Y would be an extension of  six months after                                                               
approval by  federal office  of the  state's regulation,  so that                                                               
the  local districts  know in  entirety what  they have  to build                                                               
their  plans on.   He  said, "After  those state  regulations are                                                               
finalized, ...  adopted, and noticed,  then there is  a six-month                                                               
date in which  they have to revise their plans  and get them back                                                               
into the state.  And the  state then must finish ... [its] review                                                               
of those  plans and  certify those district  plans by  January 1,                                                               
2007."  He  said the state plan has to  have the federal approval                                                               
by March 1, [2006].                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
9:05:32 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON,  in response  to  a  question from  Representative                                                               
Gardner, reviewed that the two firm  dates are March 1, 2006, and                                                               
January 1, 2007.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:07:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER asked  if there  is any  possibility that                                                               
what's needed  by March 1  may not  be available.   She explained                                                               
that  she doesn't  want to  set  a firm  date "if  we don't  have                                                               
control of all the  steps that lead up to that."   She asked what                                                               
would happen  if the federal  approval was not obtained  by March                                                               
1.                                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:07:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON responded that currently  the program ends on July 1                                                               
- when  the legislature is  not in session.   The proposal  is to                                                               
extend that to January 1, but  that, he explained, means that the                                                               
legislature would have no ability  "to influence and control that                                                               
decision."  The  March 1 date would give the  legislature 45 days                                                               
in which to act "if nothing has happened."                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:08:26 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  clarified  that she  is  just  concerned                                                               
about  having something  in  legislation that  "all  hinges on  a                                                               
piece that we don't have any control over."                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON said  he agrees  with Representative  Gardner.   He                                                               
pointed out that  House Bill 191 had some dates  in it and "every                                                               
one of them turned out to be unrealistic."                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER replied,  "Exactly, and  I don't  want to                                                               
repeat that."                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON said dates have "slipped"  before, and if they do so                                                               
again, at least the legislature would  be in session and "if both                                                               
houses  and  the administration  want  to,  if something  did  go                                                               
really crazy, we could extend."                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:09:15 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  said she  is  willing  to not  offer  an                                                               
amendment she had  thought to offer, in order that  the bill will                                                               
move  more quickly.   In  return,  she asked  for Chair  Seaton's                                                               
commitment "to help  with extending it if we need  to because the                                                               
other pieces  that we  don't control  haven't dropped  into place                                                               
next session."                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:09:40 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON gave her his commitment to do that.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:09:55 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  remarked that there  is only a  week to                                                               
go in the session  and asked if it will be  possible to "get this                                                               
thing through."                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:10:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON noted  that there is a bill on  the Senate side that                                                               
is similar.  He said he  has been in communication with the chair                                                               
of the Senate  State Affairs Standing Committee in  an attempt to                                                               
"go on a common path."                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:11:17 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG   asked  if  it  wouldn't   allow  more                                                               
breathing room to change March 1 to April 1, for example.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:11:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  responded   that  the  March  1   date  gives  the                                                               
legislature 45 days, which he said  is adequate.  He said, "There                                                               
have been a  number of negotiations around that  date, and that's                                                               
about 30 days longer than ...  [we] were offered previously."  He                                                               
noted  that  the Senate  version  of  HB  189  is on  the  Senate                                                               
calendar today to be heard on the Senate floor.                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  said, "So, what we're  doing is passing                                                               
this out so  that that can be then put  into the [House Resources                                                               
Standing Committee] directly."                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON answered that's correct.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 9:13:14 AM to 9:13:26 AM.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:13:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON  said the bill on  the Senate side doesn't  have the                                                               
six-month  approval   time  after  federal  approval,   which  he                                                               
indicated  he thinks  is important.   In  response to  a question                                                               
from Representative  Gruenberg, he said that  language appears on                                                               
page 11, in Section 15.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 9:14:19 AM to 9:14:56 AM.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON stated another consideration  is whether to put July                                                               
1, 2001, in the title of the bill.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:15:34 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER moved  Amendment  1 to  add  "on July  1,                                                               
2001", after the title sentence.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:15:59 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG objected.   He  explained, "Because  if                                                               
the vehicle  is the Senate  vehicle, they  have to add  that over                                                               
there [and]  we're going  to need a  concurrent resolution.   So,                                                               
you ought to be  sure that they do a floor  amendment to put that                                                               
in on the other bill."                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 9:16:20 AM to 9:16:50 AM.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER [withdrew Amendment 1].                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:18:04 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER  moved  to   report  24-LS0307\Y  out  of                                                               
committee  with individual  recommendations and  the accompanying                                                               
fiscal notes.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:18:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON  announced that the motion  to move the bill  out of                                                               
committee must be withdrawn in order to open public testimony.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:18:48 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MORRIS  NASSUK,   Director,  Bering  Strait   Coastal  Management                                                               
Program,  testified in  support of  "the extension  for the  OCRM                                                               
approval program changes"  and in opposition to  "the 2011 sunset                                                               
clause."  He  urged the committee to support  the extensions from                                                               
six months to a year.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:20:08 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON asked  Mr. Nassuk  how important  it is  for [those                                                               
managing the  Bering Strait Coastal  Management Program]  to know                                                               
what  the  final regulations  are  before  they are  required  to                                                               
finalize their plans.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:20:23 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NASSUK   responded  that  it's  extremely   important.    He                                                               
explained  that  it's confusing  to  be  told to  follow  certain                                                               
guidelines   that  haven't   yet  met   with  federal   approval.                                                               
Currently,   the  program   is  in   limbo  because   of  unclear                                                               
guidelines.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:20:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GARDNER asked if six  months would be adequate for                                                               
his program to  prepare his plan and submit it  once he knows the                                                               
state and federal plans.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:21:14 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. NASSUK  said [six  months] would be  an improvement  over the                                                               
present deadline of July 1.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:21:45 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MARV SMITH,  Community Development Coordinator, Lake  & Peninsula                                                               
Borough,  testified  in support  of  the  six-month extension  of                                                               
time, adding  that more time would  probably be needed.   He said                                                               
he has put  out plans for public review that  took three years to                                                               
develop, and  he has  received feedback from  many agencies.   He                                                               
said, "I've got  a lot of work  to get done."   He explained that                                                               
he found out there  are a lot of problems that  need to be worked                                                               
out with his contractor and  it's questionable whether everything                                                               
can be done by July 1.   He said, "I think the Coastal Management                                                               
Program is something that the  people of Alaska have something to                                                               
do  with."   He  stated  his  opposition  to the  sunset  clause,                                                               
scheduled for  2011, because, depending on  the administration in                                                               
office at the time, [the program] could possibly be eliminated.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:23:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON  said he  thinks developers would  hate to  see [the                                                               
program] ended, because  that would mean that they  would have to                                                               
go to  the boroughs for the  land use planning, to  the state for                                                               
state  standards, and  go separately  to the  federal government,                                                               
because there would be no consistency  review.  He asked the same                                                               
question of  Mr. Smith  as he  did of  Mr. Nassuk,  regarding how                                                               
important it is  to have the six-month extension  begin after the                                                               
final federal approval of the state regulations.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:24:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  SMITH   responded  that  he  cannot   emphasize  enough  how                                                               
important it is.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:25:18 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOHN OSCAR, Program Director,  Cenaliulriit Lake Coastal Resource                                                               
Service  Area District  (CRSA),  said the  district includes  the                                                               
largest  area of  remote villages  in  the Yukon/Kuskokwim  Delta                                                               
region  of  Alaska,  with  Yupik Eskimo  spoken  as  the  primary                                                               
language at public meetings.  He  said ACMP has been a successful                                                               
part  of  the  communities  in Alaska  regarding  the  permitting                                                               
process.   He said  a one-year extension  would be  practical for                                                               
his  program.    He  thanked   the  committee  for  its  patience                                                               
regarding  the  extension  of  deadlines,  which,  he  indicated,                                                               
assists everyone -  the legislature, the state,  and the majority                                                               
of districts -  to comply with well-planned  revisions "with fair                                                               
support  from  our  constituency  in Alaska."    He  stated  that                                                               
although the  sunset of  date of July  1, 2011,  is discomforting                                                               
for  fear of  "losing  to the  federal  government agencies,"  he                                                               
stated his belief that it  will "offer some compromise to revisit                                                               
the ... success of any program at that time."                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:26:56 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR SEATON closed public testimony.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:27:17 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG [moved Amendment 2] as follows:                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     Page 12, line 10:                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Between "July 1," and "."                                                                                                  
     Delete "2011"                                                                                                              
     Insert "2015"                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG said  he is  offering the  amendment in                                                               
response to the public testimony.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:28:41 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  objected  to  Amendment  2.   He  noted  that  the                                                               
original  bill did  not have  a  sunset date,  but after  intense                                                               
negotiations between various entities  involved in the program, a                                                               
sunset date of 2011 was chosen.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:29:34 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG withdrew  Amendment  2.   He added,  "I                                                               
appreciate your efforts to get this extended."                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:29:50 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GARDNER moved  to  report CSHB  189, Version  24-                                                               
LS0703\Y,  Bullock,  5/2/05,  out of  committee  with  individual                                                               
recommendations and  the accompanying fiscal notes.   There being                                                               
no objection  CSHB 189(STA) was  reported out of the  House State                                                               
Affairs Standing Committee.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
The committee took an at-ease from 9:30:40 AM to 9:39:22 AM.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:39:23 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SB 132-HUMAN RIGHTS COMMISSION                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
[Contains brief mention of HB 202.]                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
9:39:25 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR  SEATON  announced that  the  last  order of  business  was                                                               
SENATE  BILL NO.  132(efd fld),  "An Act  relating to  complaints                                                               
filed  with, investigations,  hearings,  and orders  of, and  the                                                               
interest  rate  on  awards  of the  State  Commission  for  Human                                                               
Rights; and making conforming amendments."                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:39:31 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
SCOTT NORDSTRAND,  Deputy Attorney General (AG),  Civil Division,                                                               
Office of the Attorney General,  Department of Law, introduced SB
132, which he  said is identical to  HB 202.  He  stated that the                                                               
intent  of the  bill  is  to "enhance  the  effectiveness of  the                                                               
Alaska  State  Commission  for   Human  Rights  ...  (ASCHR),  by                                                               
allowing  the  commission  to  evaluate  complaints  of  unlawful                                                               
discrimination  and  to  allocate its  resources  to  prosecuting                                                               
those complaints  that will best  serve the commission's  goal of                                                               
eliminating unlawful  discrimination."  The bill  would:  improve                                                               
commission  procedures,   enhance  the  fairness   of  commission                                                               
procedures,  clarify  what the  commission  may  award to  remedy                                                               
unlawful discrimination, and make some housekeeping changes.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NORDSTRAND  said the  bill  would  enhance the  commission's                                                               
effectiveness  by allowing  it  to be  more  selective about  the                                                               
cases it prosecutes.  The  executive director would be authorized                                                               
to choose  the complaints of  unlawful discrimination  that merit                                                               
pursuit, based on:  strength  of evidence, severity of violation,                                                               
employer's history  before the commission, and  complaint's value                                                               
in establishing precedence.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR. NORDSTRAND mentioned the Department  of Fish & Game v. Meyer,                                                             
a  case  which required  the  director  to  take to  hearing  any                                                               
complaints   supported  by   substantial  evidence   of  unlawful                                                               
discrimination, without  regard to  such factors as  the weakness                                                               
of the  evidence or  the strength  of the  employer's affirmative                                                               
offenses.  He  indicated that SB 132 would reverse  the effect of                                                               
that case.   The  bill would  allow a  complainant to  withdraw a                                                               
complaint  before the  accusation is  served, but  would preserve                                                               
the executive  director's right  to file  a complaint  on his/her                                                               
own if he/she  disagrees with the complainant's  withdrawal.  The                                                               
bill would also  improve commission procedures.   It would permit                                                               
agreements  during the  prehearing  - or  conciliation phase,  as                                                               
it's called in statute - to compromise damaged claims.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:42:16 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NORDSTRAND  reviewed the  process  undergone  when a  person                                                               
believes  he/she has  been discriminated  against.   He explained                                                               
that  once there  is a  finding of  substantial evidence,  that's                                                               
when the  phase called conciliation  begins, which is  an attempt                                                               
to  settle a  case  amicably  between parties.    If  there is  a                                                               
failure of  conciliation, then the  executive director  tells the                                                               
commission  that  it  is  necessary to  go  forward  with  formal                                                               
procedures.  He  offered further details, including  the steps of                                                               
a discovery process and a hearing  before a hearing examiner.  He                                                               
reiterated  the effect  that the  Department  of Fish  & Game  v.                                                             
Meyer case had.  He noted  that the claims under the Human Rights                                                             
Act can  either be brought to  the commission or to  the superior                                                               
court, thus, if  someone brings a claim, he/she would  have to be                                                               
subjected to  the test of summary  judgment.  He added,  "Now, as                                                               
it stands, in the Human Rights Commission, you don't."                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
[CHAIR SEATON turned the gavel over to Vice Chair Gatto.]                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:47:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  spoke of the nuances  between the civil                                                               
and prosecutorial aspects of the Human  Rights Act.  He asked Mr.                                                               
Nordstrand to provide the committee with  a marked up copy of the                                                               
aforementioned case.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:50:20 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR. NORDSTRAND summarized that the intent  of the bill is to give                                                               
the commission  the ability to  direct its resources in  the best                                                               
way to alleviate the greatest  amount of discrimination possible.                                                               
It  would   also  allow  a   procedure  to  be  followed   if  an                                                               
investigation  is lacking  in substantial  evidence, which  would                                                               
serve  as a  check on  the  executive director's  authority.   He                                                               
offered an  example.  He  said the commission has  concerns about                                                               
that because of the associated workload.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:51:43 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE CHAIR  GATTO said no  one knows what the  term "substantial"                                                               
means.   He stated,  "We're just  trying to figure  out a  way to                                                               
keep the door from swinging  open every time somebody nudges it."                                                               
He  opined that  it's impossible  to reach  a standard  where any                                                               
possibility of discrimination can be denied.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
9:52:23 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NORDSTRAND said  he thinks  that's  true.   He continued  as                                                               
follows:                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     What  we've  essentially  done is  recognized  that  we                                                                    
     can't  really  fix  the substantial  evidence  problem.                                                                    
     ... We  could try to  come up  with new words,  but new                                                                    
     words wouldn't  make it clearer.   So, what  we've done                                                                    
     is we've said, "If  there's substantial evidence - this                                                                    
     lowest standard of evidence -  the door can swing open,                                                                    
     but there  are reasons  why the executive  director may                                                                    
     choose not  to go  forward anyway."   And  we've listed                                                                    
     those  criteria   ...:    If  [there   is]  substantial                                                                    
     evidence,  okay,   go  forward.    But   the  executive                                                                    
     director  could   say,  for  example,   "This  person's                                                                    
     refusal to settle for a  fair sum is unreasonable.  And                                                                    
     we're not going to use  the state's resources to go any                                                                    
     further when ...  a fair settlement is  $5,000 and they                                                                    
     say, 'I ... won't settle for less than [$50,000].'"                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     As the  system stands  now, ...  it's not  costing that                                                                    
     person  to go  forward  ....   So,  there's  sort of  a                                                                    
     disincentive to settle, in  some sense, because usually                                                                    
     the farther  along in  the process  you go,  the higher                                                                    
     the settlement offer gets,  because the cost associated                                                                    
     with  going  forward increased.    And  so, this  is  a                                                                    
     recognition   that  as   a  check   to  that   kind  of                                                                    
     motivation,  the executive  director has  to be  a fair                                                                    
     judge  of   what  should  go   forward  and   what  ...                                                                    
     [shouldn't].                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. NORDSTRAND directed  attention to a handout  in the committee                                                               
packet that shows a comparison of  SB 132 with last year's Senate                                                               
Bill 354.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:54:27 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG  noted  that   he,  Chair  Seaton,  and                                                               
Representative Lynn spent  a fair amount of time  on [Senate Bill                                                               
354].                                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:54:48 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  NORDSTRAND  stated  that,  in  addition  to  the  procedural                                                               
changes,  the  bill  also  would  enhance  the  fairness  of  the                                                               
commission's   procedures   by    requiring   "charges   in   the                                                               
accusation."  He explained that  the complaint is what the person                                                               
brings  to the  commission  and signs.    The accusation  happens                                                               
after  that; it  clarifies the  charge against  the person.   The                                                               
bill  would require  that charges  in the  accusation -  that the                                                               
executive director  issues after  deciding to pursue  a complaint                                                               
to  hearing -  be based  upon an  investigators determination  of                                                               
substantial evidence.  He offered further details.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:56:46 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
VICE  CHAIR  GATTO  asked  that   Mr.  Nordstrand  come  back  on                                                               
Thursday.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
[SB 132 was heard and held.]                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
There being no  further business before the  committee, the House                                                               
State  Affairs  Standing  Committee   meeting  was  adjourned  at                                                               
9:57:17 AM.                                                                                                                   

Document Name Date/Time Subjects