Legislature(2023 - 2024)BARNES 124
03/20/2023 01:00 PM House RESOURCES
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| Confirmation Hearing(s)|| Big Game Commercial Services Board | |
| HJR11 | |
| HB103 | |
| HB104 | |
| Confirmation Hearing(s):|| Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| *+ | HJR 11 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 103 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| *+ | HB 104 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
ALASKA STATE LEGISLATURE
HOUSE RESOURCES STANDING COMMITTEE
March 20, 2023
1:03 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT
Representative Tom McKay, Chair
Representative George Rauscher, Vice Chair (via teleconference)
Representative Kevin McCabe
Representative Dan Saddler
Representative Stanley Wright
Representative Jennie Armstrong (via teleconference)
Representative Donna Mears
Representative Maxine Dibert
MEMBERS ABSENT
Representative Josiah Patkotak
COMMITTEE CALENDAR
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S)
Big Game Commercial Services Board
Larry Kunder - Anchorage
- CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 11
Urging the United States Environmental Protection Agency to
develop a woodstove certification program that addresses the
threat to clean and healthy winter air in Fairbanks; and urging
the state Department of Environmental Conservation to develop an
economically and legally defensible state implementation plan
for the Fairbanks North Star Borough nonattainment area.
- MOVED HJR 11 OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 103
"An Act extending the termination date of the Alaska Minerals
Commission."
- MOVED HB 103 OUT OF COMMITTEE
HOUSE BILL NO. 104
"An Act relating to expedited timber sales."
- HEARD & HELD
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S)
Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
Brett Huber - Anchorage
- CONFIRMATION(S) ADVANCED
PREVIOUS COMMITTEE ACTION
BILL: HJR 11
SHORT TITLE: ADDRESS AIR POLLUTION IN FAIRBANKS
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) STAPP
03/08/23 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/08/23 (H) RES
03/20/23 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
BILL: HB 103
SHORT TITLE: EXTEND ALASKA MINERALS COMMISSION
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) CRONK
03/08/23 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/08/23 (H) RES
03/20/23 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
BILL: HB 104
SHORT TITLE: EXPEDITED TIMBER SALES
SPONSOR(s): REPRESENTATIVE(s) CRONK
03/08/23 (H) READ THE FIRST TIME - REFERRALS
03/08/23 (H) RES
03/20/23 (H) RES AT 1:00 PM BARNES 124
WITNESS REGISTER
LARRY KUNDER, Appointee
Big Game Commercial Services Board
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Big Game
Commercial Services Board.
REPRESENTATIVE WILL STAPP
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: As prime sponsor, presented HJR 11.
CLIFTON COGHILL, Staff
Representative Will Stapp
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions during the hearing on
HJR 11 on behalf of Representative Will Stapp, prime sponsor.
NICK CZARNECKI
Air Quality Engineer
Department of Environmental Conservation
Fairbanks, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions during the hearing on
HJR 11.
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE CRONK
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: As prime sponsor, introduced HB 103; as
prime sponsor, introduced HB 104.
DAVE STANCLIFF, Staff
Representative Mike Cronk
Alaska State Legislature
Juneau, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Answered questions during the hearing on HB
103 and the hearing on HB 104 on behalf of Representative Cronk,
prime sponsor of both.
BRONK JORGENSEN, representing self
40 Mile Mining District
Tok, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified in support of HB 103.
BRETT HUBER, Appointee
Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
Anchorage, Alaska
POSITION STATEMENT: Testified as appointee to the Alaska Oil
and Gas Conservation Commission.
ACTION NARRATIVE
1:03:41 PM
CHAIR TOM MCKAY called the House Resources Standing Committee
meeting to order at 1:03 p.m. Representatives McCabe, Saddler,
Wright, Armstrong (via teleconference), Mears, Dibert, Rauscher
(via teleconference), and McKay were present at the call to
order.
^CONFIRMATION HEARING(S)
^Big Game Commercial Services Board
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S)
Big Game Commercial Services Board
1:05:10 PM
CHAIR MCKAY announced that the first order of business would be
the confirmation hearing on the governor's appointee to the Big
Game Commercial Services Board.
1:05:45 PM
LARRY KUNDER, Appointee, Big Game Commercial Services Board,
explained that his interest in being on the board stemmed from a
fellow board member who approached him, and he said he wanted to
be on the board to serve the public. He added it would be a
good way to give back and participate any way he could with the
resources in Alaska.
CHAIR MCKAY asked Mr. Kunder about his experience in the area of
big game that relates to his qualifications.
MR. KUNDER replied that he started hunting at the age of 13 in
Georgia and hunted in many different areas since then. In
addition, he relayed several conservation groups and boards that
he had been on. He said he also fished all over Alaska and that
he would like to see it stay in the capacity that it is in.
CHAIR MCKAY asked Mr. Kunder what he hoped to achieve in his
tenure as a board member and how many years he would be serving.
MR. KUNDER said he hoped to gain further knowledge as to how the
system actually works and what can be done to better it. He
said he enjoyed his time on the board as it is now and wished to
gain more knowledge in relation to assisting with the board and
its endeavors.
1:09:22 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked Mr. Kunder when he was appointed
and about his participation in meetings.
MR. KUNDER replied that he was appointed last year, and he had
participated in three of the meetings so far.
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked Mr. Kunder what kinds of issues he
had dealt with and how he foresaw his role on the board with an
additional term.
MR. KUNDER related that he had seen violations on both sides
from the public and the guides, how both fish and game and
troopers have handled it, and how it came through the board to
where the guides and transporters have worked together to keep
things calm and on track, not swaying to the agenda. In
reference to violations, he stated the board was looking for
ways to re-educate the guides and transporters and make sure the
public is aware of what they go through to get their
certifications.
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked Mr. Kunder what he hoped to
accomplish and what his reputation would be at the end of his
term.
MR. KUNDER said he would like to move further along, and he
stated that he thought people would say he is honest and fair.
He expressed that he wanted renewable resources to be there
forever and that everyone should be held accountable.
1:12:39 PM
CHAIR MCKAY stated that in accordance with AS 39.05.080, the
House Resources Standing Committee has reviewed the
qualifications of the governor's appointees and recommends that
the following name be forwarded to the joint session for
consideration: Larry Kunder, Big Game Commercial Services
Board. He indicated that signing the report regarding
appointments to boards and commissions in no way reflects an
individual member's approval or disapproval of the appointee,
and the nomination is merely forwarded to the full legislature
for confirmation or rejection.
HJR 11-ADDRESS AIR POLLUTION IN FAIRBANKS
1:13:30 PM
CHAIR MCKAY announced that the next order of business would be
HOUSE JOINT RESOLUTION NO. 11, Urging the United States
Environmental Protection Agency to develop a woodstove
certification program that addresses the threat to clean and
healthy winter air in Fairbanks; and urging the state Department
of Environmental Conservation to develop an economically and
legally defensible state implementation plan for the Fairbanks
North Star Borough nonattainment area.
1:14:03 PM
REPRESENTATIVE WILL STAPP, Alaska State Legislature, as prime
sponsor, presented HJR 11. He paraphrased the sponsor statement
[included in the committee packet], which read as follows
[original punctuation provided]:
"Urging the Department of Environmental Conservation
to develop an economically and legally defeasible
state implementation plan for Fairbanks North Star
Borough nonattainment area"
In May 2017, the United States Environmental
Protection Agency reclassified the Fairbanks North
Star Borough nonattainment area from moderate to
serious for particulate matter 2.5 (PM2.5). The
Environmental Protection Agency seems intent on
turning attentions toward so-called greener sources of
heat, including electric heat pumps that will not work
as solutions in the Fairbanks North Star Borough
HJR 11 urges the United States Environmental
Protection Agency to develop a woodstove certification
program that the state, Department of Environmental
Conservation and residents of the Fairbanks North Star
Borough nonattainment area can rely on and
acknowledges the unique challenges Alaskans face in
economically and technically feasible and is legally
defensible.
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP added a brief history of how the proposed
legislation was conceived.
1:17:52 PM
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP described the issue of air quality in
Fairbanks specifically. Rejecting the climate mitigation
program effectively creates undue hardships on the community, he
said, and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) related
that they could not use the wood stoves they previously
authorized them to use. He added that many changes would be
required, and if these types of implementations move forward, it
would result in a crushing effect on the town [Fairbanks,
Alaska] making it economically non-viable to live in, he said.
He affirmed that HJR 11 would serve to lower air pollution.
1:20:58 PM
REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER asked if HJR 11 will affect the entire
state or only Fairbanks.
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP said he could not speak to how the EPA
would handle other areas of the state. He further explained
that each mitigation strategy is derived within local
communities or state departments.
1:22:12 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked Representative Stapp if he had any
estimation of what the cost had been either collectively or
individually for the first round of compliance, and how it could
affect the second.
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP explained the exponential costs on
consumers and what some consumers already pay through their
utility costs. He said it had already been difficult for
residents to handle financially, but having to meet the
standards would make Fairbanks a very unaffordable place to
live.
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked about the confidence level and
mission of the resolution.
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP replied that Fairbanks had a history of
dealing with "these types of situations," and he provided brief
examples. He expressed his protectiveness of hi town.
1:25:04 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE asked a rhetorical question about how the
EPA would penalize Fairbanks if it were out of compliance.
REPRESENATIVE STAPP explained that the EPA would revoke the
federal highway dollars that are utilized to ensure the two
highways in Fairbanks are maintained.
1:26:41 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked how far the containment area
extends.
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP replied that it extends from Fairbanks to
other parts of the North Star Borough and there are maps
available on the Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC)
website.
1:27:19 PM
CHAIR MCKAY asked if Eielson [Air Force Base] is considered a
non-attainment zone.
CLIFTON COGHILL, Staff, Representative Will Stapp, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative Stapp, prime sponsor of
HJR 11, confirmed that Eielson Air Force Base goes past Salcha,
Alaska.
CHAIR MCKAY commented that he did not like the government
restricting national security.
1:28:02 PM
CHAIR MCKAY opened public testimony on HJR 11. After
ascertaining that there was no one who wished to testify, he
closed public testimony. Immediately after, he learned there
was someone who wished to testify, so he re-opened public
testimony.
1:29:12 PM
NICK CZARNECKI, Program Manager, Air Non-Point & Mobile Sources,
Division of Air Quality, Department of Environmental
Conservation (DEC), explained that he did not have any specific
testimony but that he would be available for questions regarding
the resolution.
1:29:40 PM
CHAIR MCKAY, after ascertaining that no one else wished to
testify, closed public testimony on HJR 11.
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked Mr. Czarnecki for DEC's perspective
of the air quality situation, and if he had any bureaucratic
insights.
MR. CZARNECKI replied that Fairbanks had been making some good
progress, and he reiterated that this is a wood smoke issue and
EPA has provided DEC with a "broken tool" to fix the problem and
then penalized them by taking away federal highway funds as well
as imposing other restrictions. From DEC's perspective, he said
he believed there is a plan in place to get clean air for the
Fairbanks area so it can thrive as a healthy community. He
added that it could still be done economically by maintaining
the use of wood stoves if they could get EPA to put forth a
functioning certification program and approve Alaska's plan as-
is without forcing additional controls and mandates to DEC's
power sector. In reference to the non-attainment area, Eielson
Air Force Base is not in the zone, but Fort Wainwright is, he
confirmed.
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked how air quality in Fairbanks is
sampled and tested.
MR. CZARNECKI explained that EPA's national certification
program for wood stoves is referring to the tests done to
certify wood stoves for sale in the U.S. to show that they are
clean enough, and he further explained that the tests are flawed
and easily manipulated by test labs and manufacturers. The
state of Alaska, along with other agencies, found that wood
stove manufacturers and test labs have used the leniency in
those methods to get stoves certified; they are much dirtier
than what the tests say, he stated. He added that EPA is not
providing the clean wood stoves that they are supposed to for
this non-attainment area.
1:34:21 PM
REPRESENTATIVE STAPP thanked the committee for its time and
asked for support for Fairbanks.
CHAIR MCKAY entertained a motion.
1:34:52 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE moved to report HJR 11 out of committee
with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal
notes. There being no objection, HJR 11 was reported out of the
House Resources Standing Committee.
1:35:18 PM
The committee took an at-ease from 1:35 p.m. to 1:37 p.m.
HB 103-EXTEND ALASKA MINERALS COMMISSION
1:37:29 PM
CHAIR MCKAY announced that the next order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 103, "An Act extending the termination date of
the Alaska Minerals Commission."
1:37:55 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE CRONK, Alaska State Legislature, as prime
sponsor, introduced HB 103 by reading the sponsor statement
[included in the committee packet], which read as follows
[original punctuation provided]:
HB 103 is a technical change to statute.
The Mineral Commission's present sunset date is
February 2024.
HB 103 amends that date to February 2034. (A ten-
year extension.)
1:38:26 PM
CHAIR MCKAY asked what duties the Alaska Minerals Commission
performs.
DAVE STANCLIFF, Staff, Representative Mike Cronk, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative Cronk, prime sponsor of
HB 103, explained that the Alaska Minerals Commission (AMC) had
been around since 1985 and it makes recommendations, files an
annual report, and strives to give good advice to policymakers
and administration on how best to expand and stimulate the
economy through the extraction of minerals. He stated that he
had heard nothing but good things about AMC and he added that
the commission is not a "huge expense" to the state.
CHAIR MCKAY asked about a fiscal note.
MR. STANCLIFF related there was a zero fiscal note.
1:41:03 PM
CHAIR MCKAY opened public testimony on HB 103.
1:41:15 PM
BRONK JORGENSEN, representing self, told the committee that he
is a trustee for the 40 Mile Mining District and has served two
terms on the Alaska Mineral Commission. He described the
commission as excellent for the industry; it raises hidden
concerns among the industry that can be brought to light by
various agencies. Agencies can bring problems to the commission
for resolution. He highly recommended the term of the
commission be extended [as proposed under HB 103]. He pointed
out that there is [a zero] fiscal note; those who serve on the
commission pay their own "per diem and way," and everyone on the
commission "is very committed to the goals stated." He spoke in
support of extending the commission. In response to Chair
McKay, he confirmed that he supports HB 103.
1:42:34 PM
CHAIR MCKAY, after ascertaining there was no one else who wished
to testify, closed public testimony on HB 103.
CHAIR MCKAY ascertained that no one on the committee had an
amendment to offer.
REPRESENTATIVE CRONK thanked the committee.
CHAIR MCKAY entertained a motion.
1:43:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER moved to report HB 103 out of committee
with individual recommendations and the accompanying zero fiscal
note.
1:43:41 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER objected to note that he had carried a
bill ten years previously to extend the commission. He then
removed his objection. There being no further objection, HB 103
was reported out of the House Resources Standing Committee.
1:44:19 PM
The committee took a brief at-ease at 1:44 p.m.
HB 104-EXPEDITED TIMBER SALES
1:45:03 PM
CHAIR MCKAY announced that the next order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 104, "An Act relating to expedited timber sales."
1:45:23 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE CRONK, Alaska State Legislature, as prime
sponsor, presented HB 104 and paraphrased the sponsor statement
[included in the committee packet], which read as follows
[original punctuation provided]:
House Bill- 104 is written to accomplish five main
goals:
1. To increase public safety by reducing wildfire
risks.
2. Provide timber resources in abundance for industry
growth.
3. Reduce firefighting costs to the state.
4. Provide fuel for biomass energy production and
expansion.
5. Increase local job opportunities.
Alaska's timber resources are plentiful and sorely
underutilized. In the Interior when a tree is
harvested it is one less tree for mother nature to
burn. When insect infestation occurs, timber dies by
the millions of board feet. Even so much of this dying
or dead timber is usable. We must aggressively make
this fire ready, and beetle killed timber available
before it deteriorates.
This legislation directs our State Forester and the
Division to focus on areas of commercial timber where
fire dangers are high as well as areas under insect
infestation as a priority.
HB 104 has the support of: Governor Dunleavy,
Commissioner of Natural Resources, Alaska Forestry
Association, and other Industry users.
1:46:56 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MEARS expressed her interest in a committee
substitute (CS) for a comparison.
1:47:16 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE asked if the bill would be added to the
20-year timber sale.
REPRESENTATIVE CRONK replied that he is working on all options
in a CS.
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE commented that he had several
conversations recently about timber sales, and he urged that the
CS include some sort of payment schedule that is not an entire
20 years up front.
REPRESENTATIVE CRONK offered his belief that when the CS comes
about, it would be a very thorough bill and everyone in the
industry would approve.
1:48:17 PM
CHAIR MCKAY announced that HB 104 was held over.
^CONFIRMATION HEARING(S):
^Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
CONFIRMATION HEARING(S):
Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission
1:48:38 PM
CHAIR MCKAY announced that the final order of business would be
the confirmation hearing on the governor's appointee to the
Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission.
1:49:03 PM
BRETT HUBER, Appointee, Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation
Commission (AOGCC), provided a personal and professional
background and noted that he is presently the chair of the
commission since January 9, 2023. He stressed that AOGCC has an
extremely important role in the state as an independent, quasi-
judicial agency regulating the oil and gas industry in Alaska.
He offered his belief that as a public member, his
responsibilities include asking many questions, doing his
homework, approaching issues fairly and impartially, listening
to staff and the public, and making sound and fair decisions
while adhering to the statutory and regulatory guidelines.
1:54:25 PM
REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER thanked Mr. Huber for his public service
and asked what direction the oil and gas industry is heading.
MR. HUBER pointed out that the commission is not the policy
side, but the regulator of the industry. He said there were
foreseeable challenges and he stated that there were a few new
prospects. He added that there was more activity in the North
Slope which requires different operational techniques. He said
he thought it important for the commission to share the story of
the job that it does, as the industry becomes more scrutinized.
REPRESENTATIVE RAUSCHER commented that he always had a fondness
for trying to improve the permitting process to where it could
be faster.
1:58:13 PM
REPRESENTATIVE MCCABE brought up Title 6 primacy and asked Mr.
Huber what he could do as a regulator to make the permitting go
faster.
MR. HUBER replied that regulations are supposed to be about
purpose, not process. He further noted that the legislation
that moved out of the House Resources Standing Committee would
give AOGCC the authority to seek primacy, and he offered his
belief that AOGCC would be the right agency to have that
primacy. He said it would be a fairly big regulatory lift
between the passage of the legislation and regulations being
ready to put in place.
1:59:59 PM
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked about the gas off-take program in
North Slope and the decisions AOGCC would consider taking on in
the future.
MR. HUBER replied that currently, AOGCC is dealing with shallow
gas zones in specific areas of the state, as well as dealing
with issues of plug and abandonment. He further noted the
industry is interesting being that it's new and old at the same
time. He said AOGCC is making sure it is taking on those issues
while working through the rest of the process.
REPRESENTATIVE SADDLER asked if AOGCC would approve things until
faced with evidence to deny it, or to deny things until
persuaded that it was ok to approve.
MR. HUBER restated that regulations are about purpose and not
process. It is important to try to find a way to get to the
"yes" in a responsible manner, he said.
2:02:34 PM
CHAIR MCKAY stated that in accordance with AS 39.05.080, the
House Resources Standing Committee has reviewed the
qualifications of the governor's appointees and recommends that
the following name be forwarded to the joint session for
consideration: Brett Huber, Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation
Commission. He indicated that signing the report regarding
appointments to boards and commissions in no way reflects an
individual member's approval or disapproval of the appointee,
and the nomination is merely forwarded to the full legislature
for confirmation or rejection.
2:03:58 PM
ADJOURNMENT
There being no further business before the committee, the House
Resources Standing Committee meeting was adjourned at 2:04 p.m.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| 1.31.23 Brett Huber AOGCC Resume_Redacted.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
|
| 1.31.23 Larry Kunder Big Game App_Redacted.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
|
| HJR 11 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HJR 11 |
| HJR 11 Letters of Support.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HJR 11 |
| HJR 11 Fiscal Note.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HJR 11 |
| HB 103 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 103 |
| HB 103 - Minerals Commision Annual Report.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 103 |
| HB103 AMA Letter of Support.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 103 |
| HB 103 Fiscal Note.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 103 |
| HB 104 Sponsor Statement.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 104 |
| HB 104 sectional.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 104 |
| HB 103 RDC Letter of Support.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 103 |
| Letter in Support of Brett Huber.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |
|
| AKPIRG_3.20.23_Huber House Resources testimony.pdf |
HRES 3/20/2023 1:00:00 PM |